new deadly human-to-human-transmissible coronavirus emerges out of China

POSTED BY: 1KIKI
UPDATED: Tuesday, May 5, 2026 22:21
VIEWED: 203741
PAGE 12 of 29

Nope. Your count is off. Your sizing is off. And you didn't specify how many cupboards you're assuming.

Try again.

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Quote:

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Originally posted by captaincrunch:
You can always tell when SIGNUTS is about to lie her @ss off because she'll accuse others of lying.
Check out this whopper:

Quote:

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Originally posted by SIGNYM:
I don't have enuf frig space for more than a week's-worth of food, and my smallish freezer (the one that I already said was too small) only has enough room for two or three weeks of meat and cheese, and no room left over for frozen vegies. I know my storage limits. When we unpack groceries, the frig and freezer are full. By the next week, they're pretty empty. So I shop, once per week.

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You have a fridge, 2 freezers, a pantry / storage for dry goods and you say you can't make it last for more than a week?
You must have the fattest family in California.

"When we unpack groceries, the frig and freezer are full." Both freezers?
WTF do you put in both your freezer? Whole pig? How many pounds of meat do you eat in a week? How many eggs? How many loaves of bread...how many gallons of milk do you drink in a day?

On top of which you "say" you're "also on a modified fast most of the time."
Is that the kind of fast where you eat more than usual?

You're such a lying sack of sh*t.

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Wrong again, fool. Find me the post where I said I had a pantry and two freezers.

WHY do you keep posting stuff about me that you couldn't POSSIBLY know, is always wrong, and biased to the negative??? Why do you keep lying?

Now, do you mind not shitting up this thread with lies, personal attacks, and irrelevancies? Or is that how you earn your "working from home" paycheck?

-----------
Pity would be no more,
If we did not MAKE men poor - William Blake

#STAYTHEFUCKHOME

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Maybe he's really, really confused.

Yanno, I swear he's Geezer, after the stroke, and then dementia set in. All of the mendacity, zero of the mental acuity. Which leads to a crap ton of very poorly done lying. Which is why he was put out to pasture here.

Anyway, for all I know, maybe HE's the one with the pantry and 2 freezers!

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Gotta hop!

Ciao.

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Quote:

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6IXSTRINGJACK:

I heard they've developed a self-testing kit that is similar to a pregnancy test that will allow you to test not only whether or not you have COVID currently, but if you already had it and recovered.

Not sure if that's true at all because we're in the era of Post-Truth, but if it is, imagine the implications of that. Both good, and bad.


"You're free to go back to work, as long as you clear the results with us and send us a sample of your DNA along with it.", among others.



The good news is that we'd finally have legitimate death ratios instead of all the fear mongering that's been going on for months now.

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Quote:

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SIGNYM:
That would be interesting if true

links please

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Quote:

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6IXSTRINGJACK:

I don't have any. It's something my old man mentioned yesterday. He doesn't troll the internet so I'm assuming it was some Legacy Media news source he heard it from. Just thought it was interesting and wondered if anybody heard about it. I'll see if I can find anything.

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Quote:

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Originally posted by second:

"Self-testing at home to find out whether somebody has had Covid-19 is an efficient way to find out if they are safe to return to work, a senior health official has said.

Prof Yvonne Doyle, the medical director of Public Health England, told the health select committee that finger-prick home tests would be available very soon. “We expect that to come within a couple of weeks, but I wouldn’t want to promise on that,” she said."

More at www.theguardian.com/world/2020/mar/26/covid-19-self-test-could-allow-r
eturn-to-work-says-public-health-england]

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Thanks.

Though I don't usually put any stock in what theguardian has to say about anything, I'll choose to remain optomistic that this is actually legit.

There's also this article that they linked to in there.

https://www.theguardian.com/world/2020/mar/25/uk-coronavirus-mass-home
-testing-to-be-made-available-within-days

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“Several million tests have been purchased for use. These are brand new products. We have to be clear they work as they are claimed to do,” Peacock said. “Once they have been tested this week and the bulk of tests arrive, they will be distributed into the community.”

Amazon has agreed to carry out distribution and the tests are also set to go on sale in chemist shops.

The test detects the presence of IgM, an antibody that arises very early on in the infection, and IgG, which is increased in the body’s response to the virus. The results of some of the tests on order can be read by anyone, but others would need to be interpreted by healthcare professionals.

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Like I said before though, this is both obviously very good news and potentially very bad as well. It all depends on how it is used.

My guess, since we still live in America and we're going to at least try to put up a pretense of being in a free country, there are not ever going to be any mandates to take these tests and hand over the results to the government by gunpoint, but there could be huge financial incentives to do so and/or equal penalties for choosing not to.



Just for a moment, think about exactly how something like this would need to be carried out. Ask yourself a few questions. Here's a few that I could think of right off the top of my head, but I'm sure I can come up with more, especially when we see what happens with this product in the coming weeks and months.

1. How would the government and your employer be sure that you took the test and you're cleared for work?

2. How would they know that you didn't have somebody else take the test for you?

3. Short of forcing people to take the tests, how could the government incentivize people to do so?

4. In areas where they may have started handing out tickets to people not complying with social distancing mandates, how would police enforcement know that two people standing a fo

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1KIKI

Monday, April 6, 2020 6:50 AM

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What percentage of any of those categories are within the age range of those dying? You're throwing in everybody who has those illnesses, including all of them who are much younger and aren't likely to die even if they get the Coomf and they will recover from it.

Your numbers are dumb, and your comparisons are flawed.


And as I've stated before, it's not just people who were going to die this year, but people who would have died in the next couple of years from one of those illnesses anyhow.

There will be less deaths among old people with those illnesses over the next few years than expected before because, yes, they will die this year instead.

Facts of life, hun. Get over it.

Do Right, Be Right. :)

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I agree with Signy.

In fact, why not abort every fetus ever conceived if it's just going to die anyway? Because - according to you - it's merely a matter of time, place, and cause; and those are meaningless details. According to you.

Yours is not only a really stupid argument, it's a morally bankrupt one.

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So, here's the interesting case of Germany's really low case fatality rate ... and it's not just about a lot of quickly-available testing, or a younger, healthier population.

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Germany has remarkably few COVID-19 deaths. Its healthcare system shows how Germany prevented a runaway death toll.

Here's how Germany turned itself around as one of the European countries with the highest number of COVID-19 cases to having one of the lowest mortality rates of COVID-19 worldwide.

† February: Germany has one of the highest infection rates in the world
But Germany sprung into action. By the time Trump made his comments (February 26, 2020), Germany was already taking action to address the coronavirus threat.

† Late February and early March: Germany's forceful and rapid response
In late February, the country extended school and daycare facility closures and required anyone who had contact with confirmed cases to remain in isolation for 14 days. Even in unconfirmed cases — those who had been near someone with coronavirus-like symptoms — were told to self-isolate.
Meanwhile, the government said that it would limit outside travel into the country and begin acquiring protective medical equipment to prepare for the COVID-19 fight. Along the way, despite an inability to get rapid test results, Germany was ramping up its testing efforts.
Germany was one of the first countries to develop a testing system for COVID-19. It's early access to reliable tests for COVID-19 meant that Germany could "get a much better handle on who was infected, isolate contacts, and treat those who need care," Jennifer Kates, the senior vice president and global health and HIV policy director at the Kaiser Family Foundation said.

† March 9-10: The first deaths
German chancellor Angela Merkel and her administration told Germany that they would need to do "everything possible" to slow the coronavirus spread and save lives. She announced that gatherings of more than 1,000 people would be shut down. This was 7 days before Trump recommended social distancing measures in the US based on CDC guidelines.
But perhaps what has contributed to Germany's low death rate most is an ace up its sleeve that many other countries can't match: An extremely high bed-to-person ratio. According to data from HealthSystemTracker, Germany has 8.1 hospital beds per 1,000 people and 6.1 ICU beds per 1,000 people. Italy has 3.2 hospital beds per 1,000 and 2.6 ICU beds per 1,000. The US has 2.8 hospital beds per 1,000 and 2.4 ICU beds per 1,000 people.
"Germany hospital capacity surpasses that of many other countries," Kates said. It's been a key factor in saving lives and not overwhelming a strained healthcare system.

† March 17: A bigger risk — and problems testing
On March 17, the Robert Koch Institute, which monitors public health across the country, changed COVID-19's health risk to "high" in Germany.
The German government said that because of a lag of about three to four days between testing and results, it believed the real number of cases was higher than the recorded 7,000, or so. Germany quickly expanded the number of COVID-19 beds by 1,000 to accommodate extra needs.
In the ensuing days, more curfews and quarantines went into effect. Social distancing, a core component in any country's battle with COVID-19, was further tightened as schools, daycare facilities, and other gathering limitations were extended. At the right time, Germany responded forcefully, experts said.

† March 22: A widespread crackdown
By March 22, Germany's cases hovered at around 25,000, but deaths were just 86 — a fatality rate of approximately 0.3% that easily outpaced China, Italy, and nearly every other country around the world.
That day, the German government announced that people would need to remain six feet apart, and gatherings of more

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Quote:

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Originally posted by 1KIKI:

Quote:

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What percentage of any of those categories are within the age range of those dying? You're throwing in everybody who has those illnesses, including all of them who are much younger and aren't likely to die even if they get the Coomf and they will recover from it.

Your numbers are dumb, and your comparisons are flawed.


And as I've stated before, it's not just people who were going to die this year, but people who would have died in the next couple of years from one of those illnesses anyhow.

There will be less deaths among old people with those illnesses over the next few years than expected before because, yes, they will die this year instead.

Facts of life, hun. Get over it.

Do Right, Be Right. :)

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I agree with Signy.

In fact, why not abort every fetus ever conceived if it's just going to die anyway? Because - according to you - it's merely a matter of time, place, and cause; and those are meaningless details. According to you.

Yours is not only a really stupid argument, it's a morally bankrupt one.

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Boo Hoo. Cry me a river.

I noticed you're not even going to touch the property tax issue, are you?


Why don't you stick to Chemistry and Biology and leave taxes and statistics to people who know what they're doing. Numbers certainly are not in your wheelhouse.

Do Right, Be Right. :)

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I replied to your property tax 'issue'.

Please read it.

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To further address Jack's fallacious claim that people with diabetes are going to die in a couple of years anyway, I took a look at average lifespan of people with diabetes.

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https://www.medicalnewstoday.com/articles/317477#life-expectancy-with-
type-2-diabetes

A 2010 report from the United Kingdom estimated that type 2 diabetes reduced life expectancy by *up to 10 years* ... A 2012 Canadian study calculated... that the disease caused an average reduction of 6 years in females and 5 years in males.

(So with) ... the average (US) life expectancy at birth for males (of) 76.4 years .... for females ... 81.2 years

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...the average diabetic can expect to live to about 71.4 years for males, and about 75.4 years for females. Is a 40 year old diabetic at a 6-7% risk of dying from COVID-19 getting ready to die within the year? In another year? Or two? Or is it more like in 35-40 years?

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Quote:

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Originally posted by 1KIKI:
I replied to your property tax 'issue'.

Please read it.

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No.

You didn't.

Do Right, Be Right. :)

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Quote:

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Originally posted by 1KIKI:
To further address Jack's fallacious claim that people with diabetes are going to die in a couple of years anyway, I took a look at average lifespan of people with diabetes.

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https://www.medicalnewstoday.com/articles/317477#life-expectancy-with-
type-2-diabetes

A 2010 report from the United Kingdom estimated that type 2 diabetes reduced life expectancy by *up to 10 years* ... A 2012 Canadian study calculated... that the disease caused an average reduction of 6 years in females and 5 years in males.

(So with) ... the average (US) life expectancy at birth for males (of) 76.4 years .... for females ... 81.2 years

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...the average diabetic can expect to live to about 71.4 years for males, and about 75.4 years for females. Is a 40 year old diabetic at a 6-7% risk of dying from COVID-19 getting ready to die within the year? In another year? Or two? Or is it more like in 35-40 years?

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I didn't say that "people with diabetes are going to die in a few years anyway".

In fact, NOBODY is saying that, even about those who are not extremely old and have the virus. Even the statistics you site all the time from Johns Hopkins say that, nor does the CDC or the WHO.

I said that old people close to the average age of COVID deaths, (yanno those who are OLDER than both the average age spans of people who die of diabetes that you just posted here) who also have diabetes and/or chronic heart issues and/or lung disease and/or high blood pressure are going to die in a few years anyway. (ie: Those who are roughly 80 years or older who are already in poor health for one reason or another).




And, BTW, your "40 year old diabetic at a 6-7% risk of dying from COVID-19" statistic is pure bullshit.

That's based off of confirmed cases vs. deaths. There is ZERO way to know how many people who currently have it (healthy or otherwise) that don't even know that they have it. With testing kits as hard to come by as they are, unless you're deathly ill you are not getting tested in most parts of the country and you aren't being counted.

That being said, at least until the new testing kits are proven to work, distributed en masse, and legitimately cataloged, there is also no way to even know how many people have had it that are already over it and immune either.


Do Right, Be Right. :)

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And to finally put the nail into the coffin of Jack's argument, I did look up statistics, because there are statistical techniques for unscrambling multiple causes from each other. I was confident that there were plenty of statistical analyses, and I was right. How could there not be? People need to find out what's important and what isn't.

Here's one written for the semi-layperson:

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https://www.statnews.com/2020/03/03/who-is-getting-sick-and-how-sick-a
-breakdown-of-coronavirus-risk-by-demographic-factors/

After taking into account the patients’ ages and smoking status, the researchers found that the 399 patients with at least one additional disease (including cardiovascular diseases, diabetes, hepatitis B, chronic obstructive pulmonary disease, chronic kidney diseases, and cancer) had a 79% greater chance of requiring intensive care or a respirator or both, or of dying, they reported last week in a paper posted to medRxiv, a preprint site that posts research before it has been peer-reviewed. The 130 with two or more additional diseases had 2.5 times the risk of any of those outcomes.

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This article is even more to the point of Jack's ridiculous posts:

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https://medium.com/wintoncentre/how-much-normal-risk-does-covid-repres
ent-4539118e1196

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Mashing all conditions and diseases into one grand average by decade of age, if you're a 40-49 year old male, and get COVID-19, you will lose, on average, 7 months off your life. If you're a 60-69 year old female and get infected, you'll lose, on average, over 2 years off your life. A male in the 70-79 year old age range can expect to lose 4 years off their lifespan from COVID-19.

OBVIOUSLY, COVID-19 isn't merely harvesting people who were going to die that year anyway, as Jack originally posted. Or even within a year or two, as he later dodged.

Especially older people who get COVID-19 can expect to die, on average, multiple years earlier than normal.

This isn't swapping out one imminent cause of death for another imminent cause of death, as he claims.

It's killing people off who wouldn't ordinarily have died for quite some time.

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Added to my last post while you were posting more bullshit:





And, BTW, your "40 year old diabetic at a 6-7% risk of dying from COVID-19" statistic is pure bullshit.

That's based off of confirmed cases vs. deaths. There is ZERO way to know how many people who currently have it (healthy or otherwise) that don't even know that they have it. With testing kits as hard to come by as they are, unless you're deathly ill you are not getting tested in most parts of the country and you aren't being counted.

That being said, at least until the new testing kits are proven to work, distributed en masse, and legitimately cataloged, there is also no way to even know how many people have had it that are already over it and immune either.

Do Right, Be Right. :)

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I hope you realize I don't read your posts because they offer no data, no evidence, no links - just your personal opinion. Which is like an asshole. Everybody has one.

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To continue on ... contrary to Jack's contention that the people who die are at death's door anyway, Germany provides a striking example of how that is untrue. Its case fatality rate is a smidge over 1%. So dying seems to be more related to how interested-in, and capable-of, the society is in saving people medically.

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I don't give a shit what your opinion is, woman.

I deal with facts, statistics and probability, as well as factoring in unknowns. Unknowns that your simple mind is apparently completely incapable of even pondering or even admitting exist in the first place.

But keep watching your news and wearing your masks and cowering in fear of the 125 micron bogey man. They didn't scare you with Russia, but they sure as hell got you pissing yourself right now.



I see you still haven't replied to the property tax thread after I gave you an education smack down as a retort your feeble attempt at wit.

That's the first smart thing I've seen you do in a while. Do yourself a favor and keep it that way.

Do Right, Be Right. :)

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lol

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SIX is clinging to the contention that we don't know the REAL "case fatality rate" and that somehow makes all of the bodies stacking up in refrigerated trucks (because they ran out of morgue space) disappear.

SIX, you're right, we DON'T know the case fatality rate. OTOH, with over 1,000 deaths per day caused by Covid-19 (and evidence that coroners, medical examiners etc are undercounting those deaths even so) it's turned into the third-highest cause of death IN THE USA.

NOT your typical flu!

And if "nothing" was done, as you seem to be advocating, what would the death rate look like then? 2,000/day? More? Until it becomes THE leading cause of death?

So what's your point? That it's not "worth" slowing the economy down temporarily to save hundreds of thousands or millions of people? That approach only benefits the wealthy. Which brings up an interesting philosophical point: Is "the economy" supposed to be working for people? Or are people supposed to be "working for" the economy? What is an economy FOR, anyway?



-----------
Pity would be no more,
If we did not MAKE men poor - William Blake

#STAYTHEFUCKHOME

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KIKI, I wanted to get your feedback on this

Quote:

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Originally posted by SIGNYM:
So since the SARS Cov-2 virus docks onto human cells via the ACE-2 receptor (typically found in the small vessels of the lungs but also the kidneys, which explains the kidney damage that is ALSO found after Covid-19) I wondered whether the ACE receptor blockers (ARBs) would interfere with docking and blunt the infection. But it turns out that ARBs actually cause an overexpression of ACE-2 recpetors (by a factor of 3-5X) which may explain why people with high blood pressure or heart problems far so poorly: Not because of the blood pressure or heart failure but because of the medications they're taking. THAT might explain the high death rate in Italy.

I guess I wasn't the first person to think about this, there is an active discussion about this in the medical community. https://www1.racgp.org.au/newsgp/clinical/ace-inhibitors-arbs-and-covi
d-19-what-gps-need-to

On the other hand, a comment buzzed past my ear while I was doing other things that soking prevented the kind of cytokine storm that quickly sent patients CTD (circling the drain). Since it was kind of random, I don't recall where I heard it, but what I found when looking it up is that according to the only studies that could be found on the topic, smoing actually RAISES the risk of severe complications and deaths. http://www.tobaccoinduceddiseases.org/COVID-19-and-smoking-A-systemati
c-review-of-the-evidence,119324,0,2.html So much for THAT idea (although I will continue to try and find the source of that comment, and any supporting info.)

---

-----------
Pity would be no more,
If we did not MAKE men poor - William Blake

#STAYTHEFUCKHOME

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The first Covid 19 case diagnosed in New Jersey
www.nytimes.com/2020/04/05/magazine/first-coronavirus-patient-new-jers
ey.html

Commentary on the above article: Remdesivir III

Robert Waldmann | April 5, 2020 8:20 pm

https://angrybearblog.com/2020/04/remdesivir-iii.html

The first Covid 19 case diagnosed in New Jersey

Around 3 a.m. on March 10, Balani arrived at the hospital. The medicine had come in, and she did not want to wait until the morning to administer it. With Balani in the room, a nurse woke Cai up so that he could sign the legal papers. Soon after, he was hooked up, intravenously, to the drug.

The next day Cai’s fever, which he’d had for at least nine days, finally broke. Even before he received the remdesivir, his oxygen levels started to stabilize. Now they indicated he was on the mend. He was still so weak in the following days that he could barely speak without exhaustion; every time he tried, he was racked by coughs. But the progress was steady

Chloroquine also ran, It was used for a day while the Remdesivir was in the mail,

Cai’s boss, Dr. George Hall, also made a call, not long after Huang spoke to the infectious-disease doctor on call. He spoke with another doctor on Cai’s caregiving team, a hospitalist named Danit Arad.

[skip]

Hall explained …that the Chinese National Health Commission had just published the seventh edition of guidelines on how to treat coronavirus. It was true that they were based more on clinical experience than on published studies, but he urged Arad to follow some of its protocols, which included prescribing two drugs that were commonly given to patients in China soon after they showed symptoms like shortness of breath: chloroquine, an antiviral drug once used to treat malaria, and Kaletra, another antiviral that had once been used to treat H.I.V.

[skip]

at the time that neither drug had been through extensive clinical trials or had F.D.A. approval. She listened patiently to Hall and expressed her concern that his suggestions did not conform to standard medical procedure or C.D.C. guidelines.

Hall understood the need for evidence-based medicine as well as she did, he told her. But this was life and death.

[skip]

That day, Cai was given chloroquine and Kaletra

Comment: I do not understand the need for “evidence-based medicine” or rather I do not understand how the phrase is used by doctors. There is no evidence that Covid 19 patients (without heart disease) do better without Chloroquine. I learn that “evidence based medicine” does not imply choosing the therapy that a fair balance of evidence suggests is best for the patient. Pharmaceuticals are presumed guilty until proven safe and effective. The evidence is treated as evidence in a criminal trial with the burden of proof on the pharmaceutical.

I have no idea what “standard medical procedure” might mean in the context of Covid 19. it appears that as soon as a new disease is discovered, there is a standard procedure for treating it, which can’t be based on data or evidence.

The story has a happy ending, but it is not reassuring. It also doesn’t surprise me.

The Joss Whedon script for Serenity, where Wash lives, is Serenity-190pages.pdf at www.mediafire.com/folder/1uwh75oa407q8/Firefly

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Always fun to see the SIGGY deflection two step - another tell that she just dropped a load of BS on the forum.

Quote:

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Originally posted by SIGNYM:
Wrong again, fool. Find me the post where I said I had a pantry and two freezers.

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This thread. Does your refrigerator have a freezer? Uh-huh - so that's 2 freezers.

I said "pantry / storage"

Do you have storage in your kitchen? Somewhere you could store cans, beans, rice, pasta? Things that you could easily eat + all the pounds of meat and fruit and veg in your 2 freezers and fridge?

Face it, you lied your f*ckin' @ss off. Again.

The only question is, as it is with almost everything you post, is: how many lies.
Did you lie about the clerk having plexiglass? Or did you just lie because I mentioned it in a previous post? Did you lie about talking to her on how to clean her mask? Or are you lying to make it sound like you were being a dear, how dare we question you? Was there even a clerk, or is that another lie? So many lies.

Quote:

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Originally posted by SIGNYM:
WHY do you keep posting stuff about me that you couldn't POSSIBLY know, is always wrong, and biased to the negative??? Why do you keep lying?

---

I could POSSIBLY know it because you actually posted it.

Quote:

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Originally posted by SIGNYM:
Now, do you mind not shitting up this thread with lies, personal attacks, and irrelevancies? Or is that how you earn your "working from home" paycheck?

---

I think it's relevant to protect the integrity of this forum from people such as yourself who constantly fill it with their BS.
Who would pay me to call you out for lying? That'd be constant employment though, pretty awesome.

Quote:

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Originally posted by SIGNYM:
#STAYTHEFUCKHOME

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OMG! What are you going to do this week? Dr. Birx says this is the week we should NOT go to the pharmacy or grocery store! Your XL family is going to starve!

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Quote:

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Originally posted by SIGNYM:
SIX is clinging to the contention that we don't know the REAL "case fatality rate" and that somehow makes all of the bodies stacking up in refrigerated trucks (because they ran out of morgue space) disappear.

SIX, you're right, we DON'T know the case fatality rate. OTOH, with over 1,000 deaths per day caused by Covid-19 (and evidence that coroners, medical examiners etc are undercounting those deaths even so) it's turned into the third-highest cause of death IN THE USA.

NOT your typical flu!

And if "nothing" was done, as you seem to be advocating, what would the death rate look like then? 2,000/day? More? Until it becomes THE leading cause of death?

So what's your point? That it's not "worth" slowing the economy down temporarily to save hundreds of thousands or millions of people? That approach only benefits the wealthy. Which brings up an interesting philosophical point: Is "the economy" supposed to be working for people? Or are people supposed to be "working for" the economy? What is an economy FOR, anyway?



-----------
Pity would be no more,
If we did not MAKE men poor - William Blake

#STAYTHEFUCKHOME

---

Talk to me about the economy a few months from now.

Especially if the disproportionate response so far is continued and we pass another 2.5 Trillion stimulus bill or three before it's over.


Meanwhile, not a single Stimulus check has been cut or direct deposited, and today is the day that we heard we'd all get them by. Those don't even begin to go out until the 9th, and the government says it can only print and send out 5 Million a month, so to those who don't have direct deposits on their taxes already or even a checking account to begin with (yanno, those likely in the most need of the money), they're being told that the last checks might not even be in the hands of people until September.

And it's still a coin toss in most states if you can even file for unemployment, despite the fact that millions of Americans have lost their jobs temporarily (and possibly permanently).



I'm more worried about the survivors than the people who are dying from this. I'm also more concerned about the spike in suicides, murder and just basic civil unrest that is sure to happen, especially if money doesn't get into the hands of people who really need it now AND the price of goods doesn't skyrocket in the mean time. Especially while hundreds of millions of Americans are going stir crazy in their houses feeding on whatever poison the Legacy Media is dishing out everyday to make a buck.

I'm absolutely fine with being labeled an asshole for this opinion.

I'm not the guys in China who decided to engineer this virus in an attempt to wipe out their elderly and sick population. I'm also not in any position to do anything about it either.

Do Right, Be Right. :)

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Quote:

---

Originally posted by SIGNYM:

KIKI, I wanted to get your feedback on this

Quote:

---

Originally posted by SIGNYM:
So since the SARS Cov-2 virus docks onto human cells via the ACE-2 receptor (typically found in the small vessels of the lungs but also the kidneys, which explains the kidney damage that is ALSO found after Covid-19) I wondered whether the ACE receptor blockers (ARBs) would interfere with docking and blunt the infection. But it turns out that ARBs actually cause an overexpression of ACE-2 recpetors (by a factor of 3-5X) which may explain why people with high blood pressure or heart problems far so poorly: Not because of the blood pressure or heart failure but because of the medications they're taking. THAT might explain the high death rate in Italy.

I guess I wasn't the first person to think about this, there is an active discussion about this in the medical community. https://www1.racgp.org.au/newsgp/clinical/ace-inhibitors-arbs-and-covi
d-19-what-gps-need-to

On the other hand, a comment buzzed past my ear while I was doing other things that soking prevented the kind of cytokine storm that quickly sent patients CTD (circling the drain). Since it was kind of random, I don't recall where I heard it, but what I found when looking it up is that according to the only studies that could be found on the topic, smoing actually RAISES the risk of severe complications and deaths. http://www.tobaccoinduceddiseases.org/COVID-19-and-smoking-A-systemati
c-review-of-the-evidence,119324,0,2.html So much for THAT idea (although I will continue to try and find the source of that comment, and any supporting info.)

---

-----------
Pity would be no more,
If we did not MAKE men poor - William Blake

#STAYTHEFUCKHOME

---

It's perfectly plausible.

WAY back at the beginning, the idea was floated that ARBs might be a therapy, because they would block the same receptors (angiotensin-II receptors) that SARS-COV-2 docks onto. I didn't notice anything else about that as a follow-up, but then I didn't look, either.

I didn't know that ARBs cause the body to create more receptors!

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Quote:

---

Originally posted by 6IXSTRINGJACK:
the 12th or so dodge on his capacious wheel of dodges to shift his argument off of yet another losing point

---

fify

lol

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You have unread replies regarding property taxes and national defense.

I really wonder why you haven't responded on either of those topics. /sarcasm



Owned much, Kiki?

Do Right, Be Right. :)

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BoJo (Britain's Conservative PM Boris Johnson who engineered Brexit) is doing just what he recommended for Covid-19: "Taking it on the chin".

BoJo was moved to ICU last night as a precaution bc his symptoms worsened. Because he's listed as "still conscious" it's unlikely that he's on a ventilator.

At least the Queen is still tottering around!

-----------
Pity would be no more,
If we did not MAKE men poor - William Blake

#STAYTHEFUCKHOME

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Well, I set a time limit to go into Kevin's wall of shame, and time's up! But there are 61 individual lies, trolls, insults, opinions, non-facts, dodges, and implied threats in his posts through March 17 in this thread alone. And that includes a number of days where he didn't post at all. And that ALSO leaves weeks more to count!

And there's not one single fact, or link, about COVID-19.

If what you do is what you are, that's exactly what Kevin is.

So, putting him on 'ignore', since he's utterly irrelevant.

Quote:

---

Tuesday, January 21, 2020 9:21 PM
I wouldn't worry about the corona virus.
Sunday, January 26, 2020 1:41 PM
Meh... it will be fine.
Sunday, January 26, 2020 1:41 PM
But with the internet and cable news today I'm sure people are hearing about it 10 times a day at least.
Sunday, January 26, 2020 2:36 PM
you're thinking too much about it is all
Sunday, January 26, 2020 10:38 PM
people online are going all Y2K about this
Sunday, January 26, 2020 10:38 PM
Meanwhile, nobody I know IRL has even brought it up.
Thursday, January 30, 2020 10:04 AM
I'm not at all worried about this thing
Thursday, January 30, 2020 10:04 AM
people are taking this way to seriously
(Thursday, January 30, 2020 10:04 AM
I was talking to my grandma on the phone yesterday)
Sunday, February 2, 2020 3:00 AM
I'm as prepared for the unexpected as I'll ever be right now. I'll let the kids who have to deal with the future worry about things.
Sunday, February 2, 2020 12:05 PM
My take away from that is people just don't want to hear about it.
Sunday, February 2, 2020 12:05 PM
2% actually seems quite high as a mortality rate, I'll grant that, but if every single person in the world were to contract it, that would be only 150,000,000 deaths, and that's not even a drop in the bucket to the over population problem in the world.
Sunday, February 2, 2020 2:53 PM
This virus is a joke.
Sunday, February 2, 2020 2:53 PM
Nothing is going to happen.
Sunday, February 2, 2020 2:53 PM
You're going to be alright.
Monday, February 3, 2020 1:14 AM
Don't be a bitch.
Monday, February 3, 2020 6:43 PM
I expect this behavior from the lefties here. You should know better.
Wednesday, February 12, 2020 12:08 PM
just the flu
Wednesday, February 12, 2020 7:32 PM
Dumb.
Saturday, February 15, 2020 11:01 PM
I think everybody is just over reporting on this right now because they want to deflect from how awful the Democratic Party is right out of the gates in 2020.
Thursday, February 27, 2020 12:45 AM
I'm still not convinced that this isn't just a social experiment.
Thursday, February 27, 2020 12:45 AM
Its been something like 32 years and I've never known somebody with AIDS or known anybody who knew anybody with AIDS.
Saturday, February 29, 2020 6:21 AM
16,000+ people is nothing.
Saturday, February 29, 2020 2:53 PM
Wednesday, March 4, 2020 12:57 PM
I've heard new numbers for the virus fatality rate are extremely low.
0% fatality rate for those under 10.
.2% fatality rate for those under 40.
.4% fatality rate for those under 50.
Wednesday, March 4, 2020 12:57 PM
It gets a little higher from there, but not even on the level of the common flu.
Wednesday, March 4, 2020 3:53 PM
I'm not denying that Corona virus exists. Just saying that it's not scary.
Thursday, March 5, 2020 12:20 PM
lol rich people. (re cruise ships)
Friday, March 6, 2020 1:11 PM
You know how many people are going to die from smoking in America ...
Friday, March 6, 2020 1:11 PM
... by the end of December this year?
Friday, March 6, 2020 1:11 PM
Total cases of Coronavirus in America after a month is under 200?
Friday, March 6, 2020 1:11 PM
Color me unperturbed.
Monday, March 9, 2020 1:43 AM
lol
Monday, March 9, 2020 1:43 AM
If that's what living is going to be like in the future just kill me now.
Monday, March 9, 2020 1:43 AM
Never going to do any of that.
Monday, March 9, 2020 4:46 PM
I'm probably more bored hear

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Quote:

---

You have unread replies regarding property taxes and national defense.

I really wonder why you haven't responded on either of those topics. /sarcasm



Owned much, Kiki?

Do Right, Be Right. :)

---

Quote:

---

Originally posted by 1KIKI:
Well, I set a time limit to go into Kevin's wall of shame, and time's up! But there are 61 individual lies, trolls, snarks, insults, unsupported opinions, non-facts, dodges, irrelevancies, and implied threats in his posts through March 17 in this thread alone. And that includes a number of days where he didn't post at all. And that ALSO leaves weeks more to count!

And there's not one single fact, or link, about COVID-19.

If what you do is what you are, that's exactly what Kevin is.

So, putting him on 'ignore', since he's utterly irrelevant.

---

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Quote:

---

This thread. Does your refrigerator have a freezer? Uh-huh - so that's 2 freezers.

---

No, that's 1 frig and 1 freezer (since counting the frig also counts the freezer that comes with it). At least, that's what people mean here in the US when they say 'refrigerator'. I'm surprised you didn't know that.

Quote:

---

I said "pantry / storage"

---

And for all YOU know, one cupboard is all the storage available.

Do you think that would be sufficient?

Quote:

---

... your 2 freezers and fridge?

---

And repeats the lie!

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Quote:

---

Originally posted by 1KIKI:

Quote:

---

You have unread replies regarding property taxes and national defense.

I really wonder why you haven't responded on either of those topics. /sarcasm



Owned much, Kiki?

Do Right, Be Right. :)

---

Quote:

---

Originally posted by 1KIKI:
Well, I set a time limit to go into Kevin's wall of shame, and time's up! But there are 61 individual lies, trolls, snarks, insults, unsupported opinions, non-facts, dodges, irrelevancies, and implied threats in his posts through March 17 in this thread alone. And that includes a number of days where he didn't post at all. And that ALSO leaves weeks more to count!

And there's not one single fact, or link, about COVID-19.

If what you do is what you are, that's exactly what Kevin is.

So, putting him on 'ignore', since he's utterly irrelevant.

---

---

I don't give two shits about your Coomph panic. We're talking property taxes and national defense, hun.

If you didn't have anything intelligent to add to either of those conversations, you probably should have stayed out of them.


I see that you continue to do so now. Good move on your part. Good for you to not look even less intelligent than you already look.


Do Right, Be Right. :)

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Well, I set a time limit to go into Kevin's wall of shame, and time's up! But there are 61 individual lies, trolls, snarks, insults, unsupported opinions, non-facts, dodges, irrelevancies, and implied threats in his posts through March 17 in this thread alone. And that includes a number of days where he didn't post at all. And that ALSO leaves weeks more to count!

And there's not one single fact, or link, about COVID-19.

If what you do is what you are, that's exactly what Kevin is.

So, putting him on 'ignore', since he's utterly irrelevant.

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No shame here, baby, other than how ridiculous you look.

Do Right, Be Right. :)

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Quote:

---

Originally posted by 1KIKI:

Quote:

---

This thread. Does your refrigerator have a freezer? Uh-huh - so that's 2 freezers.

---

No, that's 1 frig and 1 freezer (since counting the frig also counts the freezer that comes with it). At least, that's what people mean here in the US when they say 'refrigerator'. I'm surprised you didn't know that.

Quote:

---

I said "pantry / storage"

---

And for all YOU know, one cupboard is all the storage available.

Do you think that would be sufficient?

Quote:

---

... your 2 freezers and fridge?

---

And repeats the lie!

---

Oh, I hadn't realized that CC was still pushing his lies. Thanks for responding for me.

CC, you have absolutely NO idea what I have or don't have, but that sure doesn't stop you from lying your as off, does it? Let's see ... according to you I'm a Russian troll who lives in Russia or- alternately- a Russian troll who has a ranch and multiple illegal servants in Simi Valley (I think it was) with enough food storage space for the next millenium.

Wrong on all counts, sweet cheeks. But yanno, I never really DID count up my food storage capacity until now. Let me tell you what I DON'T have: I have no "pantry", walkin or other. BUT I BET YOU DO. I don't have shelves in the cellar, because I have no cellar. BUT I BET YOU DO. I don't have a nice modern kitchen with lots of cupboards and cabinets and under-island storage. BUT I BET YOU DO.

I have ... wait for it ... I let my eyes wander over the kitchen. That cupboard is dinnerwear, that one's glassware, the drawer underneath is eating utensils, and the cabinet under that holds a 25-year old food processor and a few other small kitchen appliances. That drawer hold aluminum foil, parchment, storage bags and wax paper, the other ones hold dish towels, aprons, and oven mitts. The poorly-designed space under the oven holds bakeware, the one under the rangetop holds pots and pans. There are a couple of other drawers that hold cooking utensils: large slotted spoon, whisk, rolling pin, vegetable peeler, mandolin, measuring cups and spoons etc. Two other cabinets hold food storage containers, mixing bowls and strainers. I use everything that I store because I cook every goddamn day of the week.

When I stopped, I realized I had ONE small cupboard and ONE small cabinet for food. One frig and one SMALL freezer (one of the smallest you can buy commercially).

It's a typical small isolated unrenovated midcentury American kitchen, built in the postwar housing boom. I don't know what they were thinking when they designed them. Not a lot of storage there. It would be nice to have a farmhouse kitchen, or a nice big open plan kitchen with an island and pantry, but I don't have any of that.

But what does this have to do with Covid-19? Will you please stop shitting up the board with your lies, insinuations, personal attacks and irrelevancies?



-----------
Pity would be no more,
If we did not MAKE men poor - William Blake

#STAYTHEFUCKHOME

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Checking back through the data I've been posting, it looks like 'stay at home' is bending the curve of new cases in the US - largely due to the overwhelming contribution of NYC, and bending the curve of new cases in California, and LACounty. There are still new cases, but the numbers of new cases are lower than previously.

New deaths are lagging the decrease, because it takes about 4 weeks between infection and death. But those should be dropping in due time.

http://www.fireflyfans.net/mthread.aspx?bid=18&tid=63473&mid=1
097694#1097694

The US is still #1! in cases at 388K, Spain is less than half that at 141K, Italy is a smidge under Spain at 136K, then France and Germany at 109K and 107K respectively.

Despite egregious under-counting, the US is not going to lose its number one spot - ever.

Both Spain and Italy are on the downslope. Even though Spain is slightly worse off than Italy in terms of numbers (total cases, total deaths, and normalized to 1M) I think you hear about Italy more because the vast majority is concentrated in a very small area. So even though Italy has a first-world medical system (by which I think means level of technology and availability, not necessarily capacity), it was severely overwhelmed in a smaller area. The US equivalent is NYC.

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KIKI your link takes me back to page 1. Can you repost the link to take me to the updsated data?

But in rereading page 1, I see you've been posting about this since BEFORE the first case in the USA! How far we've come since then!

-----------
Pity would be no more,
If we did not MAKE men poor - William Blake

#STAYTHEFUCKHOME

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Sorry about that! Hopefully this is the correct one.


http://www.fireflyfans.net/mthread.aspx?bid=18&tid=63473&mid=1
097699#1097699

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Quote:

---

Originally posted by 1KIKI:
It looks like the US is on track to reach 10,000 deaths by April 14, 2020.

And if things continue at the same pace, there'll be 100,000 deaths by April 27.

It appears to be expanding at a rate of X10 every 13days.

---

10,000 deaths was reached April 6, 2020 (not too bad an estimate for eyeball-extrapolating a graph). But the curve is wiggling - the rate of increase went up which is why 10k was earlier, then it went way down. Over the last week, it appears to be expanding at a rate of X10 every 20days. If it continues at its recent pace, it'll be 20 days from April 6, 2020 to 100,000 deaths, or about April 26, 2020.

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Almost 2,000 deaths in one day. I think prolly more, since some deaths aren't being properly recorded. That makes it the SECOND-leading cause of death, right behind heart attacks which clock in at about 2,300 per day.

Whew!

-----------
Pity would be no more,
If we did not MAKE men poor - William Blake

#STAYTHEFUCKHOME

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Since we have absolutely no way of knowing who is and who is not infected, except for people who are extremely ill going to hospitals that actually have the ability to test for the virus, there is zero reason to think that there have actually been less cases after the lockdown.

You're reading your own desires into results of a grand "scientific" test that doesn't have any constant and has far too many variables.

Don't lie to yourself.

Do Right, Be Right. :)

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Well, I set a time limit to go into Kevin's wall of shame, and time's up! But there are 61 individual lies, trolls, snarks, insults, unsupported opinions, non-facts, dodges, irrelevancies, and implied threats in his posts through March 17 in this thread alone. And that includes a number of days where he didn't post at all. And that ALSO leaves weeks more to count!

And there's not one single fact, or link, about COVID-19.

If what you do is what you are, that's exactly what Kevin is.

So, putting him on 'ignore', since he's utterly irrelevant.

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Since we have absolutely no way of knowing who is and who is not infected, except for people who are extremely ill going to hospitals that actually have the ability to test for the virus, there is zero reason to think that there have actually been less cases after the lockdown.

You're reading your own desires into results of a grand "scientific" test that doesn't have any constant and has far too many variables.

Don't lie to yourself.

Do Right, Be Right. :)

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Well, I set a time limit to go into Kevin's wall of shame, and time's up! But there are 61 individual lies, trolls, snarks, insults, unsupported opinions, non-facts, dodges, irrelevancies, and implied threats in his posts through March 17 in this thread alone. And that includes a number of days where he didn't post at all. And that ALSO leaves weeks more to count!

And there's not one single fact, or link, about COVID-19.

If what you do is what you are, that's exactly what Kevin is.

So, putting him on 'ignore', since he's utterly irrelevant.

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Since we have absolutely no way of knowing who is and who is not infected, except for people who are extremely ill going to hospitals that actually have the ability to test for the virus, there is zero reason to think that there have actually been less cases after the lockdown.

You're reading your own desires into results of a grand "scientific" test that doesn't have any constant and has far too many variables.

Don't lie to yourself.

Do Right, Be Right. :)

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I heard about, but have not been able to find a follow-up article on the fact that the UK's NHS deemed the serological test kits to be not acccurate enough, and won't distribute them. I don't know if the problem is poor sensitivity or lack of specificity. There is ANOTHER serological finger-stick test for Covid-19 antibodies which the company (falsely) claimed was approved by the FDA (BodySphere) https://www.cnn.com/2020/04/02/health/coronavirus-test-false-fda-autho
rization/index.html

As far as I can tell, the only serological test approved by the FDA by Cellex https://www.medtechdive.com/news/fda-authorizes-cellex-coronavirus-ant
ibodies-test/575451/ is for in-office and in-laboratory testing. So, no five-minute or two-minute or in-home test yet, altho I'm sure one will be developed at some point (It's a tried-and-true approach)



-----------
Pity would be no more,
If we did not MAKE men poor - William Blake

#STAYTHEFUCKHOME

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The question is, what would be the point of a home test?

It's not going to do you any good in regards to going back to work or not having to abide any unconstitutional STAYTHEFUCKHOME laws.

I don't see how bragging rights is going to help put people back to work so they can put food on the table, or help anybody get out from under their Constitutional rights being trampled.

Do Right, Be Right. :)

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In the meantime, while some people are chasing the ever-elusive "forsythia" (If you've seen "Contagion" you know what I mean) people are being treated with the plasma of recovered Covid-19 patients. (Too many links, so I'll just go with the government's choice) So there may be some incentive for various health organizations to expand serological testing, not just to answer the burning questions "How many people have been infected?" and "Are we close to herd immunity yet?" but also to look for donors. Maybe the bait will be ... "Do you want a test? Then you have to sign up to be a donor".

https://www.fda.gov/vaccines-blood-biologics/investigational-new-drug-
ind-or-device-exemption-ide-process-cber/recommendations-investigational-covid-19-convalescent-plasma


-----------
Pity would be no more,
If we did not MAKE men poor - William Blake

#STAYTHEFUCKHOME

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SIX, you're irrational. SOME things trump (ahem!) your so-called Constitutional rights. When various epidemics and pandemics swept the world, it required that people change their behavior. To curb the TB epidemics that would sweep thru early USA, people had to give up their right to spit on the sidewalk and their right to share drinking glasses. People with TB were quarantined.

Nobody has a "god-given" right to spit in the village drinking well. Reality: It is as it is.



-----------
Pity would be no more,
If we did not MAKE men poor - William Blake

#STAYTHEFUCKHOME

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dbl

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Quote:

---

Originally posted by SIGNYM:
In the meantime, while some people are chasing the ever-elusive "forsythia" (If you've seen "Contagion" you know what I mean) people are being treated with the plasma of recovered Covid-19 patients. (Too many links, so I'll just go with the government's choice) So there may be some incentive for various health organizations to expand serological testing, not just to answer the burning questions "How many people have been infected?" and "Are we close to herd immunity yet?" but also to look for donors. Maybe the bait will be ... "Do you want a test? Then you have to sign up to be a donor".

https://www.fda.gov/vaccines-blood-biologics/investigational-new-drug-
ind-or-device-exemption-ide-process-cber/recommendations-investigational-covid-19-convalescent-plasma


-----------
Pity would be no more,
If we did not MAKE men poor - William Blake

#STAYTHEFUCKHOME

---

I saw some of the technology on a video. They don't just look for 'antibodies', they do a semi-quantitative test for 'how much', as determined by the depth of a yellow color in the individuals tests in the individual wells of a multi-well plate.

I saw that they they carefully measured everything in (the one person I saw was using perfect automatic pipettor technique!), what I don't know is if they have a plate-well reader that quantifies the color, or if they just do some kind of visual-matching cutoff.

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Quote:

---

Originally posted by SIGNYM:
I heard about, but have not been able to find a follow-up article on the fact that the UK's NHS deemed the serological test kits to be not acccurate enough, and won't distribute them. I don't know if the problem is poor sensitivity or lack of specificity. There is ANOTHER serological finger-stick test for Covid-19 antibodies which the company (falsely) claimed was approved by the FDA (BodySphere) https://www.cnn.com/2020/04/02/health/coronavirus-test-false-fda-autho
rization/index.html

As far as I can tell, the only serological test approved by the FDA by Cellex https://www.medtechdive.com/news/fda-authorizes-cellex-coronavirus-ant
ibodies-test/575451/ is for in-office and in-laboratory testing. So, no five-minute or two-minute or in-home test yet, altho I'm sure one will be developed at some point (It's a tried-and-true approach)



-----------
Pity would be no more,
If we did not MAKE men poor - William Blake

#STAYTHEFUCKHOME

---

Thanks for tracking that down!

Just fyi, the in-home version was a finger-stick test, not something as handy as urine testing. Finger-sticks are quick, but relatively inaccurate as tests go, even though diabetics rely on them. There's just too much variation in blood flow to the fingertips, how well they've been lanced, how much squeezing people do to get enough blood, and so forth. So aside from any inherent technology issues there might be, the technique itself tends to poor results.

I imagine the tests need a blood draw.

Also, they're not a yes/no test - they require other clinical data.

Quote:

---

The test, however, "should not be used as the sole basis for diagnosis and can only aid in the diagnosis of patients in conjunction with a medical review of symptoms and results of other laboratory tests," FDA said in its authorization letter to ?Cellex, a Research Triangle Park, North Carolina-based firm behind the test.

---

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And FINALLY!!!

Blue shop towels filter small particles better than cotton!

Quote:

---

Using blue shop towels in homemade face masks can filter particles 2x to 3x better than cotton, 3 clothing designers discover after testing dozens of fabrics

..."We spent a few days researching and brainstorming any material that could filter: coffee filters, batting, window shades, Swiffer, interfacing, etc., all the way to more technical materials that are available to specialized industrial sectors like aviation, oil refinery, medical fields," Schempf said.

They bought a $1,400 particulate-counter device from Grainger that measures filtration ability down to 0.3 microns and spent another 10 sleepless days testing all the fabrics they could find.

They wanted a material they could buy as easily as cotton but that balanced filtration with breathability — they discovered that HEPA vacuum-cleaner bags, for instance, had great filtration but were too suffocating to wear.

The ideal material turned out to be stretchy blue shop towels made from a polyester hydro knit.

Inserting two of these towels into an ordinary cotton mask brought filtration up to 93% of particles as small as 0.3 microns, the smallest their machine could test. Meanwhile, the cotton masks filtered 60% of particles at best in their tests, Schempf said.

Polyester hydro knit towels are readily available at hardware and automotive stores. The two brands they tested were ToolBox's shop towel and ZEP's industrial blue towel. Interestingly, Scott's pro shop towels, which are also made with a hydro knit fabric, didn't work as well, Schempf said.

---

https://www.businessinsider.com/homemade-mask-using-hydro-knit-shop-to
wel-filters-better-2020-4?op=1

Thanks to hubby for finding this!

-----------
Pity would be no more,
If we did not MAKE men poor - William Blake

#STAYTHEFUCKHOME

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Have fun breathing through them.

Do Right, Be Right. :)

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Quote:

---

Originally posted by SIGNYM:
SIX, you're irrational. SOME things trump (ahem!) your so-called Constitutional rights. When various epidemics and pandemics swept the world, it required that people change their behavior. To curb the TB epidemics that would sweep thru early USA, people had to give up their right to spit on the sidewalk and their right to share drinking glasses. People with TB were quarantined.

Nobody has a "god-given" right to spit in the village drinking well. Reality: It is as it is.



-----------
Pity would be no more,
If we did not MAKE men poor - William Blake

#STAYTHEFUCKHOME

---

Apples to Oranges.

Having your ability to spit on the street shelved is quite a bit different than being on what amounts to 24/7 lockdown/quarantine for a majority of US citizens regardless if they're healthy or not, along with losing their jobs that they don't even know will still exist when these Communist drills are over.


I'm sure Bezos owned WaPo is going to tell you how great everything is after the fact though, yanno... when 50% of Ma and Pa shops don't make it through 2021 in the aftermath and Amazon.com becomes the go-to place for most Americans to buy all of their shit they don't need.

All it takes is a month to 6 weeks to ingrain new habits into people. When you force everybody to live a certain way for a long enough time, that might be the way they choose to live when they're no longer being forced.


Why do you suppose they voluntarily gave out all that "free" money and unemployment?

People would not behave long enough under these new conditions for the new habits to form if they weren't being paid to do so.

Do Right, Be Right. :)

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Hey KIKI, the whole thing is interesting but at 17:14 he starts a discussion of a paper in the South China Morning Post (SCMP) describing a study of 174 people who had recovered from Covid-19 and then tested for antibody titers. The authors found that about 30% of the recovered patients (mostly young) had antibody titers too low to be considered protective.

-----------
Pity would be no more,
If we did not MAKE men poor - William Blake

#STAYTHEFUCKHOME

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There's one other virus I know of that behaves like that, and it's Hantavirus, though they're completely different virus families.

Children (before puberty) aren't affected, but adults are.

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Quote:

---

Originally posted by SIGNYM:
Hey KIKI, the whole thing is interesting but at 17:14 he starts a discussion of a paper in the South China Morning Post (SCMP) describing a study of 174 people who had recovered from Covid-19 and then tested for antibody titers. The authors found that about 30% of the recovered patients (mostly young) had antibody titers too low to be considered protective.


#STAYTHEFUCKHOME

---

If that's true, then there is zero reason to #STAYTHEFUCKHOME.

Unless you're suggesting that we just do this for the rest of our lives.




EDITED TO ADD:

mediabiasfactcheck.com can't even be bothered to review them.

https://mediabiasfactcheck.com/sources-pending/





EDITED TO ADD 2:

Here's the "study" being referenced: https://www.medrxiv.org/content/10.1101/2020.03.30.20047365v1

Take a look at the "Tweets Referencing This Article" at the bottom of the page. Kind of funny how the same three replies show up over and over and over and over and over and over and over again by different "people".

Looks like a huge misinformation farm spreading this "study" all over Twitter to me.


EDITED TO ADD 3:

I'm going to quote/post the entire string of Twitter replies here even though it's probably going to look like a garbled mess, for posterity.

Quote:

---

Proud Uncle Cliff
@cliffsatton

RT @florian_krammer: So, I looked at this: https://t.co/6xl42BsUl4. Of course it is a pseudotyped particle entry assays. But out of 175 ver…
03:08AM
Michelle Wille
@DuckSwabber

RT @florian_krammer: So, I looked at this: https://t.co/6xl42BsUl4. Of course it is a pseudotyped particle entry assays. But out of 175 ver…
03:07AM
Jose A.
@jacmbrd

RT @angie_rasmussen: Agreed and thank you, Dr. Krammer. Besides neutralizing antibody is not the whole entire story—the immune system is la…
03:03AM
????????????
@baby_mead0ws

alarmism really is driving a high price nowadays!
03:02AM
n
@hijodeprada

RT @florian_krammer: So, I looked at this: https://t.co/6xl42BsUl4. Of course it is a pseudotyped particle entry assays. But out of 175 ver…
03:02AM
Peter Williams
@peter_c_william

RT @florian_krammer: So, I looked at this: https://t.co/6xl42BsUl4. Of course it is a pseudotyped particle entry assays. But out of 175 ver…
03:01AM
eleanorina
@_eleanorina

RT @florian_krammer: So, I looked at this: https://t.co/6xl42BsUl4. Of course it is a pseudotyped particle entry assays. But out of 175 ver…
03:01AM
????????????
@baby_mead0ws

RT @florian_krammer: So, I looked at this: https://t.co/6xl42BsUl4. Of course it is a pseudotyped particle entry assays. But out of 175 ver…
03:01AM
Andrew Riddle
@AndrewRiddle36

And we don't even know that you can expect to only get COVID-19 once. We know that SARS antibodies were mostly gone 3 years on, and this preprint found 30% of COVID-19 patients had big reductions in antibodies 3 *months* on. https://t.co/kfDrVyyHRt
03:00AM
Epidemiology+Virology Experts. Fighting COVID-19
@EpiD18329833

RT @AdamJKucharski: Interesting preliminary data on neutralising antibody responses in recovered COVID-19 patients. Seems there can be a wi…
03:00AM
?????????????????? ????????????, ?????? ???? ????
@preopticarea

RT @aetiology: @ChelseaClinton @ChuckWendig @DoctorYasmin The person you tweeted earlier has a lot of fans but often is out of his depth. S…
02:58AM
Janet Kay??????
@tinyboo49

RT @aetiology: @ChelseaClinton @ChuckWendig @DoctorYasmin The person you tweeted earlier has a lot of fans but often is out of his depth. S…
02:58AM
Eric
@EtonnantNon4456

RT @florian_krammer: So, I looked at this: https://t.co/6xl42BsUl4. Of course it is a pseudotyped particle entry assays. But out of 175 ver…
02:58AM
?? Michael C?????????????????¸. Bazaco ??
@MCBazacoPhD

RT @aetiology: @ChelseaClinton @ChuckWendig @DoctorYasmin The person you tweeted earlier has a lot of fans but often is out of his depth. S…
02:57AM
Eric
@EtonnantNon4456

RT @angie_rasmussen:

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Quote:

---

Originally posted by SIGNYM:
Hey KIKI, the whole thing is interesting but at 17:14 he starts a discussion of a paper in the South China Morning Post (SCMP) describing a study of 174 people who had recovered from Covid-19 and then tested for antibody titers. The authors found that about 30% of the recovered patients (mostly young) had antibody titers too low to be considered protective.

-----------
Pity would be no more,
If we did not MAKE men poor - William Blake

#STAYTHEFUCKHOMEPart of what it's about was what I posted here:

---

Quote:

---

http://www.fireflyfans.net/mthread.aspx?bid=18&tid=63571&p=5
Nobody knows if those antibodies are actually protective in the first place. Maybe they are, maybe they aren't. Some people were truly reinfected (not just relapsed) and AFAIK there hasn't been a study on it.

Nobody knows how high an antibody concentration (titer) you need to have to be protected.

Nobody knows how broadly applicable those antibodies might be to minor - or major - variations in the strains going around.

And of course, as you mentioned nobody knows how long they last. They could be like Noro virus (cruise-ship trots) antibodies that fizzle in a few weeks, and there you are, with another lovely case after you just got over your last case.

---

By protective I was referring to 'neutralizing'.

Giving people immunoglobulin is an old-timey treatment, like HepB immunoglobulins, where people had a general idea that it worked but not a real understanding. So, like the buildings of the day, it was under-designed and over-built. You gave people A LOT of pooled immunoglobulins, and crossed your fingers.

In a crisis it can be kind of a hail-Mary, but it can sometimes be surprisingly successful. I forget the date, but quite a ways back when - 70's? 80's? - when there was an Ebola outbreak, a recovered patient's Ig's were given to I think 8 or 9 people, and all but one survived.

So those were 'good' antibodies - protective, neutralizing. (OTOH people also develop antibodies to HIV, but they don't stop the progression to AIDS or infectiousness to others. So those are 'bad' antibodies - ineffective.) Anyway, that Ebola survivor's lymphocytes were lovingly cultured and coaxed to produce their antibodies in large enough quantities to research.

As I mentioned earlier, those lymphocytes are from many clones producing many different antibodies (polyclonal); with each clone producing a specific antibody (monoclonal). After studying individual cell lines, it was determined that one particular clone was making very effective neutralizing antibodies. So that clone's antibody was studied to see which particular structure it was attaching itself to on the Ebola virus. And that viral structure in turn was studied to see what parts in particular were important for the immune system to recognize. And from there, an Ebola vaccine was created, which is 70% effective.

I went into all of that to illustrate how fraught the topic is. It's a long, long way from finding antibodies to anywhere else - either counting on them to make people immune or using them as a treatment or toward making a vaccine. A LOT has to go into studying them, because they may or may not be particularly efficient or effective or abundant or long-lasting or ... Simply finding antibodies is necessary, but not sufficient.

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Quote:

---

Originally posted by 6IXSTRINGJACK:Take a look at the "Tweets Referencing This Article" at the bottom of the page. Kind of funny how the same three replies show up over and over and over and over and over and over and over again by different "people".

Looks like a huge misinformation farm spreading this "study" all over Twitter to me.

---

Not funny. "RT" at the beginning stands for "ReTweet," so of course it's the same. Retweeting something means you agree or you want your followers to see what you're interested in.

But do let your conspiracy mind see what it wants to see.

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How's this for conspiracy theory about a conspiracy theory.

Funding information for study:

Quote:

---

Funding Statement

This work was supported by the National Major Science and Technology Projects of China (2017ZX10202102 and 2018ZX10301403), National Natural Science Foundation of China (31771008), Hundred Talent Program of Shanghai Municipal Health Commission (2018BR08), and Chinese Academy of Medical Sciences (2019PT350002).

---

Yup. Let's believe China now because it feeds into the fear that we're so desperate to have justified.

I mean, China has been SO honest about everything up to this point, right?




For a guy who has spent three years believing Putin has been influencing American elections, you're pretty fucking dumb about this right now.

Do Right, Be Right. :)

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CORONAVRUS MAY REACTIVATE IN CURED PATIENTS, S KOREAN HEALTH AUTHORITY SAYS

Quote:

---

Coronavirus may 'reactivate' in cured patients, Korean health authority says
A man speaks to a nurse during at a testing booth outside Yangji hospital in Seoul on March 17, 2020.

SEOUL (BLOOMBERG) - The coronavirus may be "reactivating" in people who have been cured of the illness, according to Korea's Centres for Disease Control and Prevention (KCDC).

About 51 patients classed as having been cured in South Korea have tested positive again, the KCDC said in a briefing. Rather than being infected again, the virus may have been reactivated in these people, given they tested positive again shortly after being released from quarantine, said Mr Jeong Eun-kyeong, director-general of the KCDC.

"While we are putting more weight on reactivation as the possible cause, we are conducting a comprehensive study on this," Mr Jeong said. "There have been many cases when a patient during treatment will test negative one day and positive another." A patient is deemed fully recovered when two tests conducted with a 24-hour interval show negative results.

The KCDC will conduct an epidemiological probe into the cases, he said.

South Korea was one of the earliest countries to see a large-scale coronavirus outbreak, but the country has recorded 200 deaths and a falling new case tally since peaking at 1,189 on Feb 29. One of the world's most expansive testing programmes and a tech-driven approach to tracing infections has helped the country contain its epidemic without lockdowns or shuttering businesses.

South Korea reported 39 new cases on Thursday (April 9) for a total of 10,423.

Fear of re-infection in recovered patients is also growing in China, where the virus first emerged last December, after reports that some tested positive again - and even died from the disease - after supposedly recovering and leaving hospital. There's little understanding of why this happens, although some believe that the problem may lie in inconsistencies in test results.

Epidemiologists around the world are in a race to find out more about the virus that causes Covid-19. The pathogen's rapid global spread has recently seen the focus shift to patients who contract the virus but display few or atypical symptoms. South Korea has been at the forefront of tracking these cases, which are causing particular concern in China, where the epidemic is showing signs of coming under control.

---

https://www.straitstimes.com/asia/east-asia/coronavirus-may-reactivate
-in-cured-patients-korean-health-authority-says

Reported by the Straits Time (Singapore) and S Korea

This tends to run along the same idea that maybe some people don't make robust antibodies and therefore don't fully inactivate the virus.

There is a precedent with chickenpox, which manages to hide out in the nerve cells, only to re-emerge later as shingles. Also HIV: antibodies don't confer protection. "Typhoid Mary" was an asymptomatic carrier of typhus.

I think one thing that I wonder about is ... is the second infection worse than, the same as, or better than, the first? If the second infection is milder than the first, there may be some benefit to running out and getting infected. If the second infection is worse than, or about the same as the first, then all you're doing is creating more disease-carriers.

Clearly, there's a lot about this virus we don't understand. In addition to being a retrovirus, it seems to have some HIV-like characteristics.

I would suggest that since this particular coronavirus is a retrovirus (RNA-based, as opposed to DNA-bsed) that antiretroviral therapy be looked at. I have seen reports (too many to link) that treating doctors are throwing everything and the kitchen sink (hodroxychorloquine, azithromycin, zinc, beta-interferon, plasma, and anti-retrovirals) at this thing. I hope that one of these will be successful.

As an aside, the reason (if you listened to the po

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Speaking of hodroxychorloquine and fake news...

I'm surprised nobody talked about this lady and her dead husband in the RWED.

Do Right, Be Right. :)

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Quote:

---

Originally posted by 6IXSTRINGJACK:

For a guy who has spent three years believing Putin has been influencing American elections, you're pretty fucking dumb about this right now.

---

You're the guy who didn't even know what retweet was - not very smart throwing around comments about intelligence right now.

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Quote:

---

Originally posted by 6IXSTRINGJACK:
Speaking of hodroxychorloquine and fake news...
I'm surprised nobody talked about this lady and her dead husband in the RWED.

---

Talk about a nothing burger - dude, you are so desperate. She totally stoned him. Did you even listen to it??

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Actually, if you look at the data, I wonder whether antibodies (immunoglobulins) are the most effective way to clear the virus. If young people seem to do better but have fewer antibodies (at least to the spike proteins) and older people have more spike protein antibodies but don't fare as well, maybe other parts of the immune system (or antibodies to other parts of the virus) are more effective at inactivating it.

I don't know much about the immune system, other than there have got to be at least a dozen separate components that turn it on, and off (cytokines, antibodies/plasma cells, T cells, macrophages, interferons, steroids, calcineurin, etc) Every time I look itup, I bump into at least two other things I didn't know.

-----------
Pity would be no more,
If we did not MAKE men poor - William Blake

#STAYTHEFUCKHOME

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Quote:

---

Originally posted by captaincrunch:

Quote:

---

Originally posted by 6IXSTRINGJACK:
Speaking of hodroxychorloquine and fake news...
I'm surprised nobody talked about this lady and her dead husband in the RWED.

---

Talk about a nothing burger - dude, you are so desperate. She totally stoned him. Did you even listen to it??

---

She wasn't interested in the least in hearing or telling the truth.

That was a great video showing how uninterested your Legacy Media is in actually telling you the truth when they have an agenda to push.



And I'd love to hear how I'm the one desperate here. I'm not the one who went out and bought a second fridge and spends his days cowering in fear right now.

You're going to get it. If you're weak, you will die.



Do Right, Be Right. :)

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Quote:

---

Originally posted by SIGNYM:
Actually, if you look at the data, I wonder whether antibodies (immunoglobulins) are the most effective way to clear the virus. If young people seem to do better but have fewer antibodies (at least to the spike proteins) and older people have more spike protein antibodies but don't fare as well, maybe other parts of the immune system (or antibodies to other parts of the virus) are more effective at inactivating it.

I don't know much about the immune system, other than there have got to be at least a dozen separate components that turn it on, and off (cytokines, antibodies/plasma cells, T cells, macrophages, interferons, steroids, calcineurin, etc) Every time I look it up, I bump into at least two other things I didn't know.

-----------
Pity would be no more,
If we did not MAKE men poor - William Blake

#STAYTHEFUCKHOME

---

I don't think ANYBODY really understands the immune system! If it was a complete body of knowledge we still wouldn't be struggling with cancers and bacteria and viruses and autoimmune diseases!

Anyway, I can believe that SARS-COV-2 sometimes gets reactivated. I can believe people sometimes get reinfected. And I can believe the tests are sometimes bunk! I think what's important epidemiologically is whether these people are infectious. They may be producing enough antibody to (minimally) target the virus for immune destruction or (maximally) neutralize it, and either one will help keep it from being infectious. But you can still detect the RNA of a virus that has antibodies attached to it, so RNA tests will still be positive.

Like so much about the virus, there are a lot of unknowns!

/ETA: that's why I think the pathway to treatments and vaccines may be more tortuous that people think./

SARS-COV-2 is what they call a 'positive sense RNA' virus. "DNA makes RNA and RNA makes protein." A positive sense RNA is used directly as a template to make proteins. "RNA makes protein." (A negative sense RNA is the complement to a positive sense RNA. So a negative sense RNA needs to be transcribed by enzymes into a positive sense RNA in order to create proteins. A retrovirus is an RNA virus that creates DNA from its RNA template, and then inserts its own DNA into the host genome.)

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So, I went shopping today at my usual two stores. (Yanno, GSTRING, to fill up the pantry, basement, numerous cabinets and cupboards and two freezers... that I don't have ) and it's always been an interesting point to see how many are wearing masks.

The first two weeks dear daughter and I went, we were the very fashion-forward two. By the third week, there were maybe one or two (or six, in the bigger store) aside from us. By the fourth week, about 30% in the small store and 50% in the bigger store were wearing masks, but none of the employees were.

Thus last time, the smaller store got a 97%, as far as I can tell. ALL of the employees were wearing masks, and nearly everyone else was, with the exception of three people (two men and a woman.)

The larger store got a 95%. All employees were wearing procedure masks, with the exception of one dood who obviously promised to wear a bandana and just as obviously decided to slip it down to his neck.

Many people were wearing handsewn cloth masks or procedure (paper) masks, a few were wearing bandanas, and some N95 respirators had found their way out into the populace.

The store was way more crowded than I feel comfortable with. I don't know if that's because it's a Friday (but who the heck is working a regular workweek anymore?) or bcause it was raining yesterday and people put off their Thursday shopping for Friday. Like I did.

Anyway, I think more people are wearing masks bc the CDC changed its tune. Can you imagine how many might have been wearing masks before, if the CDC hadn't screwed up the message for two months???

#WEAR A MASK.

-----------
Pity would be no more,
If we did not MAKE men poor - William Blake

#STAYTHEFUCKHOME

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Yeah ...

April 03, 2020 The CDC recommends all people wear masks outside the home.
April 03, 2020 NYC asks all people wear masks outside the home.
April 03, 2020 LACounty asks all people wear masks outside the home.

FWIW

April 07, 2020 The City of Los Angeles requires all people wear masks outside the home.

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Italy, new cases and new deaths.

Did you notice something funny about this chart? There is a roughly seven-day sinusoid in the numbers. Must be that coroners, labs etc don't work on weekends, or that the numbers don't get reported until Monday?

-----------
Pity would be no more,
If we did not MAKE men poor - William Blake

#STAYTHEFUCKHOME

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Coronavirus infection may cause lasting damage throughout the body, doctors fear


By Melissa HealyStaff Writer
April 10, 2020
3:03 PM

For a world grappling with the new coronavirus, it’s becoming increasingly clear that even when the pandemic is over, it won’t really be over.

Now doctors are beginning to worry that for patients who have survived COVID-19, the same may be true.

For the sickest patients, infection with the new coronavirus is proving to be a full-body assault, causing damage well beyond the lungs. And even after patients who become severely ill have recovered and cleared the virus, physicians have begun seeing evidence of the infection’s lingering effects.

In a study posted this week, scientists in China examined the blood test results of 34 COVID-19 patients over the course of their hospitalization. In those who survived mild and severe disease alike, the researchers found that many of the biological measures had “failed to return to normal.”

Chief among the worrisome test results were readings that suggested these apparently recovered patients continued to have impaired liver function. That was the case even after two tests for the live virus had come back negative and the patients were cleared to be discharged.

At the same time, as cardiologists are contending with the immediate effects of COVID-19 on the heart, they’re asking how much of the damage could be long-lasting. In an early study of COVID-19 patients in China, heart failure was seen in nearly 12% of those who survived, including in some who had shown no signs of respiratory distress.

When lungs do a poor job of delivering oxygen to the body, the heart can come under severe stress and may emerge weaker. That’s concerning enough in an illness that typically causes breathing problems. But when even those without respiratory distress sustain injury to the heart, doctors have to wonder whether they have underestimated COVID-19’s ability to wreak lasting havoc.

“COVID-19 is not just a respiratory disorder,” said Dr. Harlan Krumholtz, a cardiologist at Yale University. “It can affect the heart, the liver, the kidneys, the brain, the endocrine system and the blood system.”

There are no long-term survivors of this wholly new disease: Even its first victims in China are little more than three months removed from their ordeal. And physicians have been too busy treating the acutely ill to closely monitor the progress of the roughly 370,000 people worldwide known to have recovered from COVID-19.

Still, doctors are worried that in its wake, some organs whose function has been knocked off kilter will not recover quickly, or completely. That could leave patients more vulnerable for months or years to come.

“I think there will be long-term sequelae,” said Yale cardiologist Dr. Joseph Brennan, using the medical term for a disease’s downstream effects.

“I don’t know that for real,” he cautioned. “But this disease is so overwhelming” that some of the recovered are likely to face ongoing health concerns, he said.

Another question that could take years to answer is whether the SARS-CoV-2 virus that causes COVID-19 may lie dormant in the body for years and spring back later in different form.

It wouldn’t be the first virus to behave that way. After a chicken pox infection, for instance, the herpes virus that causes the illness hides quietly for decades and often emerges as the painful affliction shingles. The virus that causes hepatitis B can sow the seeds of liver cancer years later. And in the months after the West African Ebola epidemic subsided in 2016, the virus responsible for that illness was found to have taken up residence in the vitreous fluid of some of its victims’ eyes, causing blindness or vision impairment in 40% of those affected.

Given SARS-CoV-2’s affinity for lung tissue, doctors quickly suspected that some recovered COVID-19 patients would sustain lasting damage to their lungs. In infections involvin

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Quote:

---

Originally posted by 1KIKI:
Yeah ...

April 03, 2020 The CDC recommends all people wear masks outside the home.
April 03, 2020 NYC asks all people wear masks outside the home.
April 03, 2020 LACounty asks all people wear masks outside the home.

FWIW

April 07, 2020 The City of Los Angeles requires all people wear masks outside the home.

---

Meanwhile....

April 10th, nobody in America can buy a mask.

lol


Doesn't matter. We're all going to get it.

Do Right, Be Right. :)

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Quote:

---

Originally posted by SIGNYM:
So, I went shopping today at my usual two stores. (Yanno, GSTRING, to fill up the pantry, basement, numerous cabinets and cupboards and two freezers... that I don't have ) and it's always been an interesting point to see how many are wearing masks.

The first two weeks dear daughter and I went, we were the very fashion-forward two. By the third week, there were maybe one or two (or six, in the bigger store) aside from us. By the fourth week, about 30% in the small store and 50% in the bigger store were wearing masks, but none of the employees were.

Thus last time, the smaller store got a 97%, as far as I can tell. ALL of the employees were wearing masks, and nearly everyone else was, with the exception of three people (two men and a woman.)

The larger store got a 95%. All employees were wearing procedure masks, with the exception of one dood who obviously promised to wear a bandana and just as obviously decided to slip it down to his neck.

Many people were wearing handsewn cloth masks or procedure (paper) masks, a few were wearing bandanas, and some N95 respirators had found their way out into the populace.

The store was way more crowded than I feel comfortable with. I don't know if that's because it's a Friday (but who the heck is working a regular workweek anymore?) or bcause it was raining yesterday and people put off their Thursday shopping for Friday. Like I did.

Anyway, I think more people are wearing masks bc the CDC changed its tune. Can you imagine how many might have been wearing masks before, if the CDC hadn't screwed up the message for two months???

#WEAR A MASK.

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Pity would be no more,
If we did not MAKE men poor - William Blake

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---

Nobody is wearing masks here. Maybe 5% of customers when I shop, and zero percent of employees.

Do Right, Be Right. :)

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So, related to SIX's non-update on the 25-year-old pharmacy tech (who SIX insists committed suicide) I did bring up Sweden as an example of a nation whose reporting we can trust that has decided to do nothing about Covid...

I decided to look them up on the worldometer https://www.worldometers.info/coronavirus/

which has a sortable table (you can sort by nation, or # cases, or deaths per million, or on any of the columns that they present.) I chose deaths per million as the relevant stat to look at. Tiny San Marino is the highest, at 1000+, followed by Spain (334 as of today), Andorra, Italy, Belgium, France etc. Sweden is tied at 11th place with 86. Significantly higher than the other Nordic countries, but not bad for a nation determined to do "nothing".

So, we should follow that stat and see if it zooms up, if Sweden bubbles up to near the top of the list, or if their ranking stays pretty constant relative to nations that are doing a lot more.



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WE'RE #1! (Again)

We broke the 2000 deaths/day threshhold.

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The "Nation State" of California really, REALLY wants to separate from the rest of the US.

I propose that New York do so as well.

More than 1/3 of the deaths in the entire country are in New York with a vast majority of those being in the city itself.

Do Right, Be Right. :)

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Well this is encouraging. New cases in the US have stabilized out in the 30,000 - 35,000 per day range in the last week. Let's see if it holds.

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I've mentioned Sweden as the bellweather nation for the "do nothing" approach, and I'm going to bring it up here again for the sake of continuity and completeness.

There were other "do nothing" nations, most recently Belarus, which had early on decided to keep the economy going but is now quietly changing its approach and asking Russia for help. Brazil continues its "do nothing" policy. India, in reality, can do nothing, altho to government virtue-signals its lockdown.

Neither Modi (India) nor Bolsanaro (Brazil) have the capacity to even know what's going on in their infamous slums/favelas. People could be keeling over at home from Covid, but until bodies start piling up in the streets, like in Ecuador, nobody will be the wiser. The total number of deaths will probably be drastically under-reported, not only because the governments have an interest in doing so, but their medical infrastructure is so woefully underpowered compared to the size of the population it would be a Herculean task just to come up with a decent tally.

In those other threads I mentioned that we can rely on Sweden's reporting, partly because Sweden has a well-developed medical and reporting system.

But then I remembered ... Sweden notoriously under-reported crimes by ME migrants, and made it illegal to even mention the ethnicity of the criminals. So Sweden isn't necessarily transparent either. Altho they have the capability for proper reporting, their history with their migrant problem shows they don't mind bending the truth ... alot ... in favor of government policy.

So, I would use their stats with caution, and be on the lookout for things like "excess deaths", not necessarily related to Covid-19.

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Quote:

---

Originally posted by 1KIKI:
Well this is encouraging. New cases in the US have stabilized out in the 30,000 - 35,000 per day range in the last week. Let's see if it holds.

---

Since new deaths new lag cases by four(?) weeks, we should expect to see a corresponding stabilization in new deaths later.

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Quote:

---

Originally posted by SIGNYM:
I've mentioned Sweden as the bellweather nation for the "do nothing" approach, and I'm going to bring it up here again for the sake of continuity and completeness.

There were other "do nothing" nations, most recently Belarus, which had early on decided to keep the economy going but is now quietly changing its approach and asking Russia for help. Brazil continues its "do nothing" policy. India, in reality, can do nothing, altho to government virtue-signals its lockdown.

Neither Modi (India) nor Bolsanaro (Brazil) have the capacity to even know what's going on in their infamous slums/favelas. People could be keeling over at home from Covid, but until bodies start piling up in the streets, like in Ecuador, nobody will be the wiser. The total number of deaths will probably be drastically under-reported, not only because the governments have an interest in doing so, but their medical infrastructure is so woefully underpowered compared to the size of the population it would be a Herculean task just to come up with a decent tally.

In those other threads I mentioned that we can rely on Sweden's reporting, partly because Sweden has a well-developed medical and reporting system.

But then I remembered ... Sweden notoriously under-reported crimes by ME migrants, and made it illegal to even mention the ethnicity of the criminals. So Sweden isn't necessarily transparent either. Altho they have the capability for proper reporting, their history with their migrant problem shows they don't mind bending the truth ... alot ... in favor of government policy.

So, I would use their stats with caution, and be on the lookout for things like "excess deaths", not necessarily related to Covid-19.

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---

I looked at the log curve(s) for Sweden at http://91-divoc.com/pages/covid-visualization/ . While other countries are bending their (log) curves, Sweden's is linear, which means the virus is spreading logarithmically. At some point it adds up! and no matter how you fudge the numbers (unless of course you're making them up out of thin air), later if not sooner, the results'll be obvious.

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Another indication of how well healthy young (mostly) males fare with SARS-Cov2 would be the military.

Quote:

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The Military's Coronavirus Cases: The Latest Rundown

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https://www.military.com/daily-news/2020/03/16/militarys-coronavirus-c
ases-latest-rundown.html

Quote:

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Lawmakers call for investigation into aircraft carrier captain's firing
Democrats in both chambers of Congress are calling for an investigation into the Navy’s firing of an aircraft carrier commander who had pleaded for help with a coronavirus outbreak on his ship.

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https://thehill.com/policy/defense/491059-lawmakers-call-for-investiga
tion-into-aircraft-carrier-captains-firing

Quote:

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Coronavirus cases on USS Roosevelt spike to 550

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https://www.msn.com/en-us/news/us/coronavirus-cases-on-uss-roosevelt-s
pike-to-550/ar-BB12usOA

Quote:

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Top Pentagon Generals Warn Enemies Not to Attack
April 10
Hit by virus, Pentagon warns enemies: don't test us
US Joint Chiefs Chairman General Mark Milley warns adversaries to not test US military readiness in the coronavirus pandemic
US Joint Chiefs Chairman General Mark Milley warns adversaries to not test US military readiness in the coronavirus pandemic (AFP Photo/Mandel NGAN)

Washington (AFP) - With an aircraft carrier forced into port and staff at bases handling nuclear missiles hit by COVID-19, the US military wants rivals to understand: don't test us, we have not been weakened.

Statement after statement from the Pentagon has sought to deliver that message amid questions this week over whether the US fighting force can maintain full readiness, with cases among service members now at 2,031.

"We're still capable and we're still ready no matter what the threat," Joint Chiefs Chairman General Mark Milley said Thursday.

---

https://news.yahoo.com/hit-virus-pentagon-warns-enemies-dont-test-us-1
65113632.html

If you include the very angry memo from Lt Gnl Robert P White to Pompeo warning him against igniting a war against Iraqi PMUs it seems the military is still barking, but also huddling.

So military deaths would be another point to track, assuming we would ever hear the news.

*****

In order to understand the truth, one must be able to actively pursue facts (ie do research) and also discount or somehow mitigate the weaknesses or bias of those reporting those facts.

Cui bono?


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BTW, just my opinion only, but the keys to reopening the economy will be 1) masks, 2) treatments, 3) vaccines - in that order of availability. But no one in the upper echelons will propose masks.

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Quote:

---

Originally posted by 1KIKI:
BTW, just my opinion only, but the keys to reopening the economy will be 1) masks, 2) treatments, 3) vaccines - in that order of availability. But no one in the upper echelons will propose masks.

---

Masks and hand-sanitizers. Do you think surgical masks would be sufficient? I personally think that the "at risk" population should have N95s and everyone else can use surgical masks.

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Cui bono?


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Nobody benefits from a global pandemic, as far as I can tell. Though the countries that will be hurt the worst are those without economic resources (and that also have an inability to borrow like Greece, Brazil, or Iran). But launching a global pandemic that turns around to bite even you in the ass seems an awfully self-destructive way to disadvantage one country or two that might be hurt more.

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Quote:

---

Originally posted by 1KIKI:
BTW, just my opinion only, but the keys to reopening the economy will be 1) masks, 2) treatments, 3) vaccines - in that order of availability. But no one in the upper echelons will propose masks.

---

Quote:

---

Originally posted by SIGNYM:

Masks and hand-sanitizers. Do you think surgical masks would be sufficient? I personally think that the "at risk" population should have N95s and everyone else can use surgical masks.

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I say N95 (or N100) for all! !! There will always be a certain portion of the population where a respirator just isn't going to work. Either because they have an out-of-the-norm face and/ or nose shape, or because they don't don it, fit it, and test it properly. For them the respirators will act like a procedure mask. But for those people who wear a respirator correctly, it'll add an extra margin of protection. And population-wide, over time, that adds up.

ETA - and respirators (plus hand sanitizers) are literally the least intrusive, fastest, cheapest, and easiest thing to do. What's not to like about that?

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Quote:

---

Originally posted by SIGNYM:

But then I remembered ... Sweden notoriously under-reported crimes by ME migrants, and made it illegal to even mention the ethnicity of the criminals. So Sweden isn't necessarily transparent either. Altho they have the capability for proper reporting, their history with their migrant problem shows they don't mind bending the truth ... alot ... in favor of government policy.

---

Did you really remember, or did you just read my reply to you in the thread you created on this topic "for me".

Do Right, Be Right. :)

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Quote:

---

Originally posted by 6IXSTRINGJACK:

Quote:

---

Originally posted by SIGNYM:

But then I remembered ... Sweden notoriously under-reported crimes by ME migrants, and made it illegal to even mention the ethnicity of the criminals. So Sweden isn't necessarily transparent either. Altho they have the capability for proper reporting, their history with their migrant problem shows they don't mind bending the truth ... alot ... in favor of government policy.

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Did you really remember, or did you just read my reply to you in the thread you created on this topic "for me".

Do Right, Be Right. :)

---

Neither. I was listening to The Duran on the topic

and they kind of brought it up

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People were actually jailed in Sweden for trying to report on it.

Our media might suck here, but at least we have free speech.

Do Right, Be Right. :)

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Report on what?

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Quote:

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Originally posted by 1KIKI:
Report on what?

---

Quote:

---

Originally posted by SIGNYM:

But then I remembered ... Sweden notoriously under-reported crimes by ME migrants, and made it illegal to even mention the ethnicity of the criminals. So Sweden isn't necessarily transparent either. Altho they have the capability for proper reporting, their history with their migrant problem shows they don't mind bending the truth ... alot ... in favor of government policy.

---

Do Right, Be Right. :)

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Oh, that. I thought the topic was COIVD-19.

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The topic is whatever I want it to be.

Do Right, Be Right. :)

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Yeah, but if you don't tell people what topic it is you're posting about, you're an idiot.

MEANWHILE, I noticed that besides being incoherent, as usual you provided no links.

Whatever.

Babble to yourself all you want.

Putting you on ignore.

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