Saudi Arabia: Foreign policy speculation
POSTED BY: SIGNYM
UPDATED: Friday, November 1, 2024 15:53
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I know I had another thread about this elsewhere, but I'll be damned if I can find it now.
I that thread, I was speculating on Obama's deep foreign policy. I know that I've banged my head repeatedly over his apparent neocon actions.
And yet... sometimes I think that Hillary, in her position as Scy State, actually initiated many of these moments (Victoria "Fuck the EU" Nuland worked for Hillary, as did Christopher Stevens, who was our "highly experienced" ie CIA-connected Ambassador in Libya while CIA-orchestrated gun-running was going on thru Benghazi). It seems to me that Obama was surprised by some of these events.
Still, the USA policy seems overall neocon-interventionist, with one great exception: The deal with Iran. THAT was something that Obama truly pushed for, and got. And from a foreign policy standpoint, that was the bung in the bunghole: Once that was achieved, all kinds of other consequences came gushing out, including Iran's and Russia's alliance and their mutual assistance to Syria. Now, I can't believe that all of that was totally unpredicted. And as a foreign policy action, it sticks out to me like a raisin in a bowl of oatmeal.
What I see is that Russia, Syria, and Iran isolating Turkey in the Mideast, and Russia isolating Turkey internationally. Turkey is THE strategic nation through which all jihadist-assistance flows. Saudi Arabia would be impotent in the region without Turkey's assistance. Russia doesn't need to go head-to-head against NATO (unless NATO really pushes for a confrontation), all they need to do is cut the supply-lines from Turkey. Even BEFORE Putin started pointing out the Erdogan family's ISIL connections, I noticed that both Germany and the USA defanged Turkey by quietly removing their missiles. (The USA refused to extend the Patriot-missile contract in October.)
I was talking to my crazy-smart hubby and his well-connected, crazy-smart friends, and they were speculating about how, in similar fashion, Russia and Iran may be isolating Saudi Arabia. Again, Russia doesn't need to go against "the USA" in the Mideast when the neocon's next-weakest partner in the region is Saudi Arabia. As I understand it (from the western press' silence) the Saudi project in Yemen isn't going so well... Iran has committed quite a few troops to the project and (according to Iran) the Houthis are actually invading Saudi Arabia.
In addition, with the price of oil engineered to be so low, Saudi Arabia is suffering from its own price-policies, and its coffers are dropping drastically from lack of income as well as fighting a war on two fronts (Yemen and Syria). And finally, Saudi Arabia is suffering from a critical lack of water. They have pumped their aquifers dry, and are now entirely dependent on wheat imports to sustain their unsustainably enlarged population.
WHAT IF THE SAUDI WAHHABI GOVERNMENT WERE TO BE ELIMINATED AS A POLITICAL FORCE? It seems to be that the current Saudi monarchy is the poison tooth in the entire Asian/Mideastern jaw, fostering terrorism and instability from Tunisia to Nigeria to Xinjiang (China) to Malyasia, and requiring that the USA support a nation that is not only inimical to our long-term interests but also in deep contradiction to our advertised ethics of freedom and democracy?
WHAT IF OBAMA'S POLICY IS TO SUPPORT RUSSIA JUST ENOUGH SO THEY CAN DO OUR DIRTY WORK FOR US? What if he is hoping to do what the USA has done for a long time: play Russia against the mideast, only THIS time with the plan that Russia will emerge weakened but victorious?
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If only people were that smart.
Maybe the Iran deal went through with fingers crossed - in the hopes that something in that direction may have been fostered at some future time. I don't see it falling like dominoes. It's more a small shift of the balance of power.
SAGAN: We are releasing vast quantities of carbon dioxide, increasing the greenhouse effect. It may not take much to destabilize the Earth's climate, to convert this heaven, our only home in the cosmos, into a kind of hell.
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Well, maybe the Iran deal was an accident. But I posted some time ago that I felt that consequential shifts were taking place - for which I have little evidence. That old alliances were being broken, very, very quietly. It was a gut feeling and its still just a gut feeling.
Here is my argument for why Obama does NOT have a deep agenda:
One of the telltale signs would be to look for groups of advisors with whom Obama could share ideas. A government won't get far without them. Putin, I know, has a select council of military, financial, economic, foreign policy and internal political advisors. Apparently they have very far-ranging discussions, they discuss different options, but (like the military) once a decision is made they all agree to abide by it. Decisions can always be revisited at some later date if something changes or if the results aren't what was expected.
The Chinese system is a lot more inscrutable but from what I hear Xi Jingping has something of a tougher row to hoe. The Chinese leadership has been committed to state-run capitalism since Mao died, when there was a complete turnover of leadership, starting with Deng Xiaoping ("To get rich is glorious") and continuing thru Jiang Zemin and Hu Jintao. http://www.chinasage.info/leaders.htm As I understand it, since the former triumverate had a collective 34 years in power (1978-2012) it was able to appoint an entire system of sympathetic party officials. While Xi Jingping and his group of advisors and supporters have a new strategy, many previously-appointed bureaucrats and functionaries are dragging their feet and Jiang Zemin is still apparently agitating for power. Still, Xi Jingping has created a number of posts (most significantly one for internal security), has made a number of important appointments, and has a coterie of supporters and advisors who've been in government for a long time.
Now consider Obama: He was an outsider, and I believe TPTB sought to manipulate him by helpfully providing him with deep-state, fully-entrenched advisors in the Pentagon, State, CIA, and Congress, Hillary among them. By now, it should be fairly easy to trace out the neocon influence ... there is a direct line, for example, from Hillary to Nuland to Kagan (Nuland's deeply and openly neocon husband). I'm sure, if I were Obama, I would have those politics mapped out exquisitely. HOWEVER, what is NOT so easy is to find the NON-NEOCN advisors with whom Obama could strategize. Who are they? Do they even exist? Does he have contacts into foreign nations which get around the neocon pathways? I can't imagine whose Obama's non-neocon advisors would be, but he would really need some if he is carving out a quiet revolution.
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You can't build a nation with bombs. You can't create a society with guns.
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Quote:
Originally posted by 1kiki:
If only people were that smart.
Maybe the Iran deal went through with fingers crossed - in the hopes that something in that direction may have been fostered at some future time. I don't see it falling like dominoes. It's more a small shift of the balance of power.
SAGAN: We are releasing vast quantities of carbon dioxide, increasing the greenhouse effect. It may not take much to destabilize the Earth's climate, to convert this heaven, our only home in the cosmos, into a kind of hell.
The simple solution would be to attack the religion rather than drop bombs on these islamic peoples, make a mockery of Islam and support muslims who make a joke of the faith.....at its core it has very shakey foundations, which is why they see Rushdie as a bigger threat than a US Cruise Missile
The Saudis are often at the top of fundamentalism, the whole region and culture built on lies and fakery, a magician kisses a fundamentalist frog and all of a sudden you have a magic kingdom but with a secret horror and jihad underneath? Saudi Arabia has been warned over Islamist funding by German Vice-Chancellor Sigmar Gabriel. The are afraid of examination of the Koran or Quran and recently arrested an Indian for 'Liking' Facebook Photo Showing Mecca Shrine as Hindu Lingam Shiv Temple, there was also the writings made famous by Rushdie's fictional book, showing pagan Satanic offense that reveal a fact that their god Allah it might built on a Pre-Muslim Arabian “Moon God”. The madness spreads to other nations with Sudan arresting 55 Christians to appease Islam, International Christian Concern’s Africa analyst William Stark said Bashir’s connections to Saudi Arabia and Iran only strengthen his hold on power.
http://news.yahoo.com/german-vice-chancellor-warns-saudi-arabia-over-i
slamist-135521960.html
http://www.islam-watch.org/home/143-roddy/840-allah-was-originally-a-p
re-muslim-arabian-moon-god.html
http://www.faithfreedom.org/there-is-a-frog-inside-every-muslim-prince
-charming/
http://www.ibtimes.co.in/saudi-arabia-indian-arrested-liking-photo-tha
t-showed-mecca-mosque-hindu-temple-625278
http://www.wnd.com/2013/02/christians-arrested-to-appease-islam/
Read more: http://www.smh.com.au/world/saudi-arabia-warned-over-islamist-funding-
by-german-vicechancellor-sigmar-gabriel-20151206-k
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... at its core EVERY religion has very shakey foundations ...
SAGAN: We are releasing vast quantities of carbon dioxide, increasing the greenhouse effect. It may not take much to destabilize the Earth's climate, to convert this heaven, our only home in the cosmos, into a kind of hell.
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Have you ever tried working for the State Department? The world would be in much better shape with you there.
SGG
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Do you know the AHA! feeling when you think you discovered something? Well, I think I figured out what all of the apparent waffling is about. YAY!
The person who gave me my idea was none other than Obama himself. During his speech on terrorism, amidst all the blah-blah-blah he said one thing that struck me as being both true(ish) and important:
Quote:
We should not be drawn once more into a long and costly ground war in Iraq or Syria. That’s what groups like ISIL want.
That explains Obama's stance, because there is America: Standing like a picador behind its "allies", prodding them into burden-sharing the so-called "war on ISIL" (more about that later) but refusing to put boots on the ground itself. It's a perfectly understandable explanation for Obama's basic approach, but doesn't explain WHAT he doing, just how.
I don't expect that anyone will credit this explanation, but I'm going to take a whack at it because I think it ties a lot of pieces together.
First of all, it's clear to me that the USA has no intention of defeating ISIL. They have failed to attack so many targets .... like 1500+ oil truck convoys and lines of jeeps, bunkers and command centers ... and attacked so many NON-ISIL targets like MSF hospitals and Syrian Army units ... that its clear to me that the USA and its "partners' activity in Iraq and eastern Syria are mere optics, if not outright air cover for ISIL. The desultory pecking away at scattered individuals and small targets clearly shows that the USA and "partners" are committed to doing nothing effective.
Indeed, Obama himself said he was committed to "containing" ISIL, not defeating it. That's because he is still hoping that ISIL will bring down Assad, when al Nusra (al Qaida in Iraq) failed.
So, setting aside "defeating terrorism" as any sort of goal, what IS our military (and partners' militaries) doing in Iraq and eastern Syria?
As it turns out, its trying to engage Russia in a war of attrition ... to get Russia ensnared in a budget-busting, soul-destroying war like Vietnam or Afghanistan.
The USA has tried this several times already. The first was in Syria, when Obama drew a red line about chemical weapons, and Turkey and its jihadist allies set off a Sarin gas attack and quickly blamed Assad. The USA was all ready to bomb Syria, until Russia set its destroyers (with some very effective anti-ship and anti-misille missiles) athwart the Syrian coast, and shot a couple of USA cruise missiles out of the sky. The USA aircraft carriers withdrew from the eastern end of the Mediterranean, and the military had to go back and recalculate the cost of getting Russia involved in Syria. Russia derailed that particular provocation by providing Sarin residues to MI6 labs which determined that the Sarin was not manufactured by Assad's military, and Russia also convinced Assad to get rid of his chemical weapons. During this time, the USA is operating a rat-line of weapons from Libya to Syria.
The next attempt was in Ukraine. If you recall, I posted more than once I thought that the Ukraine event was triggered by Syria. I originally thought that's because the Russian ships steaming in to Syria from Sevastopol put Crimea on the front burner, but perhaps Ukraine was just an already-primed alternate. Russia COULD have been ensnared in Ukraine. Instead, what Russia did was take Crimea, because of its military significance (the Russian military port of Sevastopol) but refused to openly help Novorossians. Instead, it continued to push for a unified Ukraine (less Crimea) ... no matter how egregiously Kiev bombed civilians and broke the ceasefires ... although it took a LOT of internal flak, since many ethnic Russians live in the Donbas and there are many family ties to the people there. There is still a wrestling match going on between who is going to be responsible for Kiev's debts, including debts owed to Russia for natgas. The IMF has clearly come in on the side of
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Irony alert: Saudis announce formation of 'anti-terrorism' coalition
A nation ruled by an extremist Islamic sect known as the Wahhabis announced that it has formed a grand coalition of mostly Muslim countries to fight terrorism. Saudi Arabia and 33 other nations will coordinate their efforts to end terrorism – they say.
Presumably, the government of Saudi Arabia and the coalition won't fight any of the Islamist militias the Saudis are currently supporting in Syria. And Pakistan, a member of the coalition, will somehow forget that it is supporting the Taliban in Afghanistan.
http://www.americanthinker.com/blog/2015/12/irony_alert_saudis_announc
e_formation_of_antiterrorism_coalition.html
Unlimited Muslim immigration: A Congress of fools or traitors?
http://www.familysecuritymatters.org/publications/detail/unlimited-mus
lim-immigration-a-congress-of-fools-or-traitors?f=must_reads
http://www.democraticunderground.com/?com=view_post&forum=1002&
;pid=7444133
Atheist author Richard Dawkins has claimed that people on the political left are ignoring Islam's "misogyny and homophobia," and defended GOP presidential candidate Donald Trump's free speech rights.
Counterterrorism operations targeting harmless groups to maintain political correctness?
http://hotair.com/archives/2015/12/15/counterterrorism-operations-targ
eting-harmless-groups-to-maintain-political-correctness/
the Regressive Left - excerpt from Sam Harris' podcast
sad times when you need to go super offensive Atheists and to Alex Jones tinfoil heads for information
Quote:
Originally posted by 1kiki:
... at its core EVERY religion has very shakey foundations ...
Most religions across the CIVILISED world are kind of open-minded, somehow on some level tolerant, maybe even benign....In South Korea you can say how Buddhism sucks, In Canada and Australia you can say how Roman Catholic books are BS, if you want in Australia and Canada and other western nations you can say how Protestant, Calvinist, Quaker, Pentecostalists, Swedenborgianists, Snake Handlers, Scientologist and Mormons are all idiots, you can make offensive 'art' like piss christ, you can tear apart religion in Preacher and Daredevil comicbooks and open up the religion debate in comedy like life of brian, movies like The Book of Mormon
Dogma etc.
Moreover, the reason Monty Python and The Book of Mormon and Piss Christ don’t “incite violence” is due to the fact that no one in the Mormon and Christian religion behead blasphemers, that is an Islam problem, not a free speech problem, not an all have shakey foundation problem, not a Pamella Geller Problem its an Islam problem.
Their values are sometimes different to ours as across much of the civilized world people can have open and free discourse, they can debate and discuss but you can not do this against Islam, there is punishment for being critical of the Koran, once born into Islam you can not leave it, you can not drop the Quran and become atheist, protestant, shinto...whatever, the punishemnt for leaving the Muslim faith across the Islamic world is often imprisonment, stoning, beheadings and death....they also issue 'Fatwa' that is some islamoheadedterroristic Islamic scholar throws a hissy fit when someone offends their books, or writes something bad of Nation of Islam or draws a South Park Cartoon and all of a sudden on of their priests makes law that any one of their religious thugs can collect a lot of money by killing a critic of islam, he won't even go to jail for this murder, instead he will be rewarded with money for defending what this culture produced as this backward barabaric islamic faith.
Rushdie says it better
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"Most religions across the CIVILISED world are kind of open-minded ..."
You think Buddhists are religiously tolerant pacifists? "Buddhist Mob Beats 10 Muslims To Death In Myanmar; Communal Violence Spreads". Another year, another example out of many. "'No water for him. Let him die': Horrifying moment Burmese Buddhists set fire to Muslim man in riots which left 43 dead"
And Christian religions in the civilized world were (and are) used to justify barbarities like slavery and lynchings. And if you go to the right places in the US and look white enough you'll hear that talk to this day. And the Bible - as I've repeatedly pointed out, and which you've repeatedly failed to address - IN ITS TEACHINGS says that people need to be stoned, or have their heads or hands cut off for various infractions, among other barbaric punishments.
To keep on with the Christian theme, why don't you look up The Army of God, a group of religious extremists who shoot and bomb and assassinate people in the name of god?
Do you think ALL 2.4 billion Christians should be condemned because of the actions of a minority? After all, that minority calls themselves Christian and THEY CAN POINT TO THE BIBLE for their justification. So there must be something wrong with the religion itself, don't you think? EVEN WORSE the entire Christendom has failed to rise up and condemn these murderers, and terrorists and their supporters. So we must ALL agree with what they're doing. Don't you agree?
Rather than continue to spew your incessant hatred, how about you respond to my post?
SAGAN: We are releasing vast quantities of carbon dioxide, increasing the greenhouse effect. It may not take much to destabilize the Earth's climate, to convert this heaven, our only home in the cosmos, into a kind of hell.
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Read your Quran and Islamo books again, Al-Taqiyya and Kitman
Bukhari (52:269) - "The Prophet said, 'War is deceit.'"
Qur'an (3:54) - "And they (the disbelievers) schemed, and Allah schemed (against them): and Allah is the best of schemers."
its all being shown as ex-muslims start to speak out
and the islamo radicals get shown up as fools
Quote:
Originally posted by 1kiki:
"Buddhist Mob Beats 10 Muslims To Death In Myanmar; Communal Violence Spreads".
Pally-Wood
A number of different terms to consider pallywood, the term sunni islamo propaganda, the term Hezbollywood, or presstv propaganda all going by different names but with very similar goals
get a plane ticket to Burma
and see for yourself
before parroting Western Qatar/Dubai owned mainstream media
you know how the Saudi owns a good chunk of CNN, it owns even the guys at Fox.... Alwaleed al-bin-lad Talal or some prince asshole
no doubt a few monks may have killed some islamists, but what you are getting in your news feed is 'Pally-Wood'
https://themuslimissue.wordpress.com/2015/06/07/muslim-rohingya-propag
anda-the-fake-pictures-of-the-rohingya-crisis/comment-page-1/
http://www.jamaicans.com/forums/showthread.php?197253-The-fake-picture
s-of-the-Rohingya-crisis
https://twitter.com/bbctrending/status/607767011754532865
http://themuslimissue.tumblr.com/post/120967373921/muslim-rohingya-pro
paganda-the-fake-pictures-of
https://www.facebook.com/permalink.php?story_fbid=397069947143907&
id=127735030744068
http://pamelageller.com/2015/06/fake-rohingya-persecution-pictures-pro
liferate-on-web.html/
https://www.reddit.com/r/news/comments/38x1eb/the_fake_pictures_of_the
_rohingya_crisis/
and I'm no fan of the Israel government either, they are assholes and have killed innocents
but why do people suddenly feel the urge to believe one side or the other, why do they need to support one team or the 2nd team? Is it red vs blue programming? and could it be possible on both sides of the conflict there are liars, murderers, thieves and killers? Why believe one side over another?
'pallywood' and the lies and deception from both sides incase you missed the story
http://www.honestreporting.ca/cbcs-oscar-worthy-pallywood-performance/
6744
http://truthreturns.com/pallywood-101/
http://www.geenstijl.nl/mt/archieven/2014/12/hamas_en_eu_lalala.html
http://theinglouriousbasterds.com/incroyable-les-palestiniens-detourne
nt-un-film-dhorreur-americain-pour-pallywood/
http://www.whaleoil.co.nz/2014/07/sinister-deception-television-media-
pallywood/
Myanmar Buddhist mob stories turned out to be fake, Bruma monks attacks muslim was a false story, it was one fake story after another and another false story and another fake story
BBC had to keep retracting the false stories
and btw we class Burma as a commie dictatorship....you seeing the pattern yet?
let me speed things up if you still can't connect the dots
who do you think posted this one?
Quote:
The USA has been tacitly or actively supporting jihadism for decades. It can be traced back as far as Jimmy Carter, who supplied various Afghani-based terror groups - including the Saudi Osama bin Laden- with shoulder-fired Stinger missiles to drive out the Russians.
I used to think that the USA support for terrorists was sporadic and opportunistic ... Afghanistan, Chechnya, Libya .... but over the last couple of years, as I've educated myself, I see now that our support has been there all along ... that we have "given up" large swaths of the Middle East (Afghanistan, Iraq, Libya and the planned addition of Syria) to Saudi-Wahhabi terrorism, that these were not repeated military/ foreign policy "failures" or "mistakes" on our part, but part of our payment to Saudi ArabiaNOTIFY: N | REPLY | REPLY WITH QUOTE | PERMALINK | TOP | HOME
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You know that things aren't going well when nominally-allied partners start quibbling with each other. Up until recently, we've had a concordance of interests, more or less, with the Saudis, and the Saudis with the Qataris and al Qaida and al Nusra (and nominally with ISIL), and the Qataris with the Turks, and the Turks and Qataris with ISIL. Just one big happy family, heading - more or less- in the same direction:
Depose Assad
Break the nascent Shia crescent
Establish a Sunni caliphate (That's for Saudi Arabia, Qatar, and Turkey to quibble over.)
Establish oil and gas pipelines across Syria to the Mediterranean and the EU
Break the EU's dependence on Russia oil and gas.
All was going swimmingly until Russia intervened, and lately it's been fun watching the cockroaches scatter and seeing where they go hide and who they hide with.
Turkey, having been publicly exposed as THE conduit for aid to ISIL, is now internationally naked: neither the USA nor the EU want to touch it, and it's antagonized Russia beyond immediate repair. What to do???? Well, they've made deal with Israel, where Israel agrees to pay reparations for killing Turkish citizens who were in the pro-Gaza flotilla. Scrounging for loose change, I think. Turkey also announced plans to establish a 3000-strong military base in Qatar to face "common enemies". http://www.reuters.com/article/us-qatar-turkey-military-idUSKBN0TZ17V2
0151216 What those "common enemies" are is open to question, but both Turkey and Qatar are strong supporters of the "Muslim Brotherhood" and ISIL, so I supposed those "common enemies" would be anyone who is fighting ISIL ... i.e. Russia, Iran, Iraq (parts of) and Syria.
Saudi Arabia announced they would gather together a 100,000-strong army ... made of of military units ONLY from Sunni states and including 10,000 American troops ... to "fight ISIL". ISIL was not quite a Saudi project, they were more invested in al Qaida, but they weren't really against it either. To now try and pretend that they're going to "fight ISIL" is ridiculous; "fighting ISIL" is now the most naked of fig-leaves for pure land-grabs. And some of the nations that Saudi Arabia listed as partners, such as Pakistan, Malaysia, and Indonesia, reacted with a Wait... wha...? because the press release was the first they heard of it, and so they refused to be included.
Jordan is still the CIA's favorite conduit for money to ISIL and al Qaida.
The USA is now conceding .... in the face over overwhelming evidence that they would get their military's ass handed to them should they tangle with Russia ... that maybe peace in Syria isn't such a bad idea after all. However, this doesn't represent a change of heart or intent ... the USA bombed Iraqi troops "by mistake" ... I swear to god the USA really DOES want to get kicked out of Iraq, so they can make trouble from Qatar!
When big partnerships start breaking up, it's easier to tease apart who is really allied with whom and on what grounds, because that's when you start to see a divergence of interests. This should be instructive.
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You can't build a nation with bombs. You can't create a society with guns.
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Hey, c'mon guys!
Speculatin' is important. I feel like I'm being forced to do all the speculatin' myself!
Feel free to join in. It's just speculation, after all!
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You can't build a nation with bombs. You can't create a society with guns.
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GSTRING- are you drinking and posting again?
Quote:One of MY planes??? I guess you must really like ISIL.
*snort* an amusing statement after Turkey swats one [of]your planes
Quote:Not only are Russian planes flying the same zone, there are no "rebels" left alive down there to shoot at pilots as they drift down on parachutes. Turks now no longer even violate Greek airspace (which they did with impunity before) let alone Syrian airspace. And now, even the USA and it's other "coalition partners" refuse to fly over Syria. Why do you suppose that is?
out of the sky like a buzzing fly. I'm guessing Russian planes aren't going to fly that route again any time soon.Turkey 1, Russia 0
Quote:I was paying attention to Syria WHEN Ukraine came up. I've been paying attention to it all along. I said, at the time, that I thought Ukraine was triggered by Syria.
BTW, since you obviously weren't paying attention to Syria until your masters notified you to change the focus away from Ukraine... Peace in Syria has always been the idea.
Syria involves our partnerships with Saudi Arabia and the rest of the GCC and Turkey, which also involves pipelinistan, oil and the petrodollar as well as worldwide jihadism. All pretty weighty topics. BTW, I also pay attention to China, the EU, Brazil, Venezuela etc. I'm sorry that your scope of interest isn't wide enough to encompass important and relevant topics, and that you're stuck on Ukraine.
But not to worry, I'm sure Ukraine will come up as a relevant topic soon enough, and then your tiny mind will have something familiar to latch on to.
And now, since you're once again engaging in your incessant narcissism and I'm just enabling it, I'm going to stop responding to you.
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You can't build a nation with bombs. You can't create a society with guns.
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Jane
First, your post basically says MY RELIGION IS BETTER THAN THEIRS ... because ... theirs is stupid and mine isn't. I reject that argument in its entirety. And it is one of the stupidest, most circular arguments I've ever come across.
Second, NONE of the incidents I described were either retracted or disproved by your post. If you want to dispute MY arguments you actually have to address THEM, not some other point someone else made, somewhere else. BTW the photo of the self-immolating man is here: http:// i.dailymail.co.uk/i/pix/2013/04/25/article-2314598-125686A5000005DC-265_634x362.jpg, and it doesn't even remotely resemble the photo in the article I quoted. Swing and a miss.
And you've completely failed to address the barbarities committed by Christians in the past AND PRESENT, which they justify in the name of the bible.
Before regurgitating your hatreds YET AGAIN, try reading ... and thinking.
"Most religions across the CIVILISED world are kind of open-minded ..."
You think Buddhists are religiously tolerant pacifists? "Buddhist Mob Beats 10 Muslims To Death In Myanmar; Communal Violence Spreads". Another year, another example out of many. "'No water for him. Let him die': Horrifying moment Burmese Buddhists set fire to Muslim man in riots which left 43 dead"
And Christian religions in the civilized world were (and are) used to justify barbarities like slavery and lynchings. And if you go to the right places in the US and look white enough you'll hear that talk to this day. And the Bible - as I've repeatedly pointed out, and which you've repeatedly failed to address - IN ITS TEACHINGS says that people need to be stoned, or have their heads or hands cut off for various infractions, among other barbaric punishments.
To keep on with the Christian theme, why don't you look up The Army of God, a group of religious extremists who shoot and bomb and assassinate people in the name of god?
Do you think ALL 2.4 billion Christians should be condemned because of the actions of a minority? After all, that minority calls themselves Christian and THEY CAN POINT TO THE BIBLE for their justification. So there must be something wrong with the religion itself, don't you think? EVEN WORSE the entire Christendom has failed to rise up and condemn these murderers, and terrorists and their supporters. So we must ALL agree with what they're doing. Don't you agree?
Rather than continue to spew your incessant hatred, how about you respond to my post?
SAGAN: We are releasing vast quantities of carbon dioxide, increasing the greenhouse effect. It may not take much to destabilize the Earth's climate, to convert this heaven, our only home in the cosmos, into a kind of hell.
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Not sure of the exact numbers but some researchers and guys went out and surveys and polls were done
numbers go something like this -
84% of Muslims in the Middle East support the death penalty for leaving Islam
41% of Pakistanis approve of attacks on Americans
Recent surveys show that most people in several countries with significant Muslim populations have an unfavorable view of ISIS, including virtually all respondents in Lebanon and 94% in Jordan. Relatively small shares say they see ISIS favorably. In some countries, considerable portions of the population do not offer an opinion about ISIS, including a majority (62%) of Pakistanis.
70% Want Sharia Law Above all other Laws
Muslim Views on Suicide Bombing and Gunmen killing Random Infidels
40% have sympathy for bombers
36% of Arabs polled said the 9/11 attacks were morally justified; 38% disagreed; 26% Unsure
30% support ISIS
15% of Muslims in Turkey support suicide bombings (also 11% in Kosovo, 26% in Malaysia and 26% in Bangladesh)
Quote:
Originally posted by 1kiki:
You think Buddhists are religiously tolerant pacifists? "Buddhist Mob Beats 10 Muslims To Death In Myanmar;
You are a mentally ill Islamophile
and you are posting Pally-Wood propaganda
the Bible and the Christian Bible faith is BS, I have posted PLENTY of times against dumbass Christians...if you want to go bashing bible belt Christians then COOL! I'm all for you bashing those dumb bible nuts, I suggest you give one of those old firefly threads a bump instead of hijacking this thread with your apologizing for Muslim-Supremists, Chistian-bashing and your Islamophillic agenda
it seems you missed my above post
it's PALLY-WOOD
Quote:
Originally posted by JAYNEZTOWN:
get a plane ticket to Burma
and see for yourself
before parroting Western Qatar/Dubai owned mainstream media
you know how the Saudi owns a good chunk of CNN, it owns even the guys at Fox.... Alwaleed al-bin-lad Talal or some prince asshole
no doubt a few monks may have killed some islamists, but what you are getting in your news feed is 'Pally-Wood'
https://themuslimissue.wordpress.com/2015/06/07/muslim-rohingya-propag
anda-the-fake-pictures-of-the-rohingya-crisis/comment-page-1/
http://www.jamaicans.com/forums/showthread.php?197253-The-fake-picture
s-of-the-Rohingya-crisis
https://twitter.com/bbctrending/status/607767011754532865
http://themuslimissue.tumblr.com/post/120967373921/muslim-rohingya-pro
paganda-the-fake-pictures-of
https://www.facebook.com/permalink.php?story_fbid=397069947143907&
id=127735030744068
http://pamelageller.com/2015/06/fake-rohingya-persecution-pictures-pro
liferate-on-web.html/
https://www.reddit.com/r/news/comments/38x1eb/the_fake_pictures_of_the
_rohingya_crisis/
fakery
Quote:
Originally posted by 1kiki:
Jane
First, your post basically says MY RELIGION IS BETTER THAN THEIRS ...
I have no religious book youdumbfuck get with the program I'm here since 2004 you should know me by now, I don't promote any religious stupidity or support any large organized religion or any religious indoctrination
if you happen to go wandering in the sand hungry, walking across the sun and cloud for days, and eat something weird and start speaking to a 'God' or your Gods then cool, please keep it to yourself. People practicing their own faith fine, but hugeass Mosques and rich Buddhist Temples and Preachers that's a game of theft, brianwashing and BS
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I don't know much about Buddhism or Hinduism, and only a little about Islam and only a little more about Xtianity. What I DO know about the last two religions is that BOTH of their holy books talk about vengeance and punishment .... and forgiveness and tolerance. There's justification for both. People on their own tend to want to go with the "softer" aspects of their religions, the parts about holidays and so forth; it's the power structures which provoke mayhem through constant propagandizing and fear-mongering and (sometimes) weaponizing. Follow the money. If you cut off the money you'll go a long way to reducing the problem.
--------------
You can't build a nation with bombs. You can't create a society with guns.
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One of the events which cause the USA to fold .... and it DID fold, at least formally ... was something that happened just a few weeks ago. I think I've mentioned that my husband has extensive familiarity with weapons of all types. Hell, he has a nearly-photographic memory for all things manmade .... he can tell me by outline what model and year car he's looking at, chip numbers, gear ratios, bore and stroke numbers, and the make and model of nearly every American and Russian weapon system that he's ever looked at.
Frankly, it makes my eyes roll.
So I kind of "yeah ... uh huh... yeah...whatever.." my way thru the discussion of Russia's long-range bomber hitting Syria until about two weeks later, when I actually READ what happened, and it definitely made me sit up an take notice.
Not only did Russia hit Syrian targets with their usual ground-support jets and helicopter gunships, and (previously) long-range cruise missiles from the Caspian Sea, they ALSO sent their long-range bomber all the way around Europe and down the Mediterranean (because the EU and Turkey had denied airspace to ISIL-fighting Russian aircraft), and launched missiles from submarines and ships. I was shocked they would go thru all of the trouble to do something that was militarily so unnecessary.
At first, I thought it was a field-test, but soon figured out it was a demonstration for the Pentagon. Shortly afterwards, Kerry went to Moscow, and soon after that, the UN Security Council with USA approval, voted for Syrian elections. (Something that Russia has been trying to promote since 2012.)
Weapons bore me to tears. I can't tell the difference between an F-16 and an SU-24, or between a corvette or a destroyer. But when military powers are eying each other across a line of hostility, relative weaponry sure makes a difference.
--------------
You can't build a nation with bombs. You can't create a society with guns.
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Quote:
So why has Human Rights Watch (HRW)—despite proclaiming itself “one of the world’s leading independent organizations” on human rights—so consistently paralleled U.S. positions and policies? This affinity for the U.S. government agenda is not limited to Latin America. In the summer of 2013, for example, when the prospect of a unilateral U.S. missile strike on Syria—a clear violation of the UN Charter—loomed large, HRW’s executive director Kenneth Roth speculated as to whether a simply “symbolic” bombing would be sufficient. “If Obama decides to strike Syria, will he settle for symbolism or do something that will help protect civilians?” he asked on Twitter. Executive director of MIT’s Center for International Studies John Tirman swiftly denounced the tweet as “possibly the most ignorant and irresponsible statement ever by a major human-rights advocate.”
https://nacla.org/article/hypocrisy-human-rights-watch
--------------
You can't build a nation with bombs. You can't create a society with guns.
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"I have no religious book youdumbfuck"
You posted multiple videos of people saying MY RELIGION IS BETTER THAN THEIR RELIGION which I wasted enough time watching. If you didn't mean them as an argument against Islam, you shouldn't have posted any of them.
Don't you agree?
Also, links for your supposed surveys, otherwise - they're just so much blah blah blah. "and you are posting Pally-Wood propaganda" which you've failed to disprove - twice. Because YOUR posts failed to address MY SPECIFIC posts. Again. Want to go for three?
You made this claim:
"Most religions across the CIVILISED world are kind of open-minded ..."
And I provided multiple examples of multiple religions used to justify extreme violence. Even your so-called CIVILIZED religions aren't. Because IN THEIR TEACHINGS are incitements to violence either as punishment against their members or as reasons to war on others. The reason MOST of us don't do that isn't because our religions are so superior, it's because we ignore those many, many teachings.
So why pick on Islam?
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Quote:
Originally posted by 1kiki:
Even your so-called CIVILIZED religions aren't.
CIVILIZED WORLD - don't misquote me
IF right now we were living in 1975 I might argue Cambodian terror monks, Camboadian terror communists and Pol Pots Theravada Buddhists were the greatest threat to humanity
IF we now were on a ship landing in Pre-Columbian Mesoamerican, our ships arriving from Spain and France into ancient lands of Mexico, Texas, Venezuela...and other Pre Colombian shores I might argue that Aztec religion with its culture of Child sacrifice and Human Sacrifice was the greatest crime on humanity
IF we were living in 1940 I might argue the German Occult, Germany's Nazi Social Fascists and German Christianity was the greatest threat to civilisation.
and although I have lived in the Western world and respect the West's democracy, scientific progress. I respect the West its humanity, its culture still I don't promote Christianity, I think the Roman Catholic churches, the Protestant faith, the Mormonism, Jehovah's all other these faiths all have corruption and none will fully recover from their corruption and scandals. Catholicism and Protestantism have killed each other across Europe, many years back they were killing each other by the thousands and thousands on the streets of Europe, they burned 'Witches', both faiths have abused children, taken abused girls and raped young boys, while British and Canadians and French and Australians and Americans and all allies fought Fascist German's the Catholic Church of Rome was to cowardly to stand up to Nazi German's and instead sided with the Nazis...the rape of boys, supporting the Third Reich this is something from which the Catholic church will never recover.
Quote:
Originally posted by 1kiki:
You posted multiple videos of people saying MY RELIGION IS BETTER THAN THEIR RELIGION which I wasted enough time watching. If you didn't mean them as an argument against Islam, you shouldn't have posted any of them.
Let me post them again, once more I will post these videos
because it seems the videos didn't sink into your thick skull first time 'round
What 'religion' do you think these vids are promoting?
Is it Shinto religion? is it Wicca Witchcraft? Is it Baha'i or Sikhism?
tell me the religion these vids promote?
tell me what is their religion?
and although I use terms 'thick skull' I don't believe you are stupid. I know what I write is a shocker for some it breaks your reality and is quiet shocking to you
Around your skull there is a web of massmedia, radiowaves and tv...you have been programed to respond in certain ways to certain events, once you realize tv today is slightly more advanced, slightly more humane than tv Japan watched in 1940 or a little more advanced than tv and radio which German's watch in 1940s you will be able to break out of this Matrix like Neo or Keanu Reeves did in the movie....and yes Americans are programed by tv just like they were programed to believe Iraq had WMDs and brainwashed by tv to believe Iraq was connected to 911
People respond to me always thinking I am some bible belt gun nut Christian from the South...what if I told you I am not even American, if I said I wasn't a native English speaker, not even Christian...what if I told you I wasn't even 'white'....would you still continue your programmed narrative?
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There are many you failed to post again.
"Islam Ex Muslim Allah is a Gangster watch this you will leave Islam"
I'm a former Muslim Christian convert and my religion is better than theirs.
"Taqiyya and Jihad - - lying to non-believers"
"Muslim scholars teach that Muslims should generally be truthful to each other, unless the purpose of lying is to "smooth over differences.""
Yes, this post attributes to ISLAM the rantings of a few.
Watch this
then watch this
Romans 1:18 ESV
For the wrath of God is revealed from heaven against all ungodliness and unrighteousness of men, who by their unrighteousness suppress the truth.
John 3:36
Whoever believes in the Son has eternal life; whoever does not obey the Son shall not see life, but the wrath of God remains on him.
Isaiah 26:21
For behold, the Lord is coming out from his place to punish the inhabitants of the earth for their iniquity, and the earth will disclose the blood shed on it, and will no more cover its slain.
Ezekiel 25:17
I will execute great vengeance on them with wrathful rebukes. Then they will know that I am the Lord, when I lay my vengeance upon them.”
Nahum 1:2-6
The Lord is a jealous and avenging God; the Lord is avenging and wrathful; the Lord takes vengeance on his adversaries and keeps wrath for his enemies. The Lord is slow to anger and great in power, and the Lord will by no means clear the guilty. His way is in whirlwind and storm, and the clouds are the dust of his feet. He rebukes the sea and makes it dry; he dries up all the rivers; Bashan and Carmel wither; the bloom of Lebanon withers. The mountains quake before him; the hills melt; the earth heaves before him, the world and all who dwell in it. Who can stand before his indignation? Who can endure the heat of his anger? His wrath is poured out like fire, and the rocks are broken into pieces by him.
Revelation 20:15
And if anyone's name was not found written in the book of life, he was thrown into the lake of fire.
Then of course god deceives Abraham - “Take your son to the land of Moriah and kill your son there as a sacrifice for me. This must be Isaac, your only son, the one you love. Use him ..." But HEY! that's OK because - yanno - he's god.
And so on.
For every crackpot and extremist who seems to be interpreting the Quran to incite violence, I can find actual quotes from the Bible that are as bad, or worse.
And uh - you failed to notice that the extremist Army of God, the violent Buddhists, the genocidal Israelis are example from TODAY. MODERN TIMES. And yet, you seem focused on Islam as THE religion that needs to be wiped off the face of the earth.
You're crazy.
SAGAN: We are releasing vast quantities of carbon dioxide, increasing the greenhouse effect. It may not take much to destabilize the Earth's climate, to convert this heaven, our only home in the cosmos, into a kind of hell.
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Ok my mistake, so you are a f-ckingidiot
AND YOU LOST
you fall flat on your face, you cry and throw a hissy fit and all you hit is smoke and I laugh at you like a Zen Master would laugh at a baby having a little temper tantrum
you tried, you lost and now you look like a crybabybitch
Walk away from this one cos you're not winning
I post something against Islamism and immediately you hijack this thread to bash Christians, I don't give a fuck if you bash them DO IT
IT AMUSES ME, I find it funny
but do it in another thread and don't hijack this one with your Pro-Islamic Anti-Christian BS
There are other firefly threads, plenty of them out there for bashing those dumbass redneck Christian bible readers
The only reason I happen to post vids that seem to be from the -Christianrightwing or rednecks Christains is because almost NO ATHEIST WILL BASH ISLAM...most of them are too chickenshits
In the left movement you can find thousands and thousands of people who attack those Christian bible nuts
Yet there are only about 20 or so Atheists or Apostates who do attack Islam, people like Dawkins, Christopher Hitchens, Ayaan Hirsi Ali, Maher...but that's it....you've got this thing called radical Islam which censors criticism, death threats to South Park cartoonists, bombings, beheadings, whenever you need film to make a point against islam sadly you need to vist the rightwinger newscaster because the leftwing are too chicken to call out islamism, unfortunately for the liberals the right is winning this war of minds because its the right and not the left who are calling it correct on radical islam...often times the left are to spineless to call out Islamists
People would normally be allowed criticize suicide bombers, people would normally criticize mohammed a rapist mass murdering pedophile as a terrible human and yet they believe this man muhammed to be a prophet of 'God', Muslims are still adamant to their false belief that Allah was not a pagan god, the people would normally be encouraged to examine Islam, examine Mecca as historians and writers like Rushdie did, open up the books and examine its Pagan Moon God Al-Lat and the Sabians, Nabonidus, Babylonian, Hindu and Persian roots which come from pre-Islamic Arabia
blame Islamophillia, Qatar and Saudi money, blame regressive leftism and your dumbass party and your dumbass tv brainwashing
and yes I have read the history and done the math, and I think it is correct to call radical Islam the greatest threat to humanity, since its birth it has been eating people the 6th Century CE or BC as you Americans call it, 7th century BC - ?8th century....Islam has spread itself through violence...how do you think it left Mecca and spread into Libya, how did it spread to Turkey? Spread into Iran?
Do you think as some crazy Liberals do that Islam spread itself through kisses and flowers
Is that how Islam historically spread? It spread through bunny rabbits, hugs and happy colors and happy rainbows? Is that how you think Muslims sent their religion into other lands, flowers and kisses?
It is estimated that muslims and radical Islam may have killed upwards of 200+ Million People, yes think about that number for a second plus TWO HUNDRED MIL PERSONS killed by radical muslims
and while its true there are times when other religions have been a greater danger to humanity but currently its islamism that's winning the race for violence and depravity
Regressive lefts are killing the Democrats turning them into Dumbocrats
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"I post something against Islamism and immediately you hijack this thread to bash Christians ..."
Actually, I showed that there's extremism built into the bible, both the ot and the nt - with quotes! - and made the general case that every religion has its own brand of extremism built in. It's a fact. Sorry you can't deal with reality.
And I further made the points I've been making all along, that 1) the fact you (mostly) don't see Christians, Jews, Buddhists and others doing extreme things is because people ignore those inconvenient teachings (well, you do see Zionists doing a lot of extreme things - they're genocidal); and 2) you'll find people willing to take those extreme doctrines to the extreme in EVERY religion.
So - given that there's extremism built into every religion, and you'll find extremists willing to be extreme in every religion - why are you so focused on trying to wipe Islam specifically off the earth?
SAGAN: We are releasing vast quantities of carbon dioxide, increasing the greenhouse effect. It may not take much to destabilize the Earth's climate, to convert this heaven, our only home in the cosmos, into a kind of hell.
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a quick lesson in the art of fighting without fighting not a video game Ryuko no Ken, yizhong yuyan yongyuan bugou
Did you ever wonder why the radical muslims hate and fear Salman Rushdie a 5' 7" and 130 lbs man, mere stature, soft manner, slightly balding, pudgy...why they fear him more than they fear 100 US Cruise missiles?
Quote:
Originally posted by 1kiki:
Sorry you can't deal with reality.
You're the one not dealing with reality, I have been on this forum a long, long time, way back before 2005, 2004 way, way back when it was once an Andromeda tribute website, the tv show firefly a mere subforum
and I have been bashing radical Chistians, I have been critical of the bible nuts for a long long time...it is you who can't deal with reality
Quote:
Originally posted by 1kiki:
trying to wipe Islam specifically off the earth?
Who says I want to kill any of them?
Maybe I don't want anyone dead, maybe I only want all the radical ones deported home to Mecca or whichever islamic hole they would enjoy to live?
Maybe I'm an old school Democrat? Connect with the people born in the FDR, MLK, de Gaulle, JFK eras? Maybe all I want is for political leaders to have a spine just as JFK spoke against communism?
Maybe I don't want a single cruise missile wasted on some idiot on a camel, maybe the wacky religion can be broke with South Park cartoons and Salman Rushdie books
Are you getting the picture yet?
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"Maybe I don't want anyone dead"
Well, I didn't say MUSLIMS, which would be directed at people and would involve death --- I said ISLAM. Here: "And yet, you seem focused on ISLAM as THE religion that needs to be wiped off the face of the earth" and here: "why are you so focused on trying to wipe ISLAM specifically off the earth?" Do you understand the difference?
Your posts are anti-Islam.
SAGAN: We are releasing vast quantities of carbon dioxide, increasing the greenhouse effect. It may not take much to destabilize the Earth's climate, to convert this heaven, our only home in the cosmos, into a kind of hell.
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Quote:
Originally posted by 1kiki:
Your posts are anti-Islam.
Take a second analyzing your own writing, your own person with the potential for individual thought, have time to do a little quick objective self criticism. Step outside your self for a moment and think about what you said here
....will reply later
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support muslims who make a joke of the faith.....at its core it has very shakey foundations
that is an Islam problem
not an all have shakey foundation problem ... its an Islam problem
this backward barabaric islamic faith
and much, much more.
So, why do you think Islam is so bad compared to the teachings of other religions and the actions of their most dedicated adherents?
SAGAN: We are releasing vast quantities of carbon dioxide, increasing the greenhouse effect. It may not take much to destabilize the Earth's climate, to convert this heaven, our only home in the cosmos, into a kind of hell.
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FINALLY! Someone is speculating.... well, even more than speculating ... about the deep-state politics behind our so-called policies in the Mideast (and elsewhere)
Seymour Hersh Bombshell: US Military Shared Intelligence With Assad In Defiance Of Obama, CIA
This is a very long article, which I've quoted extensively and linked. According to Hersch, there is a very deep division between the CIA and the formal military - so much so that our military provided intelligence to the German, Israeli, and Russian militaries, who were to pass that on the the Syrian military.
Hersch references both his previous articles and other events in support of his article, many of which I've tracked through regular world reportage. In addition, he obtained high-level interviews of participants and observers to stitch this all together into a narrative.
The parts that I've tracked thru the press ...
The "rat line" of supplies from Qatar and Saudi Arabia thru Turkey to the "freedom-loving" "Arab Spring" "pro-democracy" "rebels" in Libya, from too many sources to cite, some VERY specific, about the numbers of planeloads of arms and where they came from, clocked thru Turkish airports. There is NO irony too heavy-handed for the clusterfuck of deep-state actors pushing western-exceptionalist liberals into supporting jihadist terrorists under the banner of R2P, and creating a jihadist-laden, desperately broken, smoking ruin where once a secular and prosperous nation once stood. If R2Pers haven't learned anything from Libya (or Iraq), they are irremediably brainwashed and it's doubtful they will EVER learn anything outside of their own narrow ideology. (KPO, THUGR, G)
But I digress. The point is that these arms shipments were reported in the press, and CERTAINLY known to the major militaries and intelligence units within the western powers. After Libya fell, there was another "rat line" established through Bengahzi, trans-shipping arms from Libya, once again through Turkey, to Syria. Our "poor innocent" Ambassador to Libya, Christopher Stevens, was almost certainly directly involved, as his personal calendar places him at the CIA's operations center -
Quote:. I've posted about many times about Turkey's, Saudi Arabia's, and Qatar's roles in the teaching, training, funding, and arming of jihadists MANY TIMES here.
On 11 September 2012 the US ambassador to Libya, Christopher Stevens, was killed during an anti-American demonstration that led to the burning down of the US consulate in Benghazi; reporters for the Washington Postfound copies of the ambassador’s schedule in the building’s ruins. It showed that on 10 September Stevens had met with the chief of the CIA’s annex operation. The next day, shortly before he died, he met a representative from Al-Marfa Shipping and Maritime Services, a Tripoli-based company which, the JCS adviser said, was known by the Joint Staff to be handling the weapons shipments.
The false-flag SARIN GAS ATTACK IN GHOUTA, helpfully arranged by Turkey, was also a topic of many posts HERE.
Even KPO acknowledged at one point the significant intervention by the CIA in Syria. In a discussion about WHAT "moderate rebels"?, with the revelation that only five had been officially trained, as I recall KPO referenced the "hundreds of thousands" of CIA secretly-trained "rebels" in Syria. It was a backwards acknowledgement that the CIA has broad operations there.
Turkey's shipments to jihadists in Syria are also well-known and fairly widely reported (at least, in world news), and I've certainly posted about THAT many times.
In addition, the whistleblower letter of protest, signed by about 50 Defense Intelligence Agency (DIA) analysts, protesting the "whitewashing" of their reports on the deteriorating situation in Syria, as well as a 2011 DIA analysis of the potential growth of a independent jihadist state with continued
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Some of you guys are killing these threads with all the videos you are posting. They take forever to load. Give it a break
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New Kids on the Block: Saudi Coalition to 'Stall Joint Anti-Daesh Effort'
Quote:
Parties to the Syrian conflict, including new ones, are pursuing completely different goals in this standoff, which undermines a joint fight against Daesh militants, according to the US-based intelligence firm Stratfor.
The US-based intelligence firm Stratfor suggested that a united fight against Daesh (ISIL/Islamic State) terrorists may be undermined by "the differing goals and interests" of the Syrian conflict's participants. Stratfor analyzed the possible consequences of the participation of "new faces" — members of the so-called Islamic military coalition, which was recently announced by Saudi Arabia. According to Sratfor, "an end to the Syrian conflict is nowhere in sight, and more countries are being drawn into the fray."
"Responding to US pressure and keen to have more influence on the direction of the Syrian civil war, the Saudis are attempting to coordinate a deployment of troops on the ground in Syria alongside their allies," [al Qaida- SIGNYM] Stratfor said. It referred to the United States and Turkey as the countries which are also interested in the deployment of Arab forces in Syria. As for Washington, Stratfor said, it has repeatedly been criticized over "a perceived lack of progress in the war" against Daesh, which is why the White House currently wants to draw additional forces in the region.
http://sputniknews.com/middleeast/20151227/1032369713/syria-daesh-coal
ition.html#ixzz3vXZoRcRi
I'm not sure if you know who Strafor is. I suggest you look it up.
What I see now is a war of attrition, with the USA and Saudi Arabia (that barbaric enforcer and promoter of Wahhabism) in alliance. I'll detail that later, maybe.
--------------------
In a previous thread, I speculated that world powers were getting closer to war.
Well, that moment is here. War is being waged on informational, economic, financial, political, militia, and proxy-fronts. Full-scale nuclear war has been openly threatened (by Russia). The only thing lacking is the major militaries directly confronting each other with soldiers, tanks, warships, and airplanes.
Like the paired DNA breaking apart and each forming a separate pole, nations and entities - by their actions- are splitting apart, distinguishing themselves from each other when they were previously amorphous. The location of this polarization is Syraq. On the one hand is Russia, Iran, Syria, Hezbollah, nominally China, and possible partners or neutrals like India, Egypt, the Causasus, and south and central America.
On the other side is ISIL, al Qaida, Boko Haram, Saudi Arabia/GCC, and (I'm ashamed to say) the USA and the EU. And the international banks, one should never forget those.
I can't believe ... here we are, on the side of terrorists and Nazis.
I weep for my country.
--------------
On a knee-jerk level, people support the deep-state of the USA, UK, or EU. But the time has come, I think to decide- WHAT DO YOU REALLY SUPPORT? What are you really for?
--------------
You can't build a nation with bombs. You can't create a society with guns.
There is a difference between THUGR is a genius., and THUGR is a "genius". And everyone knows it except THUGR, who is a "genius".
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Oh. my. god.
When Saudi Arabia announced the 'coalition', and Malaysia and Pakistan who were supposed members said 'Hey! That's the first WE ever heard about it!', I assumed it was a publicity stunt.
But it now seems real, and the 'coalition' is set to put troops in Syria - without invite or permission, which makes them aggressor nations - and the US is backing it?
Oh. crap.
Russia can't help but interpret this as a US/ EU plan to use proxies to destroy it. And it WILL react in a definitive military way. It can't help BUT do that. This is reckless, insane escalation. Because when, not if, Russia responds, what will happen next? Other countries will be drawn in and line up on one side, or the other, in a feedback cycle of increasing war.
Does Obama WANT WWIII? (Which I guarantee will be nuclear.) Is he fine with that?
THGR, kpo, 'G' - are YOU fine with that?
SAGAN: We are releasing vast quantities of carbon dioxide, increasing the greenhouse effect. It may not take much to destabilize the Earth's climate, to convert this heaven, our only home in the cosmos, into a kind of hell.
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As usual, you're looking at the sources and not what it says.
I suggested that you look up Stratfor not because it's universally right, but because it's CLEARLY NOT A PRO-RUSSIAN ORGANIZATION. A point which you amply demonstrated for me, thank you!
Now, do you have anything INTERESTING AND ON-TOPIC TO SAY? Or are you reflexively spewing crap, again?
--------------
You can't build a nation with bombs. You can't create a society with guns.
There is a difference between THUGR is a genius., and THUGR is a "genius". And everyone knows it except THUGR, who is a "genius".
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Quote:
Originally posted by 1kiki:
Oh. my. god.
When Saudi Arabia announced the 'coalition', and Malaysia and Pakistan who were supposed members said 'Hey! That's the first WE ever heard about it!', I assumed it was a publicity stunt.
But it now seems real, and the 'coalition' is set to put troops in Syria - without invite or permission, which makes them aggressor nations - and the US is backing it?
Oh. crap.
Russia can't help but interpret this as a US/ EU plan to use proxies to destroy it. And it WILL react in a definitive military way. It can't help BUT do that. This is reckless, insane escalation. Because when, not if, Russia responds, what will happen next? Other countries will be drawn in and line up on one side, or the other, in a feedback cycle of increasing war.
Does Obama WANT WWIII? (Which I guarantee will be nuclear.) Is he fine with that?
THGR, kpo, 'G' - are YOU fine with that?
Iran (Shia) and Saudi Arabia (Sunni) are engaged in a war of religions that engulfs the Middle East. I don’t know how many times this has to be explained to you. The United States is trying to get the Arab nations to fight their own battles, while blocking the Republicans here from marching another fifty thousand troops into the conflicts there.
Fuck Russia, without the use of Nukes it would be over in a month if full scale war is declared.
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Quote:
Originally posted by SIGNYM:
There is a difference between THUGR is a genius., and THUGR is a "genius". And everyone knows it except THUGR, who is a "genius".
Love the complement SIG. The way this is written it clearly states that you consider me not only a genius, but by restating it and putting it in quotes, incredible. Wish I could say the same about you but alas, you are a moron.
As for your Turkey invades Iraq quote. Since you were in attack mode and criticizing Turkey with no mention of previous conversations about the term invasion, you clearly were not being sarcastic.
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Originally posted by G:
Stratfor is big in the world speculation business. Stands for: Strategic Forecasting (no wonder SINGSLIKEACANARY likes them so much).
http://www.businessinsider.com/stratfor-has-11-chilling-predictions-fo
r-what-the-world-will-look-like-in-10-years-2015-6
Stratfor has 11 chilling predictions for what the world will look like in 10 years
#1
Russia will collapse ...
*gasp*!...wait... I have to catch my breath... laughing too hard... ok:
"There will not be an uprising against Moscow, but Moscow's withering ability to support and control the Russian Federation will leave a vacuum," Stratfor warns. "What will exist in this vacuum will be the individual fragments of the Russian Federation."
Sanctions, declining oil prices, a plunging ruble, rising military expenses, and increasing internal discord will weaken the hold of Russia's central government over the world's largest country. Russia will not officially split into multiple countries, but Moscow's power may loosen to the point that Russia will effectively become a string of semiautonomous regions that might not even get along with one another.
"We expect Moscow's authority to weaken substantially, leading to the formal and informal fragmentation of Russia" the report states, adding, "It is unlikely that the Russian Federation will survive in its current form."
Awww SNIGGLES, just when you thought things were going so well for your new country!
Hey! OMG! Look what else they said:
"The world has been restructuring itself since 2008, when Russia invaded Georgia and the subprime financial crisis struck."
*double snort* that's just too good - you sure can pick 'em.
"Yea", this is just too good to be true. Hey 1kiki, are you and SIG OK with that?
Hey SIG look. Yea is in quotation marks. What could I possible mean by that?
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Iran (Shia) and Saudi Arabia (Sunni) are engaged in a war of religions that engulfs the Middle East.
Which religious sects were involved in Egypt? Libya? Tunisia? Algeria? Iraq? It sure seems like the US and the western world* (more on this later) go out of their way to be involved in this so-called 'sectarian' strife, with no visible sectarian interests involved - or mentioned by the US or the western press.
The United States is trying to get the Arab nations to fight their own battles... * Then why is it involved in supporting one side over the other, and using everything BUT boots on the ground (except, of course illegal secretive actions by the CIA) to support one side or the other? Are you trying to tell me that the US insistence 'Assad must go' (or Hussein, Qaddafi, Mubarak, or Abidine Ben Ali) is the US NOT engaging itself in that strife? Is THAT the US letting them 'fight their own battles'?
SAGAN: We are releasing vast quantities of carbon dioxide, increasing the greenhouse effect. It may not take much to destabilize the Earth's climate, to convert this heaven, our only home in the cosmos, into a kind of hell.
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Quote:
Originally posted by 1kiki:
So, why do you think Islam is so bad compared to the teachings of other religions and the actions of their most dedicated adherents?
here is one for you, its a link...now before I post it I will give you a warning the writer may be a Deist, he might have a philosophy of Deism....but I'm not selling you anything just asking you to look at some written ideas
http://www.sullivan-county.com/id2/index.htm
The article is interesting
I am not selling you religion, not selling you Christianity or asking you to change philosophy or go to a Hindu temple or change and become Buddhist
I will sum its conclusion in case you can't be bothered to read
Quote:
Originally posted by EXTERNAL WEBSITE from a philosophical math teacher and professor:
Conclusion
Islam today is the most violent and intolerant faith on earth and for no good reason. Muslims have lost both their greatness and reason for conspiracy theories, hysteria, and terrorism.
Today most Muslim countries produce nothing and the per capita income even of wealthy Saudi Arabia is half that of South Korea and going down. Most Muslims sit by in silence or make excuses. Religious fundamentalism has left Islam unable to modernize, innovate, or Muslims even to feed themselves. Millions of Muslims live on Western handouts while calling for the death of those that feed them. Islam needs a Muslim Thomas Paine or Thomas Jefferson. The alternative is continued war and conflict with every nation on earth and eventual extermination.
If there is anything factually incorrect on this page, e-mail me and I'll correct it. Send verifiable proof.
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Quote:
Iran (Shia) and Saudi Arabia (Sunni) are engaged in a war of religions that engulfs the Middle East.
It's always tough to tell when a nation is engaging in a religious war for economic reasons, an economic war for religious reasons, or a shooting war for national reasons.
With more information, I've re-thought my speculation about the mideast troubles being a result of a Sunni-Shia war.
IMHO there are only TWO nations in the Mideast that are engaged in religious wars: Saudi Arabia and Israel. Iran, although theocratic, isn't trying to impose the Shia version of Islam on anybody. They seem to be fighting mostly defensively, and their motives appear to be along the lines of nationalism.
Quote:
I don’t know how many times this has to be explained to you. The United States is trying to get the Arab nations to fight their own battles, while blocking the Republicans here from marching another fifty thousand troops into the conflicts there.
First of all, that's 100% bullshit. Leaked embassy cables show that the USA has been fomenting sectarian division in Syria since 2006. Also, there's all of those overt invasions and covert CIA activities - funded by illegal drug trafficking, which the USA Army is prohibited from interfering with (You want to know the reason for the recent "heroin epidemic"? Try cheap opium, sourced from Afghanistan.)
In addition to being 100% counterfactual, you reveal your pro-Democrat biases by saying
"The United States is ... while blocking the Republicans". It's like you think Republicans are NOT part of the United States; only the Democrats in the WH are "the United States"! You should be clearer, at least in your own mind.
Quote:Yes, but not in the direction you think. The military .... not the spooks illegally funding their covert ops with drug sales, but the real military ... is loathe to tangle with Russia, for all kinds of reasons (weapons).
Fuck Russia, without the use of Nukes it would be over in a month if full scale war is declared.
Everything you wrote is wrong. Unbelievable! But at least you're consistent.
--------------
You can't build a nation with bombs. You can't create a society with guns.
There is a difference between THUGR is a genius., and THUGR is a "genius". And everyone knows it except THUGR, who is a "genius".
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Well, it looks like hellzapoppin' in the ME.
Saudi Arabia - fomenter of jihadism, brutal theocratic tyranny, and our friend and ally - did one of its mass executions a few days ago.
More executions this year than for many previous decades, and an indication that the current Monarch Salman bin Abdulaziz Al Saud 
... or his favorite first son by his third wife, Mohamed bin Salman Al Saud 
(It's a little hard to tell who's driving the bus) is far more aggressive than the previous monarch.
One of those executed was a well-known Shia cleric, Sheikh Nimr al-Nimr, who was convicted of "terrorist acts". This set off a firestorm- literally- of protest in Iran, as the Saudi Embassy was set on fire. The Saudis and their postage-stamp allies (including Bahrain, which is majority Shia but headed by a Sunni theocracy itself) have either cut diplomatic ties with Iran or downgraded them.
Given that Saudi Arabia was warned by the west about executing the Shia cleric, this execution was an entirely deliberate provocation.
And sure enough, the Iranians were provoked, and in a pre-planned bit of political theater the KSA and its postage-stamp allies went off in a snit.
So, why now?
It must be to derail the UN Syrian peace process which the USA, Russia, Iran, and Saudi Arabia are to begin.
And, as expected, the "opposition" in Syrian - MOSTLY FUNDED BY SAUDI ARABIA (so much for those "moderate Syrian rebels!) are pulling out of the peace talks.
The Saudis clearly don't want a peace. And the only reason to toss the chessboard is when things aren't going well! Either the Russian military action is having the desired effect of routing Saudi terrorists, or the Saudi's oil-price war has boomeranged (subsidy cuts in the KSA!), or the Saudi's two-front war is draining their coffers, or the USA is sidling out the door ... but clearly the Saudis feel as if they're in a weak bargaining positions and don't anticipate a positive outcome from negotiations.
Obama- your move?
--------------
You can't build a nation with bombs. You can't create a society with guns.
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Every one here SIG knows Saudi Arabia is an ally to the United States. Everyone here also knows you are allied with Russia. Therefore your ally is Iran.
So, it is probably best when you refer to Saudi Arabia you do not refer to them as our ally in a way that suggests the word (our) includes you.
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Quote:
Originally posted by G:Quote:
Originally posted by THGRRI:
So, it is probably best when you refer to Saudi Arabia you do not refer to them as our ally in a way that suggests the word (our) includes you.
Heh heh - I love when she tries to pull the "I weep for my country..." bs.
SNIGGLES, hate to break it to you again... we know. It has been that obvious for a very long time. It kind of undermines your conceit when you think we don't see the bright red hammer and sickle tattoo on your forehead.
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You guys must really love ISIL.
--------------
You can't build a nation with bombs. You can't create a society with guns.
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Quote:
Originally posted by G:Quote:
Originally posted by SIGNYM:
You guys must really love ISIL.
:eyeroll:
STIGMA'S Top 10 Things to do in 2016:
1. Bring more Stupid...
2. Over Simplify Everything
3. Admit confusion occasionally to gain empathy
4. Work harder at acting sincere
5. see #1
6. Join the Right Wing to fight boredom
7. Smack Kiki
8. Randomly agree with people to throw them off
9. Start spelling "Nazi" ISIL
And Number 10: See #5
Following THUGR'S example, I noticed you don't object when THUGR pulls out the "commie troll" and "comrade" epithets. Not that you're biased or anything, but it's just weird that you notice these ad hominens when I do them (in direct honor of our dear friend, THUGR) but not when he does. So I figured I'd return the favor.
--------------
You can't build a nation with bombs. You can't create a society with guns.
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Since your monomania about Russia appears in every single friggin' thread that you post in, relevant or not, maybe you should explain yourself here:
WHY I ABHOR RUSSIA
http://www.fireflyfans.net/mthread.aspx?tid=60306
--------------
You can't build a nation with bombs. You can't create a society with guns.
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Quote:
Originally posted by SIGNYM:Quote:
Originally posted by G:Quote:
Originally posted by SIGNYM:
You guys must really love ISIL.
:eyeroll:
STIGMA'S Top 10 Things to do in 2016:
1. Bring more Stupid...
2. Over Simplify Everything
3. Admit confusion occasionally to gain empathy
4. Work harder at acting sincere
5. see #1
6. Join the Right Wing to fight boredom
7. Smack Kiki
8. Randomly agree with people to throw them off
9. Start spelling "Nazi" ISIL
And Number 10: See #5
Following THUGR'S example, I noticed you don't object when THUGR pulls out the "commie troll" and "comrade" epithets. Not that you're biased or anything, but it's just weird that you notice these ad hominens when I do them (in direct honor of our dear friend, THUGR) but not when he does. So I figured I'd return the favor.
Oops, there's those pesky quotes again SIG. I guess what you are really saying is that I do not pull out the commie troll and comrade epithets.
You're such an ass.
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Break the oil addiction, replace the energy needs with solar, biofuel, nuclear, wind whatever
Have another commodity back the Dollar - Gold, Uranium, Coffee, Copper, Helium-3, Computer chips, Bit coins, Silver whatever it needs....just break that Petro-Dollar bondage
taking the Dollar off the Gold Standard was a massive mistake
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a West that is morally bankrupt or not?
the Saudi it executes people for crime but also kills people for offending their pedophile terrorist Moongod named Al-Lah
the Soccer Scum, the Low IQ who support it and FIFA scum..."heid the baw" as Scottish call them
Saudi Arabia: Flawed Assessment of World Cup Bid
https://www.hrw.org/news/2024/10/28/saudi-arabia-flawed-assessment-wor
ld-cup-bid
Groups criticise flawed FIFA World Cup 2034 assessment
https://www.insidethegames.biz/articles/1149641/
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