Surge or Surrender

POSTED BY: Hero
UPDATED: Saturday, January 20, 2007 17:03
VIEWED: 15139
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FREMDFIRMA

Friday, January 19, 2007 2:47 AM

Apparently there's been a reading comprehension failure here.

Quote:
Sure, have your opinion, that's all you, and of no concern to me, if you feel it's a good idea, what have you, who am I to say different, sure.

An opinion is just that, an opinion.

Quote:
But when you vote to loot my pocket and my family for it

Different story, at that point - that's you, robbing me, is how I see it.

Doesn't look like anyone's gonna be reasonable, and it sure doesn't look like folks are going to re-examine sending others to die for something they only vaguely support in a halfass fashion, so screw it, my point is completely lost on folk it seems, guess that's a big part of why this mess continues.

And yes, if I support something so wholeheartedly as to strongly believe in it, I DO put forth on it - case in point, folks too drunk to drive.

Most cab companies have a seasonal program where they take a loss for PR value by running home drunks for free during new years, but the rest of the year yer pretty much out of luck.

I started offering said service year-round, it's not that much of a bite to my pocket all things considered and I feel better knowing these fools are NOT on the road, and cleaning vomit off the backseat is a helluva lot better than scraping some poor sodder and his victims off the asphalt, in my opinion.

Certain bars started putting up a kitty to pay me back for the service, which seems to be substantially contributed to by a lot of shall we say, repeat customers thereof, and so I don't lose out much if at all anymore, and in the end you have less folk climbing behind the wheel when they shouldn't be, which is a good thing, and one I believed in.

If imma jackass for asking folk put up an equal share for something they vote to have stolen from me, then imma jackass, so be it.

-Frem

ANTHONYT

Friday, January 19, 2007 2:59 AM

Frem,

I doubt there's any votes that say, "I vote to take money from Frem and to sacrifice his first born."

Rather it's more likely everyone gets to pay money, and everyone who volounteers for military service is at risk...

so how is your share unequal? How are you putting up more than anyone else?

I don't see your logic even one iota.

As for your drunk driving intervention, congratulations. That is a good and wholesome act.

That doesn't begin to make me believe that you back every vote you make with personal, physical involvement. Unless you hardly ever vote? That's possible.

--Anthony

"Liberty must not be purchased at the cost of Humanity." --Captain Robert Henner

RUE

Friday, January 19, 2007 3:12 AM

OMG how did this happen?

RUE

Friday, January 19, 2007 3:13 AM

I got a three-peat.

RUE

Friday, January 19, 2007 3:13 AM

Maybe the question is better asked as - do you support the war enough to bring back the draft?

ANTHONYT

Friday, January 19, 2007 4:07 AM

Quote:
Originally posted by rue:
Maybe the question is better asked as - do you support the war enough to bring back the draft?

That is a MUCH better question.

Of course, those who have been paying attention know that I wish to end this fiasco as soon as possible.

My only excitement about the recent Bush proposal is that it was attached to an expectation of withdrawal before next year.

--Anthony

"Liberty must not be purchased at the cost of Humanity." --Captain Robert Henner

FLETCH2

Friday, January 19, 2007 8:05 AM

Quote:
Originally posted by rue:
Maybe the question is better asked as - do you support the war enough to bring back the draft?

I'm against it. It takes time to set up a draft, select people, tran, equip and deploy them and that's just to get your most basic "point a gun in the right direction" infantry grunt.

If the government institutes a draft it means either they think the war will run at least another 2 years or they will need a LOT more men fairly soon. Otherwise the cost and disruption of the program doesn't make sense over just recruiting more folks into the military through inducements. I'm not sure anybody really want to be there more than another 2 years or wants large numbers of hastily prepared and rudementarily equiped troops thrown into the fray.

FREMDFIRMA

Friday, January 19, 2007 12:52 PM

Rue has the better question sure...

Look, i'm snippy about this cause i've buried friends over it, ok?

Little knew what he was getting into, and nobody who defuses or disables dud ordinance for a living has any illusions about what'll eventually happen to em, but as for the rest - how do you explain to the kids mother when he signed up to get out of the hood and into college, and he comes back in a box, and for what ?

How do you explain that to the grieving parent of a friend ?
When it's bought us as a people essentially nothing but risk, debt and misery ?

And then to hear someone evidence support for it, but a distinct unwillingness to put anything on the line for it, how exactly do you think imma take it ?

As a general rule I tend not to ask folk to do anything for me that I would not do if the situation demanded it, is that so wrong then ?

And it's one thing to volunteer for service, and another to be held past your term and repeatedly stoplossed till your employer eliminates your position, your house is foreclosed and your wife bails - talk to some of these guys, especially the older ones who they dredged up from the IRR program, which was meant as a last-ditch defensive concept, it's sadly too common - we're askin a lot even of the ones who do come back at least half-sane and in one piece.

Quote:
That doesn't begin to make me believe that you back every vote you make with personal, physical involvement.

You didn't see the brawl around here over jackin my property taxes to build an un-needed new school in someone else's district...
They wanted a 'blank check' for their contractor buddies to sponge on, and no way in hell does a town with a population of less than a thousand need a school with EIGHT tennis courts no-thank-you.

We shot that proposal to bits, and then city council whines about taxpayers not being 'educated' enough to vote intelligently (i.e. how they wanted!) and wants to spend more tax dollars on a propaganda campaign to 'educate' us before the slap this idocy back on the ballot ?

To quote Book - "Not.Gonna.Happen."

If I put a vote to it, if I care that much, yeah, I'll generally do somethin about it - went down to Woodward to a meeting and fronted some bills out of pocket for Dean (yeah, I voted for him, afore he sold out to the DNC) and backed up Jenny Granholm pretty solid - and would love to see that useless criminal Cox right straight out of this state on a rail.

And of course, Firefly, right ?

Maybe i'm strange, maybe a lot so, but if I believe in something, yeah, i tend to back it up such as is possible, so forgive me if i don't really understand folks who don't.

-Frem

ANTHONYT

Friday, January 19, 2007 3:54 PM

Well, Frem,

I guess you're just a superior human being.

Me? I believe in a lot of things, but only physically involve myself in a few.

I've voted on a myriad of issues, but I've never had the balls to 'brawl' anyone over my vote, much less to 'shoot' their bills. I never did more than place a ballot in a box. I also never personally fronted all of the money a political candidate needed to enact bills.

I *have* had co-workers die and get f-up on the job, but I never had to talk to little Johnny and explain why dad didn't come home.

Hell, I never even drove a drunk home who wasn't my friend.

I always thought I could have an opinion, even vote, without getting my ass personally involved in the issue in question. I thought I could do that and still be a man. Even a good man.

But now I realize I'm hypocritical scum that deserves to weep while Frem plays a humbling tune on the virtiola.

*sets the bar on high, and engraves it 'Frem'*

Behold, the bar upon which humanity is judged.

--Anthony

"Liberty must not be purchased at the cost of Humanity." --Captain Robert Henner

FREMDFIRMA

Friday, January 19, 2007 7:09 PM

Now yer just bein an ass.

Look, lemme put it in such a simple form as to get it through your pin head.

Your opinion is just that, your opinion.
But when you vote for something like this...

How can you morally justify sending people off to die for something you only vaguely give a shit about ?

Your moral position sucks, and you know it, and all the lame excuses in the world just do not cut it with me.

Your Mileage May Vary.

-F

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