I wish you all could rcognise
POSTED BY: Cache
UPDATED: Sunday, April 1, 2007 08:57
VIEWED: 27065
PAGE 13 of 14
Wow.... I want Firefly back as much as the next folk... but pissing off the GORRAM Fox isn't gunna get us anywhere, hell, it might even make us fall back a step... all we can really do is keep signing, keep collecting, and keep spreading the 'verse...
We'll HOLD, HOLD till Firefly's back on the air!!!
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Hey I actually did a bit of research instead of
going off of assumptions. Now I am not a lawyer
but:
Excerpt from USC title 17 Section 506
§506. Criminal offenses
(a)
Criminal infringement.
(1)
In general. Any person who willfully infringes a copyright shall be punished as provided under section 2319 of title 18 [18 USC §2319], if the infringement was committed--
(A)
for purposes of commercial advantage or private financial gain;
(B)
by the reproduction or distribution, including by electronic means, during any 180-day period, of 1 or more copies or phonorecords of 1 or more copyrighted works, which have a total retail value of more than $ 1,000; or
(C)
by the distribution of a work being prepared for commercial distribution, by making it available on a computer network accessible to members of the public, if such person knew or should have known that the work was intended for commercial distribution.
Looking at that retail value stipulation I would
say that distributing 100 copies of a 1 of 4
DVD box set with a retail value of 29.99 falls
slightly under the mark of criminal. So to do so
would be breaking no law. /waves to all those
calling me a criminal. 
Even if the value
of the one disc is assumed to be the value of the
whole boxed set one could still send out 33 discs
without breaking the law.
Now that we are aware of what is legal and what is
not we can begin to have the real discussion.
What civil actions can be taken?
Excerpt from USC title 17 Section 501
§501. Infringement of copyright
(a)
Anyone who violates any of the exclusive rights of the copyright owner as provided by sections 106 through 122 [17 USC § §106-122] or of the author as provided in section 106A(a) [17 USC 106A(a)], or who imports copies or phonorecords into the United States in violation of section 602 [17 USC 602], is an infringer of the copyright or right of the author, as the case may be. For purposes of this chapter [17 USC § §501 et seq.] (other than section 506 [17 USC 506]), any reference to copyright shall be deemed to include the rights conferred by section 106A(a) [17 USC 106A(a)]. As used in this subsection, the term "anyone" includes any State, any instrumentality of a State, and any officer or employee of a State or instrumentality of a State acting in his or her official capacity. Any State, and any such instrumentality, officer, or employee, shall be subject to the provisions of this title in the same manner and to the same extent as any nongovernmental entity.
(b)
The legal or beneficial owner of an exclusive right under a copyright is entitled, subject to the requirements of section 411 [17 USC 411], to institute an action for any infringement of that particular right committed while he or she is the owner of it. The court may require such owner to serve written notice of the action with a copy of the complaint upon any person shown, by the records of the Copyright Office or otherwise, to have or claim an interest in the copyright, and shall require that such notice be served upon any person whose interest is likely to be affected by a decision in the case. The court may require the joinder, and shall permit the intervention, of any person having or claiming an interest in the copyright.
Now this is the sticky part. Here is where the
majority of corporations send you a C&D. In my
mind however, what corporation in their right mind
stops an ad campaign that is designed to drive up
sales of their product? The end result being that
copies of their product end up in the hands of
those who either 1) would not buy their product
even if they knew of its existence (i.e. people
who watch the first disc and toss it in the trash)
or 2) would buy their product if they knew of its
existence and do so expressly because of said
campaign.
P.S. Troublemaker, I would reply to your harsh
comments but I'm not going to let your obviously
winning attitude get me down. Much love to ya.
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Also wanna say... whats with all the personal attacks here folks?? Seriously... if we wanna get something done, we gotta WORK TOGATHER!!! Shure, smackin' down on eachothers ideas is fun and all... but enough with the personal attacks!!! 
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Quote:
Originally posted by BrownCoat2007:
Wow.... I want Firefly back as much as the next folk... but pissing off the GORRAM Fox isn't gunna get us anywhere, hell, it might even make us fall back a step... all we can really do is keep signing, keep collecting, and keep spreading the 'verse...
We'll HOLD, HOLD till Firefly's back on the air!!!
Not pissing off Fox hasn't done anything either.
Seems to me that any publicity is good publicity. There is no way in the 'verse that anything that got their attention would be a bad thing, no matter how criminal somebody got about it. I'm not suggesting anybody do anything criminal here, I'm just saying that if FOX or Universal or whoever you need to blow to get the show back on the air thought there was money to be made off of bringing it back, there is no way in hell that they would sit on show just to make an example out of somebody.
That's what the RIAA, MPAA & the 5 years in prison and up to $250,000.00 per infringement is for.
"A government is a body of people, usually notably ungoverned." http://www.myspace.com/6ixstringjack
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heh, other thing we could do if we REALLY wanna get noticed is *looks around all consperitorial like* blow up FOX headquarters? 
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Hah! Let me be the first to say, it was really nice knowing you before the Thought Police came and took you away.
EDIT: And I said BLOW, not BLOW AWAY! Dunno about FOX, but I certainly wouldn't want a girl to make that mistake. "A government is a body of people, usually notably ungoverned." http://www.myspace.com/6ixstringjack
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hah indeed, hope y'all know that I was kidding =) 'cause blowing up things, while fun and shiney, is most defenatly illegal, if it were to be someones property other then your own
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Well, I don't really know who to respond to, or in what order, so since it's Cache's thread...
Cache:
Just in case you got the wrong impression, I'm not calling you a 'criminal'. As I said, way back up the page, people break the law -- wittingly or unwittingly -- all the time. Hell, sometimes, in order to do what I'd consider 'the right thing' -- rendering assistance at the scene of accident, for example -- a person could leave themselves liable to a lawsuit.
What you have been proposing is against the law. But it's simply not in the same league as what kaneman confessed, specifically, downloading "Serenity" and then selling pirated CD/DVD-Rs for profit. By analogy, your proposal is like setting a bonfire in your backyard (the fire marshal may cite you); what kaneman does is analogous to wanton arson. In both cases, y'all are playing with fire; but in kaneman's case, there is a blatant disregard for the health of the community. I hope everyone can easily see the difference.
I and many others would prefer not to give the Browncoat Movement an unsavory reputation by doing anything of questionable moral or legal merit.
6ixStringJack:
There is no such thing as a free society without free speech. But free speech, as envisioned by the founders of our nation and codified in our laws, does not extend to pandering criminal acts. You did not do that. kaneman did. And I'm not piling all this on kaneman. Every person has a conscious decision to make, whether to be part of the problem or part of the solution. The good news is, no matter what we've done in the past (or earlier today), we can decide to change our ways and act more responsibly to our fellow human beings, starting right now. It really is as simple as that. My sole reason for participating in this thread was to be a dissenting voice to those who so readily consider breaking a law which protects us all from the worst of such predations (see 'arson' analogy above) simply to promote an entertainment. It doesn't equate...
BrownCoat2007:
Having said all the above, I don't care if anything I say or do pisses other people off, much less F*x TV. I'm not walking this earth to make others feel more comfortable with an easy lie. I tell the truth, as it appears to me, from my unique perspective. If that makes some folks happier or more hopeful, then I am truly glad. If it makes others uncomfortable or incensed at me, at least I was honest about it. I ain't happy about it when I piss people off, but at least I can live with myself. It's better to speak what's in your heart -- and that same goes for those who have differing opinions, like 6SJ -- than to live like a lily-livered coward, afraid to speak up, and kowtowing to those who would be our masters. Free speech -- as I said above -- is the only thing that makes all persons equal, the only thing that keeps us from living in abject fear of our government, our church, our employers.
Frankly, if I could magically make F*x Television as a corporate entity so furious with me that they all spontaneously combusted, I'd consider that a good day's work. ..Don't even get me started on Gail Berman, the former associate of Whedon's who -- as President of F*x TV -- played an instrumental role in Firefly's mishandling and inglorious cancellation. She's a traitor, in my book.
As much as I want Firefly back on television (please, God), I don't know how happy I'd be to see it back on F*x. Supposedly, Sci-Fi is ending (not canceling) Battlestar Galactica at the end of season 4. I know where they could pick up a good idea for a series, and it wouldn't cost near as much as BSG to produce...
Respectfully,
zoid
_________________________________________________
"I aim to misbehave." -Capt. Mal Reynolds, Serenity, a.k.a. 'the BDBOF'
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Great post their Zoid. Only thing I have to offer on top of that is that our Forefathers, having come originally from a place where the Government was oppressive themselves, were very aware of the very real possibility that our own government would someday become corrupt and self serving. In fact, I believe they were convinced that it was inevetabley going to happen some day. This is why we have our Constitutional rights in the first place, and specifically why they tell us our right to free speech and the right to bear arms are so important. It's stated right there that these rights may one day be needed to rise against our own corrupt Government. I'd like to think that it won't come down to that in my lifetime, but who knows? Some people are already convinced that this time has come.
I would assume that in this context, they regarded free speech above even the law.
Note that I'm not using this as a means to justify freedom of speech to cover the discussion of illegal activities of ALL kinds, such as piracy for profit or arson.... I'm just sayin'..... "A government is a body of people, usually notably ungoverned." http://www.myspace.com/6ixstringjack
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Quote:
Originally posted by zoid:
Cache:
Just in case you got the wrong impression, I'm not calling you a 'criminal'. As I said, way back up the page, people break the law -- wittingly or unwittingly -- all the time. Hell, sometimes, in order to do what I'd consider 'the right thing' -- rendering assistance at the scene of accident, for example -- a person could leave themselves liable to a lawsuit.
What you have been proposing is against the law. But it's simply not in the same league as what kaneman confessed, specifically, downloading "Serenity" and then selling pirated CD/DVD-Rs for profit. By analogy, your proposal is like setting a bonfire in your backyard (the fire marshal may cite you); what kaneman does is analogous to wanton arson. In both cases, y'all are playing with fire; but in kaneman's case, there is a blatant disregard for the health of the community. I hope everyone can easily see the difference.
I and many others would prefer not to give the Browncoat Movement an unsavory reputation by doing anything of questionable moral or legal merit.
As much as I want Firefly back on television (please, God), I don't know how happy I'd be to see it back on F*x. Supposedly, Sci-Fi is ending (not canceling) Battlestar Galactica at the end of season 4. I know where they could pick up a good idea for a series, and it wouldn't cost near as much as BSG to produce...
Respectfully,
zoid
_________________________________________________
"I aim to misbehave." -Capt. Mal Reynolds, Serenity, a.k.a. 'the BDBOF'
Zoid,
Now we are getting somewhere at last! I am not
sure as to wether or not you have read the last
post I submitted but what I am suggesting is not
illegal in terms of jail sentences and the FBI
getting involved. Of course that is if we keep
our mailings to a minimum, which is better than
nothing.
As for your latter point, Sci-Fi is the perfect
spot. When we begin our legal mail campaign, we
notify the Sci-Fi channel and direct their execs
to keep a close eye on the DVD sales over the
next few months. They will see a strong spike
for sure, and know that it is from new fans not
just the same ol same ol. BSG is ending this is
true, going out gracefully in a manner which if
all things were right in the world should have
been afforded to Firefly. This is our prime
opportunity. Our moment in the sun. And we
don't even have to worry about triangulation!
What say you???
Respectfully,
Cache
P.S. It was not you who called me a criminal, but
I am not here to point fingers and name names. I
am here to get our show back.
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