The Root of all Evil : The God Delusion
POSTED BY: Calhoun
UPDATED: Thursday, December 17, 2015 06:12
VIEWED: 49488
PAGE 3 of 32
Quote:
Originally posted by Tinadoll:
I have seen its pretty much one sided too. People are just looking for an agrument.
Well, I think that's true of some people on the boards (and maybe even some people in this very discussion). But I'm not sure that this is completely true. Take Khyron and I, for instance. I'm a theist, he's an atheist. But if he and I were to talk about the question of God's existence, it would be to have a fight, but to have a discussion (a philosophical argument, not an emotional one). I've only really seen one post on here that I would consider hostile--we seem to be behaving ourselves fairly well to this point. Perhaps we just want to talk about it.
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Quote:
Originally posted by FollowMal:
Y/W
*bows respectfully*
Oh, stop that, cutey pants. How can I keep my game face on with you being all adorable?
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*smiles mischeviously*
To join us go here: http://www.serenitymovie.org/browncoats/forums/index.php?showtopic=870
5
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Quote:The Nazis were supported by the Catholics. The Nazi war-machine could not have functioned without them.
Originally posted by Causal:
Hitler even based his genocide on pseudo-scientific eugenics theories.
Hitler in his speeches spoke about removing the 'Jew' so a 'Christian' empire could flourish.
More insane ramblings by the people who brought you beeeer milkshakes!
No one can see their reflection in running water. It is only in still water that we can see.
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I am not reading any of the posts, I just had this pop into my mind when I saw the title of the thread and thought I would share it with y'all.
Firstly, as we all know, time is money. Also, women are evil. Thirdly, we know that women take time and money to keep happy. Substituting in and simplifying yields:
Time = Money
Women = Evil
Women = Time * Money = Money^2 = Evil
Taking the square root of both sides, we get
Money = sqrt(Evil). :)
~jimi
any man who can hitch the length and breadth of the galaxy, rough it, slum it, struggle against terrible odds, win through, and still knows where his towel is is clearly a man to be reckoned with
It was Sassy-induced bulemia, gagging herself for no other reason than to look just like a Sassy cover girl.
It was Sassy-induced bulemia, she would GAG and SPIT and PUKE and BLEED her way into a perfect little world.
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Religion isn't to blame for most of the world's violence; humans are to blame for most of the world's violence.
See how I summed that up there? 
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"If you want to win a war, you must serve no master but your ambition."
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Quote:
Originally posted by citizen:Quote:The Nazis were supported by the Catholics. The Nazi war-machine could not have functioned without them.
Originally posted by Causal:
Hitler even based his genocide on pseudo-scientific eugenics theories.
Hitler in his speeches spoke about removing the 'Jew' so a 'Christian' empire could flourish.
Ah, the RWE gang rolls in to disrupt our nice civil discussion.
Hitler killed Jews because of his understanding of nationalism and Social Darwinism, with a little eugenics thrown in to boot. He didn't kill them because as a "Christian" it was his duty to kill Jews. He killed them because he didn't want to see his precious "Aryan" race mongrelized by a nation with no roots and no home. Look at the Nazi anti-Jewish propaganda. They cast the struggle as Aryan vs. Jew, not Christian vs. Jew. Hitler really believed that killing off the Jews would be his service to all mankind, because on his view, the Aryans represented light and the Jews evil. As well, I know that the Catholic church was silent, but complicit? Hitler "couldn't have done it without them?" Those are claims in need of justification.
And if you're fond of pinning the blame for evil on religion, then why did Stalin, an atheist, slaughter (by some estimates) 10 million of his own countrymen? Or why did Pol Pot kill so many Cambodians? Or why were the Tutsis and Hutus killing each other? Respectively: power, power, power. Sometimes religion makes a great cover for a power grab, but I'd submit that most of what is commonly taken as purely religious violence is really just a power grab dressed up pretty (which is what I think Hitler was after: popularizing his Anti-Semitism by dressing it up, rather than it being genuine religious conviction).
That, of course, isn't to say there hasn't been much evil perpetrated on religious grounds, but people have been slaughtering each other far longer than there have been institutional religions, and should institutional religion ever vanish, people will still slaughter each other.
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Yes, Hitler did often use Christianity to appeal to the popular mass. After all, Germany was a Christian state, but Hitler also said this:
Quote:
Amongst the accusations which are directed against Germany in the so called democracies, is the charge that the National Socialist State is hostile to religion. In answer to that charge I should like to make before the German people the following solemn declaration:
1. No one in Germany has in the past been persecuted because of his religious views, nor will anyone in the future be so persecuted. [[]Emphasis mine.[]]
-- Adolf Hitler in a speech at the Reichstag 30JAN1939.
So Hitler was not using Christianity as a tool of violence but rather as a tool to dishonestly assuage the fears of a Christian nation that would never have willing accepted Hitler’s atrocities. While Hitler himself was clearly not a supporter of Christianity, unless he was using it to tell the Germans of his religiously tolerant policies.
Nihil est incertius vulgo, nihil obscurius voluntate hominum, nihil fallacius ratione tota comitiorum.
Nothing is more unpredictable than the mob, nothing more obscure than public opinion, nothing more deceptive than the whole political system.
-- Cicero
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When I saw this originally broadcast on Channel 4 (UK) I couldn't help but notice that Pastor Ted Haggard (who Dawkins confronts in the programme) bears an uncanny resemblance to Patrick Swayze's character in Donnie Darko... it was a laugh when he hit the news with his "indiscretion" involving a male masseur. Two-faced git.
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Quote:I'm afraid, Casual, considering I didn't attack you, nor conduct myself in anything but a civil manner you don't get to blame me for any 'uncivil discourse' here. Especially when it is you who attacked me, I ask you, was this attack on me necessary? Or am I forbidden from having an opinion here?
Originally posted by Causal:
Ah, the RWE gang rolls in to disrupt our nice civil discussion.
Quote:Hitler killed the Jews because he was psychotic and lusted for power. He justified it with some psuedo-science, nationalism AND Catholicism.
Hitler killed Jews because of his understanding of nationalism and Social Darwinism, with a little eugenics thrown in to boot.
Quote:I never said he did. You said that Hitler, and the Nazis had nothing to do with religion, that is obviously not the case. They had tanks being blessed, Hitler played to the popular support of Catholics, the reasons for this (the fact they were the dominate group) are obvious, but the fact that HE didn't believe in Christianity, that HE didn't believe what they were doing was for the Christian god, does not remove the fact that many of his followers did.
He didn't kill them because as a "Christian" it was his duty to kill Jews.
I was merely pointing out that where you claim Hitler and Nazis 'had nothing to do with religion' isn't entirely the whole story.
Quote:They also cast it as building a Christian empire, that was what got a great deal of the population 'on side'.
They cast the struggle as Aryan vs. Jew, not Christian vs. Jew.
Quote:The Catholic church is known to have helped Nazis escape the Allies, the Pope used to be a member of the Hitler youth, the Catholic church holds more complicity than merely silence, but I was more thinking of the Catholics of Germany. Having said that, if Rome had not been so silent it's possible that Hitler wouldn't have gained that popular Catholic support.
As well, I know that the Catholic church was silent, but complicit?
Quote:Really? You think saying "without the support of the largest group in Germany Hitler couldn't have done what he did" needs clarification?
Hitler "couldn't have done it without them?" Those are claims in need of justification.
Quote:You're making sweeping statements. Some evil acts being non-religious doesn't indicate there are no evil acts that are.
And if you're fond of pinning the blame for evil on religion, then why did Stalin, an atheist, slaughter (by some estimates) 10 million of his own countrymen? Or why did Pol Pot kill so many Cambodians?
Furthermore, you're dragging me into a debate that I didn't comment on. I commented on one specific, that you seem to want to shoe horn into a generalisation I did not make.
Quote:So Hitler not believing in Religion, not using that as his motivation, means his followers didn't? Does a cult leader not believing what he preaches mean cults aren't to blame for kool-aid incidents?
Sometimes religion makes a great cover for a power grab, but I'd submit that most of what is commonly taken as purely religious violence is really just a power grab dressed up pretty (which is what I think Hitler was after: popularizing his Anti-Semitism by dressing it up, rather than it being genuine religious conviction).
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