Australia repeals maligned 2-year-old carbon tax

POSTED BY: AURaptor
UPDATED: Sunday, December 1, 2024 16:34
VIEWED: 4174
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MAGONSDAUGHTER

Saturday, July 19, 2014 2:26 AM

Quote:
Originally posted by AURaptor:

You think the carbon tax would help matters of skyrocketing prices ?

Huh.

So, when you say 'about to go into a death spiral', are we talking next year ? 5 years ? 10 ? 20 ? Help me out here, and spare me the cries of "WOLF!"

Sheesh, do I really want to do this?

Indicators are that the death spiral will be sooner rather than later, I'm guessing 5-10 years.

http://www.abc.net.au/radionational/programs/scienceshow/death-spiral-
begins-for-australian-electricity-companies/5443136#transcript

Prices are already incredibly high for us here now. And the burden falls hugely on the lowest income.

Stupid short term thinking around energy, what you display basically, means that tonnes of housing stock built in the latter half of the 20th century did not factor energy efficiency. Hey we had coal and it was cheap. It was easier to build a cheap house and attach heating/cooling systems needed for our extreme climates than incorporate anything that might reduce the need for energy. One might even assume that was deliberate. Many Australians from lower/middle incomes live in these hot boxes, which now cost those same people a bomb to heat and cool.

What we do also have is lots of sunlight. Lovely and free, so that cant be good for free markets, hey what? So as solar becomes more efficient, people who can afford it are buying into it. Which should be a good thing, but it impacts on the price of electricity for those who cant afford it.

Ironically, the government offset industries affected by the carbon tax, so possibly the repeal will mean loss of income for those industries with an increasing spike.

In some ways, high prices for power would be a good thing. It is market forces after all, which will hike up the price of a diminishing resource, but you need something to replace it. And governments can encourage or repell investment in replacements. The current government is doing all it can to repell investment, which means we are left with some difficult times looming.

So here is me being all reasonable and all, and I await your one line rehash of some snarky neo con commentator.

MAGONSDAUGHTER

Monday, July 21, 2014 3:39 AM

Quote:

Tony Abbott's success in scrapping the carbon tax last week has not arrested his government's poll slide, with Labor's primary support jumping 3 points and voters still favouring Bill Shorten for a third consecutive month.

Mr Abbott's trustworthiness stands at a record low 35 per cent after Joe Hockey's first budget, which has also shredded his standing as preferred treasurer.

The budget's mix of harsh cuts and new imposts including the $7 GP co-payment and a fuel tax rise, have wiped out the 17-point advantage Mr Hockey had over shadow treasurer Chris Bowen in March.

AURAPTOR

Monday, July 21, 2014 3:52 AM

Quote:
Originally posted by BYTEMITE:

AURaptor might be military. I've never had it confirmed.

Or might not. Not sure why that's an issue, either way. Nor where it's said that I am an old establishment 'yes man'. I've spoken out plenty against the old guard . But I've not blindly rejected wisdom either, out of hand, simply because it wasn't formed yesterday.

AURAPTOR

Monday, July 21, 2014 4:12 AM

Quote:
Originally posted by THGRRI:

Yes, correct and that is what I try and do. I noticed G ( and others)have made great arguments to show Rappys ignorance. The guys a fool. That's not just a I hate you thought. The guy really is ignorant.

Actually, I'm not ignorant. What's funny is seeing how you arrive at such a term simply for those who see things differently or refuse to accept what's being spoon fed him on all matters, great and small.

Here's a bit of what I know -

We live on a very old planet , that goes around a star, in a solar system on the outskirts of a galaxy containing billions of stars. Our Milky Way is an average galaxy, in age and size.

Life on our planet had changed , yes evolved, more than most folks care to comprehend. Mainly because we don't know the scope and variety of life that's existed through out the ages. As I don't believe in a super natural creator, or magic, I'm equally skeptical of the existence of such things as the Loch Ness Monster, Chupacabra, Bigfoot, Mermaids, or the like. And despite all that, I know, we as humans are still in the dark about a great many things on our planet, not to mention the Cosmos.

I've heard many religious types describe atheists as being just arrogant, adversarial and rebellious, purely out of spite and hubris. And while some atheist may fall w/ in that group, the description does not apply to all. Nor does it apply to me.

So, call me a fool because I don't buy into the claims made by a vocal group of folks who are intent on altering our way of life , for no real clearly defined reason, and even worse, with out any clearly thought out plan , then I consider myself in fine company.

This fool ( Copernicus ) wishes to reverse the entire science of astronomy; but Sacred Scripture tells us that Joshua commanded the sun to stand still, and not the earth.

— Martin Luther, Works vol 22, c. 1533.

MAGONSDAUGHTER

Monday, July 21, 2014 5:52 AM

see here is the thing I could never really understand....

if...the tiny minority of the science community are correct...and that is a big if, given theyre all in bed with the energy companies, but say they are and climate change, which everyone agrees is happening, is NOT man made, even if that is true, wouldn't it be in everyone's best interest to take steps to replace dependance upon systems of energy production that rely on finite sources and produce high levels of pollution to energy sources that are infinite and substantially cleaner?

What I dont get is that...even if you have doubts or are unconvinced, that you couldn't see the benefits in those kind of changes.

As far as I see it change happens in two ways - you plan for it and manage it or you bury your head in the sand and wait for it to happen to you.

THGRRI

Monday, July 21, 2014 6:26 AM

Quote:
Originally posted by AURaptor:
Quote:
Originally posted by THGRRI:

Yes, correct and that is what I try and do. I noticed G ( and others)have made great arguments to show Rappys ignorance. The guys a fool. That's not just a I hate you thought. The guy really is ignorant.

Actually, I'm not ignorant. What's funny is seeing how you arrive at such a term simply for those who see things differently or refuse to accept what's being spoon fed him on all matters, great and small.

Here's a bit of what I know -

We live on a very old planet , that goes around a star, in a solar system on the outskirts of a galaxy containing billions of stars. Our Milky Way is an average galaxy, in age and size.

Life on our planet had changed , yes evolved, more than most folks care to comprehend. Mainly because we don't know the scope and variety of life that's existed through out the ages. As I don't believe in a super natural creator, or magic, I'm equally skeptical of the existence of such things as the Loch Ness Monster, Chupacabra, Bigfoot, Mermaids, or the like. And despite all that, I know, we as humans are still in the dark about a great many things on our planet, not to mention the Cosmos.

I've heard many religious types describe atheists as being just arrogant, adversarial and rebellious, purely out of spite and hubris. And while some atheist may fall w/ in that group, the description does not apply to all. Nor does it apply to me.

So, call me a fool because I don't buy into the claims made by a vocal group of folks who are intent on altering our way of life , for no real clearly defined reason, and even worse, with out any clearly thought out plan , then I consider myself in fine company.

This fool ( Copernicus ) wishes to reverse the entire science of astronomy; but Sacred Scripture tells us that Joshua commanded the sun to stand still, and not the earth.

— Martin Luther, Works vol 22, c. 1533.

This whole post is hogwash. It has nothing to do with global warming and as a reason for you to suggest scientists are wrong it is woefully inadequate.

Ignorant people always say what you say. You are called ignorant simply because you see things differently. That's because you're all ignorant. Ignorant means lacking in knowledge and training.

With all the evidence presented here in these threads and all the times you have debated this here, the term ignorant no longer applies to you; but Stupid does. Sorry....

Oh yeah, as an atheist myself that does not apply here either.

THGRRI

Monday, July 21, 2014 6:36 AM

Quote:
Originally posted by Magonsdaughter:
see here is the thing I could never really understand....

if...the tiny minority of the science community are correct...and that is a big if, given theyre all in bed with the energy companies, but say they are and climate change, which everyone agrees is happening, is NOT man made, even if that is true, wouldn't it be in everyone's best interest to take steps to replace dependance upon systems of energy production that rely on finite sources and produce high levels of pollution to energy sources that are infinite and substantially cleaner?

What I dont get is that...even if you have doubts or are unconvinced, that you couldn't see the benefits in those kind of changes.

As far as I see it change happens in two ways - you plan for it and manage it or you bury your head in the sand and wait for it to happen to you.

He can not understand what it is you mean when you ask doesn't it make sense to do it anyway. He is following a script put out by corporate entities and Republicans. He doesn't really research the stuff. He just repeats what he hears. It would kill him to realize he has been played for a fool all this time.

MAGONSDAUGHTER

Monday, July 21, 2014 6:48 AM

Nah, he loves it. It's all attention.

THGRRI

Monday, July 21, 2014 7:01 AM

Quote:
Originally posted by Magonsdaughter:
Nah, he loves it. It's all attention.

I have head that before but he doesn't need to be that way to get it. Nah, he's or should I say he is not to bright.

AURAPTOR

Monday, July 21, 2014 8:17 AM

Quote:
Originally posted by Magonsdaughter:

*** wouldn't it be in everyone's best interest to take steps to replace dependence upon systems of energy production that rely on finite sources and produce high levels of pollution to energy sources that are infinite and substantially cleaner?***

I have no real problem w/ that , save for a couple of areas...

Such sources, though 'finite', are still readily available, easy to unlock from the Earth, and yield a very large return on production of energy. Simply put, nothing comes close to matching the bang for the buck.

Quote:

What I dont get is that...even if you have doubts or are unconvinced, that you couldn't see the benefits in those kind of changes.

Build a better mouse trap, and folks will flock to it. It's just that simple. Convince yourself that BIG OIL has a massive conspiracy to lock up alternate energy sources all day long, it doesn't matter. Either they do, and we're set for infinity, or they don't, which means that when oil and gas run out, we're all humped.

We'll adapt. We won't have any other choice.

Quote:

As far as I see it change happens in two ways - you plan for it and manage it or you bury your head in the sand and wait for it to happen to you.

Even if you plan for it, I'd say the latter will occur.

At the very least, all these post - apocalyptic t.v. shows and survival 'reality' programs on now will filter into the culture and we'll just adjust all that much easier!

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