I wanna do this one more time: Was Mal wrong when he shot that surrendering guy in Serenity?
POSTED BY: chrisisall
UPDATED: Friday, June 6, 2014 05:29
VIEWED: 19444
PAGE 12 of 14
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If they are a danger to you or someone else at that moment, yes I think killing can be seen as moral. A person tied up or putting their hands up in surrender, not so much.
I think you're underestimating what kind a danger a person can be in both those circumstances.
Based on what you said previously, would it be moral for a state to execute someone if they armed them first?
I think we won't agree because it seems like an arbitrary line that's being drawn here.
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We will disagree.
Then agreeing to disagree.
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Quote:Well, I'm not agreeing to disagree! That I disagree with! No agreeing here!
Originally posted by BYTEMITE:
Then agreeing to disagree.
To disagree, I mean.
m52 is colouring outside the lines on this one IMO. We all do it to a degree or another, but m52 is assigning extra meanings to where there aren't that many, and leaving out others that matter. He's trying to confound us bungers.
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Originally posted by BYTEMITE:
I think you're underestimating what kind a danger a person can be in both those circumstances.
Based on what you said previously, would it be moral for a state to execute someone if they armed them first?
I think we won't agree because it seems like an arbitrary line that's being drawn here.
Really? What danger was Crow when he was tied up? What danger was the pilot?
I guess if the person that was going to be executed decided to pick up the gun and tried to use it would be, but I don't see that happening.
I do not fear God, I fear the ignorance of man.
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Quote:
Originally posted by chrisisall:
m52 is colouring outside the lines on this one IMO. We all do it to a degree or another, but m52 is assigning extra meanings to where there aren't that many, and leaving out others that matter. He's trying to confound us bungers.
What extra meaning? Mal by the definition of the word is a murderer. People may not want to assign that word to a character we like, but that does not change things.
I do not fear God, I fear the ignorance of man.
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Let's try to be practical. Out on the Rim, the rightness or wrongness of Mal's actions are only important to decide if he will be punished and the severity of that punishment.
The punishment for murder varies in different jurisdictions. The worst punishment where Mal is would be something trivial -- it isn't a big deal because people die every day. For the crime of premeditated murder in the first degree, Mal is sentenced to community service. For all time he must carry cargo from community to community. It is a life sentence. I'm going to leave it with that.
The Joss Whedon script for Serenity, where Wash lives, is Serenity-190pages.pdf at www.mediafire.com/folder/1uwh75oa407q8/Firefly
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Quote:
Originally posted by m52nickerson:
Really? What danger was Crow when he was tied up?
He was still making threats. That's like the definition of threatening, especially because it's implied he's a guy who can follow through on those threats and already tried to kill them.
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What danger was the pilot?
Inherently untrustworthy because of what he'd done.
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I guess if the person that was going to be executed decided to pick up the gun and tried to use it would be, but I don't see that happening.
Not going to lie, that's a very unique perspective on morality, that only self-defense qualifies as justified killing.
I'd actually see giving a gun to a guy they're trying to execute as immoral, like they're toying with them. The cruelest thing a person can do is give someone hope then snatch it away.
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The punishment for murder varies in different jurisdictions.
You mean the jurisdiction of all the people who were just killed?
They'd hand Mal the gun and acquit him, including Shepherd Book, who tried to shoot at them himself. It's the flaw in any justice system, and the concept of justice in general. Bias is inherent in the results.
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Once again, the lady takes what I was going to say & states it better. Thanks, darlin'!
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Quote:
Originally posted by BYTEMITE:
He was still making threats. That's like the definition of threatening, especially because it's implied he's a guy who can follow through on those threats and already tried to kill them.
So he is making threats, he could not do anything at that point in time.
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Originally posted by BYTEMITE:
Inherently untrustworthy because of what he'd done.
So it is okay to kill untrustworthy folk?
I do not fear God, I fear the ignorance of man.
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Quote:If you're bitten by a rabid animal, why get shots right away? The virus can't immediately do any damage...
Originally posted by M52NICKERSON:
So he is making threats, he could not do anything at that point in time.
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