Oppositional Defiant Disorder
POSTED BY: Bytemite
UPDATED: Wednesday, February 9, 2011 04:51
VIEWED: 6599
PAGE 5 of 11
Some people find Ritalin to be a relief from scattered thoughts and jumpy perception.
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Sig,
The human mind. We're not talking about a neurodegenerative condition here, a malformed brain that will cause disability and death, we're talking about the human mind.
To correct everyone to "normal" would rid the world of Van Gogh, Tchaikovsky, Nietzsche, I could go on forever with this list, and you could too.
Did you happen to watch this Firefly show? It's pretty cool I here.
I'm sorry, I'm a fan of the world. I like it as it is, unmodified, uncontrolled, chaotic, not hydrogenated methylated chloro-fluoro-ethoxylated. Just good old planet earth, with people. Not a clone army of zombies. Ordinary, crazy, dangeous, funny, lovable people.
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Van Gogh killed himself, and by all accounts had a distressing, loveless life. Of course now that he is dead, we all love his art, but he died with his talent unappreciated.
He might have preferred a bit of light to counter all that dark.
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Quote:Awwww. You just gave me the warm fuzzies.
Originally posted by dreamtrove:
Did you happen to watch this Firefly show? It's pretty cool I here.
I'm sorry, I'm a fan of the world. I like it as it is, unmodified, uncontrolled, chaotic, not hydrogenated methylated chloro-fluoro-ethoxylated. Just good old planet earth, with people. Not a clone army of zombies. Ordinary, crazy, dangeous, funny, lovable people.
As you say, "Spot on."
-------
Everything I say is just my opinion, not fact.
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Quote:Where does the mind end and the brain begin?
The human mind. We're not talking about a neurodegenerative condition here, a malformed brain that will cause disability and death, we're talking about the human mind.
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>_>
There's actually some indication that a lot of the more crazy seeming stuff Vincent Van Gogh did was actually for the money.
I'm not sure about the dying part unless his brother, who was also the manager of his artistic property, had a say in it.
But wasn't this really DT's point? It's not about quantity or duration of life, it's not even necessarily about quantity of happiness, it's about the depth and lofty heights of the human condition.
There is no triumph without struggle. Endeavoring in that struggle, even if the struggle ends in tragedy, is as noble a thing as I've ever heard of.
But yes, if someone wants to choose to go the path of the lotus eaters, then that's their decision. I think it would be a damn shame if EVERYONE went that way though, just "for happiness!"
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Quote:
It's not his decision to make alone, although he could have a voice in it. A small child cannot have the same capacity to understand what is best for him.
If a 5 year old decided that
- he wasn't going to ever eat anything other than icecream ever again
- he was not going to bed every night until 1pm
then his parents would intervene. Clearly those things would not be in a child's best interest. Children do not have the information nor the capacity to make fully informed choices about stuff. Parents 'parent' - that is their role and they do it to the best of their ability. To make informed choices on behalf of a child until they are old enough to make them on their own.
Now I'm not sure how old your relative is, if he is very young still then it is pretty much his parents decision. If he is reaching his teens, then his wishes should be given a fair degree of weight, and I guess it's pretty hard to make a teenager do anything.
Rather than get into a debate with you about the difference of lack thereof in ability to make decisions as compared by age, I'll just say that my understanding is that he is old enough that he understands enough, and also is able to make decisions on his own.
As a side note, I'm not sure most five year olds can fully make decisions yet either, but where possible and safe to do so I try to err on the side of letting them make up their own minds about things.
It goes back potentially to Frem's sliding scale idea.
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Quote:
Originally posted by Bytemite:
>_>
There's actually some indication that a lot of the more crazy seeming stuff Vincent Van Gogh did was actually for the money.
I'm not sure about the dying part unless his brother, who was also the manager of his artistic property, had a say in it.
But wasn't this really DT's point? It's not about quantity or duration of life, it's not even necessarily about quantity of happiness, it's about the depth and lofty heights of the human condition.
There is no triumph without struggle. Endeavoring in that struggle, even if the struggle ends in tragedy, is as noble a thing as I've ever heard of.
But yes, if someone wants to choose to go the path of the lotus eaters, then that's their decision. I think it would be a damn shame if EVERYONE went that way though, just "for happiness!"
Van Gogh never made any money. He died a pauper and I think he sold one or none of his work.
I certainly have never said that I believe that we should live for happiness and that everyone should be medicated in order to be happy. Conversely, I don't think people should endure chronic and debilitating mental health if there is some way of treating them just because some people have a belief that living in misery and chaos is 'natural'. So is dying in childbirth and rampant infant mortality, but we have the capacity to improve people's lives and we choose to do it in many ways.
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Quote:
Originally posted by Bytemite:Quote:
It's not his decision to make alone, although he could have a voice in it. A small child cannot have the same capacity to understand what is best for him.
If a 5 year old decided that
- he wasn't going to ever eat anything other than icecream ever again
- he was not going to bed every night until 1pm
then his parents would intervene. Clearly those things would not be in a child's best interest. Children do not have the information nor the capacity to make fully informed choices about stuff. Parents 'parent' - that is their role and they do it to the best of their ability. To make informed choices on behalf of a child until they are old enough to make them on their own.
Now I'm not sure how old your relative is, if he is very young still then it is pretty much his parents decision. If he is reaching his teens, then his wishes should be given a fair degree of weight, and I guess it's pretty hard to make a teenager do anything.
Rather than get into a debate with you about the difference of lack thereof in ability to make decisions as compared by age, I'll just say that my understanding is that he is old enough that he understands enough, and also is able to make decisions on his own.
As a side note, I'm not sure most five year olds can fully make decisions yet either, but where possible and safe to do so I try to err on the side of letting them make up their own minds about things.
It goes back potentially to Frem's sliding scale idea.
You and I have very different ideas about parenting then. I prefer family life where everything is not negotiable with infants, and where parents have authority. I aim for authoritative parenting, which incidentally has an excellent success rate for kids with behaviourable issues.
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Quote:
Van Gogh never made any money. He died a pauper and I think he sold one or none of his work.
Half true. He sold a number of paintings through the art firm he worked with and his brother, but died young and not very rich. He did, however, because very famous posthumously, as you know.
He produced over 2,000 works, and compared to the number he sold, he didn't sell many, no.
Quote:
He suffered from anxiety and increasingly frequent bouts of mental illness throughout his life and died, largely unknown, at the age of 37 from a self-inflicted gunshot wound.
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Van Gogh spent his early adulthood working for a firm of art dealers and traveled between The Hague, London and Paris, after which he taught in England.
Quote:
The extent to which his mental illness affected his painting has been a subject of speculation since his death. Despite a widespread tendency to romanticise his ill health, modern critics see an artist deeply frustrated by the inactivity and incoherence brought about by his bouts of sickness. According to art critic Robert Hughes, Van Gogh's late works show an artist at the height of his ability, completely in control and "longing for concision and grace"
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