Post your coimments about tonight's Dollhouse episode, 'The Target'

POSTED BY: Haken
UPDATED: Thursday, February 26, 2009 23:55
VIEWED: 21189
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SIRI

Monday, February 23, 2009 4:56 AM

I liked this last episode better than the first one. I'm curious to see how the show develops hope it is given enough time to evolve. It seems as if clever, slightly-off kilter-make you think shows (like our Joss likes to give us) are frequently not given that time. Perhaps it's our nature to want to have it all now.

It seems as if Echo is imprinting differently than planned. There was mention made of the mistakes in attempting to program the doll/people. I did enjoy seeing Eliza kick-butt.

So I haven't read through all the threads here but was pleased to see Amy Acker on the show, too. I didn't notice her the first week (if she was there) and didn't see her photo with the main characters.

Siri

DREAMTROVE

Monday, February 23, 2009 5:03 AM

Quote:
lmao, dude, are you referencing Red vs Blue there, or did you seriously just think of that on your own? XD

I felt pretty sure I was the first person to post that. I think John came up with it independently, he's a smart guy, also, he's not on the other site, where we were talking about this.

John

I don't think like angel, know, I think that this is not going to be about good and evil, but rather about human and animal. The angel thing was overly simplistic, but joss was just a kid, he wasn't thinking very sophisticated. I wish he would get back that sense of humor though.

Also, regardless of your political affiliations, that democrats line cracked me up. Maybe there is hope for humor.

My main snag here is that everything that happens in this show I can see a mile away. This was probably true on the others, but there was so much joyride. I think it needs something more.

Now we know why fred is all f^&ked up, and how she and echo, not on so well, but she'll get over it, please, can other actives do something?

We need a little cast makeover here. I think someone who can play 110 personalities is needed stat. I love Eliza, and I know she's not that girl. Summer's that girl, but she's occupied. Unless she wants to double up.

MSA

Monday, February 23, 2009 5:51 AM

Ok all I have to say is MUCH BETTER than the pilot. You could really feel Joss in this one:)

To love someone is to see a miracle invisible to others.
--Francois Mauriac
It's fuzzy-minded liberal thinking like that that gets you eaten.

ASARIAN

Monday, February 23, 2009 6:09 AM

Went to see the 2nd episode again tonight. For one, thhere's no getting enough of Eliza. :) And for two, I wanted to see whether I missed any clues about Alpha. And I like the Alpha as 'pattern' theory: doesn't necessarily have to be true, but can't so easily be dismissed either. But here's what I think, so far:

It's becoming clear that Echo's erasures aren't taking too well: elements from her past/previous imprints are starting to seep through while 'active' (flashes/apparitions of her former selfs in the woods), and she retains stuff (The "Shoulder to the wheel" thingy) after being erased. So, it's fair to say the whole Tabula Rasa concept -- the notion that you can wipe people completely clean -- is questionable. And I think Joss already foreshadowed that 'conclusion' in one of Echo's very first lines (Episode 1):

ECHO: "Have you ever tried and clean an actual slate? You always see what's on it before."

I felt free to take that as a hint. :)

I think Alpha is the guy we see at the end of the first episode, watching a recording of Echo. So, where does that put Echo? It stands to reason Alpha experienced similar erasure issues that went unnoticed until the unfortunate 'composite event' mishap. So, he may have bonded with Echo, in the Dollhouse, earlier, for that reason. Not only does he not kill her, he actively seems to help her (he's the one who sent Paul Ballard the photo of Echo with "Caroline" on the back. and is seen with lots of dead bodies lying around him while watching that tape of Echo). Question, of course is, where would he get his hands on a family tape Echo made? Conjecturing further, I'd say he's related to her (brother perhaps?), and that house with the TV in it, is their parents' home (with father and mother lying dead on the floor).

Of course, this is Joss we're talking about. So, I won't fall too much in love with my theory, lest I appear fully fooled. :) Which is how I like it, btw: nothing is more boring than predictability.

--
"Mei-mei, everything I have is right here." -- Simon Tam

ASARIAN

Monday, February 23, 2009 6:27 AM

Quote:
Originally posted by dreamtrove:

We need a little cast makeover here. I think someone who can play 110 personalities is needed stat. I love Eliza, and I know she's not that girl. Summer's that girl, but she's occupied. Unless she wants to double up.

I believe Summer already made her position on that resoundingly clear, earlier:

"Stupid son of a bitch, dress me up like a gorram doll!"

Sorry, couldn't resist. :)

P.S. I love Summer; really do. But, in earnest, I think Eliza really is perfect for the job. There's no ignoring her rather sizeable sex-appeal (well, it's true). And I believe she's every bit as good an actress as Summer. The girl can act, for certain! And I think she can play a 110 different personalities just fine (and I'll be watching these incarnations each time). And in many ways, especially inside the Dollhouse, I think Echo's mannerisms are rather 'Riveresque' as it is.

--
"Mei-mei, everything I have is right here." -- Simon Tam

TUJIAOZUO

Monday, February 23, 2009 7:45 AM

Quote:
Originally posted by asarian:
Quote:
Originally posted by dreamtrove:

We need a little cast makeover here. I think someone who can play 110 personalities is needed stat. I love Eliza, and I know she's not that girl. Summer's that girl, but she's occupied. Unless she wants to double up.

I believe Summer already made her position on that resoundingly clear, earlier:

"Stupid son of a bitch, dress me up like a gorram doll!"

Sorry, couldn't resist. :)

P.S. I love Summer; really do. But, in earnest, I think Eliza really is perfect for the job. There's no ignoring her rather sizeable sex-appeal (well, it's true). And I believe she's every bit as good an actress as Summer. The girl can act, for certain! And I think she can play a 110 different personalities just fine (and I'll be watching these incarnations each time). And in many ways, especially inside the Dollhouse, I think Echo's mannerisms are rather 'Riveresque' as it is.

--
"Mei-mei, everything I have is right here." -- Simon Tam

Agreed, Joss and Eliza hammered out this show originally, it's tailored to Eliza, and while Summer would do a great job I think Eliza is the girl for this role.

That said, I know Joss said somewhere he wasn't going to bring a lot of old Whedon alumni over to this show, but I think he needs to reconsider that. While the episode was great (so much better than the pilot, this should have been the pilot), pretty solid and feeling Jossian overall, it could benefit from a few Alumni coming in as guests as the season (and overall series) progresses. Joss has always hired strong actors, and I'm sure most of them would be be more than happy to jump into a guest star role. It was good to see Sheppard (I was like 'Badger!' Then completely dropped the fact that he was Badger and focused in on the detectives) and it got me thinking how it'd be nice to see Sean or even Morena as a Dollhouse client. Or Nicholas or Seth or Gina or Jewel any other alumni getting to help flesh out more of the DH universe.

Your Indian Pirate Lord,
Ash

SMAUG

Monday, February 23, 2009 2:41 PM

Well.. my stance on the first episode was "meh". While I didn't hate it, I like the overall concept of the show, it just left me a little underwhelmed.

This episode combined with the first one.. I'm liking more. While the episode still didn't blow me away or anything. I would raise it from "meh" of the first one to say that I "liked" this one. Definatly more insight into all the characters that is starting to give a better picture of what the show can be.

I liked a lot of character moments in this episode. I especially liked the roll reversal where Echo asks her handler (don't quite have everyones name down yet) if he trusts her. And I believed him when he said "with my life". I think it shows us how much they truly have 'bonded' in the time they have been together, even though we are not sure yet how long that has been.

Loved seeing Mark Sheppard show up.. hopefully he will have an ongoing part in the show.

What I mainly didn't like about this episode is the hunter guy. They just didn't give us enough information about the motivations of this guy. Yea he's a physco.. but once they figured that out and found out who he really is.. couldn't they have given us a little more info on his background so we could understand why he would would be driven to do something like this?

What we are left with is an explanation of "He did it 'just cuz'.. he's a physcopath." That's too easy of an explanation, and not enough for me to buy it. Give us at least a glimpse of his motivation.. even if it only gives a better picture of how crazy he is. Like why in the world did he think he would be able to hire an active under false pretenses and not have the dollhouse come after him with their little mini army? Did he have something to blackmail them with when they would come after him?

Here's a few other questions to ponder:

1) Are the actives simply named after the phonetic alphabet? Makes sense that they would be..

Alpha
Charlie
Bravo
Delta
Echo
Foxtrot
etc..

If that's the case.. is Echo only the 5th active? and Alpha was the first?

I like the theory that "Alpha" may be an imprint and not just a physical active.

2) Do cute girls really try to flirt with guys that live next to them in apartment buildings by baking them food? lol

Ladies.. the whole thing about the way to a man's heart is through his stomach may have had some truth to it 50 years ago.. but I can think of a million ways to my heart.. and none of them involve food. I think a lot of guys would agree.

3) It appears that a lot of times an active (at least echo, and possibly other female actives) are hired out for 'romantic' purposes. Which I'm fine with. Actually it's an intrequing aspect of the show. We've seen many glimpses of Echo being hired out as such. However, we haven't seen how Echo starts such an assignment. IE.. when she first meets her "love interest" who hired her. So if someone is just highering her out of a weekend whirlwind romance, do you think that the person has to be there when they do the imprint so that she's sort of "already in love" with them when she wakes up? Sort of like how they imprint the trust with her handler?

I'm sure they will reveal more.

I'm also sure that as the show progresses that we will see other actives on assignment, or in combination with Echo.

4) The second in command security guy. Why is he such a ***#$&( towards the actives? His entire paycheck revolves around the actives.. why go and screw with them? Seems like everyone should show them more respect. They, and Topher, are the rockstars that make the whole thing work.

5) How in the world does the dollhouse hide an entire small army? Helicopters and all? As soon as you tell ONE other person on this planet something.. it's no longer a secret. I guess one thing that's not sitting right with me.. is that this dollhouse, that seems like a HUGE operation, and is constantly being hired out by rich people, is able to stay a secret?

I can understand

FREELANCERTEX

Monday, February 23, 2009 3:00 PM

Quote:
Originally posted by dreamtrove:
Quote:
lmao, dude, are you referencing Red vs Blue there, or did you seriously just think of that on your own? XD

I felt pretty sure I was the first person to post that. I think John came up with it independently

well i ask only because in RvB a very similar thing happened XD it was great

THESOMNAMBULIST

Monday, February 23, 2009 3:37 PM

Quote:
Originally posted by lissa:
Was anybody else reminded of SlayerFest '98? And I mean that in a good way:)

Props to Steven DeKnight (writer and director). He did some great work on Angel, and looks like he will be doing the same on Dollhouse!

~lissa

Yes. I did! Felt very Buffy in many ways. Especially the way Echo had had enough and decided to hunt the hunter. Great episode.

And yes Steven DeKnight continues to improve with his writing and directing. I think this was a nice gesture from Joss to give him the second episode and in many ways the juicier story too. It is a pity that he has now left the production though :( Perhaps to start his own show? Anyway all the best to him.

The notion of composite memories is brilliant. That can only become more exciting. I'm wondering if the 'Dolls' notion are an extension of what Joss had in mind, for what the Governement were doing to River and co in Firefly?

INSTANTKARMAGIRL

Monday, February 23, 2009 6:41 PM

I liked better than the pilot, which isn't unusual for me and Joss shows.

While I enjoyed last Friday's episode, I'm having issues with the core themes of the show.

I know it's just getting started and I will, as always, give Joss and team time to develop, but with nearly all of his other creations, there's something underlying about the females he writes, the sex that they have, and roles that they carry that strike me as unsettling.

I guess I have an issue with programmable people and yes, I know that I'm supposed to have a problem with it, it's supposed to make me uneasy, but at least in the pilot episode it dealt with hiring her out to save someone or perform an actual function, other than just sex.

I don't have a problem with Inara and her position as Companion...because she controls everything about it...but these Dolls, males and femals, have no choice, except the very first choice they made to enter the house...which didn't seem like a choice.

It makes me very uneasy that there are so many people standing around, helping the process happen.

It's just me, I'm sure, but I hope to be able to get over my issues with it soon. The last episode was written very well and touched on a great (and potentially caring) relationship between Echo and her handler.

~**~
"How come you're flying about with us brigands? I mean, shouldn't you be off bringing religiosity to the Fuzzie-Wuzzies or some such?"~Cap'n Mal

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