Boycott ENTERPRISE .. it's just that bad.
POSTED BY: Ghoulman
UPDATED: Monday, January 24, 2005 20:10
VIEWED: 38245
PAGE 10 of 15
See, now my brain is working. You bastards.
The above post, 2nd paragraph: I didn't mean, SEE bad movies/TV/whatever. We're all guilty of that. I admitted to seeing "Van Helsing" in the post before that.
I meant, like, ENJOY. See repeatedly. I thought "A.I" was freakin' TERRIBLE, but people bought that DVD because they really enjoyed it, not noticing the plot holes, character inconsistencies, or sheer illogic. I was amused by "Van Helsing" and all, but I cannot think of a reason I'd ever watch it again. Conversely, I'll watch Indiana Jones until the day I die.
Anyway, nothing we can do about those people. Except recommend 'Firefly.' I'm really done typing now.
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Quote:
Originally posted by Quicksand:
I'll take that bet.
The problem is that anything that makes one Think Critically tends to get crapped on by the masses. "Dude, Firefly is stoopid," I'll often read or hear. "Sci-Fi and cows?! U R dum!"
We, the Critical Thinkers, are in the minority. Or at least, that's the way it feels to ME. Clever, thought provoking TV or film is low-rated, and makes little money, while the top-rated TV shows and movies are such clever, intellectual fare as "American Idol," and "Four Explosions and a CGI Funeral."
We, the educated, can never hope to take American Culture back, because we'd have to stop too often and explain things to those left behind.
But we can URGE people in a certain direction: "I'm not driving you to McDonald's; how about Subway?" or, "Hey, there's this new movie called 'Serenity' coming out, and it's AWESOME."
I maintain that "Pulp Fiction" was slightly more intellectual entertainment, because you had to think about it, and once the Smart Folks explained it, it DID find a way into popular culture. Same with Buffy, or ... I dunno, Aspirin.
Unfortunately, "Enterprise" pays off right now, in the millions, to the Corporate Whores of the world. So we're screwed.
But thanks for the very, very good argument. Only one out of every 50 people I meet can even comprehend Critical Thinking, so maybe that's another reason to just try to lead by example. I dunno.
No offense or anything but I read that post as pure elitism. Particularly this comment "We, the educated, can never hope to take American Culture back, because we'd have to stop too often and explain things to those left behind.". I think it's quite arrogant to assume that we are the gifted few with the ability to use "Critical Thinking" where as the majority of America the ones that watch crappy reality TV are obviously stupid. I'm sure that are many Ivy League graduates who would list a reality show as one of their favorite TV shows. In fact if movies like Van Helsing or TV shows like Enterprise make a ton of money I don't mind that some people like them there are some reality shows (but not all) that I do absolutely hate (like "The Swan") but that's because I have problems with the way they treat real people. What's art and what isn't is purely in the eye of the beholder and if I oneday find that there's nothing I care to watch anymore I'll stop watching TV and movies.
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I hate to sound like "The Life of Brian" ("Blessed are the cheesemakers." "The CHEESEMAKERS?" "Well, not Cheesemakers exactly, but men of Commerce ...")
I didn't mean to be taken quite literally by the quote "I don't know much about art, but I know what I like." ... not art specifically ...
It was highlighting an attitude where people who haven't studied a subject feel free to trivialize it, worse ignore it, shut their brains off, stick their heads in the sand, because for them there is something honest about not liking it and therefore dismissing it. It is, in my opinion, a reverence for ignorance.
Of course everyone has their own likes and dislikes. Liking something just because it's fun is great. And important serious meaningful stuff can be no fun at all.
But to dismiss something vital from your world that you are ignorant about just because you don't like it, well ... I think it's a misguided American truism.
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Quote:
Originally posted by Quicksand:
p.s. What the frag is "A Canticle for Leibowitz?!"
The book came out in 1960, by Walter M. Miller, Jr. I recently came across the original 20-something page short story that the first third of the book is based on, originally published in 1955 as "The First Canticle".
It's a marvelous post-apocalyptic story, opening in a future Utah, near a monastary of St. Liebowicz. In this future, average folks have destroyed books and learning as being part of what brought the atomic horror on their heads ... the monastery keeps secret knowledge hidden within it (books, blueprints, technical manuals). It is considered a 'good' thing to be a Simpleton ... in the world-at-large, learning and books are considered highly dangerous.
You can probably find both versions of the story (short or book-length) in a second-hand book shop quite easily ... I'd say this is one of the great pieces of 1950s SF.
Cheers,
Annik
... my sister's a ship. We had a complicated childhood.
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Well I don't like Star Trek but that's just a matter of personal choice and I go out of my way not to dump on other people's likes and dislikes. So the whole premise of this thread is something I can't go along with.
Also I don't talk politics in public so I'll ride right on past that stuff, again it's all personal choice and all that, see above. Besides all politics are wrong in a subjective sense, hence pointless. Yeah that was humor, people should use it more. 
The one thing that I can agree with 110% on this whole thing here is that A Canticle for Leibowitz is a great book and if y'all haven't read it ya probably should.
That's all.
~-~-~-~-~-~-~-
"Oh hey, I got an idea. Instead of us hanging
around playing art critic till I get pinched by
the Man, how's about we move away from this
eerie-ass piece of work and get on with our
increasingly eerie-ass day, how's that?"
My eerie-ass website:
http://gunhandsfirefly.homestead.com/Index.html
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Quote:
No offense or anything but I read that post as pure elitism.
I'm not offended, cuz I like a good arguement.
I wasn't saying (though I maybe, er, accidentally implied) that I'm better than people who watch that stuff because "they are dumb and I am smart." All sorts of people watch all sorts of things, and besides, there are plenty of people who are smarter than me... just none of them work for the Fox Network, is all.
I didn't mean to disrespect anyone for watching, say, Jerry Springer and loving it. But I'm disrespecing Jerry Springer because, DAMMIT man, you have this huge opportunity to make people think, to affect peoples LIVES... and you're showing me KKK moms. I mean, whatthefuh?
*I* feel disrespected when someone tells me Firefly is stupid because it has cows and a gas-powered 4-wheeler. To the people who make those arguments: How do we teach them anything, unless we raise our standards?
I'm not saying we should ban Jerry, but I would like to increase the number of shows that make me think to more than, say, 3.
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Quote:
Originally posted by Quicksand:
I didn't mean to disrespect anyone for watching, say, Jerry Springer and loving it. But I'm disrespecing Jerry Springer because, DAMMIT man, you have this huge opportunity to make people think, to affect peoples LIVES... and you're showing me KKK moms. I mean, whatthefuh?
*I* feel disrespected when someone tells me Firefly is stupid because it has cows and a gas-powered 4-wheeler. To the people who make those arguments: How do we teach them anything, unless we raise our standards?
I'm not saying we should ban Jerry, but I would like to increase the number of shows that make me think to more than, say, 3.
Then I guess it would really sadden you to know that Jerry Springer is HUGE in Europe. That's one of the reasons everybody hates Americans.
But I like what you said about raising our standards. As far as Enterprise goes, I think the writers realized their own shortcomings and raised their own standards this year. Several people have mentioned the improvements in the show over the season. Although I enjoyed the many episodes that seemed to revolve around Trip's bare chest, I am glad the show got some beefing up. But I am highly devoted to critical thinking, and I like Enterprise. Not every smart person is going to like the same thing.
But my point about raising standards is this. I spend all day with teenagers, most of whom have been told repeatedly how dumb they are. So they act dumb. They talk dumb. They talk about how dumb they are, and joke about how dumb the other people in the class are. You should see what happens when you tell them they're smart and mean it. They start acting smart - every single one of them. They just need someone to tell them they can do it, and they comply. So all those people who talk about kids today being stupid are full of crap. Kids today are as smart as they ever were. We just have to tell them they are.
So if we feed the public reality TV and tell them it's good, that's what they watch. If we feed them good TV and let them watch it, they will. Look at Buffy. It had a huge audience because it was considered cool to watch Buffy. We rise to the standards we are given.
"Dear diary, today I was pompous and my sister was crazy."
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Quote:
Originally posted by Ghoulman:
... oh and I don't want to sound like I'm dumping on those who say 'it's improving' but FRELL! ... do you normally wait through years of crap to get to the good? Has any good come yet? Will it?
Honestly. What sort of bizarre logic is that?
And for the love of mudville ... realize that this sort of TV (on various levels) keeps shows like Firefly off the air. After all... if the viewing SciFi fans will accept such rubbish than why the frell would a network pay for a high class production like Firefly? Or Angel? Or... are ya seeing a pattern here boys and girls?
*bump*
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LOL. Well thats pathetic... bumping your own thread. Whats even worse though is that you are simply just trying to cause trouble. It's not clever Ghoulman and its not needed.
"May have been the losing side. Still not convinced it was the wrong one."
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Thanks for adding to the embarrasing number of posts here that attack me for having an opinion.
Pathetic. Yes, yes it is.
So when I saw all the "save ENT" threads showing up I thought I'd bump this one. Sorry. 
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