Polygamist Pedophiles and Papal Pontifications
POSTED BY: deadlockvictim
UPDATED: Wednesday, May 28, 2008 01:32
VIEWED: 23329
PAGE 5 of 28
just so you all know FLDS member are NOT Mormons, sorry this just bugs the b-jesus outta me.
hi
NOTIFY: Y | REPLY | REPLY WITH QUOTE | PERMALINK | TOP | HOME
Quote:
Originally posted by Finn mac Cumhal:
While I share your objections to the heinous acts preformed by so-called religious leaders and my sympathies go out to the victims - I’m not sure I think the church is obligated to pay reparations.
I think people are furious with the Catholic church because they covered it up. When a family or victim would come forward with allegations of abuse, instead of kicking the pedophile priest or bishop out of the church, removing them from their post and excommunicating them... they quietly sent them to other diocese where no one knew what they had done. So these pedophiles were able to continue molesting children in their new churches.
Disgusting.
While the church shouldn't be held responsible for something they had no knowlege of, the minute they found out about it and did nothing to stop it, and then aided in covering up the crimes, they ARE accountable. Absolutely. They should be held responsible for their actions, or non-action, as the case may be.
We sue doctors and lawyers for malpractice. Why not a church leader?
"Can you, for a moment, imagine how depressing it is to teach one thousand years of masculine ineptitude? Why do you think there are so few women historians? I'll tell you why. Because history is not such a frolic for women as it is for men... History is a commentary on the various and continuing incapabilities of men. History is women following behind with a bucket and a mop." - Alan Bennett, "The History Boys"
NOTIFY: Y | REPLY | REPLY WITH QUOTE | PERMALINK | TOP | HOME
I agree. If a man and 5 women are happy in a polygamist relationship, who am I to say they can't do that? Even raising children in that environment - if they're happy and well-cared for, loved and nutured, who cares if it's two moms or two dads or 5 moms and 1 dad?
What I take issue with is this deep-seated belief that a teenage girl is chattel - to be taken in hand, trained like a proper dog, deflowered, and turned into a baby-machine.
Suddenly, I'm having a flash back of Hard Candy. This whole story makes me want to grab a scalpel and do some gelding of my own - particularly on some "godly" and "righteous" old farts.
"Can you, for a moment, imagine how depressing it is to teach one thousand years of masculine ineptitude? Why do you think there are so few women historians? I'll tell you why. Because history is not such a frolic for women as it is for men... History is a commentary on the various and continuing incapabilities of men. History is women following behind with a bucket and a mop." - Alan Bennett, "The History Boys"
NOTIFY: Y | REPLY | REPLY WITH QUOTE | PERMALINK | TOP | HOME
That's all well and good, but honestly I don't see how it's any of your business. Or mine, or anyone's on this board. When you and I live in a Utopic society that isn't teeming with disease, decadence, inhumanity and "Democracy" at the helm, then yes, I think we can start telling other people that their way of life is wrong. Any society that needs to pop pills on a daily basis to cope is not a role model and should not be telling people how to live, in my opinion.
That being said, Big Gov had no more business upturning that society's life and lively hood and turning it into a media circus than they did doing the same thing in Iraq.
WMD's in Iraq, rape in Texas. It's all the same bullshit spin to get the proles behind the Goverenment's only desire, which is apparently the Imperialization of the entire world and to one day use the ever-improving technology at their disposal to keep tabs on every single human being in the world, micro-manage every aspect of their lives, and know everything there is to know about them. One day that six inches between your ears won't be private anymore either.
For some, like me, who blog their feelings on these matters, a lot of what was in there is already on the books. I'm not too concerned for my own well being because I'm not doing anything wrong, but I'm quite confident that there are people keeping tabs on my internet usage. I know for a fact that it happens at my job, but it's possible that I've pissed more than a few people off up on the hill that I shouldn't be pissing off by not being a good little Bushbot and just shutting up and washing my War down with a couple of tabs of Soma every day.
"A government is a body of people, usually notably ungoverned." http://www.myspace.com/6ixstringjack
NOTIFY: Y | REPLY | REPLY WITH QUOTE | PERMALINK | TOP | HOME
Quote:
Originally posted by 6ixStringJack:
That's all well and good, but honestly I don't see how it's any of your business. Or mine, or anyone's on this board. When you and I live in a Utopic society that isn't teeming with disease, decadence, inhumanity and "Democracy" at the helm, then yes, I think we can start telling other people that their way of life is wrong.
Were you replying to MY post? If so, I don't think you read what I wrote.
I find it offensive that my fellow "sisters" are forced to marry lecherous men that are old enough to be their fathers or grandfathers. I find it offensive that this little "utopian" society condones rape. I find it offensive that they use young women as brood mares.
That being said, once a young woman turns eighteen, the law says she can do what she wants. So if she chooses to be one of ten wives, that's her business. If she wants to be a part of a society that can take her children away from her if she misbehaves, that's her business.
On a similar note, did anyone read about these two moronic Christian fundamentalist parents who let their daughter slip into a TREATABLE diabetic coma and die? Yeah, they just prayed over her and expected a miracle. Apparently, they'd never heard the phrase, "God helps those who help themselves."
These fundamentalists could learn a thing or two from the Amish. The Amish encourage their young people to go out into the world and decide if they want to stay in the community or leave. While the adults may or may not use modern medicine, they recognize that they do not have the right to deny their children proper medical care.
My point is, once a person is of legal age to make decisions about how to live their life, the government shouldn't interfere with those decisions. But if a parent or community leader is trying to force a child to participate in religious practices that are ILLEGAL or physically harmful, then yeah, the government should step in. Absolutely.
"Can you, for a moment, imagine how depressing it is to teach one thousand years of masculine ineptitude? Why do you think there are so few women historians? I'll tell you why. Because history is not such a frolic for women as it is for men... History is a commentary on the various and continuing incapabilities of men. History is women following behind with a bucket and a mop." - Alan Bennett, "The History Boys"
NOTIFY: Y | REPLY | REPLY WITH QUOTE | PERMALINK | TOP | HOME
I got all you said the first time, and I admit that it's hard to disagree with a lot, if not most of it. I'm just saying that before people sit back in judgement of these people who's lives were upturned by our own Government pulling a hurricane Katrina on them, they might want to take a step back and look at just how screwed up their own lives are, and the fact that the very Government that is "saving" your sisters from the alleged lecherous men is the very same Government which has laid the groundwork for the current miseries in today's Western Democracy.
Hardly calling their life Utopian here, just making a commentary that in general our own lives and livelyhood is just about as far from Utopian as you can get without each and every one of us being physically collared, and all things considered, I find it quite rediculous that we're at the forefront of spreading (forcing) our wonderful Democracy on everyone else and making sure that they're a secular a people as we are. Hey, ain't life great when we replace religion with Idol Worship a 'la Kelly Clarkson? I know I feel blessed.
Now give me my pills. "A government is a body of people, usually notably ungoverned." http://www.myspace.com/6ixstringjack
NOTIFY: Y | REPLY | REPLY WITH QUOTE | PERMALINK | TOP | HOME
Empire - It's not just girls, it's children as a whole.
See, one of my primary axes to grind is that nowhere in our law, our society, do we ever actually consider them human beings, consider them PEOPLE - till they hit the magic number.
Until that point they are legally and socially considered in a class just below pets, beloved property, but property just the same, and I mean below pets cause if you did some of the same crap to a pet that folks do to kids, you would be charged for it.
That bein said, the state which has formented that environment is no proper caretaker either, there's no emotional bond, no logical reason for them to care other than as a matter of social control.
When it comes to hair splitting, barring an iron-clad, proven case of sustained abuse at the hands of their parent(s) - the State has no business nor any moral authority to make value judgements.
Many of our social ills stem directly from the way we treat our children, and the horrors we often visit upon them in the work "raising" or "educating" them, to offer them in a place in a society that, from a childs viewpoint, is often nightmarish, dystopic even, and when they choose to reject it, we bring out the square peg hammer and apply it quite liberally, don't we ?
They ain't pets, livestock or a commodity, they are PEOPLE - but until you, I, or anyone else can ram that through to society as a whole, and the State besides, it's just gonna be the way it is.
One should ponder the influence of those who do connect with the younger generation and treat them as human beings, given the plain and simple fact that some day a percentage of those kids is gonna be in charge.
Ponder it good, and consider your fate once it is in their hands.
-Frem
It cannot be said enough, those who do not learn from history, are doomed to endlessly repeat it
NOTIFY: N | REPLY | REPLY WITH QUOTE | PERMALINK | TOP | HOME
Quote:
Originally posted by 6ixStringJack:
No class, no respect, no recognition to the right to privacy and the right to practice your religion..... No suprise, right?
I am very ashamed of my Government on a daily basis
What religion? It was the farthest thing from a religion imaginable. Their leader Jeffs is a convicted pedophile rapist, and the entire cult compund was set up as a pedophile's fantasy land. There are no records of any legal marriages, no records of any birth certificates....brothers and sisters don't even know the other, or who their parents are...they were born and raised for one purpose..to provide future sexual deviant opportunities for the criminal pedophiles running the place. These women are zombies.....females with zero self-respect for themselves, females willing to sacrifice their own identities to become dominated living sex toys for the male dominators. And as far as you being ashamed of the Government....what else is new?
NOTIFY: Y | REPLY | REPLY WITH QUOTE | PERMALINK | TOP | HOME
Quote:This is the rhetorical tactic of demanding perfection from the opposing view.
That's all well and good, but honestly I don't see how it's any of your business. Or mine, or anyone's on this board. When you and I live in a Utopic society that isn't teeming with disease, decadence, inhumanity and "Democracy" at the helm, then yes, I think we can start telling other people that their way of life is wrong.
Quote:I know that you don't like laws and government in general, but they WERE breaking the laws of Texas (and most other states) by enforcing pedophilia. So the state did have authority over those folks, unlike Iraq over whom we have no authority whatsoever. BTW I think laws against pedophilia are GOOD laws. Are you so disgusted with "the government" that you can's spare any disgust for pedophilia?
That being said, Big Gov had no more business upturning that society's life and lively hood and turning it into a media circus than they did doing the same thing in Iraq.
---------------------------------
Let's party like it's 1929.
NOTIFY: Y | REPLY | REPLY WITH QUOTE | PERMALINK | TOP | HOME
What you and Jongs say is all well and good Signy. You know what I think about believing everything the corporate run media says. The truth is, you and I will never in our lives know what really happened there. We will hear testimony that damns them, but I'm sure there was a lot of good that happened there too and it probably wasn't a "cult", but there was nothing stopping some people in a world separated from the mainstream from taking advantage of that situation.
Frem is right, and there should have been a way to do that descreetly and weed out the bad guys. This would have served two very important purposes.. 1) Keeping this travesty of an embarrasment and media circus from being something that people turned around and bashed the "cult" out of existance, and MUCH more importantly 2) try to solve this in a way where it wasn't the behemoth of a tragic uprooting of those children's lives. I for one, don't buy that the entire operation was an infringement of personal liberties and I believe that in all likely hood, the REAL bad guys have been made the poster children for the church. I'm not saying that the horror stories you regurgitate aren't possible, but I'm saying that they're not probable. Regardless of that though, even if they were all monsters, I think there would be a better way of handling this. There were too many of them to flee. Nobody was going anywhere. This could have been handled through them and the people that you two have so much trust in, in our Government.
Instead, they chose to go Waco on them. True... there aren't any burning skulls of children this time, but if I was a gambling man, I would bet my savings on the fact that half of those girls are going to grow up to be strippers and call girls now. But I'll tell you what... if I'm wrong in 12 or 15 years or so, I'll let you tell me I was wrong all night and I'll even buy the booze.
Regards,
~6SJ "A government is a body of people, usually notably ungoverned." http://www.myspace.com/6ixstringjack
NOTIFY: Y | REPLY | REPLY WITH QUOTE | PERMALINK | TOP | HOME