Polygamist Pedophiles and Papal Pontifications
POSTED BY: deadlockvictim
UPDATED: Wednesday, May 28, 2008 01:32
VIEWED: 23329
PAGE 4 of 28
Siggy, my concern is that in spite of such evidence the case is polluted beyond repair by the over the top tactics, playing fast and loose with the regulations (possibly invalidating evidence obtained) and the media circus of press involvement as a propaganda tool.
I'd like to see the perps fry too, but when we start lookin the other way folk who bend the rules, we're soon to find those rules bent around our necks.
I am hoping they can salvage a case out of this, but am also highly doubtful it's any kind of possible at this point.
While I doubt he'd admit it, Hero knows exactly why I am pissed off and could probably articulate it in explicit detail if he wanted to - it's annoying as hell to have a perfectly good case wrecked by some gung-ho asshole with no respect for proper procedure.
-F
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Quote:Then you are responsible for every criminal on the street, since your point can easily be extended to society as a whole.
Originally posted by SignyM:
FINN: Churches, the military, cults, police, business... you'll find beatings, harassment, initiations beyond the pale, torture, pedophilia in all of them at one point or another. IMHO responsibility should float to the top, unless the organization can show that it tried to prevent (proactively) and to eliminate retroactively) criminal activity. I'm tying this one back to the "Do You Support Our President?" thread because the organization IS responsible for the "culture" that it's members inhabit.
Nihil est incertius vulgo, nihil obscurius voluntate hominum, nihil fallacius ratione tota comitiorum.
Nothing is more unpredictable than the mob, nothing more obscure than public opinion, nothing more deceptive than the whole political system.
-- Cicero
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Quote:HUH????
Then you are responsible for every criminal on the street, since your point can easily be extended to society as a whole.
No, it can't. Because it has to do with lines of authority... surely you've heard of that!
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Let's party like it's 1929.
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And of course you imagine yourself outside of those lines of authority.
Nihil est incertius vulgo, nihil obscurius voluntate hominum, nihil fallacius ratione tota comitiorum.
Nothing is more unpredictable than the mob, nothing more obscure than public opinion, nothing more deceptive than the whole political system.
-- Cicero
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Quote:
Originally posted by Hero:Quote:
Originally posted by Kirkules:
Just to be clear, I wasn't making generalisations about Catholics or Catholic priests, just legal liability.
Oh, well in that case your dead wrong. The members of the church have no liability for the misdeeds of the individual priests or the Church's coverup.
That's like making you responsible for you neighbor's failure to meet City 'Use of Land' laws. After all, you live there, same neighborhood, and did nothing to make him clean it up and you never moved away.
H
I wasn't saying that every individual Catholic should be sued for the actions of a few priests. The Catholic church should have the same liability as any other group or corporation. When a corporation gets sued for wrongdoing by one of their employees, all the stock holders in the corporation are punished when a huge reward goes to a plaintiff. The only way a Catholic can avoid being held liable is to leave the church. Just like the share holder in the corporation has the option of cutting their losses by selling their stock when a lawsuit is announced, a Catholic is free to minimize their future losses by leaving the church.
As far as your bad neighbor argument goes, I might have some liability if we are both in the same homeowners association. If the neighbor doesn't comply with City laws, and then abandons the property, the City will then come after the HOA.
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Mister Grigg makes some interesting points, although I am not sure I would fully agree with him.
http://freedominourtime.blogspot.com/2008/04/your-children-are-ours.ht
ml
He does however point out some of the procedural misdeeds, and the outright hypocrisy of texas officials regarding this case in relation to their own concept of public welfare.
One thing that jumps out at me is the intent to permanently take custody rights even from parents with utterly no evidence of wrongdoing, as a gesture of contempt and usurpation on behalf of the state - which burns me to no end given the well known horrors of the texas foster care system, and known, proven complicity of it's social service dept in one of the freak-feeder food chains as victim procurement.
Our people are on full all hands alert, those with legal training are volunteering as gaurdian ad litem and others are monitoring such as is possible without invasion of privacy.
If even ONE of those kids gets dumped into the feeder system or handed off to one of the known perps via the foster care system, you folks are gonna see a shitstorm of epic proportions in any way we can cause it to happen.
Children are not a commodity, nor are they property, and both the FLDS and the State of Texas need desperately to learn this lesson, and should they push matters in the direction it seems to be going, that just might happen.
-Frem
Guardian Ad Litem
"Guardians ad litem are also appointed in cases where there has been an allegation of child abuse, child neglect, PINS, juvenile delinquency, or dependency. In these situations, the guardian ad litem is charged to represent the best interests of the minor child which can differ from the position of the state or government agency as well as the interest of the parent or guardian. These guardians ad litem vary by jurisdiction and can be volunteer advocates or attorneys."
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Quote:Again... HUH?????
And of course you imagine yourself outside of those lines of authority.
I'm not "the boss" of a LOT of people! I may have a moral or ethical obligation to do "something" about criminal activity... such as call 911, defend someone, or act as a helping witness... and I've done all of those.... but if I'm not in charge of the person committing the criminal act I'm not liable.
It's all about authority and responsibility. If I'm the officer/ manager/ bishop/ in charge and I claim some sort of authority over certain people I also have responsibility for what they do under my authority. I'm not 100% liable ... there are exceptions for what I couldn't reasonably have known... but I AM liable. In the case of the Catholic Church, for example, there WERE Bishops who simply transferred "problem priests" from parish to parish, knowing full well the history of complaints. Clearly they knew what was going on and they didn't stop it, so they're liable. And the same goes for Cardinals.. if they could have reasonably known what the Bishops under their authority were doing but didn't stop it, they're also liable.
So I have absolutely no idea what you're driving at.
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Let's party like it's 1929.
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Well they did once have a guy in charge who had a name that sounded something like "Bring 'em Young"...
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Erm, I generally would not assign responsibility to the management of a church, but for obvious evidence of complicity.
Primary amongst which is the Church of the Servants of the Paraclete.
Go on, look it up - they used it as a recycling center to stuff known offenders till the heat died down, and then from there sent them to new, unsuspecting parishes without even the courtesy of warning them of the perps history.
Just sayin.
My current problem is how to keep an eye on 416 people without violating their rights or privacy, so that they don't disappear into the black hole of a feeder system on us.
-F
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Out of the frying pan and into the fire.
I'm sure these kids are going to be in much better hands when the Beast known as US Gov has property ownership over their lives till they're 18 years old.
Any even minute chance at happiness these kids ever had is completely out the window now. The government, pigs, lawyers and that judge have successfully turned their lives upside down and they will all be ruined.
You people watch too many cop shows and Lifetime movies. Who the hell are you to judge how a separatist society runs? Sure there are bad apples in every bunch, but they should be weeded out. To raid the enitre place and uproot their entire way of life over one single phonecall claiming abuse is absurd. It's a mega-waste of Texas taxpayer dollars for one, but it's blaming everybody for what one person did.
No class, no respect, no recognition to the right to privacy and the right to practice your religion..... No suprise, right?
I am very ashamed of my Government on a daily basis, but it's things like this and Waco that really take the cake. When we abuse our own citizenry.
You may go back to celebrating your victory "for the children" now, you crazy mob.
"A government is a body of people, usually notably ungoverned." http://www.myspace.com/6ixstringjack
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