Opinion on Iraq has changed recently.

POSTED BY: kaneman
UPDATED: Friday, July 28, 2006 17:54
VIEWED: 1743
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KANEMAN

Thursday, July 27, 2006 7:26 PM

Just read a piece in the local paper interviewing local troops in Iraq. These men and women clearly have no idea why they are there. They all felt like they are just riding around waiting to get blown up. They also believe that Iraq will have a civil war the moment we leave. If this the case, shouldn't we just withdraw now?

One soldier replied, when asked about morale, " It's like taking what you hate most about your job..doing it five hours a day, in 120 degree heat, getting shot at doing so, and sand in your underwear to boot...than ask yourself about morale!...All for what? we don't know..none of us gives a (expletive - expletive) whether or not Iraq is a democracy. So one side has to win. Be it Shiite, be it Sunni. I don't care. It's apparent, these people have made it obvious they can't live in unity."

I thought for awhile we should be there, lately? not so much.)

PENGUIN

Thursday, July 27, 2006 7:33 PM

I agree completely that there will be a civil war as soon as we leave. There may even be one while we're there. Then what do we do? Who's side do we back?

We were idiots to invade (yes, invade) a country and think we could bring it democracy. Hell, democracy barely works here in the US with only 300+ years of history. How arrogant of us to believe that a county with thousands of years of history and thousands of years of feuding factions could be made to accept democracy!

Stupidity starts at the top...

CHRISISALL

Thursday, July 27, 2006 7:36 PM

From the beginning, it was done the wrong way.
We got Saddam; good on us. But the Iraq war is massive chemotherapy where surgery and immuno-building techniques might have worked better.
(Too much time on the medical thread...)

We're meddling. And getting more Americans wounded and killed to do it.

My two credits Chrisisall

KANEMAN

Thursday, July 27, 2006 8:34 PM

Would it be better to just split the country into two nations?

CHRISISALL

Thursday, July 27, 2006 8:46 PM

Worked with Germany...sort of...

No history credentials Chrisisall

SOUPCATCHER

Thursday, July 27, 2006 9:20 PM

I don't know enough about Iraq to say whether or not splitting the country would work. From some of what I've read I've gotten the opinion that neither Sunni or Shiite are homogenous categories.

Some of the big questions in my mind are: do we want permanent military bases in Iraq? Does the Administration have a plan beyond "staying the course?" Will we make substantive changes before 2009?

I think the majority of Americans would be sympathetic to the Murtha plan if it was ever given an accurate airing (based on polling data - http://www.pollingreport.com/iraq.htm ). However, it doesn't matter what the majority of Americans think. What matters is what this Administration decides because, let's face it, Congress hasn't shown any inclination to challenge the President.

SIMONWHO

Thursday, July 27, 2006 10:00 PM

And North Korea/South Korea has been a raging success.

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SIGNYM

Thursday, July 27, 2006 10:02 PM

I continue to vote for splitting it in three (don't forget the Kurds). And in ther future, when it looks like we may have created a "Shiite crescent" (Syria, Iran, Iraq) while our internally-threatend "allies" like Saui Arabia are muttering expletives under their collective breath, splitting Iraq may look like an attractive alternative. Better that Iran get only a third of Iraq than the whole thing.

(Unless of course Bush wants Iran to get "bogged down" on Iraq. Or possibly wants all the Shiites to coalesce so he can bomb them all in one fell swoop....)

---------------------------------
Don't piss in my face and tell me it's raining.

KANEMAN

Thursday, July 27, 2006 11:31 PM

Quote:
Originally posted by SoupCatcher:
I don't know enough about Iraq to say whether or not splitting the country would work. From some of what I've read I've gotten the opinion that neither Sunni or Shiite are homogenous categories.

Some of the big questions in my mind are: do we want permanent military bases in Iraq? Does the Administration have a plan beyond "staying the course?" Will we make substantive changes before 2009?

I think the majority of Americans would be sympathetic to the Murtha plan if it was ever given an accurate airing (based on polling data - http://www.pollingreport.com/iraq.htm ). However, it doesn't matter what the majority of Americans think. What matters is what this Administration decides because, let's face it, Congress hasn't shown any inclination to challenge the President.

From what I read permanent bases is not an option...I think we have already stated we will leave..Question becomes when?

Good point about Kurds and three.

As far as North and South Korea. At least half is civil. And the other is isolated...not really turmoil ya know? Iraq is also in the middle of a powder keg. where as Asia is pretty stable.

CITIZEN

Thursday, July 27, 2006 11:40 PM

Quote:
Originally posted by chrisisall:
Worked with Germany...sort of...

No history credentials Chrisisall

Except the reasons it 'worked' in Germany was because the world’s two largest allied groups (Warsaw Pact and NATO) invested their militaries and the threat of global nuclear war.

That simply is not, and cannot, happen in Iraq. It's something that should have been done instead of forming Iraq in the first place, the Western powers carved up the area after the First World War like Europe mark two.

Firstly Europe took hundreds of years and two world wars to reach a point where we weren't constantly at each others throats, and that's without the problems that inevitable arise from just arbitrarily drawing lines on a map and calling it a nation, just look at Africa for a practical demonstration of what happens there.

I don’t think splitting Iraq in two (besides you’d need three not two new countries, Kurds Shiites and Sunnis) would work. For a start there’s no superpower in the other half like there was for Germany, and you need MAD (Mutually Assured Destruction, I just thought the abbreviation needed to be stated) in order to stop one side going for the other. I have few doubts that if it wasn’t for the bomb hanging over our heads like the sword of Damocles there would have been a Third World War already originating in Germany.

The Sunnis hate the Shiites, and the Shiites hate the Sunnis and everyone hates the Kurds. Any splitting of Iraq on religious grounds will just end with two or more countries at each others throats, if you doubt this just look at India and Pakistan.

More insane ramblings by the people who brought you beeeer milkshakes!
No one can see their reflection in running water. It is only in still water that we can see.

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