The Evidens

POSTED BY: JO753
UPDATED: Monday, February 14, 2022 07:11
VIEWED: 159178
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SECOND

Saturday, June 17, 2017 5:43 AM

6ixStringJoker, I don't release my tax returns on fireflyfans.net because there is nothing in it for me. But then I'm not running for President. But then I also did not promise many times to release my taxes as soon as the IRS finishes my audit, while Trump did promise. But then again Trump did not expect to win, so why release his taxes?

Economists say the ultra-wealthy are dodging taxes far more than we think. They are not worried about jail. Trump had no need to worry until he won the election. Now he will be under scrutiny that he never considered before.
https://qz.com/994323

Do you know why he cheated? Any effort Trump put into tax evasion, assuming his time is worth as little as $10,000 per hour, will be well paid back in taxes avoided. That is his ROI. There is no way Trump would pass up the opportunity to cheat because there is hundreds of millions of dollars involved. Again we're talking about Donald Trump, not Honest Abe Lincoln nor George "I cannot tell a lie" Washington.
www.msn.com/en-us/news/politics/trump%E2%80%99s-businesses-show-mixed-
returns-during-campaign-and-presidency/ar-BBCMBWc?li=BBmkt5R&ocid=spartanntp

Quote:
Originally posted by 6stringJoker:
Quote:
Originally posted by second:
If Trump is one of those indecent people whose every move is controlled by ROI (and he is) he obviously would cheat big time because it is so easy to do and a tax cheater's ROI is ENORMOUS.

The ROI on tax cheating is not ENORMOUS. Part of weighing out ROI is comparing possible benefits against possible consequences of your actions. Saving a few million here or there by outright breaking the law when you have a business the size of Trump's is potential career suicide.

Again, I'm not saying that he didn't do it. I just don't think that he did.

There are plenty of ways to avoid taxes legally, and I'm quite sure that the accountants and tax attorneys on his team took advantage of every single one of them for what they're likely getting paid. (He even admitted to the public already that there were years that he did not pay taxes, so I don't know what your point about this all is).

Maddow and Olberman would have countless hours worth of shows pouring over those things and vilifying Trump for them. The only people who would look at what they were talking about and say "Who the fuck cares? That's business." are other large corporation big-shots who know that's just how the game is played.

It's a no brainier not releasing those to the public when he doesn't have to.

Don't ever expect to see them, voluntarily or otherwise. It's not going to happen. They may subpoena them for investigation, but there is no way those are ever going to be released to the public unless they are illegally leaked or somebody changes the law to state that any president or presidential candidate MUST disclose their tax returns to the public.

The Joss Whedon script for Serenity, where Wash lives, is Serenity-190pages.pdf at www.mediafire.com/folder/1uwh75oa407q8/Firefly

6STRINGJOKER

Saturday, June 17, 2017 5:51 AM

Quote:
Originally posted by second:
6ixStringJoker, I don't release my tax returns on fireflyfans.net because there is nothing in it for me. But then I'm not running for President. But then I also did not promise many times to release my taxes as soon as the IRS finishes my audit, while Trump did promise. But then again Trump did not expect to win, so why release his taxes?

Economists say the ultra-wealthy are dodging taxes far more than we think. They are not worried about jail. Trump had no need to worry until he won the election. Now he will be under scrutiny that he never considered before.
https://qz.com/994323

Do you know why he cheated? Any effort Trump put into tax evasion, assuming his time is worth as little as $10,000 per hour, will be well paid back in taxes avoided. That is his ROI. There is no way Trump would pass up the opportunity to cheat because there is hundreds of millions of dollars involved. Again we're talking about Donald Trump, not Honest Abe Lincoln nor George "I cannot tell a lie" Washington.

Quote:
Originally posted by 6stringJoker:
Quote:
Originally posted by second:
If Trump is one of those indecent people whose every move is controlled by ROI (and he is) he obviously would cheat big time because it is so easy to do and a tax cheater's ROI is ENORMOUS.

What is your definition of "cheating"?

Are you inadvertently trying to say that you outright break the law when you do your taxes, or are you saying that you use every single legal loophole that, while maybe not "honest", are still avoiding outright breaking the law?

I'm sure there is some shady shit in those tax returns. What I'm saying is that I doubt there are any outright illegal things. Whether or not he ever had any intentions of becoming President it is stupid for somebody with that much responsibility to gamble not only with his own well-being but that of every single employee working for him around the world to blatantly spit in the face of the IRS.

I agree. He did promise to release his tax returns. In the debates where Hillary made a huge stink about it. There is no way he wasn't going to lie about releasing them in that forum. There would have been no argument by anybody that he lost the debates if he didn't make that promise.

I'd like to see how many promises of any type have been made in the debates over the years that were reneged on. Why is this one any more important than any of the other lies every presidential hopeful has ever said?

SECOND

Saturday, June 17, 2017 6:17 AM

The knowledge that some people are more trustworthy, honest, impulsive, and aggressive than others is essential to navigating life. It’s simply not a good personal policy to assume that everyone you stumble upon in life has your best interest at heart. You stumbled upon Trump.

Quote:
Originally posted by 6stringJoker:
Quote:
Originally posted by second:
6ixStringJoker, I don't release my tax returns on fireflyfans.net because there is nothing in it for me. But then I'm not running for President. But then I also did not promise many times to release my taxes as soon as the IRS finishes my audit, while Trump did promise. But then again Trump did not expect to win, so why release his taxes?

Economists say the ultra-wealthy are dodging taxes far more than we think. They are not worried about jail. Trump had no need to worry until he won the election. Now he will be under scrutiny that he never considered before.
https://qz.com/994323

Do you know why he cheated? Any effort Trump put into tax evasion, assuming his time is worth as little as $10,000 per hour, will be well paid back in taxes avoided. That is his ROI. There is no way Trump would pass up the opportunity to cheat because there is hundreds of millions of dollars involved. Again we're talking about Donald Trump, not Honest Abe Lincoln nor George "I cannot tell a lie" Washington.

Quote:
Originally posted by 6stringJoker:
Quote:
Originally posted by second:
If Trump is one of those indecent people whose every move is controlled by ROI (and he is) he obviously would cheat big time because it is so easy to do and a tax cheater's ROI is ENORMOUS.

What is your definition of "cheating"?

Are you inadvertently trying to say that you outright break the law when you do your taxes, or are you saying that you use every single legal loophole that, while maybe not "honest", are still avoiding outright breaking the law?

I'm sure there is some shady shit in those tax returns. What I'm saying is that I doubt there are any outright illegal things. Whether or not he ever had any intentions of becoming President it is stupid for somebody with that much responsibility to gamble not only with his own well-being but that of every single employee working for him around the world to blatantly spit in the face of the IRS.

I agree. He did promise to release his tax returns. In the debates where Hillary made a huge stink about it. There is no way he wasn't going to lie about releasing them in that forum. There would have been no argument by anybody that he lost the debates if he didn't make that promise.

I'd like to see how many promises of any type have been made in the debates over the years that were reneged on. Why is this one any more important than any of the other lies every presidential hopeful has ever said?

The Joss Whedon script for Serenity, where Wash lives, is Serenity-190pages.pdf at www.mediafire.com/folder/1uwh75oa407q8/Firefly

6STRINGJOKER

Saturday, June 17, 2017 6:54 AM

Quote:
Originally posted by second:
The knowledge that some people are more trustworthy, honest, impulsive, and aggressive than others is essential to navigating life. It’s simply not a good personal policy to assume that everyone you stumble upon in life has your best interest at heart. You stumbled upon Trump.

We all stumbled upon Trump. What is your point?

Even Democrats knew and admit that Hillary is a liar. Show me an honest politician, let alone presidential candidate.

JO753

Saturday, June 17, 2017 9:53 AM

Interesting Salon articl:
http://www.salon.com/2017/02/02/president-trump-modifies-obamas-sancti
ons-against-russia/

From the artikl:

Quote:
Any major change in America-Russia bilateral relations with Trump will look particularly troubling in light of reports that there was no transcript of Trump’s first call with Russian dictator Vladimir Putin because he turned off the recording.

Remember all the hubbub about our intel ajensyz dropping the ball allowing the 9/11 attack to sekseed so well? Seemz they didnt lern much.

More frum the articl - a wake up klaxon for any sheepl hoo think Putin running America mite not be so bad:

Quote:
In other news, journalist Vladimir Kara-Murza, one of Putin’s most prominent Russian critics and part of the pro-democracy group Open Russia, suddenly died of organ failure earlier on Thursday. He had previously been poisoned and become seriously ill as a result, although it was never proved that the poisoning was deliberate. He was described as healthy prior to his unexpected death.

Rachel Maddow interviewed that guy a few months ago!

----------------------------
DUZ XaT SEM RiT TQ YQ? - Jubal Early

http://www.7532020.com

6STRINGJOKER

Saturday, June 17, 2017 9:48 PM

lol

SIGNYM

Saturday, June 17, 2017 9:51 PM

Kara-Murza is not dead. Your article links to a BBC article which was posted Feb 2, and which mentions "organ failure" and "medically-induced coma". But in a subsequent Feb 8 article ...

Quote:
Kremlin Critic Kara-Murza Emerges From Coma, Condition Improving

Kremlin critic Vladimir Kara-Murza Jr. who has been hospitalized in critical condition for the second time in two years in what his family and friends suspect was a deliberate poisoning, has awoken from a coma and improved noticeably, his lawyer and wife told RFE/RL.

Vadim Prokhorov said in a February 8 post on Facebook that his client’s heart was functioning normally and that he was conscious enough to interact with his wife, though he still was unable to talk. ...

https://www.rferl.org/a/russia-kara-murza-emerges-from-coma-improving/
28298654.html

Seems like your Salon article was "fake news". Or at least "jumped the gun and didn't add a retraction" news.

Yanno, I read several articles about this at the time, and the whole "poisoning" scenario seemed wobbly at the time. Here are snippets of articles and what I found troubling about them ...

From the BBC

Quote:
The journalist's wife said he had suffered the same sudden onset of symptoms as in his previous illness.

"The ambulance took him directly to the hospital where the same medical team has since been trying to determine what is happening," she said.

"He was brought there conscious but was put in a medicated coma and on life support later, because his organs began shutting down like last time."

... No cause was ever established for Mr Kara-Murza's last [previous] illness, but tests confirmed that he had ingested a poisonous substance.

There is NO generic test for "poison". If there was, it would make forensic investigation a whole lot easier! Why the BBC would post such claptrap is beyond me.

FROM RADIO FREE EUROPE

Quote:
Kremlin critic Vladimir Kara-Murza Jr. who has been hospitalized in critical condition for the second time in two years in what his family and friends suspect was a deliberate poisoning, has awoken from a coma and improved noticeably, his lawyer and wife told RFE/RL ....

Kara-Murza, 35, fell ill on February 2 in Moscow and was hospitalized in an intensive-care unit. His wife said later that her husband had suffered kidney failure and was on life support after being placed in a medically-induced coma.

His family says his symptoms are almost identical to those of his near-fatal 2015 illness, also in Moscow, which he believes was the result of a deliberate poisoning in retaliation for his political activities.

Earlier this week, Yevgeniya Kara-Murza said doctors had diagnosed her husband with "acute poisoning by an undetermined substance."

First of all, there are a lot of unsubstantiated quotes from Kara-Murza's friends and family. Did RFE ever go back to the doctors and ask for a confirmation of the diagnosis? Because, as I mentioned before, there is no such thing as a generic test for "poison". If I were a medical examiner I would have to reach that DX by excluding every other possible cause, AND I would have to find some sort of puncture mark or chemical burns in the mouth or on the skin or something unusual in the stomach indicating the administration of a foreign substance.

And then there is this ...

Quote:
Yevgeniya also said that samples of her husband’s blood, hair, and fingernails had been sent to a private laboratory in Israel for analysis.

No results have been forthcoming so far.

So despite the fact that every western article mentions "poison" in it many times, "poisoning" had not yet been demonstrated. So far, it's an allegation.

Now, there is at least one cause of sudden organ failure in previously healthy people - two people that I knew personally died of it - and that is sepsis. Literally, healthy one day and in a coma the next a

6STRINGJOKER

Saturday, June 17, 2017 11:02 PM

lol. I'm not the one being programmed by the MSM everyday.

SIGNYM

Sunday, June 18, 2017 12:02 AM

Quote:
6stringJoker says: Sheep sounds and pictures

This from the guy who was wringing his hands over a poisoning death of Kara-Mruza (at the hands of big bad Putin) that didn't even happen.

Meanwhile ...

City Poisoned by Terrorists

I'll let you figure out what that is.

-----------

"Pity would be no more,
If we did not MAKE men poor"- William Blake
THUGR, JONESING FOR WWIII
All those guns 1kiki, are pointed towards your beloved Russia. All those cyber capabilities, pointed right at Russia. Thanks Putin, and get ready to duck.
I'll accept your apology any time, THUGR. But I know you're not man enough to give me one

SIGNYM

Sunday, June 18, 2017 3:05 AM

Quote:
6stringJoker says: Sheep sounds and pictures- GSTRING

This from the guy who was wringing his hands over a poisoning death of Kara-Mruza (at the hands of big bad Putin) that didn't even happen. - SIGNY

"wringing his hands??" no. Sad? If it had happened, yes, of course

Yes, IF it has happened.

Quote:
as you should have been.- GSTRINg

Are you telling me that I should let my emotions be jerked around by a piece of bad reporting (at best) or deliberate propaganda (at worst)?

... And you claim OTHER people are sheep?

Quote:
Are you unaware of Russia's poisoning history? No?

Yes, actually I am aware. I probably know a lot more about it than you do, because, as an analytical chemist, I know how difficult it is to look for "toxins". People have actually turned in analysis requests asking me to look for anything "toxic". My first response to them is that I goggle at them a bit and then ask "How much do you want to spend"? There are hundreds of thousands of toxics and thousands of effective poisons, and new discoveries are made every year. So I'm always in awe when someone tracks down a rarity.

Quote:
So you're just acting dim again? - GSRTING

No, that would be you. Not only did you fall for a a piece of fake news, you are now trying to pretend that somehow I'm the dummy and you're the smart one.

Quote:
Of course - that's what you bring half the time: bad acting. I get that it's easy for you to lie to strangers, but the facility you have for lying to yourself is truly sad.- GSTRING

I have absolutely NO IDEA what you're posting about. How am I "lying to myself"? All I said was that the person that you were wringing your hands over was not, in fact, dead.

You're like KRAPO, who claimed that I "cheered him [Putin] on in every expression of it http://www.fireflyfans.net/mthread.aspx?tid=61700 and, as far as I know, is still to this day trying to find those quotes where I did that.

BTW- You might want to back off on that spittle-laced personal attack on SIX. All it tells me is that you have nothing interesting to say.

-----------

So, just to reiterate what this whole thread is about: It's about EVIDENS.

SOMETHING YOUR BOTH FAILED TO LOOK FOR WHEN YOU READ THAT SALON ARTICLE.

What was the flaw that caused you to be blind-sided?
Your "trust" in certain sites?
Your generous definition of "evidens" to include anything from rumors to allegations?
Your tendency to agree with anything that matches your assumptions/ expectations/ biases?
Your inability to notice logical flaws and weasel-words embedded in the articles that you "like" and"trust"?
Your unwillingness to look for contradictory information?

I think maybe your "evidens-parsing" skills need some work.

-----------

"Pity would be no more,
If we did not MAKE men poor"- William Blake
THUGR, JONESING FOR WWIII
All those guns 1kiki, are pointed towards your beloved Russia. All those cyber capabilities, pointed right at Russia. Thanks Putin, and get ready to duck.
I'll accept your apology any time, THUGR. But I know you're not man enough to give me one

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