Waterboarding- the real deal
POSTED BY: SignyM
UPDATED: Friday, May 9, 2008 01:12
VIEWED: 11112
PAGE 3 of 23
Quote:I'll cop to obnoxious, but not smugness, Bush impounded it all for himself, there just isn't any more for the rest of us to use.
Originally posted by Jongsstraw:
Chris...since you don't trust anything or anyone except your own obnoxious smugness
Quote:Because where my penis is situated, it doesn't allow for...well, you know...
why don't you simply go fuck yourself?...Dong ma?
My trust must be earned- I don't give it away. Bush has earned my resentment is all.
BottomlineChrisisall
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Quote:Spoken just like Joe Hallenbeck.
Originally posted by Fremdfirma:
any asshole tries to do for me better get it right the first time, cause his ass is mine like a prison bitch if he don't, and THAT, folks, is the American way.
LBfanisall
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Finn, Finn, Finn ...
"I wonder when Amnesty International will put up an add showing us what real torture is like."
I realize you know everything about torture, but you could stand to learn about it from the experts - the people who endured it at the hands of a brutal dictator. A Pol Pot survivor says this about waterboarding:
Half a world away, the divisive debate over whether waterboarding constitutes torture comes into sharp relief at the infamous S-21, Tuol Sleng Prison in Phnom Penh, Cambodia.
This is where the genocidal regime of Pol Pot and the Khmer Rouge imprisoned and brutalized its enemies from 1975 to 1979. I visited the once secret S-21, now a museum, with Van Nath, a former inmate. He remembers being brought here blindfolded and terrified: "I thought that was the end of my life," he told me. "In my room people kept dying, one or two every day."
Van Nath was kept in a room packed with 50 other inmates, shackled together and forced to lie down. "We could not sit. If we wanted to sit, we had to ask permission first. No talking, whispering or making noise," he told me.
Van Nath described how male prisoners were whipped raw, their fingernails were yanked out, they were hogtied to wooden bars. Prison guards mutilated women's genitals, ripped off their nipples with pliers. And worst of all, babies were ripped from their mothers' arms and slaughtered.
Take water torture, for instance. Van Nath remembers it as if it were yesterday. I gasped as I entered a room filled with his vivid depictions.
One of his paintings shows a prisoner blindfolded and hoisted onto a makeshift scaffold by two guards. He is then lowered head first into a massive barrel of water. Another shows a prisoner with cloth over his face, writhing as an interrogator pours water over his head.
Van Nath still remembers the accompanying screams: "It sounded like when we are really in pain, choking in water," he told me. "The sound was screaming, from the throat. I suppose they could not bear the torture. Whenever we heard the noises we were really shocked and scared. We thought one day they will do the same thing to us."
As he talked and showed me around, my mind raced to the debate in the United States over this same tactic used on its prisoners nearly 40 years later. I asked Van Nath whether he had heard this was once used on America's terrorist suspects. He nodded his head. "It's not right," he said.
But I pressed him: Is it torture? "Yes," he said quietly, "it is severe torture."
***************************************************************
So Finn, any more words of wisdom on what constitutes real torture ?
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Quote:I think people that witnessed the Towers coming down & the heads of peeps being sawed off have been 'TV-anethetized' and no longer consider anything that doesn't actually kill or remove body parts to be torture.
Originally posted by rue:
So Finn, any more words of wisdom on what constitutes real torture ?
I mean, unless they themselves experience it, I guess.
Chrisisall
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The Japanese waterboard, and it's a war crime.
We waterboard, and it's totally reasonable.
You fuckin' rightie wingnuts and your moral relativism make me sick.
"I thoroughly disapprove of duels. If a man should challenge me, I would take him kindly and forgivingly by the hand and lead him to a quiet place and kill him."
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Quote:Hey- remember that Firefly ep where Mal & Wash were torturing that guy...oh wait...they weren't torturing, they were BEING tortured...that's right, torturin' ain't the job of Big Damn Heroes, it's a job for the likes of Niska & his crew...kinda make ya wonder what some folks even watched the show for, seein' as peeps that don't agree with employing it as part of their methods are un-grown up, have no cajones, and don't trust the oh-so-trustworthy government...Mal & crew must seem pretty much like a group of pansies to them folk...who'd watch a show about wussies tryin' to be noble as a grape when there's bad guys to be waterboarded?
Originally posted by Storymark:
We waterboard, and it's totally reasonable.
Huh?Chrisisall
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Quote:
Originally posted by Storymark:
The Japanese waterboard, and it's a war crime.
We waterboard, and it's totally reasonable.
You fuckin' rightie wingnuts and your moral relativism make me sick.
"I thoroughly disapprove of duels. If a man should challenge me, I would take him kindly and forgivingly by the hand and lead him to a quiet place and kill him."
THANK YOU!!
Waterboarding isn't "like" drowning; it's, like, DROWNING. They are actively drowning you when you're waterboarded. That they don't actually KILL you (most of the time, at least) doesn't mean you aren't actually drowning when they're doing it to you.
And, unlike the people who volunteer to be waterboarded to show how harmless it is, the people we've actually tortured DID NOT KNOW WHETHER OR NOT WE WERE EVER GOING TO STOP DROWNING THEM.
I'm against torture when THEY do it, and I'm against torture when WE do it. Color me reactionary, but I'd rather not become a terrorist in order to battle terrorists. That's something that fuckheads like AwwwCrapper and Finn will just never get their heads around.
Mike
"I supported Bush in 2000 and 2004 and intellegence[sic] had very little to do with that decision." - Hero, Real World Event Discussions
I can't help the sinking feeling that my country is now being run by people who read "1984" not as a cautionary tale, but rather as an instruction manual. - Michael Mock
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Quote:I'd colour you consistent.
Originally posted by Kwicko:
Color me reactionary
Chrisisall
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Works, does it ?
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dunking
That's all waterboarding is, when you get right down to it, and the stones throw from the puritan scum who did this, and the christian scum who waterboard is not so great, which is why I view their religion and diety as monstrous and evil.
When you strip the bullshit off, the difference between christian zealots and muslim zealots is essentially nil - and were it not for the wisdom of a bunch of chary diests who knew what they were capable of and created a secular government, breaking the unholy alliance of church and state, we would likely be in no better shape.
Of course, there WAS a secular government in the middle east, run by a guy we propped up and enabled, but yanno, they had the misfortune to be sitting on a boatload of stuff we wanted, and got a little tired of being our bitch, and in our own blind pride, arrogance and zealotry, we walked right into a disaster of historically epic proportions - it's as if, instead of the trojan horse, we all went over to the trojan camp and got passed out drunk and woke up with second smiles.
Zealotry of any stripe leads to stupidity, be it religious, moral, or political.
-Frem
It cannot be said enough, those who do not learn from history, are doomed to endlessly repeat it
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Quote:God, you’re dumb.
Originally posted by SignyM:
FINNQuote:This is singularly stupid, even from you. Do you know anything about Amnesty International? Apparently not, but that doesn't prevent you from shooting your mouth off like a fool.
I wonder when Amnesty International will put up an add showing us what real torture is like.
Well, for the truly ignorant (that's you, Finn) it's not as if AI is "against" waterboarding but "for" every other form of torture around the world. Look it up.
Nihil est incertius vulgo, nihil obscurius voluntate hominum, nihil fallacius ratione tota comitiorum.
Nothing is more unpredictable than the mob, nothing more obscure than public opinion, nothing more deceptive than the whole political system.
-- Cicero
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