Why are the SW Prequels horrible?

POSTED BY: V
UPDATED: Tuesday, March 14, 2006 16:00
VIEWED: 13816
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CAPTAINSHINY

Sunday, March 12, 2006 2:33 PM

An example of dialogue from ep #:

-"You're beautiful."
-"That's because I'm in love."
-"No, it's because I'm in love with you!"

-Stay Shiny
"The people who made the show, and the people who saw the show, which is roughly the same number of people, fell in love with it, a little bit too much to let it go, too much to lay down arms when when the battle looked pretty much lost. In Hollywood, people like that are called unrealistic, quixotic, obsessive... In my world, they're called Browncoats."
-Joss Whedon

NUCLEARDAY

Sunday, March 12, 2006 2:50 PM

I think my problem, and possibly others, with the prequels, was not so much that I hated them, but more that I didn't LOVE them. ;p

It's hard to recreate the magic, I know. But I grew up in the 80's. I saw episodes V, and VI in theatres as a wee one (wasn't born for episode IV.) To say that Star Wars was somewhat... formative, would be an understatement.

I had tears welling up in my eyes when I saw episode one in theatres. From the very moment they did the cool scrolling plot summary thingy at the beginning. It just sort of went downhill from there for me, though.

Lucas just couldn't deliver for me what I'd been hyped-up to expect. I'd been hearing rumours of other Star Wars movies to come since I was potty-training, after all.

There were some really good parts. I thought the end to episode 3, was quite poignant. Anything with Palpatine in it was excellent, as well. (some reason I really liked his lines. "I'll be sure to keep a close eye on this one" (sp) And I thought Ewan McGregor was great as Obi-Wan.

My problem was that often I felt like I was liking the prequels simply because I felt I should, not due to their own merit. They're good movies, though. But it's like trying to rekindle a romance from a high-school crush. 20 years later and suddenly she's got bags under her eyes, missing teeth, 3 children, and a massive cocaine habit ;p

The prequels were good, just not STAR WARS good ;p

Oh, and Natalie Portman ;p

________________________________________________
You can take my hope when you pry it from my cold, dead fingers.

SIMONB

Sunday, March 12, 2006 2:52 PM

Quote:
Originally posted by Jonus:
Jake Lloyd was only like 8 years old. You can't expect an Oscar winning performance from someone that young. Ewan McGregor and Liam Neeson were awesome. And Darth Maul is kick-ass cool. Oh, and Natalie Portman

Episode II is just misunderstood. Hayden Christensen's performance is probably one of the worst I've ever seen, but he has the right look to be Anakin. And Natalie Portman in white spandex

Now Episode III was the shiznite. Ewan's performance was awesome, we finally got to see the Emperor's wrath, and Hayden's performance was much better. And Natalie Portman

Most people who complain about the prequels grew up with the Originals. I didn't. I became a fan with Episode I. While I love the Originals, I'm a sucker for special effects and bad-ass villains and Natalie Portman. That's why I love the Prequels.

Gotta say I agree with you. I grew up with the originals, and I still love them, but I think of STAR WARS as a 6-part novel, and I enjoy all parts (and the Clone Wars cartoons) equally as chapters in a larger story.

Also, yeah, they have effects - so what? It's great that George can finally show us his worlds as he wants them to be seen. Star Wars (like Firefly) takes me to a wholly new and exciting universe, full of amazing details and characters, and with so much depth to it, I never got bored - always wanting to learn more and see what's around the next corner. I love to be dazzled, and it's no different now to how Star Wars was in the 70's - George has always tried to be cutting edge with his effects, and I don't have a problem with it.

As for the mushy love dialogue, I know how hard love dialogue is to write and pull off. Yet I also know strange and silly things some people in love say when talking to each other in real life - especially during the first few months of a new relationship. Why should Anakin be any different with his feelings? But in the grand scheme of things, nothing's prefect and it doesn't detract from my enjoyment of the story or characters.

- quick edit just to say - they were really overhyped though!

- Shiny. Let's be bad guys.

NEEDY

Sunday, March 12, 2006 3:07 PM

Quote:
Originally posted by SimonB:

Episode 1 suffered (IMHO) because it was an introduction, and yeah maybe Jar Jar was a mistake (but he never got on my nerves as much as he did to some people) and Jake Lloyd was wooden as hell, but I love Qui-Gon Jinn and Darth Maul. Episode 2 was brilliant, I felt George redeemed himself with that one (boy am I gotta get it for saying that - but that's just what I felt about it) - though I do fast-forward through the mushy Anakin/Padme scenes. And Episode 3 I really loved. Though I would have loved to have re-written some of the dialogue before hand.

I agree with you Simon B wholeheartedly
Even though I will always love the originals more, I do like the prequels too.
Episode 1 is not without its faults and, unlike the rest of films, I have to be in the right mood to watch it (mainly because of all the juvenile stuff). I really enjoyed it the first time I saw it, but unfortunately I can't rewatch it as frequently as I could the others.
Hearing young Anakin treat the end space battle like a video game ("Woohoo!" and "I'll try spinning, that's a neat trick") really does grate.

Episode 2, I think is great, and I enjoy it more than the original Star Wars - the only downside being the unbearably bad Padme and Anakin scenes. They're bad not because the actors are awful, but because of the terrible dialogue

Episode 3, if theres one major thing I could throw at it, is that so much is crammed in - surely with 3 movies at his disposal, Lucas could have spread the plotpoints throughout the trilogy - apart from introducing Anakin as a character, what does episode 1 do to set things up?
I also cringed at Palpatine's "No! No! No!" during his confrontation with Mace Windu and the almost spoofish line "NOOOOOOO!!!" from Darth at the end

Other than that, I loved the movies
(though upon reading that, you might not believe me)

For the record - I think Hayden Christensen IS a good actor, though you don't get many opportunities to see this in the star wars films, at least in episode 2.
However, there are some:
Anakin's dark side emerging at the Tusken Raider's camp, followed by his confession to Padme in episode 2
I think, despite the dialogue and minimalistic direction, he really came alive and proved how good an actor he was in episode 3

Nay-sayers who still disagree should check out his film Shattered Glass

-----
Needy. Male Companion a.k.a. First Boy Whore of Destiny
-----
www.myspace.com/needsalt

VITABRAND

Sunday, March 12, 2006 3:17 PM

This little post will show you how much I actually cared to pay attention to the prequals.

I don't know if it was the dialog in the script, but the kid they got playin Anikin / Vader in Ep3 sounded like a spoiled rich kid who's daddy didn't let him take the bentley out for a saturday night spin. Seemed to me that every word that came out of his mouth was whining just shy of a tantrum. I wanted to reach through the screen and throttle him until he quit moving and turned blue.. Ewan McGregor, fantastic as always.... but that kid playing Vader.. I'd die happy never to hear his voice again.

SIMONB

Sunday, March 12, 2006 3:34 PM

Quote:
Originally posted by NEEDY:

Hearing young Anakin treat the end space battle like a video game ("Woohoo!" and "I'll try spinning, that's a neat trick") really does grate...

...Episode 2...the unbearably bad Padme and Anakin scenes. They're bad not because the actors are awful, but because of the terrible dialogue

...apart from introducing Anakin as a character, what does episode 1 do to set things up?
I also cringed at Palpatine's "No! No! No!" during his confrontation with Mace Windu and the almost spoofish line "NOOOOOOO!!!" from Darth at the end

Yeah, I'd agree with those flaws. It was a spoofish line, and I too cringed at Palpatine's "No! No! No!" moment. That could have been better handled.

The ending of Episode III really got to me though - the death of Padme, and the end of the Jedi (especially Mace!!!!) Ki-Adi Mundi and Aayla Secura.

I also love the creative vision that goes into Star Wars - the beauty and artwork of the sets, landscapes, locations, costumes and designs.

Also, to respond to Vitabrand about Anakin's endless whining, I'd personally say it's part of the character (though sounds like it worked a little too well in making you wanna throttle him!) since he's meant to be becoming more impatient and arrogant as the films progress. But yeah, I think the dialogue was probably not helping. Hayden is a good actor, though (gotta say) at times he did seem more like a petulant teenager than someone consumed by darkness. But I still think he was the best choice for Anakin -he just looked and 'felt' right.

Still, in an ideal world, George Lucas would become a huge Firefly fan and would give Joss loads of money and the creative freedom to make Firefly as Joss wants it done (the way Lucas was able to 'liberate' Star Wars from outside control and make them how he wanted to)....

(Sorry, was I daydreaming again?)

- Shiny. Let's be bad guys.

V

Sunday, March 12, 2006 3:42 PM

The real issue I have with Lucas on the whole is his made up BS about how he had this "planned from the begining". If you've looked up over the years what he's said about star wars being a long line of movies, it increasingly gets contradicted time and time again. Even the issue of the original trilogy being planned as such is a big debate with lucas lovers and lucas haters. Then there's the obvious: Continuity set up in the original series blown to hell by shoddy storytelling and deux ex machina style endings. There's making things up as you go along, and thats fine, when it turns out good, then there's pulling stuff out of your rear like whimsical creatures and musical numbers with blatent use of CGI for no apparent reason. Hats off to directors such as Peter Jackson who know when CGI can be effective and be a part of the story, instead of always going "OH SNAP LOOK AT THIS! IT'S UNREAL!"

CGI yoda will continue to bug the crap out of me for years to come.

Remember, Remember the fifth of November

NEEDY

Sunday, March 12, 2006 3:57 PM

Quote:
Originally posted by SimonB:

The ending of Episode III really got to me though - the death of Padme, and the end of the Jedi (especially Mace!!!!) Ki-Adi Mundi and Aayla Secura.

Yeah, like I said, believe it or not, I did like the prequels. The scene where all the Jedi get wiped out one by one and Yoda begins to feel them dying off is spectacular. I think John Williams to all the Star Wars films is great, but the soundtrack to Episode 3 is my favourite - I believe the track is Anakin's Betrayal during that scene.
The death of Padme... well is a bit touch-and-go for me (no jokes about me wanting to touch her and go). I thought it was nicely acted and all, but the line "She had lost the will to live" seems off (so she's just going to give up, despite her newborn babies?). I could have gone on and believed that its was Anakin's choking her that did it, but that line throws it all out.
Plus the continuity errors with Leia in Jedi saying she remembered her mother and that Obi-Wan in empire referred to Luke as "Our last hope" even though he was in the delivery room and knew full well about Leia.
Still these things can be explained I guess, and normally I'm not one to nit-pick at films (I do understand that they aren't real after all) but there you go

Quote:

Still, in an ideal world, George Lucas would become a huge Firefly fan and would give Joss loads of money and the creative freedom to make Firefly as Joss wants it done (the way Lucas was able to 'liberate' Star Wars from outside control and make them how he wanted to)....

(Sorry, was I daydreaming again?)

- Shiny. Let's be bad guys.

Hey, there's still the Star Wars tv series - if Joss feels like getting back into TV, there could be a partnership there. Hell, forget the partnership, just let Joss take over

-----
Needy. Male Companion a.k.a. First Boy Whore of Destiny
-----
www.myspace.com/needsalt

NEEDY

Sunday, March 12, 2006 3:59 PM

Quote:
Originally posted by V:

CGI yoda will continue to bug the crap out of me for years to come.

Remember, Remember the fifth of November

Whilst I admit that Lucas really overdid it with the CGI and blatantly showed it off instead of focussing on what really mattered, I felt the CGI Yoda was a good decision.
The puppet in Episode 1 just looked wrong, and Yoda just looked a lot better as a digital creation - plus, it gave us the opportunity to see him kick butt, something we'd never see the puppet do

-----
Needy. Male Companion a.k.a. First Boy Whore of Destiny
-----
www.myspace.com/needsalt

SIMONB

Sunday, March 12, 2006 4:08 PM

Personally, I don't think Leia's line about remembering her mother was a mistake - Leia is Force Sensitive and she was the last one taken out of the womb, so in mind mind she empathically picked up her mothers feelings, plus also she's looking back with her memories and feelings, and time can distort those perceptions. Ok, That's just my take on things, but it works for me. As for Luke being their last hope, at that stage he was the only one openly embracing the Jedi path or even aware that he had powers.

Plus, I don't think the prequels do disrupt the continuity that much....or perhaps I'm just good at rationalising things to make them fit. But it worked for me.

- also, yeah, they should have left out the "she's lost the will to live" line for Padme's end and should have left it as the Force-choke trauma that killed her.

Also, yeah - CGI yoda Rules!!!!!!

- quick edit - just to say I do believe you Needy when you say you love them, and it's cool to know there's someone else out there who feels the same! Was worried when I posted my comment earlier that I was signing my own death warrant! lol

- Shiny. Let's be bad guys.

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