McCain and Palin are lying whores!
POSTED BY: ImperaTodd
UPDATED: Monday, November 10, 2008 00:00
VIEWED: 9896
PAGE 1 of 2
Sorry I can't remember the last time I was this mad! This nation is facing an economic melt down and instead of a plan we get a whole host gose shoveled out! I once respected Palin and McCain as honorable people, and while didn't agree with them, still held a fundamental respect for them. No longer do I respect either of them, and now I see how dishonorable the GOP has become! I am sick to my stomach right now.
http://www.cnn.com/2008/POLITICS/10/04/palin.obama/index.html
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Were I an Alliance citizen during the War of Unification I would have been an Alliance Patriot, but I would have run guns for the Browncoats. No I am not a greedy baby eating monster! Gunrunning would have been the patriotic thing to do.
Governments have a way of warping ideals.
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Also, don't forget that as a "war hero", McCain routinely bombed civilians.
Mike
This world is a comedy for those who think, and a tragedy for those who feel.
Trolls Against McCain!
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Yeah, this is completely uncivilized. Obama and McCain have to work together in the senate. They are coworkers. There are limits to whaty you can say about a coworker. But of course, Two-faced McCain claims to respect Obama. Meanwhile, his spokesmodel can basically declare Obama an enemy combatant--with a wink and a smile.
With rhetoric like that, what's to stop a Palin/McCain regime from locking the Obamas of the world up without a trial? These are dark, dark days we're living in. Let's just hope the American people can pull us back from that abyss come November.
HKCavalier
Hey, hey, hey, don't be mean. We don't have to be mean, because, remember, no matter where you go, there you are.
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Songbird McCain only tells the truth when tortured by whores in the Hanoi Holiday Inn.
http://VietnamVeteransAgainstJohnMcCain.com
Palin's just a whore. She's too dumb to lie.
Quote:
"This sucker (Amerika) is going to go DOWN!"
-George W Bush, meeting with McCain and Obama for their $850-Billion bankrobbery on Wall Street
www.theherald.co.uk/news/news/display.var.2453629.0.If_money_isnt_loos
ened_up_this_sucker_is_going_to_go_down.php
www.thesmokinggun.com/archive/bushdui1.html
I'm to the point now where I say let it crash and burn. I hope everybody loses their pensions, like Uncle Scam stole mine and my wife's.
Ruby Tuesdays is cutting back all employees to a 2-day workweek, if they're lucky.
Martial law - bring it ON! What will the morons do then?
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Quote:WTF are you talking about!? Basically every coherent sentence she manages to string together is a lie about something. Haven't you been watching her at all!?
Originally posted by piratenews:
Palin's just a whore. She's too dumb to lie.
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Trolls against McCain, you betcha!
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Quote:
Originally posted by ImperaTodd:
I once respected Palin and McCain as honorable people, and while didn't agree with them, still held a fundamental respect for them.
I think you might be the lying whore here. Your selective indignation is comical. Every other word out of Obama and Biden's mouths in this campaign has been lies, but an exaggeration of the connection between Obama and Ayers make you lose respect for McCain. Preaching to the choir is fine, but don't expect anyone with an open mind to buy your bullshit. If you are truly as naive as you post indicates, then I apologize for my harsh tone.
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Quote:Examples, please.
Originally posted by Kirkules:
Every other word out of Obama and Biden's mouths in this campaign has been lies
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Trolls against McCain, you betcha!
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Quote:
Originally posted by Khyron:Quote:Examples, please.
Originally posted by Kirkules:
Every other word out of Obama and Biden's mouths in this campaign has been lies
Here's a few lies Biden told in the debate with Palin.
Joe Biden's 14 Lies
1. TAX VOTE: Biden said McCain voted “the exact same way” as Obama to increase taxes on Americans earning just $42,000, but McCain DID NOT VOTE THAT WAY.
2. AHMEDINIJAD MEETING: Joe Biden lied when he said that Barack Obama never said that he would sit down unconditionally with Mahmoud Ahmedinijad of Iran. Barack Obama did say specifically, and Joe Biden attacked him for it.
3. OFFSHORE OIL DRILLING: Biden said, “Drill we must.” But Biden has opposed offshore drilling and even compared offshore drilling to “raping” the Outer Continental Shelf.”
4. TROOP FUNDING: Joe Biden lied when he indicated that John McCain and Barack Obama voted the same way against funding the troops in the field. John McCain opposed a bill that included a timeline, that the President of the United States had already said he would veto regardless of it’s passage.
5. OPPOSING CLEAN COAL: Biden says he’s always been for clean coal, but he just told a voter that he is against clean coal and any new coal plants in America and has a record of voting against clean coal and coal in the U.S. Senate.
6. ALERNATIVE ENERGY VOTES: According to FactCheck.org, Biden is exaggerating and overstating John McCain’s record voting for alternative energy when he says he voted against it 23 times.
7. HEALTH INSURANCE: Biden falsely said McCain will raise taxes on people's health insurance coverage -- they get a tax credit to offset any tax hike. Independent fact checkers have confirmed this attack is false
8. OIL TAXES: Biden falsely said Palin supported a windfall profits tax in Alaska -- she reformed the state tax and revenue system, it's not a windfall profits tax.
9. AFGHANISTAN / GEN. MCKIERNAN COMMENTS: Biden said that top military commander in Iraq said the principles of the surge could not be applied to Afghanistan, but the commander of NATO's International Security Assistance Force Gen. David D. McKiernan said that there were principles of the surge strategy, including working with tribes, that could be applied in Afghanistan.
10. REGULATION: Biden falsely said McCain weakened regulation -- he actually called for more regulation on Fannie and Freddie.
11. IRAQ: When Joe Biden lied when he said that John McCain was “dead wrong on Iraq”, because Joe Biden shared the same vote to authorize the war and differed on the surge strategy where they John McCain has been proven right.
12. TAX INCREASES: Biden said Americans earning less than $250,000 wouldn’t see higher taxes, but the Obama-Biden tax plan would raise taxes on individuals making $200,000 or more.
13. BAILOUT: Biden said the economic rescue legislation matches the four principles that Obama laid out, but in reality it doesn’t meet two of the four principles that Obama outlined on Sept. 19, which were that it include an emergency economic stimulus package, and that it be part of “part of a globally coordinated effort with our partners in the G-20.”
14. REAGAN TAX RATES: Biden is wrong in saying that under Obama, Americans won't pay any more in taxes then they did under Reagan.
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Here's 50 of Obama's lies.
http://www.snopes.com/politics/obama/50lies.asp
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"Also, don't forget that as a "war hero", McCain routinely bombed civilians."
THIS is why America hates liberals so much.
Kwicko, when the Vietnam veterans were coming home, were you one of the ones that spit on them?
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About time someone brougth Obama's ties to the terrorist to light. For too long, the MSM has been ducking and dodging from their duty to tell the truth.
That some on this board don't LIKE hearing the truth - tough. Time for you to wake up and deal w/ the real world. For once.
It is not those who use the term "Islamo-Fascism" who are sullying the name of Islam; it is the Islamo-Fascists. - Dennis Prager
" They don't like it when you shoot at 'em. I worked that out myself. "
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Quote:
Originally posted by Kwicko:
Also, don't forget that as a "war hero", McCain routinely bombed civilians.
Mike
This world is a comedy for those who think, and a tragedy for those who feel.
Trolls Against McCain!
Yeah, because valuable bombs and putting planes and pilots in harms way by targeting innocent civilians instead taking out dangerous enemy sites is EXACTLY what the NAVY was all about....
Idiot.
If McCain was 'targeting civilians', how'd his plane get shot down ? The villagers use slingshots and spears to bring down his plane ?
It is not those who use the term "Islamo-Fascism" who are sullying the name of Islam; it is the Islamo-Fascists. - Dennis Prager
" They don't like it when you shoot at 'em. I worked that out myself. "
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So RAPO I noticed that you skedaddled out of the Econ 101 thread when a number of plain facts got in your way.
Just like I said: when a thread doesn't go your way, you bail, only to re-emerge three threads later. Immune from reality much? You betcha! 
---------------------------------
Let's party like its 1929.
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Quote:
Originally posted by SignyM:
So RAPO I noticed that you skedaddled out of the Econ 101 thread when a number of plain facts got in your way.
Just like I said: when a thread doesn't go your way, you bail, only to re-emerge three threads later. Immune from reality much? You betcha!
---------------------------------
Let's party like its 1929.
No, I just got tired of talking in circles w/ you. Every thing you asked for, I've already answered, and often more than once. Some zealots I chose not to engage in any more, for it's a waste of time.
It is not those who use the term "Islamo-Fascism" who are sullying the name of Islam; it is the Islamo-Fascists. - Dennis Prager
" They don't like it when you shoot at 'em. I worked that out myself. "
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Quote:So,
Originally posted by AURaptor:
Every thing you asked for, I've already answered, and often more than once.
(wait for it....)
Shut up, Au!
Chrisisall
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Quote:
Originally posted by Kirkules:
Here's 50 of Obama's lies.
http://www.snopes.com/politics/obama/50lies.asp
HOLY CRAP, Kirk! Your own link refutes 22 outright lies, distortions and pure propaganda from the "50 lies" email smear you're siting! Off hand, at least a dozen of the other 28 are matters of opinion and exageration. I expect I could refute them all, but I'm not gonna bother as the integrity of your smear has been duly undermined already. Did you not think we'd read the whole page, or did you simply neglect to do so yourself?
And to see our own tarnished Golden Eagle jumping on the low-information bandwagon is so utterly typical it would be funny, if it weren't so gravely pathetic. Epic fail. You both lose the Internet and owe the Obama's hand calligraphied apologies.
HKCavalier
Hey, hey, hey, don't be mean. We don't have to be mean, because, remember, no matter where you go, there you are.
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Anything that has the Jackboot symps running around in frenzied, panicked little circles has my approval - even if I otherwise despise it.
-F
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Quote:
AuRaptor wrote:
Yeah, because valuable bombs and putting planes and pilots in harms way by targeting innocent civilians instead taking out dangerous enemy sites is EXACTLY what the NAVY was all about....
Idiot.
Okay, WHERE did I say that McCain "targeted" innocent civilians? I pointed out that he DID bomb civilians. They might not have been the target, but they were certainly hit.
Is it now your contention that not a single bomb dropped by McCain ever killed even one civilian? That's a bold claim, seeing as they were routinely bombing areas of Hanoi, aiming at military targets imbedded within the city.
Also, I notice that Bill Ayers - the alleged "terrrrst" you're linking Obama to - was ACQUITTED of bombing and conspiracy charges.
Not that you'd ever let the facts or the truth get in your way...
Fucking dolt.
And it should be noted that McCain killed more people on the Forrestal than Ayers allegedly bombed. So isn't McCain the REAL terrorist?
Mike
This world is a comedy for those who think, and a tragedy for those who feel.
Trolls Against McCain!
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Quote:
Originally posted by Khyron:Quote:WTF are you talking about!? Basically every coherent sentence she manages to string together is a lie about something. Haven't you been watching her at all!?
Originally posted by piratenews:
Palin's just a whore. She's too dumb to lie.
Rookie salespeople make the best "liars", because they don't KNOW they're lying. They just say what their managers tell them to say, and the managers lie to their salesforce.
Palin is a classic case of bimbo - "beauty queen", "sports teleprompter reader", "small town mayor". Which are sales jobs. Who's REALLY telling her what to say and what to do?
However, the longer salespersons stay on the job, eventually they reach a point of no return, where they figure out where the lies are. Then they must choose to speak the lies (that's where the big money is), or tell the truth and take a cut in pay.
Has Palin crossed that Rubicon? Is she smart enough to know what a Rubicon is?
"Dirty dirty whore!"
-Capt Malcolm Reynolds
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Quote:
Originally posted by Kwicko:Quote:
AuRaptor wrote:
Yeah, because valuable bombs and putting planes and pilots in harms way by targeting innocent civilians instead taking out dangerous enemy sites is EXACTLY what the NAVY was all about....
Idiot.
Okay, WHERE did I say that McCain "targeted" innocent civilians? I pointed out that he DID bomb civilians. They might not have been the target, but they were certainly hit.
Is it now your contention that not a single bomb dropped by McCain ever killed even one civilian? That's a bold claim, seeing as they were routinely bombing areas of Hanoi, aiming at military targets imbedded within the city.
Also, I notice that Bill Ayers - the alleged "terrrrst" you're linking Obama to - was ACQUITTED of bombing and conspiracy charges.
Not that you'd ever let the facts or the truth get in your way...
Fucking dolt.
And it should be noted that McCain killed more people on the Forrestal than Ayers allegedly bombed. So isn't McCain the REAL terrorist?
Mike
So, is bombing German civilians to help end WW2 is ok, but not Vietnamese civilians? The bombs McCain were dropping were far more accurate than the carpet bombing tactic used just 20+ yrs before, but you want to crucify McCain for merely doing his job ? Even today, w/ laser and GPS guided bombs, there's such a thing as collateral damage. Droping bombs is far improved over what it was in 'nam, and 'nam was far improved compared to WW2. You might as well said McCain 'targeted' civilians, w/ the attitude you gave.
Ayers wasn't " aquitted", as you claim but , per the NYT's story ...
Quote:If he was innocent, why was he hiding ? Oh, just like O.J., I'm sure he was innocent too.
Federal riot and bombing conspiracy charges against him were dropped in 1974 because of illegal wiretaps and other prosecutorial misconduct, and he was welcomed back after years in hiding by his large and prominent family.
From the NYT's interview...
" No Regrets for a Love Of Explosives; In a Memoir of Sorts, a War Protester Talks of Life With the Weathermen
By DINITIA SMITH
Published: September 11, 2001
''I don't regret setting bombs,'' Bill Ayers said. ''I feel we didn't do enough. '' Mr. Ayers, who spent the 1970's as a fugitive in the Weather Underground, was sitting in the kitchen of his big turn-of-the-19th-century stone house in the Hyde Park district of Chicago. The long curly locks in his Wanted poster are shorn, though he wears earrings. He still has tattooed on his neck the rainbow-and-lightning Weathermen logo that appeared on letters taking responsibility for bombings. And he still has the ebullient, ingratiating manner, the apparently intense interest in other people, that made him a charismatic figure in the radical student movement.
Now he has written a book, ''Fugitive Days'' (Beacon Press, September).... He writes that he participated in the bombings of New York City Police Headquarters in 1970, of the Capitol building in 1971, the Pentagon in 1972. But Mr. Ayers also seems to want to have it both ways, taking responsibility for daring acts in his youth, then deflecting it.
No, McCain is by no means a 'terrorist', as he was a uniformed solider,dropping bombs on military targets. Terrorist TARGET civilians, and that's exactly what McCain was NOT doing. I'm so fucking sick and tired of Left wing assholes trying to blur the issue of what a terrorist is or isn't, simply so they can vilify America and those who fought for her.
Please, get your facts straight and leave your partisan blinders at the door if you're gonna even try to discuss here.
It is not those who use the term "Islamo-Fascism" who are sullying the name of Islam; it is the Islamo-Fascists. - Dennis Prager
" They don't like it when you shoot at 'em. I worked that out myself. "
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Saint Rap, martyr for the cause of 'the truth'
You telling people to get their facts straight and leave their partisan blinders at the door as a precondition to discussion is ... extremely silly.
You, of all people. 
***************************************************************
Silence is consent.
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Quote:
Originally posted by HKCavalier:Quote:
Originally posted by Kirkules:
Here's 50 of Obama's lies.
http://www.snopes.com/politics/obama/50lies.asp
HOLY CRAP, Kirk! Your own link refutes 22 outright lies, distortions and pure propaganda from the "50 lies" email smear you're siting! Off hand, at least a dozen of the other 28 are matters of opinion and exageration.
You are just helping to confirm my original point. You think that when Obama lies 50 times they're just exaggerations, but when McCain exaggerates they're lies. Your indignation is just as phony as the original post of this thread and only shows you are unable to be objective about the candidates due to your preconceptions. That's fine, but don't expect the rest of us to share your delusions.
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Quote:
Originally posted by rue:
Saint Rap, martyr for the cause of 'the truth'
You telling people to get their facts straight and leave their partisan blinders at the door as a precondition to discussion is ... extremely silly.
You, of all people.
***************************************************************
Silence is consent.
Your petty indignation does not change the facts. Not one bit.
It is not those who use the term "Islamo-Fascism" who are sullying the name of Islam; it is the Islamo-Fascists. - Dennis Prager
" They don't like it when you shoot at 'em. I worked that out myself. "
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Kirkules
You obviously didn't read your own link. It REFUTED the idea that they were lies.
duh.
***************************************************************
Silence is consent.
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Saint Rap, martyr for the cause of 'the truth'
What 'facts' would those be ? Are you talking about your opinions as is they were 'facts ? You seem to do that an awful lot.
***************************************************************
Silence is consent.
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Quote:You pathetic liar.
No, I just got tired of talking in circles w/ you. Every thing you asked for, I've already answered, and often more than once. Some zealots I chose not to engage in any more, for it's a waste of time
I WIN!! I WIN!! I WIN!!!
Just doing your ploy.
heh heh heh
---------------------------------
Let's party like its 1929.
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Quote:
Originally posted by rue:
Kirkules
You obviously didn't read your own link. It REFUTED the idea that they were lies.
duh.
Sounded to me more like they were rationalising Obama's exaggerations. Nobody here can deny a relationship between Obama and Ayers that lasted four years or more. Even the New York Times article got it wrong when they said Obama hasn't communicated with Ayers since 2002. Obama said himself that he talked to Ayers a year and a half ago.
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Quote:
Originally posted by Kirkules:
You are just helping to confirm my original point. You think that when Obama lies 50 times they're just exaggerations, but when McCain exaggerates they're lies. Your indignation is just as phony as the original post of this thread and only shows you are unable to be objective about the candidates due to your preconceptions. That's fine, but don't expect the rest of us to share your delusions.
This reply only shows that your indignation is phony as well - you make reference to Obama's "lies" and McCain's "exaggerations", as if one was okay, but the other isn't. They're both lies. I know you think you're being objective, but your partisanship is showing.
Mike
This world is a comedy for those who think, and a tragedy for those who feel.
Trolls Against McCain!
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Quote:
Your petty indignation does not change the facts. Not one bit.
Nor does yours.
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Quote:
Originally posted by rue:
Saint Rap, martyr for the cause of 'the truth'
What 'facts' would those be ? Are you talking about your opinions as is they were 'facts ? You seem to do that an awful lot.
***************************************************************
Examples abound, but I'll simply start w/ the ones listed right in this thread, not so far above your own post.
Ayers wasn't " aquitted", as you claim but , per the NYT's story ...
Quote:
Federal riot and bombing conspiracy charges against him were dropped in 1974 because of illegal wiretaps and other prosecutorial misconduct, and he was welcomed back after years in hiding by his large and prominent family.
If he was innocent, why was he hiding ? Oh, just like O.J., I'm sure he was innocent too.
From the NYT's interview...
" No Regrets for a Love Of Explosives; In a Memoir of Sorts, a War Protester Talks of Life With the Weathermen
By DINITIA SMITH
Published: September 11, 2001
''I don't regret setting bombs,'' Bill Ayers said. ''I feel we didn't do enough. '' Mr. Ayers, who spent the 1970's as a fugitive in the Weather Underground, was sitting in the kitchen of his big turn-of-the-19th-century stone house in the Hyde Park district of Chicago. The long curly locks in his Wanted poster are shorn, though he wears earrings. He still has tattooed on his neck the rainbow-and-lightning Weathermen logo that appeared on letters taking responsibility for bombings. And he still has the ebullient, ingratiating manner, the apparently intense interest in other people, that made him a charismatic figure in the radical student movement.
Now he has written a book, ''Fugitive Days'' (Beacon Press, September).... He writes that he participated in the bombings of New York City Police Headquarters in 1970, of the Capitol building in 1971, the Pentagon in 1972. But Mr. Ayers also seems to want to have it both ways, taking responsibility for daring acts in his youth, then deflecting it.
No, McCain is by no means a 'terrorist', as he was a uniformed solider, dropping bombs on military targets . Terrorist TARGET civilians, and that's exactly what McCain was NOT doing. I'm so fucking sick and tired of Left wing assholes trying to blur the issue of what a terrorist is or isn't, simply so they can vilify America and those who fought for her.
It is not those who use the term "Islamo-Fascism" who are sullying the name of Islam; it is the Islamo-Fascists. - Dennis Prager
" They don't like it when you shoot at 'em. I worked that out myself. "
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Quote:
Originally posted by Kwicko:Quote:
Your petty indignation does not change the facts. Not one bit.
Nor does yours.
That's the point. I'm offering facts, not blindly ignoring them.
It is not those who use the term "Islamo-Fascism" who are sullying the name of Islam; it is the Islamo-Fascists. - Dennis Prager
" They don't like it when you shoot at 'em. I worked that out myself. "
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Quote:
Originally posted by Kirkules:Quote:
Originally posted by HKCavalier:Quote:
Originally posted by Kirkules:
Here's 50 of Obama's lies.
http://www.snopes.com/politics/obama/50lies.asp
HOLY CRAP, Kirk! Your own link refutes 22 outright lies, distortions and pure propaganda from the "50 lies" email smear you're siting! Off hand, at least a dozen of the other 28 are matters of opinion and exageration.
You are just helping to confirm my original point. You think that when Obama lies 50 times they're just exaggerations, but when McCain exaggerates they're lies. Your indignation is just as phony as the original post of this thread and only shows you are unable to be objective about the candidates due to your preconceptions. That's fine, but don't expect the rest of us to share your delusions.
But Kirk, snopes itself debunks half of these lies--what are you talking about?
HKCavalier
Hey, hey, hey, don't be mean. We don't have to be mean, because, remember, no matter where you go, there you are.
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HK, not taking sides here, because frankly I've not been paying attention and I don't really care, but I THINK what's being pointed out here is that some lies aren't lies at all, just misquotes, exaggerations or one flat out being wrong. A person CAN give false information if they believe it to be true and NOT be lying. It's called 'being wrong'.
Bush has been accused of lying when no such evidence was given, even if he was wrong.
I suppose the same applies here.
Or not.
It is not those who use the term "Islamo-Fascism" who are sullying the name of Islam; it is the Islamo-Fascists. - Dennis Prager
" They don't like it when you shoot at 'em. I worked that out myself. "
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Saint Rap martyr for the cause of 'the truth': I thought you were talking about THESE examples of FACT and OBJECTIVITY:
"About time someone brougth Obama's ties to the terrorist to light. For too long, the MSM has been ducking and dodging from their duty to tell the truth."
"Every thing you asked for, I've already answered, and often more than once."
Please, get your facts straight and leave your partisan blinders at the door if you're gonna even try to discuss here.
***************************************************************
Silence is consent.
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Quote:
Originally posted by rue:
Saint Rap
"About time someone brougth Obama's ties to the terrorist to light. For too long, the MSM has been ducking and dodging from their duty to tell the truth."
"Every thing you asked for, I've already answered, and often more than once."
Please, get your facts
***************************************************************
Silence is consent.
Another pointless, irrelevant post by rue.
It is not those who use the term "Islamo-Fascism" who are sullying the name of Islam; it is the Islamo-Fascists. - Dennis Prager
" They don't like it when you shoot at 'em. I worked that out myself. "
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Martyrdom beginning to chafe a little ?
***************************************************************
Silence is consent.
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From another thread:
AURaptor, I have a values question for you: Could you please explain the disturbing evidence presented by Sydney Schanberg that McCain deliberately covered up the story of abandoned MIAs in Vietnam?
http://www.thenation.com/doc/20081006/schanberg
Longer version: http://www.nationinstitute.org/p/schanberg09182008pt1
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Trolls against McCain, you betcha!
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S'wenyways
How many people here have heard the rumor Palin was wearing a wire ? What's your opinion ?
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Please note the distinction in my post between 'fact', 'rumor' and 'opinion'.
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khyron...not gonna entertain baseless muck racking rumors from another thread.
I'm just not.
It is not those who use the term "Islamo-Fascism" who are sullying the name of Islam; it is the Islamo-Fascists. - Dennis Prager
" They don't like it when you shoot at 'em. I worked that out myself. "
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Quote:
Originally posted by rue:
S'wenyways
How many people here have heard the rumor Palin was wearing a wire ? What's your opinion ?
***************************************************************
Please note the distinction in my post between 'fact', 'rumor' and 'opinion'.
Very first I've heard of it, if you're asking me. you weren't specific in who you were askin'.
It is not those who use the term "Islamo-Fascism" who are sullying the name of Islam; it is the Islamo-Fascists. - Dennis Prager
" They don't like it when you shoot at 'em. I worked that out myself. "
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Saint Rap, martyr for the cause of 'the truth'
Directs to your moral credibility, son.
And some people may just be curious what you think.
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1) It's not baseless, I've provided the links.
2) Then go to the other thread and respond to the articles there.
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Trolls against McCain, you betcha!
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Quote:
Originally posted by Khyron:
1) It's not baseless, I've provided the links.
2) Then go to the other thread and respond to the articles there.
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Trolls against McCain, you betcha!
Wooo 'links' , precious says ? LINKS ? Then all PirateNews ever post on here IS true then ?
I don't have to say anything more than that.
It is not those who use the term "Islamo-Fascism" who are sullying the name of Islam; it is the Islamo-Fascists. - Dennis Prager
" They don't like it when you shoot at 'em. I worked that out myself. "
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OK Saint Rap, martyr for the cause of 'the truth'
I think you can give up your self-crowned saintly halo. Now you can offically join the ranks of the eight circle of hell - the hypocrites.
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Ah, so you wanted me to post the article here so that you wouldn't have to go to all the work of clicking on the link? Okay then.
Quote:
McCain and the POW Cover-up
By Sydney H. Schanberg, September 17, 2008
This article appeared in the October 6, 2008 edition of The Nation.
John McCain, who has risen to political prominence on his image as a Vietnam POW war hero, has, inexplicably, worked very hard to hide from the public stunning information about American prisoners in Vietnam who, unlike him, didn't return home. Throughout his Senate career, McCain has quietly sponsored and pushed into federal law a set of prohibitions that keep the most revealing information about these men buried as classified documents. Thus the war hero people would logically imagine to be a determined crusader for the interests of POWs and their families became instead the strange champion of hiding the evidence and closing the books.
Almost as striking is the manner in which the mainstream press has shied from reporting the POW story and McCain's role in it, even as McCain has made his military service and POW history the focus of his presidential campaign. Reporters who had covered the Vietnam War have also turned their heads and walked in other directions. McCain doesn't talk about the missing men, and the press never asks him about them.
The sum of the secrets McCain has sought to hide is not small. There exists a telling mass of official documents, radio intercepts, witness depositions, satellite photos of rescue symbols that pilots were trained to use, electronic messages from the ground containing the individual code numbers given to airmen, a rescue mission by a Special Forces unit that was aborted twice by Washington and even sworn testimony by two defense secretaries that "men were left behind." This imposing body of evidence suggests that a large number--probably hundreds--of the US prisoners held in Vietnam were not returned when the peace treaty was signed in January 1973 and Hanoi released 591 men, among them Navy combat pilot John S. McCain.
The Pentagon had been withholding significant information from POW families for years. What's more, the Pentagon's POW/MIA operation had been publicly shamed by internal whistleblowers and POW families for holding back documents as part of a policy of "debunking" POW intelligence even when the information was obviously credible. The pressure from the families and Vietnam veterans finally produced the creation, in late 1991, of a Senate "Select Committee on POW/MIA Affairs." The chair was John Kerry, but McCain, as a POW, was its most pivotal member. In the end, the committee became part of the debunking machine.
Included in the evidence that McCain and his government allies suppressed or tried to discredit is a transcript of a senior North Vietnamese general's briefing of the Hanoi Politburo, discovered in Soviet archives by an American scholar in the 1990s. The briefing took place only four months before the 1973 peace accords. The general, Tran Van Quang, told the Politburo members that Hanoi was holding 1,205 American prisoners but would keep many of them at war's end as leverage to ensure getting reparations from Washington.
Throughout the Paris negotiations, the North Vietnamese tied the prisoner issue tightly to the issue of reparations. Finally, in a February 1, 1973, formal letter to Hanoi's premier, Pham Van Dong, Nixon pledged $3.25 billion in "postwar reconstruction" aid. The North Vietnamese, though, remained skeptical about the reparations promise being honored (it never was). Hanoi thus held back prisoners--just as it had done when the French were defeated at Dien Bien Phu in 1954 and withdrew their forces from Vietnam. France later paid ransoms for prisoners and brought them home.
Two defense secretaries who served during the Vietnam War testified to the Senate POW committee in September 1992 that prisoners were not returned. James Schlesinger and Melvin Laird, secretaries of defense under Nixon, said in a public session and under oath that they based thNOTIFY: N | REPLY | REPLY WITH QUOTE | PERMALINK | TOP | HOME
Quote:
Originally posted by Kwicko:Quote:
Originally posted by Kirkules:
You are just helping to confirm my original point. You think that when Obama lies 50 times they're just exaggerations, but when McCain exaggerates they're lies. Your indignation is just as phony as the original post of this thread and only shows you are unable to be objective about the candidates due to your preconceptions. That's fine, but don't expect the rest of us to share your delusions.
This reply only shows that your indignation is phony as well - you make reference to Obama's "lies" and McCain's "exaggerations", as if one was okay, but the other isn't. They're both lies. I know you think you're being objective, but your partisanship is showing.
Mike
I think you've come as close as any here to understanding what I was trying to say. The idea that someone would condemn McCain/Palin for an exaggeration of the true story about the Obama/Ayres connection, but think all of Obama's exaggerations are just fine, just struck me as funny. I try to keep my biases in the open for all to see, I just wish others would stop playing the objective observer and admit that they convieniantly excuse the same actions they condemn when it's on the other side.
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"... but think all of Obama's exaggerations are just fine ..."
A claim you've made a few times now with not a whole lot to back it up. Nothing, in fact.
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Ah, Kirkules, I forgot about you. Could you please provide an independent, non-partisan list of Biden's debate "lies"? The one you provided were released by the McCain campaign and is so full of spin that it's hard to make out what Biden's lies are and what the McCain campaign's lies are.
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Trolls against McCain, you betcha!
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Quote:
Originally posted by piratenews:Quote:
Originally posted by Khyron:Quote:WTF are you talking about!? Basically every coherent sentence she manages to string together is a lie about something. Haven't you been watching her at all!?
Originally posted by piratenews:
Palin's just a whore. She's too dumb to lie.
Rookie salespeople make the best "liars", because they don't KNOW they're lying. They just say what their managers tell them to say, and the managers lie to their salesforce.
Palin is a classic case of bimbo - "beauty queen", "sports teleprompter reader", "small town mayor". Which are sales jobs. Who's REALLY telling her what to say and what to do?
However, the longer salespersons stay on the job, eventually they reach a point of no return, where they figure out where the lies are. Then they must choose to speak the lies (that's where the big money is), or tell the truth and take a cut in pay.
Has Palin crossed that Rubicon? Is she smart enough to know what a Rubicon is?
"Dirty dirty whore!"
-Capt Malcolm Reynolds
OMG PN, that is like the smartest post you have ever made!
And btw you other idiots - Bill Ayers was involved in the "terrorist" activites 40 freakin years ago, at a time when the Vietnam War was going on and sentiments were strong AGAISNT it. At the time Obama would have been 8 fucking years old. So find something else to bitch about because this is just stupid.
I am on The List. We are The Forsaken and we aim to burn!
"We don't fear the reaper"
FORSAKEN original
Trolls Against McCain
“I like your Christ, I do not like your Christians. Your Christians are so unlike your Christ.” Mahatma Gandhi
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Quote:
Originally posted by Khyron:
Ah, so you wanted me to post the article here so that you wouldn't have to go to all the work of clicking on the link? Okay then.
Trolls against McCain, you betcha!
No, you presented a "link" as if that's some sort of accepted bit o' evidence. It's nothing more than a fictionalized story written by a partisan and published in a far left publication.
No thanks.
It is not those who use the term "Islamo-Fascism" who are sullying the name of Islam; it is the Islamo-Fascists. - Dennis Prager
" They don't like it when you shoot at 'em. I worked that out myself. "
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Quote:
And btw you other idiots - Bill Ayers was involved in the "terrorist" activites 40 freakin years ago, at a time when the Vietnam War was going on and sentiments were strong AGAISNT it. At the time Obama would have been 8 fucking years old. So find something else to bitch about because this is just stupid.
It doesn't matter, FMF, how long ago it happened. Ayers was involved in several bombings, and has never repented for his deeds. Under no circumstances in a FREE society is it acceptable for a group use violence as a form of protest. No matter HOW strongly their views. This isn't stupid, it's stupid people who think that it is.
It is not those who use the term "Islamo-Fascism" who are sullying the name of Islam; it is the Islamo-Fascists. - Dennis Prager
" They don't like it when you shoot at 'em. I worked that out myself. "
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Quote:
Originally posted by AURaptor:Quote:
And btw you other idiots - Bill Ayers was involved in the "terrorist" activites 40 freakin years ago, at a time when the Vietnam War was going on and sentiments were strong AGAISNT it. At the time Obama would have been 8 fucking years old. So find something else to bitch about because this is just stupid.
It doesn't matter, FMF, how long ago it happened. Ayers was involved in several bombings, and has never repented for his deeds. Under no circumstances in a FREE society is it acceptable for a group use violence as a form of protest. No matter HOW strongly their views. This isn't stupid, it's stupid people who think that it is.
It is not those who use the term "Islamo-Fascism" who are sullying the name of Islam; it is the Islamo-Fascists. - Dennis Prager
" They don't like it when you shoot at 'em. I worked that out myself. "
No, what is stupid is to hold it agaisnt someone who was a child at the time.
I am on The List. We are The Forsaken and we aim to burn!
"We don't fear the reaper"
FORSAKEN original
Trolls Against McCain
“I like your Christ, I do not like your Christians. Your Christians are so unlike your Christ.” Mahatma Gandhi
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FMF
Are you trying to convince Saint Rap that his political religion is wrong ??? It's his identity, dontcha' know.
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Quote:
Originally posted by FutureMrsFIllion:Quote:
Originally posted by AURaptor:Quote:
And btw you other idiots - Bill Ayers was involved in the "terrorist" activites 40 freakin years ago, at a time when the Vietnam War was going on and sentiments were strong AGAISNT it. At the time Obama would have been 8 fucking years old. So find something else to bitch about because this is just stupid.
It doesn't matter, FMF, how long ago it happened. Ayers was involved in several bombings, and has never repented for his deeds. Under no circumstances in a FREE society is it acceptable for a group use violence as a form of protest. No matter HOW strongly their views. This isn't stupid, it's stupid people who think that it is.
It is not those who use the term "Islamo-Fascism" who are sullying the name of Islam; it is the Islamo-Fascists. - Dennis Prager
" They don't like it when you shoot at 'em. I worked that out myself. "
No, what is stupid is to hold it agaisnt someone who was a child at the time.
So, if David Duke ( or some other white supremacist political figure ) was a child , or not even born during Wordl War 2, you'd think it ok if he idolized Adolph Hilter ? Because that's pretty much what you're saying.
2 things you're overlooking, FMF, is that Ayers never apologized for what he did. Also, Obama , knowing who/ what Ayers did, still is fine w/ associating his campaign and his image with this thug.
It is not those who use the term "Islamo-Fascism" who are sullying the name of Islam; it is the Islamo-Fascists. - Dennis Prager
" They don't like it when you shoot at 'em. I worked that out myself. "
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Quote:
Originally posted by Khyron:
Ah, Kirkules, I forgot about you. Could you please provide an independent, non-partisan list of Biden's debate "lies"? The one you provided were released by the McCain campaign and is so full of spin that it's hard to make out what Biden's lies are and what the McCain campaign's lies are.
You're finally getting the idea (assuming you're joking). For you the source of the information determines whether it's factual or not. I always thought facts are facts, independent of the source.
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Ahh, but Saint Rap, martyr for 'truth' and practitioner of hypocrisy
Obama ISN'T associating his campaign with Ayers OR using his image. That's just another Palin lie dontch' know.
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Quote:
Originally posted by rue:
Ahh, but Saint Rap, martyr for 'truth' and practitioner of hypocrisy
Obama ISN'T associating his campaign with Ayers OR using his image. That's just another Palin lie dontch' know.
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Silence is consent.
No, it's a fact.
Well, I think that is a fair general statement, but I also believe that Senator Obama served on a board with Mr. Ayers for a period of time, the Woods Foundation, which was a paid directorship position. And if I'm not mistaken, that relationship with Mr. Ayers on this board continued after 9/11 and after his reported comments, which were deeply hurtful to people in New York, and I would hope to every American, because they were published on 9/11 and he said that he was just sorry they hadn't done more. And what they did was set bombs and in some instances people died. So it is -- you know, I think it is, again, an issue that people will be asking about. And I have no doubt -- I know Senator Obama's a good man and I respect him greatly but I think that this is an issue that certainly the Republicans will be raising.
- Hillary Clinton
It is not those who use the term "Islamo-Fascism" who are sullying the name of Islam; it is the Islamo-Fascists. - Dennis Prager
" They don't like it when you shoot at 'em. I worked that out myself. "
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Ahh, but Saint Rap, martyr for 'truth' and practitioner of hypocrisy - Glad you agree -- you ARE a self-appointed martyr and hyprocrite.
As for Palin's lies - which you regurgitate here on cue - you have nothing but your assertions. And your assertions count for less than zero.
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'Cause we know what you are, you betcha'!
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Quote:
Originally posted by rue:
Ahh, but Saint Rap, martyr for 'truth' and practitioner of hypocrisy - Glad you agree
As for Palin's lies - which you here regurgitate on cue - you have nothing but your assertions. And your
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'Cause we know what you are, you betcha'!
You don't comprehend very well when you read, do you ?
There are no Palin lies, just your lies. I didn't " regurgitate " one god damn thing ...I quoted HILLARY CLINTON, you dumb ass, not Sarah Palin.
The only zeros here are how many assertions I made and YOUR IQ score.
It is not those who use the term "Islamo-Fascism" who are sullying the name of Islam; it is the Islamo-Fascists. - Dennis Prager
" They don't like it when you shoot at 'em. I worked that out myself. "
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This is pathetic. The "link" between these two men is that they served on a board together and shared occasional phone calls??
You've got to be sh*ttin' me!
Quote:I happen to know for a fact that Rue's IQ score is in three digits. Yours? It's be a single digit except zero doesn't count.
The only zeros here are how many assertions I made and YOUR IQ score.
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Let's party like its 1929.
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Quote:
Originally posted by SignyM:
This is pathetic. The "link" between these two men is that they served on a board together and shared occasional phone calls??
You've got to be sh*ttin' me!
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Let's party like its 1929.
You'd wish that's all it were.
Funny that you'd try to spin it like that though.
Funny and sad.
Quote:
The Obama campaign has struggled to downplay that association. Last April, Sen. Obama dismissed Mr. Ayers as just "a guy who lives in my neighborhood," and "not somebody who I exchange ideas with on a regular basis." Yet documents in the CAC archives make clear that Mr. Ayers and Mr. Obama were partners in the CAC. Those archives are housed in the Richard J. Daley Library at the University of Illinois at Chicago and I've recently spent days looking through them.
The Chicago Annenberg Challenge was created ostensibly to improve Chicago's public schools. The funding came from a national education initiative by Ambassador Walter Annenberg. In early 1995, Mr. Obama was appointed the first chairman of the board, which handled fiscal matters. Mr. Ayers co-chaired the foundation's other key body, the "Collaborative," which shaped education policy.
The CAC's basic functioning has long been known, because its annual reports, evaluations and some board minutes were public. But the Daley archive contains additional board minutes, the Collaborative minutes, and documentation on the groups that CAC funded and rejected. The Daley archives show that Mr. Obama and Mr. Ayers worked as a team to advance the CAC agenda.
It is not those who use the term "Islamo-Fascism" who are sullying the name of Islam; it is the Islamo-Fascists. - Dennis Prager
" They don't like it when you shoot at 'em. I worked that out myself. "
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So far, I haven't seen any evidence that there is anything more to it. Even the article that Palin cites says the men "were not close".
You know, I serve on a LOT of committees, in work groups etc. Some ppl that I work closely with... I can't stand, politically. If I were to be linked with every person I've ever worked with, or for.... that's just senseless. And smacks of desperation, if you want to know the truth.
Quote:Well, since they WERE working for the CAC, I would hope so!!!, And what was this horrific agenda??? To "improve Chicago's public schools". Big friggin' deal!
The Daley archives show that Mr. Obama and Mr. Ayers worked as a team to advance the CAC agenda.
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Let's party like its 1929.
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If they were working as a team, they thus knew each other far more than " casually " as Obama claims / LIES .
Now shut the fuck up over this, and face reality.
At the very least, read the WHOLE damn article. http://online.wsj.com/article/SB122212856075765367.html
It is not those who use the term "Islamo-Fascism" who are sullying the name of Islam; it is the Islamo-Fascists. - Dennis Prager
" They don't like it when you shoot at 'em. I worked that out myself. "
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Look, I can work as a "team" with someone and still only know them casually outside of the work sphere. In fact I prefer it that way.
You're such a boob.
Oh, BTW, here is the website of that "far left" organization ACORN.
www.acorn.org
Check it out, if you're not too afraid of being exposed to something different.
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Let's party like its 1929.
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You didn't read the article, or do anything to find out more, that is clear.
Remain ignorant, and fully confident in your lack of knowledge. I'm sure it makes for sound sleep at night.
It is not those who use the term "Islamo-Fascism" who are sullying the name of Islam; it is the Islamo-Fascists. - Dennis Prager
" They don't like it when you shoot at 'em. I worked that out myself. "
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Since you didn't exactly link the article, how was I supposed to access it, ya boob?
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Let's party like its 1929.
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Saint Rap, self-appointed martyr for the 'truth', and hypocrisy practitioner
But you wrote Obama, "... knowing who/ what Ayers did, still is fine w/ associating his campaign and his image with this thug."
You DID write that, right ? Didn'tcha '? Or did someone get hold of your computer ?
You have failed to prove this. Anywhere. You have failed to show they did anything but work in the same organization. Anywhere. And your quotes simply don't address your claims. Anywhere. Your 'quotes' and 'facts' are totally irrelevant.
Well, just like your posts, I have to say.
And always looking back. There you go again.
City on a beacon ... there we go again .. exceptionalismism special people ... herd of mavericks
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Discredited Republican voter-suppression guru Ken Blackwell is attacking Barack Obama with naked lies about his supposed connection to ACORN.
• Fact: Barack was never an ACORN community organizer.
• Fact: Barack was never an ACORN trainer and never worked for ACORN in any other capacity.
• Fact: ACORN was not part of Project Vote, the successful voter registration drive Barack ran in 1992.
In his capacity as an attorney, Barack represented ACORN in a successful lawsuit alongside the U.S. Department of Justice against the state of Illinois to force state compliance with a federal voting access law.
I KNOW ! The DOJ was ALSO an organizer for ACORN ! NOW I SEE THE LIGHT !
(not)
Yeah, Saint Rap, self-appointed martyr for the 'truth', and hypocrisy practitioner IS a boob.
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Quote:No no no!!! That can't be true! Because you ALSO said
still is fine w/ associating his campaign and his image
Quote:So, which is it? Is Obama associating his campaign and his image with this guy? Or he is trying to hide whatever association they had?
they thus knew each other far more than " casually " as Obama claims
You're so confusing, Rapo! It's like you had this big schizoid split that prevents you from... oh, sorry about that. Didn't mean to poke fun at your disabilities.
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Let's party like its 1929.
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Just out of curiosity, I got the names of the other members of the board of directors (along with Obama's). This is from the first annual report:
Susan Crown, VP
Henry Crown & Co.
Patricia Albjerg Graham, Pres.
The Spencer Foundation
Stanley O. Ikenberry, Pres. Emeritus
University of Illinois at Urbana-Champaign
Handy Lindsey, Jr., Executive Director
Field Foundation of Illinois, Inc. (established in 1940)
Barack Obama
Davis, Miner, Batnhill & Galland
Ray Romer
Arnold R. Weber, Pres.
The Civic Committee
Wanda White, Executive Director
Community Workshop on Economic Development
I noticed Obama didn't have a title so it looks like he served as a legal voice. A more radical group of people you'd never find.
The Collaborative which was a separate group, consisted of 16 people including a Chicago school principal, the assistant to the president of the Chicago Public Schools Board of Education, a member of the State Board of Education, the President of Chicago State University, and a program officer for the MacArthur Foundation, among others.
It took me FAR longer to type this than to find it. It doesn't take much to find the facts. But apparently it's far too complicated for Saint Rap, self-appointed martyr for the 'truth', and hypocrisy practitioner.
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What's so hard acknowledging that Ayers is a multiple bomber, admits to it, doesn't repent from it, and , were it not for bungled prosecution, he'd have served hard time in a Federal pen. You listing other members of a board serves ZERO purpose in explaining away what Ayers did and why Obama is so connected to him.
A really pathetic attempt on your part, to be honest. Why not just sit back, take a deep breath, and come to grips that Obama associates himself w/ really bad people.
Rezko
Ayers
Rev. Wright....all just for starters.
It is not those who use the term "Islamo-Fascism" who are sullying the name of Islam; it is the Islamo-Fascists. - Dennis Prager
" They don't like it when you shoot at 'em. I worked that out myself. "
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Quote:
Originally posted by SignyM:
Since you didn't exactly link the article, how was I supposed to access it, ya boob?
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Let's party like its 1929.
Yeah, I did, and I'll do it again.
JUST like it's posted above... http://online.wsj.com/article/SB122212856075765367.html
Moron.
It is not those who use the term "Islamo-Fascism" who are sullying the name of Islam; it is the Islamo-Fascists. - Dennis Prager
" They don't like it when you shoot at 'em. I worked that out myself. "
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Saint Rap, martyr for 'truth' and practitioner of hypocrisy
"... explaining away what Ayers did and why Obama is so connected to him ..."
SOooo connected to him. Just like everyone else on the board --- right ? And everyone in the Chicago Schools Research Consortium. And everyone in The Collaborative who actually worked WITH Ayers - right in the same branch ! Why, they were ALL just tools of a mad ex-bomber ! Every single one of them !
You stupid turd.
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Did you notice that you didn't link the article until AFTER you said I wasn't reading it on purpose?
And you call ME a turd?
So, back to the point in question: What are you more pissed off about? That Obama links his campaign and image to Ayers? That he DOESN'T? That Obama worked with him and actually (GASP!!!) spoke on the phone with him five years ago? That they funded the "far left" group ACORN? (BTW, did you check out their website? I DID link it, yanno!)
Or, are you just so filled with bile that you can't think straight?
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Let's party like its 1929.
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Uhhm, Saint Rap, martyr for 'truth' and practitioner of hypocrisy has already shown he can't think straight. You know, massive stockpiles of WMDS near "Tikrit and Baghdad and east, west, south and north somewhat", roaring ON FIRE ! economy and other notable delusions.
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So, Saint Rap, self-anointed martyr for 'truth' and practitioner of hypocrisy
You made a lot of claims about Obama that simply aren't true.
You said he was an ACORN organizer - he never was.
You said he was a trainer for ACORN - he never was.
You said ACORN worked with his organization Project Vote - it never did.
You claim that because he represented ACORN in a lawsuit alongside the US DOJ for equal voting rights he and ACORN brought down the US economy - a stupid claim on it face (unless of course it was Barney Frank who did it with an offhand comment, a much more credible claim).
You said that because he (and many other highly respected people and government officials) worked in the same organization as Ayers that the two shared and share radical leftist goals - presumably along with everyone else there who associated with Ayers in exactly the same way.
And to support your jackass claims you quote an irrellevant Hillary Clinton statement and an article by the WSJ that's so full of factual errors it would take pages of type just to document them all.
You do realize just how BIG a boob you are --- Right ? All in your effort to defend McCain and Palin and all THEIR lies.
I'd ask you if your shocked at what you are (in case you didn't know it you're a cheap repubican whore) but it would be a pointless question - you're too stupid to even get how degraded you are.
Either way, you're just going to have to face it
John McCain was one of the Keating Five and he associates with really bad people.
Phil Gramm
John Hagee
Karl Rove
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Silence is consent.
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Quote:
Under no circumstances in a FREE society is it acceptable for a group use violence as a form of protest. No matter HOW strongly their views.
I call bullshit.
Not only is it acceptable, in some cases it's downright fuckin patriotic.
When in the Course of human events it becomes necessary for one people to dissolve the political bands which have connected them with another and to assume among the powers of the earth, the separate and equal station to which the Laws of Nature and of Nature's God entitle them, a decent respect to the opinions of mankind requires that they should declare the causes which impel them to the separation.
We hold these truths to be self-evident, that all men are created equal, that they are endowed by their Creator with certain unalienable Rights, that among these are Life, Liberty and the pursuit of Happiness. — That to secure these rights, Governments are instituted among Men, deriving their just powers from the consent of the governed*, — That whenever any Form of Government becomes destructive of these ends, it is the Right of the People to alter or to abolish it, and to institute new Government, laying its foundation on such principles and organizing its powers in such form, as to them shall seem most likely to effect their Safety and Happiness. Prudence, indeed, will dictate that Governments long established should not be changed for light and transient causes; and accordingly all experience hath shewn that mankind are more disposed to suffer, while evils are sufferable than to right themselves by abolishing the forms to which they are accustomed. But when a long train of abuses and usurpations, pursuing invariably the same Object evinces a design to reduce them under absolute Despotism, it is their right, it is their duty, to throw off such Government, and to provide new Guards for their future security.
*And we've come a long way from "Consent of the Governed" when universally hated policies are rammed down the throat of the people with the threat of downright force, when it's rule of the gun in truth, enforced by a federalised, militarised standing army(police) at the beck and call of the powers that be.
And in case nobody recognizes it, which, given the state of public education(indoctrination) in the US, I'd make that at least a 50/50 bet, that happens to be the preamble to the Declaration of Independance, a document with a laundry list of misdeeds laid at the foot of King George that is chillingly similar to the bullshit we face from our own administration today.
http://www.ushistory.org/declaration/document/index.htm
Hell, Jefferson outright supported the practice.
"God forbid we should ever be twenty years without such a rebellion. The people cannot be all, and always, well informed. The part which is wrong will be discontented, in proportion to the importance of the facts they misconceive. If they remain quiet under such misconceptions, it is lethargy, the forerunner of death to the public liberty. ... And what country can preserve its liberties, if it's rulers are not warned from time to time, that this people preserve the spirit of resistance? Let them take arms. The remedy is to set them right as to the facts, pardon and pacify them. What signify a few lives lost in a century or two? The tree of liberty must be refreshed from time to time, with the blood of patriots and tyrants. It is its natural manure."
"I hold it, that a little rebellion, now and then, is a good thing, and as necessary in the political world as storms in the physical. Unsuccessful rebellions, indeed, generally establish the encroachments on the rights of the people, with have produced them. An observation of this truth should render honest republican governors so mild in their punishment of rebellions, as not to discourage them too much. It is a medicine necessary for the sound health of government."
Pat Henry was in full agreement with that sentiment as well.
"Guard with jealous attention the public liberty. Suspect ev
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Quote:Well, the thing with links is, you have to click them to get where the evidence is. I grant you, the links themselves aren't proof, but I did expect that you figured out the 'clicking'-concept by now. My bad, no worries.
Originally posted by AURaptor:
No, you presented a "link" as if that's some sort of accepted bit o' evidence. It's nothing more than a fictionalized story written by a partisan and published in a far left publication.
No thanks.
As you can see, I posted the shorter version of the article above. There's a whole lot of facts in there, presented by a Pulitzer-winning investigative journalist. If you click on the link that follows the words "longer version:" in my other post above (it's easy, you point to it with your mouse and press the left mouse button), you get led to a version of the article that has tons of documentation. After you've looked at it, let me know which documents were the ones that were "fictionalized".
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Trolls against McCain, you betcha!
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Quote:I got your point ages ago, you didn't get mine, though. Instead of getting a list of Biden's lies, you got a list of unreferenced claims that was released from the McCain campaign! And you consider this list to be a list of unspun, objective facts! And apparently anybody who questions the veracity of these "facts" is a partisan who's obsessed with dissing the source rather than dealing with the facts themselves!
Originally posted by Kirkules:Quote:You're finally getting the idea (assuming you're joking). For you the source of the information determines whether it's factual or not. I always thought facts are facts, independent of the source.
Originally posted by Khyron:
Ah, Kirkules, I forgot about you. Could you please provide an independent, non-partisan list of Biden's debate "lies"? The one you provided were released by the McCain campaign and is so full of spin that it's hard to make out what Biden's lies are and what the McCain campaign's lies are.
Is any of this hypocrisy that you exhibit sinking in yet?
If you want to show that Biden lied, either get an independent, non-partisan list with references, or provide references for the list you've presented before.
In fact, I'm such a nice guy, I've picked out the most glaring omissions of evidence for you:
Quote:I think it should be noted that Biden was referring to an amendment that didn't address taxes at that income level.
1. TAX VOTE: Biden said McCain voted “the exact same way” as Obama to increase taxes on Americans earning just $42,000, but McCain DID NOT VOTE THAT WAY.
Quote:Opposing something but then conceding that it's necessary when the circumstances have changed isn't lying. Except when you're a Democrat, it seems ...
3. OFFSHORE OIL DRILLING: Biden said, “Drill we must.” But Biden has opposed offshore drilling and even compared offshore drilling to “raping” the Outer Continental Shelf.”
Quote:If McCain said this, the right would probably be vehemently arguing that this is a "half-truth" at worst. But double-standards aside, why does John McCain hate our troops? He voted against them because it contained a timeline? Wtf?
4. TROOP FUNDING: Joe Biden lied when he indicated that John McCain and Barack Obama voted the same way against funding the troops in the field. John McCain opposed a bill that included a timeline, that the President of the United States had already said he would veto regardless of it’s passage.
Quote:'Whatever Biden meant or didn’t mean to say on the rope line, he has supported clean coal in the past.' ( http://www.factcheck.org/elections-2008/factchecking_biden-palin_debat
5. OPPOSING CLEAN COAL: Biden says he’s always been for clean coal, but he just told a voter that he is against clean coal and any new coal plants in America and has a record of voting against clean coal and coal in the U.S. Senate.
e.html)
Quote:Needs evidence (I won't google for you).
7. HEALTH INSURANCE: Biden falsely said McCain will raise taxes on people's health insurance coverage -- they get a tax credit to offset any tax hike. Independent fact checkers have confirmed this attack is false.
Quote:Needs verification.
8. OIL TAXES: Biden falsely said Palin supported a windfall profits tax in Alaska -- she reformed the state tax and revenue system, it's not a windfall profits tax.
Quote:Working with tribes ... does that mean the US military recruiting tribes to oppose insurgents? Because here's what the dear commander actually said about that: 'Another facet of the Iraq strategy that McKiernan doubts can be duplicated in Afghanis
9. AFGHANISTAN / GEN. MCKIERNAN COMMENTS: Biden said that top military commander in Iraq said the principles of the surge could not be applied to Afghanistan, but the commander of NATO's International Security Assistance Force Gen. David D. McKiernan said that there were principles of the surge strategy, including working with tribes, that could be applied in Afghanistan.
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Puppet oh puppet, where for art thou?
Pay no attention to the man behind the curtain!
There goes the neighborhood.
Shiny! Let's be bad guys!
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Quote:
Originally posted by rue:
Saint Rap, martyr for 'truth' and practitioner of hypocrisy
"... explaining away what Ayers did and why Obama is so connected to him ..."
SOooo connected to him. Just like everyone else on the board --- right ? And everyone in the Chicago Schools Research Consortium. And everyone in The Collaborative who actually worked WITH Ayers - right in the same branch ! Why, they were ALL just tools of a mad ex-bomber ! Every single one of them !
You stupid turd.
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Silence is consent.
You're nothing but a blind partrisan who's in denial and basically , you're being a prick too.
It is not those who use the term "Islamo-Fascism" who are sullying the name of Islam; it is the Islamo-Fascists. - Dennis Prager
" They don't like it when you shoot at 'em. I worked that out myself. "
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What rebellion are we talking about ? Me thinks you confuse actual rebellion w/ thuggery and terrorism.
So, I'm guessing you're a big fan of Timmothy McVeigh ?
Is THIS your view of an acceptable " little " rebellion? 
the blood of patriots and tyrants, huh?
This is NOT what Jefferson had in mind, not by a long shot.
It is not those who use the term "Islamo-Fascism" who are sullying the name of Islam; it is the Islamo-Fascists. - Dennis Prager
" They don't like it when you shoot at 'em. I worked that out myself. "
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I don't agree with his actions (40 years ago!!), but how many people did Ayers kill, AURaptor?
And how is Ayers relevant to Obama?
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Trolls against McCain, you betcha!
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Quote:And you, of course, are the only one who's been factually correct and intellectually rigorous, and you're just so dang NICE about it too, dontcha know?
You're nothing but a blind partrisan who's in denial and basically , you're being a prick too.
BTW, I'm still waiting for answers to my questions... from this thread AND the other.
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Let's party like its 1929.
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Quote:He would undoubtedly shoot you as an enemy of the Constitution, and this Nation, AU.
Originally posted by AURaptor:
This is NOT what Jefferson had in mind, not by a long shot.
Chrisisall
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John McCain was a member of the Vietcong during the Vietnam War, he spent years with them, and was so loyal he refused to return to the united states when he had the chance.
Sarah Palin hates the US so much she's an active member of a separatist group.
More insane ramblings by the people who brought you beeeer milkshakes!
No one can see their reflection in running water. It is only in still water that we can see.
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Quote:To vote for either of these cowards would be the act of a traitor.
Originally posted by citizen:
John McCain was a member of the Vietcong during the Vietnam War, he spent years with them, and was so loyal he refused to return to the united states when he had the chance.
Sarah Palin hates the US so much she's an active member of a separatist group.
Nowwe'recookin'isall
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How interesting to hold up McVeigh as so horrible.
So, tell me, when is Janet Reno gonna face the needle for the dead kids at Waco, huh ?
Why is it A-Ok when forces of the Government murder childen, and so horrible when someone did it in retaliation ?
Shouldn't it be a horror no matter WHO commits it ?
Why should agents of the Gov get a free pass, especially in light of the fact that they knew damn well what the likely result of lobbing between 400 and 700 rounds of a CS munition (M-651) that was removed from military inventories not only for it's tendancy to start fires, but also in that particular formulation, had a tendancy to produce hydrogen cyanide as a reaction byproduct, especially if introduced to a pre-existing fire.
And that doesn't take into account that even if neither of those issues was present, they were certainly and deliberately trying to achieve a concentration that would effectively displace enough oxygen to suffocate their victims besides.
And care to guess where they were AIMING the goddamn things, by their own reports ?
That ain't a justification of McVeighs actions, although whoever planted the bombs INSIDE the Federal Building is actually responsible, and that might or might not have been him, mind you - but hell yes, his involvement is sufficient for me to damn him for it, sure.
But *IF* McVeigh is such a monster, and worthy of execution, tell me then why you're not clamoring for Janet Reno to face the needle ?
Was it me, I woulda buried em both alive, in the same coffin.
And no, I was never fond of those bastards down at Elohim cause more than half of em were jackboot cuddling collaborators like you, Rap.
I was always a bit more partial to the Weathermen, the Citizens Commission to Investigate the FBI, Dean Harvey Hicks, and Marvin John Heemeyer.
While not essentially opposed to the idea of stringing up folks who have betrayed their Oaths of office, it's not for an individual to make that decision, not for something as precious as a human life, however ill spent.
Things that are destroyed are just that, things, symbolic in nature and ultimately replaceable - but Gandalf put it best...
"Deserves it! I dare say he does. Many that live deserve death. And some that die deserve life. Can you give it to them? Then do not be too eager to deal out death and judgment. For even the very wise cannot see all ends."
Of course, on YOU I waste the words, since you only value human life so far as those possessing it agree with you, no matter how you try to conceal it beneath your torn and tattered mask of reason.
Might wanna take a powder and touch up a bit, cause the monster's showing through as of late - just some friendly advice.
Me, I respect all human life, and which "side" a terrorist who targets the innocent deliberately is officially on doesn't matter a whit to me, I find em all reprehensible, but most of all when they do so under the auspices of a so-called legitimate government, since by no stretch of "consent of the governed" can one be said to have consented to their own murder.
That's even MORE cowardly and despicable than those who commit such atrocities openly.
-Frem
It cannot be said enough, those who do not learn from history, are doomed to endlessly repeat it
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Quote:
Originally posted by SignyM:Quote:And you, of course, are the only one who's been factually correct and intellectually rigorous, and you're just so dang NICE about it too, dontcha know?
You're nothing but a blind partrisan who's in denial and basically , you're being a prick too.
BTW, I'm still waiting for answers to my questions... from this thread AND the other.
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Let's party like its 1929.
Not once have you even tried to reply to my facts, just spewed nonsensical insults.
It is not those who use the term "Islamo-Fascism" who are sullying the name of Islam; it is the Islamo-Fascists. - Dennis Prager
" They don't like it when you shoot at 'em. I worked that out myself. "
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Quote:When you get around to posting facts, I'll get around to responding.
Not once have you even tried to reply to my facts, just spewed nonsensical insults.
You STILL haven't clarified what it is you're complaining about. You've posted a lot of meaningless crap about Obama and ACORN and Ayers, and failed to demonstrate any meaningful connection that would make me think that Obama is some sort of terrrst, or approves of terrorism.
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Let's party like its 1929.
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Quote:'Facts' like this?:
Originally posted by AURaptor:
Not once have you even tried to reply to my facts,
"Hey lookie... the market is rebounding. Imagine that."- Tuesday, September 30, 2008 - 09:41
You're such an idiot.
Chrisisall
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Signy, everyone, you MUST see this movie preview!!!!:
OMGLOL!!!isall
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Quote:
BTW, I'm still waiting for answers to my questions... from this thread AND the other.
Signy, that's a long wait for a train don't come...
Mike
This world is a comedy for those who think, and a tragedy for those who feel.
Trolls Against McCain!
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Quote:You mean, I won't get an answer to any of my questions either!?
Originally posted by Kwicko:
Signy, that's a long wait for a train don't come...
* runs into room, slams door shut, starts crying *
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Trolls against McCain, you betcha!
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Well lookee here! Mrs Joe Sixpack a big fat fibber? say it aint so joe!!!
http://www.huffingtonpost.com/shannyn-moore/palins-darfur-lie-alaskan_
b_132125.html
I am on The List. We are The Forsaken and we aim to burn!
"We don't fear the reaper"
FORSAKEN original
Trolls Against McCain
“I like your Christ, I do not like your Christians. Your Christians are so unlike your Christ.” Mahatma Gandhi
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Quote:Typical NeoCon activity.
Originally posted by FutureMrsFIllion:
http://www.huffingtonpost.com/shannyn-moore/palins-darfur-lie-alaskan_
b_132125.html
Hey CRAptor, what say you, or are you too busy reveling in the roaring economy?
Chrisisall
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Quote:
Originally posted by chrisisall:Quote:'Facts' like this?:
Originally posted by AURaptor:
Not once have you even tried to reply to my facts,
"Hey lookie... the market is rebounding. Imagine that."- Tuesday, September 30, 2008 - 09:41
You're such an idiot.
After the House did NOT vote on a 'bail out', the market did indeed rebound.
Dumbass, I posted a gorram FACT. There's not one god damn thing you can do/say/post which will refute that. Did the market continue that way ? Nope, never claimed it did. Curiously, the Senate passed it's own version of the bill, and then the House re-voted on its version and guessy whatty ? The market tanked and tanked.
You're the idiot, pin head.
It is not those who use the term "Islamo-Fascism" who are sullying the name of Islam; it is the Islamo-Fascists. - Dennis Prager
" They don't like it when you shoot at 'em. I worked that out myself. "
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Palin didn't lie. The Huffington Post is a well known far Left wing rag. Not doing exactly what a specific group wants done isn't proof of anyone lying. Did she jump at divesting in Sudan at the drop of a hat? Nope. Took a while, but Alaska eventually did, so what's the big deal ?
I wish the Left would grow the hell up .
It is not those who use the term "Islamo-Fascism" who are sullying the name of Islam; it is the Islamo-Fascists. - Dennis Prager
" They don't like it when you shoot at 'em. I worked that out myself. "
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You parse your "facts" pretty carefully, don't you? If the whole canvas is blue but with one red spot, you'll point to the red spot.
If Bush used the term "mortal threat", "unique and growing threat" and said that Iraq was intending to hit us with WMD, and Scott McClellan used the term "imminent threat" you'll says See? Bush didn't use the term "imminent thread so he didn't lie!
If UN Resolution says Recalling all of our previous resolutions, we now decide to give Iraq a final chance to comply YOU'LL says See? The UN included its previous Resolutions be reference and therefore that means can could invade, totally ignoring the entire meaning of the Resolution!
If the market goes up ONE DAY but everything else is tanking, you'll cling to the one-day phenomenon.
You have not shown in this thread anything other than the fact that Obama once worked on a board with a guy and had occasional phone conversations. Heck, you can't even figure out what you're so lathered about!!
Rapo, for your own sanity's sake, please give up that heavy-duty filter between you and the rest of the world.
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Let's party like its 1929.
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Saint Rap, self-annointed martyr for 'truth' and practitioner of hypocrisy
"You're nothing but a blind partrisan who's in denial and basically , you're being a prick too."
And here we have a prime example of how it is that Saint Rap, self-annointed martyr for 'truth' and practitioner of hypocrisy creates his own martyrdom.
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He's a legend in his own mind.
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