Herc's Speculation about Giles in 4.10 -- Can it be true?
POSTED BY: Poster Nutbag
UPDATED: Wednesday, March 26, 2003 03:57
VIEWED: 17466
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Except that I'd heard somewhere that "Ripper" was a prequel concept... it takes place, supposedly, in Giles' pre-sunnydale days.
Unlikely. Tony's so noticeably older than he was 7 years ago. A prequel wouldn't fly, though RIPPER could be set in the time right after he left Sunnydale in season 6.
However, my feeling is if Giles is dead, there will be no RIPPER. Period. But thing is, Giles isn't dead. I'm positive about that. You don't kill off a beloved character like that -- Capt Kirk style. The axe-fall-cut-away is so not the big 'ol death scene Giles would get were he really snuffed.
My theory is that BOTN Giles is the First, and can take his form because the real Giles is unconcious somewhere. Giles/First said that it takes the form of those who have died, but omitted the unconcious rule because if he, Giles/First, is discovered, then the group would have to conclude real Giles is dead. Hopeless sitch time.
Other stupid theory: The First can take the form of Buffy. Buffy is alive now but *has* died. Perhaps Giles was clinically dead for a moment then revived.
--- Joe
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It just seems to me that if Giles were really the first in BOTN, then why would he be helping to protect the SiTs? If the goal of the first is to kill off the Slayer Line, then why wouldn't he *say* he's taking them to Buffy's, but instead take them to some deserted place where 50 Harbingers wait with great big daggers to finish them all off. Just doesn't make sense to me.
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Giles: Right. It's good to see you. Um, no need to panic.
Oz: Just a thought. Poker: not your game.
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Just doesn't make sense to me.
Well, The First may have plans to manipulate Buffy into helping him/her/it as Giles, get all of the "potentials" in one place at one time, and then kill them all at once. Plus, it'd have Buffy on its side...
But I also don't think that anything this obvious would be true... the way this rumor got started was in a claimed ASH quote in which he says they wouldn't let him touch anything on the set during filming. My guess is that this was leaked by ME to throw us all off the real trail. I mean, if you look at the facts, it just doesn't seem right. First, ASH would never ever ever give a clue that big to anyone unless there was a hidden motive. Second, Joss has said that Giles will face the consequences for killing Ben this season (and unless death was the consequence, we have yet to see this). Third, the clues are just too obvious ("Hey, let's not show them if Giles gets killed by the harbringer... that way we can throw them off the trail). Fourth, Ripper spinoff (and unless these rumors recently resurfaced to make us question whether Giles really is dead or not, it's a pretty sure bet that a dead Giles couldn't fill a series). And fifth, ME has been known to mislead the audiences (There's the death of Tara controversy, then there was the ambiguity of Spike's re-souling in Africa (i.e., was it a mistake he got his soul back or was it his intention all along?), etc...).
So, in the end, there are clues to lead us either way, but my gut says that Giles isn't dead.
And on an off-topic note, Who think's Principal Wood is God (or some sort of celestial being)? Think about it...
--Dylan Palmer, Pretentious Bastard at Large--
"Oh my god, I'm a hack!" - Joss Whedon
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God, huh? That's a pretty interesting theory. Although I don't see him as being some sort of "pure good" creature, since he buried Jonathan, which seems to help keep the evil secret. Maybe he's a demon kind of like the guy who showed himself to Angel to get him on his current path before Buffy was called. (it's not like me to not be able to find the specifics on an episode when I go looking for it... but I can't remember if they showed that flashback on Buffy or Angel... and when or why they would have shown it, so hopefully you'll know who I'm talking about. The guy who found Angel in the sewers living on the occassional rat.)
His little comment about mystery movies seemed awfully pointed... maybe he is a watcher... just not a very active one.
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Hey, you're not the Watcher of me!
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There's all kinds of goodness here to reply to...
First, sorry didn't know about slayer lineage restricted to one...
Second, I couldn't remember about dying from the bullet, thank you...
Tara couldn't be brought back because it was a natural death...the Harbingers don't bring a natural death so maybe they'll bring him back from the dead.
That's it for now...
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I've got a different theory about Giles - its a slight of hand trick. We're being set up by Mutant Enemey to watch Giles. What we're not noticing is whats going on in the background. Sure, Giles just stood around most of the time - but so did the SIT's... what if Morphy WAS in this episode - but not as GILES?
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Originally posted by Nonoluna:
Tara couldn't be brought back because it was a natural death...the Harbingers don't bring a natural death so maybe they'll bring him back from the dead.
That's it for now...
Cassie and Joyce both died naturally. The First can take their form. Tara didn't come back very simply because Amber didn't want to do it. But if we must fanwank, I'll say that the First calculated that it would be easier to convince Will thru a messenger to commit suicide with the promise of reuniting with Tara, than Tara herself trying to convince Will to do the deed.
EDIT: OKAY. Just realized you were talking about resurrection. I'm a complete idiot. Ignore me.
--- Joe
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Why does Giles have to be the First? I believe that Joyce wasn't the First. Somehow she found a way back and is doing her small part to help Buffy. Can't Giles be the same way? Personally, I think Giles is dead, BUT the Buffy staff is aware of all of us who analyze everything, trying to figure the season out in advance. This could very well be nothing more than ME playing evil games with us. Speaking of evil, does anyone else hope that the principal is not? He could have taken Jonathan's body so no one else would stumble across it. Remember, he doesn't want the kids to see evil, 'cause you can't unsee it.
Was anyone else EXTREMELY upset that they were trying to drown a creature that DOESN"T BREATHE?!? Unless, Spike got the special soul that allows him to; won't Angel be jealous.
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Spike drowning! So pissed me off. Vampires can, of course, voluntary inhale and exhale (to smoke for example), but if they're head's beneath water I'm sure they know to keep their friggin' mouths shut! I understand torturing the vampire by filling his lungs with water would be pretty effective, but you would have to hold is mouth open and poor the water in. OTOH, you would have to somehow force him to inhale it, rather than swallow, so perhaps that wouldn't work either.
You ME loons!
--- Joe
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Unless it was holy water. Though, holy water traditionally burns, right? Or maybe it was more psychological torture... showing Spike that no matter what he does, he's still not a man, just a demon who doesn't need breath. Whatever, it didn't really bug me that much... and it was written by Doug Petrie and Marti Noxon, and they know Buffy lore enough to have a decent explanation.
--Dylan Palmer, Pretentious Bastard at Large--
"Oh my god, I'm a hack!" - Joss Whedon
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