Why Halloween is depressing
POSTED BY: MAL4PREZ
UPDATED: Tuesday, September 9, 2025 06:32
VIEWED: 15515
PAGE 14 of 16
Moving past the "all-Americans-are-0-empathy-imperialists" biatch who's trying to play innocent... "Who me? What'd I say?"
Oh yeah Magon's annoyed me. Big time.
Quote:You really should. It seems that someone built a show and cast around playing off of Robin Williams at his silliest, resulting in many good moments. They show outtakes at the end of each episode. SMG makes a Buffy reference in one of the best of them.
Originally posted by Niki2:
Robin Williams has a series?! Where do I find it?? No, cancel that, I'll look it up...
I don't watch live TV either. All internet for me. I am blessedly free of commercials! I'm always confused when I watch TV at a friends house and they actually sit and watch the commercials. When I had TV, it was all about mute or channel changes.
So you've seen Williams live? Must have been awesome! Well, I think as a human in person he'd freak me out, with his crazy energy and his brain going all over the place. I think you have to be half genius and half insane to be that funny. My lord he's good though.
Quote:I'm glad you say that, and I'm ready to believe you. It's human nature to paint the past too rosy.
Mal4, I'm sorry, but I disagree. We've painted Kennedy with the Hero Brush, and he wasn't all that great in reality.
Thing is, it's not that I believe Kennedy to be a superhero as much as I see the forces of Dick Cheney & Co to be a true evil. I came to awareness around 1980 and life has changed so much since then, in ways that are squarely on the rise of corporations and big money and big military. I can't help but think that if the liberals had won out a few decades before and kept the conservatives away from power, the pockets of local culture I knew in 1980 would not have been swallowed by the almighty strip-mall.
*---------------------------------------*
The French Revolution would have never happened if Marie Antoinette had just given every peasant an iPhone.
NOTIFY: Y | REPLY | REPLY WITH QUOTE | PERMALINK | TOP | HOME
Quote:
Originally posted by MAL4PREZ:
Bullshit Magons. As I thoroughly explained above, you said a helluva lot more than an innocent: "I don't like Halloween". If you actually bothered to pull your head out and read posts responding to you, you would have noticed that a lot of people agreed to a large degree. My first responses to you were to acknowledge the many annoying aspects of it.
But that's not what you were after. You continued to bitch and moan and get personal and insulting, and I only cut you down after that singing the anthem bullshit you pulled.
I challenge you to find any direct quote from my posts that was anywhere close to blind patriotism. Go now and look.
Unless you're too busy fucking yourself. Which you should be.
Geez, I'm glad I never said anything critical about July 4th, you'd come after me with a bazooka.
NOTIFY: Y | REPLY | REPLY WITH QUOTE | PERMALINK | TOP | HOME
Mal4, no, I was never lucky enough to catch Williams at the comedy clubs, I don't frequent them (in fact, we rarely ever "went out" to anything). I have friends who did--he always did it unannounced, so you never knew where he would show up. I've seen all his stand-up live performances numerous times, and wish I'd ever had the chance to see him live! He had a house in the City back then (I know where), just as George Lucas used to live down the street from us...him I DID see, once at the market, but none of any of the other famous folk who live around here.
The concept of letting Robin "riff" and then using what they want is the best way to work with him and what many have done...that's how they got his character in "Aladdin", among others (his addiction to coke back then didn't help, and it's pretty predictable that would be the drug he'd get hooked on!). His brain just moves so damned fast, and he pulls stuff out of thin air as well as bringing up stuff he's used before, that you just never know what's going to come out. Makes him hard to work with, among other things. ;o)
I think I really fell for him when he WAS able to control himself and did such a fantastic job in Good Will Hunting, it showed he could actually ACT, not just riff insanely. Since then he's solidified that respect over and over, especially with Awakenings. He's never been everybody's cup of tea, certainly, but always been mine.
I certainly agree with you about Kennedy, and many more, in comparison to Reagan and especially the Bush/Cheney Evil Empire...and you may be quite right, that if the "Moral Majority", "Christian Right" and Cheney/Rove/etc., hadn't come to power, things would be QUITE different. I just speak up when I hear the Kennedy As Hero thing; in my opinion, tho' quite a bit more dangerous in his way, Bobby would have been a better President. It was HIS death that totally destroyed me.
As to Magons, I think the heat has ramped up to the point where nobody's hearing her, which is sad because I admire all of you greatly. As I said in my very first post, I don't think most Americans can actually hear what she's trying to say, but I also think there are some misconceptions on her part. I'm just sad it's gotten so heated.
NOTIFY: Y | REPLY | REPLY WITH QUOTE | PERMALINK | TOP | HOME
Quote:
Originally posted by Niki2:
As to Magons, I think the heat has ramped up to the point where nobody's hearing her, which is sad because I admire all of you greatly. As I said in my very first post, I don't think most Americans can actually hear what she's trying to say, but I also think there are some misconceptions on her part. I'm just sad it's gotten so heated.
Oh, we've heard her quite well. The fact that she's still going with this: "Boo-hoo all I did was say I don't like a Holiday" thing, even after I gave her direct quotes of what I'm reacting to, proves that she's not hearing me. She's not even trying.
If she was, she would have noted right away that we have common ground. I tried to point out that we are really allies here, but she came right back and painted me as a 0-empathy imperialist, etc. She doesn't want common ground. All she wants is to preserve her victim hood boo-hoo and not hear anything different. To which I continue to have no response but: go fuck herself.
*---------------------------------------*
The French Revolution would have never happened if Marie Antoinette had just given every peasant an iPhone.
NOTIFY: Y | REPLY | REPLY WITH QUOTE | PERMALINK | TOP | HOME
Okay, I read through the entire thread. My personal conclusion is that people aren't hearing each other, tempers have flared and there's quite enough unpleasantness on both "sides" to suffice. After reading it all, I think I know where things went wrong, so if anyone's interested, here's my analysis:
MOST people were actually listening to one another, and understanding, when this all started. Wish nailed some of what I feel, and some of what Magons has been trying to say, in my opinion:Quote:
I firmly believe most Americans have NO CLUE how we are affecting the rest of the world.
I'm sure a lot of Christians would deny that they want the rest of the world doing their holidays, but I know that a lot would secretly revel in the "superiority" of it all. It makes me kind of sick that Americans ( and lets face it- companies EVERYWHERE LOOOOVE how commercialized we are) are soo inadvertently messing with others cultures…
Personally, I think there are a lot of so-called "Christians" out there who already DO revel in the superiority of Christianity and would love for it to be universal, but that's another discussion.
The "revel in your cultural imperialism" was uncalled for, but given the personalities involved, not surprising. To say one ASSUMES "Magons is looking for people to acknowledge her cultural superiority" is about as asinine as Magons' statement, and every bit as much of a snark.
I didn't see anywhere Magons "(blamed) the excesses of her own people on America". I understand how what she wrote can be taken that way, but a number of us understood that's not what she was doing, Oonj got it exactly:
"People having fun is not the objection.
People adopting US customs in lieu of their own is felt as a loss.
Very upsetting when one loves-respects her own culture.
My refusal to hear-understand the hurt was like an insult."
And so did G:
"Her countrymen are proving to be just as weak and susceptible to million dollar marketing as ours have been. That has to be hard to take given country pride and obvious dislike for most things US."
I'm not sure Magons has ever shown "obvious dislike for most things US", but that's just my opinion.
Moving into psychoanalysis with "It's disingenuous at best. Denial and transference of guilt more likely" would be sufficient to make anyone's hackles go up, if they weren't already.
I then misunderstood something, which gave Byte the opportunity to take a swipe at Oonj and ream me (which still makes me laugh when Mal4 called it "only a little understandable bristling"), and the conversation got threadjacked into Byte going after me (despite my admitting I'd misunderstood and explaining why). During which time, I've refrained from mentioning until now, Byte TWICE wrote bald-faced lies about me, both of which she edited out when I called her on them. I'll probably get reamed for mentioning that, but it made an impression.
Skipping past all the ensuing bullshit, Magons came back and tried to explain:Quote:
Inundation, some would say indoctrination with another's culture....24 hours of tv and films dominated by another culture along with sophisticated advertising changes the way people think. It changes their brains!!! That's what we have here. So produce our own, you say. Yeah we do. But market forces means that local productions can't compete with American imports. So there we have it. Local business cant compete with huge multinationals like KFC, MacDonalds, Cripsy Creme. pleased to say that Gloria Jean was a fizzer.
She's absolutely right. I repeat, again, it's not "Americans", but a small minority of moneyed, powerful individuals driving it, and given how much MOST of us here hate it, putting it on us is unfair. But the fact remains that it's vi
NOTIFY: Y | REPLY | REPLY WITH QUOTE | PERMALINK | TOP | HOME
Niki - your post makes me think of that Sherlock Holmes story where Sherlock reconstructs Watson's train of lock just by observing him. I am fascinating by trying to recapture a train of thought, so I did indeed read your whole post.
Quote:
Originally posted by Niki2:
I'm not sure Magons has ever shown "obvious dislike for most things US", but that's just my opinion.
I disagree. I think she's been clear about that, not only in her posts but in how she overlooks the posts of anyone who's American. She has shown her bias. It didn't matter that we agreed with her and offered to be allies: we are American therefore we are anthem singing hand-on-heart imperialists in her mind.
My goodness, will I ever be able to refer to that without both of my middle fingers twitching in Magon's direction? I need to meet her in real life just to satisfy this urge to give the most offensive bird I can express... and more insults than I can come up with at the moment.
I guess I'll just have to hope she is fucking herself good and hard. She's earned it.
*middle finger*
Quote:Which is what I told her. For Magon's to ignore my message so entirely and go even further as to *blame* me for something I hate as much, or more, than she does, if damned near unforgivable.
She's absolutely right. I repeat, again, it's not "Americans", but a small minority of moneyed, powerful individuals driving it, and given how much MOST of us here hate it, putting it on us is unfair.
Something I hate the worst of Americana for is ignoring what *I* (meaning: the reasonable Americans) say when we try to stop the insanity. Magons has done exactly this - she has ignored sanity so she can blame a scapegoat. Only a direct retraction from her makes this anywhere close to forgivable.
You are right about her use of "you." That's what did it for me, and as close as I can tell the others as well: she categorized me based on her presumptions. She has made no effort to take that back. Her bias and her ability to ignore the individual, the human being that exists separate from the state, makes her close to the evil in my mind.
Her mentality, the one of going with assumptions rather than *listening* to people who are individuals with their own ideas whether they are Aussies or Americans or anything else, is the root of why the true evil has taken over.
Yes, I went there. I defined evil and aimed it at her mentality.
Until the true allies are capable of putting their egos aside and *listening* to each other, the corporate fuckers will take advantage of us all. People with Magon's mentality will make it easier for the evil fuckers by refusing to acknowledge the true good guys and bad guys in the world.
*---------------------------------------*
The French Revolution would have never happened if Marie Antoinette had just given every peasant an iPhone.
NOTIFY: Y | REPLY | REPLY WITH QUOTE | PERMALINK | TOP | HOME
We'll have to agree to disagree. I've long respected you, I'm sad to see you so cemented in your opinion, but I will accept that it is so.
I will merely note that how and what you write absolutely epitomizes "Until the true allies are capable of putting their egos aside and *listening* to each other, the corporate fuckers will take advantage of us all."
NOTIFY: Y | REPLY | REPLY WITH QUOTE | PERMALINK | TOP | HOME
Quote:
Originally posted by Niki2:
We'll have to agree to disagree. I've long respected you, I'm sad to see you so cemented in your opinion, but I will accept that it is so.
I will merely note that how and what you write absolutely epitomizes "Until the true allies are capable of putting their egos aside and *listening* to each other, the corporate fuckers will take advantage of us all."
Hey - Magons need only say some mild form of: "I guess you have something to say that I might agree with, though you are American" and I'd be right there for her. That's all I've been looking for. What made me turn against her was her unwillingness to admit to such a small thing.
My interpretation of her input to this thread: "All you Americans are imperialists who are incapable of feeling empathy and incapable of understanding what it's like to lose one's culture to corporations." I disagree with this strongly and will continue to do so until she admits that some Americans may possibly have been through the same tragedy that she has.
My guess: she'll never make such an admission because she is so biased and so dependent on her scapegoat that she can consider no other option. She has chosen her good guys and her bad guys and she will not be swayed.
Go on Magons. Prove me wrong. It wouldn't take much.
*---------------------------------------*
The French Revolution would have never happened if Marie Antoinette had just given every peasant an iPhone.
NOTIFY: Y | REPLY | REPLY WITH QUOTE | PERMALINK | TOP | HOME
This is still going on? Wow, I thought everyone had said everything...at least twice by now. Too bad we can't just let it die.
Magons DID agree with any number of things, Mal4, as well as taking responsibility for her own countrymen. Obviously it's not enough, maybe it never would be. I think we all get that you're pissed all to hell.
I'm glad you understand G. Myself, I wouldn't advise anyone to get involved; I've been through it enough times to know how it can eat up your life and produce no good results, which is why I only got peripherally involved in the Target thing...too old, too many times through the wringer. While yes, it's the only way to make any kind of an impact, nowadays those in power are SO much more powerful, in so many ways, that living one's own life and enjoying one's family as much as one can seems to me the more logical decision. I do continue to admire and support those willing to sacrifice, unquestionably.
NOTIFY: Y | REPLY | REPLY WITH QUOTE | PERMALINK | TOP | HOME
Quote:
Originally posted by Niki2:
Okay, I read through the entire thread. My personal conclusion is that people aren't hearing each other, tempers have flared and there's quite enough unpleasantness on both "sides" to suffice. After reading it all, I think I know where things went wrong, so if anyone's interested, here's my analysis:
MOST people were actually listening to one another, and understanding, when this all started. Wish nailed some of what I feel, and some of what Magons has been trying to say, in my opinion:Quote:
I firmly believe most Americans have NO CLUE how we are affecting the rest of the world.
I'm sure a lot of Christians would deny that they want the rest of the world doing their holidays, but I know that a lot would secretly revel in the "superiority" of it all. It makes me kind of sick that Americans ( and lets face it- companies EVERYWHERE LOOOOVE how commercialized we are) are soo inadvertently messing with others cultures…
Personally, I think there are a lot of so-called "Christians" out there who already DO revel in the superiority of Christianity and would love for it to be universal, but that's another discussion.
The "revel in your cultural imperialism" was uncalled for, but given the personalities involved, not surprising. To say one ASSUMES "Magons is looking for people to acknowledge her cultural superiority" is about as asinine as Magons' statement, and every bit as much of a snark.
I didn't see anywhere Magons "(blamed) the excesses of her own people on America". I understand how what she wrote can be taken that way, but a number of us understood that's not what she was doing, Oonj got it exactly:
"People having fun is not the objection.
People adopting US customs in lieu of their own is felt as a loss.
Very upsetting when one loves-respects her own culture.
My refusal to hear-understand the hurt was like an insult."
And so did G:
"Her countrymen are proving to be just as weak and susceptible to million dollar marketing as ours have been. That has to be hard to take given country pride and obvious dislike for most things US."
I'm not sure Magons has ever shown "obvious dislike for most things US", but that's just my opinion.
Moving into psychoanalysis with "It's disingenuous at best. Denial and transference of guilt more likely" would be sufficient to make anyone's hackles go up, if they weren't already.
I then misunderstood something, which gave Byte the opportunity to take a swipe at Oonj and ream me (which still makes me laugh when Mal4 called it "only a little understandable bristling"), and the conversation got threadjacked into Byte going after me (despite my admitting I'd misunderstood and explaining why). During which time, I've refrained from mentioning until now, Byte TWICE wrote bald-faced lies about me, both of which she edited out when I called her on them. I'll probably get reamed for mentioning that, but it made an impression.
Skipping past all the ensuing bullshit, Magons came back and tried to explain:Quote:
Inundation, some would say indoctrination with another's culture....24 hours of tv and films dominated by another culture along with sophisticated advertising changes the way people think. It changes their brains!!! That's what we have here. So produce our own, you say. Yeah we do. But market forces means that local productions can't compete with American imports. So there we have it. Local business cant compete with huge multinationals like KFC, MacDonalds, Cripsy Creme. pleased to say that Gloria Jean was a fizzer.
She's absolutely right. I repeat, again, it's not "Americans", but a small minority of moneyed, powerful individuals driving it, and given how much MOST of us here hate it, putting it on us is unfair.
NOTIFY: Y | REPLY | REPLY WITH QUOTE | PERMALINK | TOP | HOME