Real World Event Discussions

Are You in the New American Center?

POSTED BY: Geezer
UPDATED: Saturday, April 5, 2025 19:24
VIEWED: 9322
PAGE 5 of 7

Tuesday, November 5, 2013 6:33 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by SIGNYM:
I think Geezer is hoping to redefine his brand of "propertarian libertarianism" away from the corporate-created cover that it is, and find that there are people on this board (or in the greater American population) who potentially agree with him.



Yeah. Right. I paid NBC News and Esquire to run this survey so I could convince the multitude of folks on RWED to be libertarians. This despite the fact that "Libertarian" never appears in the article.

I think you're complaining about the survey because it doesn't make anyone who disagrees with you politically out to be a raging ultraright-wing Tea Partier.


"When your heart breaks, you choose what to fill the cracks with. Love or hate. But hate won't ever heal. Only love can do that."

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Tuesday, November 5, 2013 7:00 PM

What you guys aren't noticing:

Quote:

Beware: Huge Media Companies Are Selling Corporate Ideology as the 'New American Center'

“IT’S OFFICIAL,” the box on my screen announced in capital letters. “YOU’RE ONE OF THE BLEEDING HEARTS.”

To examine the Esquire/NBC News “New American Center” is to enter a Beltway consultants’ dreamscape, a perceptual interspace where real Americans’ opinions dissolve and are replaced by a chimerical creature whose secret language is only understood by certain insider politicians, corporations and consultants.

That creature’s name is “The Center.”

The survey commissioned by these two news organizations tells us very little about American public opinion. But it tells us a great deal about the insular worlds in which certain journalists and consultants reside.

Pop Quiz

Although there were some interesting nuggets of data in the study, overall it was an ill-conceived venture whose main purpose seemed to be reinforcing a prevailing article of faith inside the Beltway: that there is an undiscovered “center” to American politics, and that finding it will spell success for savvy corporations, candidates and consultants.

I tried to review the poll’s methodology with an open mind. But we’re not told how the study identified the “American Center,” and its architects at the Benenson Strategy Group failed to respond to requests for information.

That organization’s founder, Joel Benenson, became something of a polling legend when he defied the hackneyed pseudo-wisdom of his former mentor Mark Penn and helped guide Barack Obama to an upset victory over Penn’s client in the 2008 primaries. It’s unfortunate, then, that this particular study is packed with the kind of zingy and vacant language for which Penn became notorious. It labels Americans on a left/right axis of Bleeding Hearts, Gospel Left, Minivan Mods, MBA Middle, Pickup Populists, #whateverman, Righteous Right, and Talk Radio Heads.

By comparison, Penn’s “soccer mom” lingo seems almost profound.

Reviewing the raw data only added to the confusion. Why, for example, did many of the raw-data entries list the leftmost category as “Young Libs” rather than “Bleeding Hearts”? We don’t know—and they’re not saying.

The Unhidden Persuaders

Esquire and NBC News don’t report this study so much as hype it. Disturbingly, these journalists use the same marketing language employed by the consultants who wrote the report. Esquire tells its readers that the “New American Center” is “passionate, persuadable, and very real.” NBC News informs visitors to its website that “the center is real, passionate and persuadable.” (The NBC News piece carries the byline of a “senior staff writer.” The Esquire piece is credited to “The Editors.”)

Meanwhile, over at the Benenson Strategy Group website, project leader Daniel Franklin is quoted as saying that “the Center is dynamic and persuadable”—there’s that word again—“creating an opportunity for politicians and businesses alike to reevaluate how they communicate and connect with the American public.” That sounds like a pitch for corporate clients. Benenson’s past and present clients include Toyota, major drug companies, Shell Oil, and Verizon.

Esquire, in particular, crosses the line into naked huckstering for both this survey and centrist ideology. All the “centrist” buzzwords and catchphrases are there: We're told we must get past the “meaningless labels,” transcend our obsolete “culture war,” conquer the “extreme partisanship of Washington” (no particular party’s held responsible for that), and reconnect with “the actual national mood and values.”

The editors sneer at what they call the “hoary conventional wisdom” that “we as a people are now hopelessly polarized in our culture, our values, and our politics”—an odd stance when promoting a study which slices the public into separate (and rather clichéd) social divisions.

That, too, comes straight from the corporate-centrism playb

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Tuesday, November 5, 2013 7:08 PM

Ahhh, I read the thread; am glad to see many of you questioned the "study", and I hail Byte for her perspicuity: "My bullshit-o-meter is going insane with most of these answers and the questions themselves. I see ulterior motives in all the wording."

And I'm glad to see Frem found the same analysis I did--I'm leaving mine up because it's there in its entirety, if anyone's interested.

I'm also gratified to see that

A) What are considered "lefties" here were more than happy to take the quiz, and smart enough to question the results, while the "righties" here, aside from Geezer and his consistent attempts to justify the study, weren't even willing to bother, and

B) Few people bought into the propaganda.

Good on you guys.

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Tuesday, November 5, 2013 8:28 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by Geezer:

So, is it that you think that Esquire and NBC News, neither of which are hotbeds of rightwing thought(as far as I'm aware), skewed the survey to make the Right look more centerist? If so - why?

Or do you think that most of the Rightwingers who took the survey purposefully answered the questions in a way that would inflate the centerist numbers? And again - why?

Maybe the survey just didn't deliver the answers you wanted?






Just because NBC news and Esquire are the ones reporting the survey results doesn't mean they designed it, it just means they're the ones SHILLING it. Even left wing media is corporations and business, and their interests aren't information OR the public, it's power and keeping power. Just as it is with right-wing media.

Further research into the origins of this survey indicates it was designed by manipulators from both the democrats and the republicans, with an agenda that is neither left-wing or right, but generally detrimental to the public that it claims to represent. The questions and answer options given are dishonest, full of loaded question unstated premise fallacies and false dichotomies, and just so worded to return exactly the answers wanted by the pollsters.

That is why it is misleading, and that is why a lot of us here picked up on it and are calling foul. This poll is entirely not representative of anything, beyond how desperate the powers that be are to make sure we stay in our labels like good little citizens and think and act and vote exactly how they tell us - for their benefit. And not ours.

I don't think you realized this when you posted. My suggestion is to be a little more discerning and skeptical in the future. Don't take questions and answers in a poll at face value, ask why the questions are being asked and pay attention to how both questions and answers are phrased. You will begin to spot manipulation when you feel a slimy sensation like someone is breathing down your neck, trying to placate you with meaningless meaningful words.

I for one am running the hell the other way. I'm not even curious what label this poll might think I fall under - that is part of the manipulation.

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Wednesday, November 6, 2013 6:50 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by BYTEMITE:
Just because NBC news and Esquire are the ones reporting the survey results doesn't mean they designed it, it just means they're the ones SHILLING it. Even left wing media is corporations and business, and their interests aren't information OR the public, it's power and keeping power. Just as it is with right-wing media.



As I noted in the original post in this thread, even if you don't agree with the survey, it's interesting.

I got no problem with folks finding fault with the survey, but when they start proposing that I have some nefarious purpose behind posting it... Well, that gets into the realm of the recent "The U.S. is trying to take over the world using Halloween" and "Thanksgiving is just the rich showing off" conspiracy theories that have shown up in other threads.

It's unfortunate that you can't post anything here for general discussion any more without getting personally attacked for it or being accused of having an ulterior motive.


"When your heart breaks, you choose what to fill the cracks with. Love or hate. But hate won't ever heal. Only love can do that."

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Wednesday, November 6, 2013 7:18 PM

I call bullshit. You "legitimized" the "survey" in your very first follow-up post with

Quote:

I was thinking that the divide in RWED isn't so much Left vs. Right as WAAAAY Left vs. Center. The categories the survey shows seem to confirm this, but it'd be interesting to get actual results to verify.

then went on trying to legitimize it with "So NBC and Esquire are rightwing?"

When people began questioning the "survey", you came back with
Quote:

So, is it that you think that Esquire and NBC News, neither of which are hotbeds of rightwing thought(as far as I'm aware), skewed the survey to make the Right look more centerist? If so - why?

Maybe the survey just didn't deliver the answers you wanted?



We answered clearly how and why the "survey" was skewed, and quite eloquently and astutely on Byte and Frem's part, and that pissed you off. You never addressed the problems we had with it, just came back with this snark. All that shows you obviously DO have a "problem with folks finding fault with the survey". I for one don't think you have any nefarious purpose, merely that you have a bias and the study "verified" your bias for you, you took it at face value and didn't like that others didn't as well.

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Wednesday, November 6, 2013 8:46 PM

From the Thanksgiving Hater to the Pollster Guy: You'll stop being personally attacked when you stop making personal attacks.

I was one of the people who wasn't accusing you of ulterior motives, only questioning the survey itself, but you just had to make a jab at me. Not okay with that.

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Wednesday, November 6, 2013 9:27 PM

Yep... they're still trying to cram everyone into the left/right puppet show. Too bad, that.

MYOB

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Wednesday, November 6, 2013 9:51 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by Geezer:


It's unfortunate that you can't post anything here for general discussion any more without getting personally attacked for it or being accused of having an ulterior motive.



Seriously? You got discussion - and you got a little push-back for your entirely one-sided opening, (that this proves that the board is "far left vs. middle).

You opened with a contentious position, and still got better conversation than you deserved - and now you're whining.

Need a tissue little girl??




"Goram it kid, let's frak this thing and go home! Engage!"

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Wednesday, November 6, 2013 11:48 PM



Bleeding heart.

No surprise there.

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