Iraq war illegal, Kofi Annan - The UN

POSTED BY: Ghoulman
UPDATED: Saturday, March 28, 2026 18:32
VIEWED: 15590
PAGE 7 of 15

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Originally posted by HKCavalier:

Hey, Sigma, you notice how ol' Geezer said "the British?" His tendencies are showing. See, to someone like Geezer, the British people are basically civilized while the Iraqi people, well...not so much.

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Bigotry in its various forms, eh?

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Originally posted by HKCavalier:

It was never a war against Saddam Hussein was it? He's alive and well while tens of thousands of Iraqi people are dead. And folks like Geezer think they deserved it.

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Or that it was a "nessassary" evil. Which the world knew it wasn't from the before the start of this whole charade.

At this point I'd like to add (along with Rue) that no-one has answered his very pointed question. Perhaps because it'd tell the tale of how weak there position really is.

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Originally posted by HKCavalier:

What guarantees my freedom is the love and high regard which the United States of America enjoys throughout the world. "Life, Liberty and the pursuit of Happiness" is a phrase known to people everywhere and America symbolizes these values for people in every country on Earth.

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Unfortunately, this is becoming less and less of a truth. Before, Americans would just get treated poorly as they traveled around the world. Now there is actual risk. 'Tis a sad state of affairs.

I'd say fixing this would be to change the hostile policies to friendly ones. But, I guess that's too crazy an idea to work, eh?

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Originally posted by HKCavalier:

The people of the world know that tyrants come and go, that the military arm of every government is a medieval throwback and not to be trusted. All governments in the world are at least 300 years behind the general population. For the most part our government has been the tool of the richest Americans, which is a distinct improvement over the previous model of government where the most violent faction governs.

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An excellent point. Dictatorships are very unstable. And people who lived under a dictator must _*/themselves/*_ choose to move to a democracy. Otherwise, it'll never stick.

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Originally posted by HKCavalier:

Our current masters would turn back this clock and return the people to the rule of naked force. They imagine that their violence is the real power in the world and not a disease from which our people suffer. If they succeed and America ceases to be a beacon of hope around the world, our people and our way of life may truly be threatened.

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The US has the chance to choose what they want in only a couple of months. Choose wisely.

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"Canada being mad at you is like Mr. Rogers throwing a brick through your window." -Jon Stewart, The Daily Show

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Originally posted by SigmaNunki:

Or Sept 11, 2001. Talk can't resolve the senseless murder of thoudsands of innocents.

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Or simply victims of war. Bin Laden make his declaration of war in 97.

Innocent, perhaps. Just as innocent as the victims in Dresden, or Hiroshima, or Hanoi, or Belgrade, or any city in Iraq. Wars have victims, most have nothing to do with the politics which led to their deaths. Before the screams of civilian targets start, economic targets have always been a mainstay of strategic attack... the effects on your economy were the proof in the pudding

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Originally posted by Hero:

Or in Russia last month, how do you compromise with those who cheerfully murder children by the dozen.

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A tragedy, mind you just a few years ago the Russian army rolled into Grozny, a city of 1.5 million or so. They used artillery and airpower to limit their exposure. To the point 8% or so of the original buildings remained.

While not condoning the response, why didn't the international community raise a fuss over that. Further if somebody leveled a US city in such a fashion how would the surviving Americans react ?

Judge them as you well, but at least be aware of both sides of the issue

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What I have done here is proof by counter example. You can come up with any examples you wish where violence has "solved" the conflict, and maybe you might actually find one that did. But, this in no way makes it a general truth as I have agrued successfully above.

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I would suggest the violence employed by Sir Issac Brock, and Sir George Prevost to smack down another American war of aggression as an example, defending ones country by force of arms against an enemy marching on your border, is neccersary even to diplomatic efforts. In 1939, when Poland was attacked they had no chance of winning, but the Polish army stood and fought for two reasons. Pride, and the knowledge that they could not ask other nations to support them if they were unwilling to make a demonstration of force themselves.

Not that I agree completely with Heinleins premise in all cases, but in the examples he uses in Troopers provides in controlled directed violence. Achieving your objective, no more, no less. Unless the admission that the objective in Iraq was to secure the resources of the country for the United States is valid... the objective is very much in doubt ? The removal of Saddam could have come much earlier, even minor support of the US prevoked then abandoned Shia rebellion would have done the job. But that wouldn't have left the US in control ?

In troopers the scene where Zim demonstrated that a man with a nuclear weapon could be taken out of play with a throwing knife was the lesson that controlled and directed violence can be deployed for a desired effect. Mass violence, for questionable objectives... Zim and Rico may not have looked upon this war in quite the same way.......
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" If I going to get killed for a word....
Then my word is Poon-Tang "

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Originally posted by Puma:

Hell no, never forget. There is absolutely NO reason that those 3000, innocents should have been killed.

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I never said you should forget. I said let it go. Your god Dr. Phil said this as well. The healing cannot begin unless you let it go.

I've lost a couple of friends and yes it hurt. But, then I did the grown up thing to do and moved on. Do I remember them? Do I charish those memories? A resounding *yes*!

But, do I pine on how I miss them? Do I cry daily and bother my family/friends/people around me/etc.? *No*!

Let it go.

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Originally posted by Puma:

It has been years, and we should see video of those planes flying into the towers, every day. The fire should neve leave us. We are in a battle. A battle for our way of lives. You are deluding yourself completely, if you think anything less.

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You seem to believe this and that is a sad thing. All what you suggest will do is brain-wash people into thing that they are fighting a war that can be won by bombs and bullets. This is clearly not the case. It'll just make it worse. Time will prove me right and history already does. Look at the Chechen rebels and there conflict for a perfect example.

But since you nor anyone in the USA is actually fighting for there lives besides the usual daily grind. I'd think that you'd be hard pressed to find a rational human being to fall for this line of thinking.

NOTE: You say that this is a fight for your way of life, but, perhaps you should fight the downfall of democracy in your own country.

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Originally posted by Puma:

No, this is a perfect example of someone that wants to appease terrorists and murderers, and make it seem ok. Until you realize that there is evil in this world, you will always be a victim of it. It is monsters that have no iota of humanity in them, that can do this to children. You can make peace with a man, you can not make peace with a monster.

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Actually no, you should get some knowledge about the history of the conflict before you start spouting off about it.

Chechnya was promised independance and they never got it. Now they are fighting for it since Vladimir Putin didn't give it to them. It's now reached the point where they feel they need to do these horrible things to get things done.

I'd say that I think we'd all be a little afraid of eachother if we actually realized what we are all capable of. So, before you call them monsters you should realize that they started off like you or I.

Or perhaps calling them monsters dehumanizes them enough for you to live in your little world where this is ok.

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Originally posted by Puma:

I find it interesting you mention this. Since you have no grounds in reality to base it on. One of the guys I work with just came back from Iraq. He was an MP, and was in the hotzones. He says the Iraqi people, like us. Treat us as friends. The major number of combatants there, are NOT Iraqi citizens, but foriegn "freedom fighters", that want cnotrol of the country.

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Um, perhaps you should get some news that isn't from one of the american propaganda stations. ie BBC World, The Independant, or anthing else outside of the US. I think you'd find that I have much reality to "base it on."

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Originally posted by Puma:

Another point to show the evil that we are fighting over there.
[snip]

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One story that could be made up. Perhaps a link to some evidence that this is the case would be nice.

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Originally posted by Puma:

You talk as if negotiation has a chance in hell of working. It doesn't. These monsters are like rabid dogs. You put them down, there is no cure. We are not Islam, so they want to kill us. There is nothing, ABSOLUTELY NOTHING that you can say or do (short of converting to their violent religion), to change that. You have to wake up, and realize that we are coddled over here, in the Americas. The world sucks. Life is unfair.

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