Union thugs. Willing to fight freedom, at all cost.

POSTED BY: AURaptor
UPDATED: Tuesday, January 31, 2023 21:02
VIEWED: 6547
PAGE 1 of 1

AURAPTOR

Tuesday, December 11, 2012 9:58 PM

That's FIGHT freedom, not fight FOR freedom

"False words are not only evil in themselves, but they infect the soul with evil." - Socrates

" I do not love the bright sword for its sharpness, nor the arrow for its swiftness, nor the warrior for his glory. I love only that which they defend. "

ANTHONYT

Tuesday, December 11, 2012 10:25 PM

Hello,

I wish the editing wasn't so haphazard. It skips from scene to scene, picking up in the middle of various altercations without any context.

Perhaps this person will publish a longer, less edited movie so that we can fully appreciate just what is going on and why.

--Anthony

Note to Self:
Raptor - woman testifying about birth control is a slut (the term applies.)
Context: http://tinyurl.com/d6ozfej
Six - Wow, isn't Niki quite the CUNT? And, yes, I spell that in all caps....
http://tinyurl.com/bdjgbpe
Wulf - Niki is a stupid fucking bitch who should hurry up and die.
Context: http://tinyurl.com/afve3r9

“The stupid neither forgive nor forget; the naive forgive and forget; the wise forgive but do not forget.” -T. S. Szasz

STORYMARK

Tuesday, December 11, 2012 10:55 PM

We should just call him PirateRaptor from now on...

Excuse me while I soak in all these sweet, sweet conservative tears.

"We will never have the elite, smart people on our side." -- Rick "Frothy" Santorum

"Goram it kid, let's frak this thing and go home! Engage!"

AURAPTOR

Tuesday, December 11, 2012 10:57 PM

Yeah. I can see how anyone might think that, because of editing, we somehow missed the part where it became fully justified to use violence and tear down a tent which had folks inside of it.

Storybook, you can call me Captain Jack Sparrow , for all I care. That you'd prefer to attack the messenger, instead of comment on the brutish thuggery of these union punks, is telling.

VERY telling.

"False words are not only evil in themselves, but they infect the soul with evil." - Socrates

" I do not love the bright sword for its sharpness, nor the arrow for its swiftness, nor the warrior for his glory. I love only that which they defend. "

ANTHONYT

Tuesday, December 11, 2012 11:10 PM

Hello,

I'm glad you agree. Were I making this video, I would be sure to show the moments preceding and following each altercation.

This video is like a theoretical version of the movie Zero Dark Thirty, but instead of showing the events leading up to the raid on the Bin Laden compound, you just show a bunch of soldiers assassinating an old man in his house, and then roll credits.

Context matters.

--Anthony

Note to Self:
Raptor - woman testifying about birth control is a slut (the term applies.)
Context: http://tinyurl.com/d6ozfej
Six - Wow, isn't Niki quite the CUNT? And, yes, I spell that in all caps....
http://tinyurl.com/bdjgbpe
Wulf - Niki is a stupid fucking bitch who should hurry up and die.
Context: http://tinyurl.com/afve3r9

“The stupid neither forgive nor forget; the naive forgive and forget; the wise forgive but do not forget.” -T. S. Szasz

AURAPTOR

Tuesday, December 11, 2012 11:21 PM

Context needed here ?

Elected officials, declaring "there will be blood" over this, all but insuring violence will take place.

"False words are not only evil in themselves, but they infect the soul with evil." - Socrates

" I do not love the bright sword for its sharpness, nor the arrow for its swiftness, nor the warrior for his glory. I love only that which they defend. "

ANTHONYT

Tuesday, December 11, 2012 11:26 PM

Hello,

You have provided another oddly edited video. It is just fifteen seconds long, starts after the person has begun speaking, and ends in mid-sentence. Why? Why such a closely cropped sound bite?

Do these youtubers not know that the service can hold many, many, many minutes of content?

Don't you wonder what was left out of the recording? Don't you wonder why?

Don't you miss the context?

--Anthony

Note to Self:
Raptor - woman testifying about birth control is a slut (the term applies.)
Context: http://tinyurl.com/d6ozfej
Six - Wow, isn't Niki quite the CUNT? And, yes, I spell that in all caps....
http://tinyurl.com/bdjgbpe
Wulf - Niki is a stupid fucking bitch who should hurry up and die.
Context: http://tinyurl.com/afve3r9

“The stupid neither forgive nor forget; the naive forgive and forget; the wise forgive but do not forget.” -T. S. Szasz

AURAPTOR

Tuesday, December 11, 2012 11:30 PM

Dispute what was posted, if you can.

"False words are not only evil in themselves, but they infect the soul with evil." - Socrates

" I do not love the bright sword for its sharpness, nor the arrow for its swiftness, nor the warrior for his glory. I love only that which they defend. "

ANTHONYT

Tuesday, December 11, 2012 11:36 PM

Hello,

There's nothing to dispute, Mr. Raptor. Fifteen seconds from the middle of someone's speech, cut off in mid-sentence.

Doesn't that bother you? Don't you wish the video contained the entirety of this person's speech?

If not, why not? What is the benefit of such selective, close cropping?

--Anthony

Note to Self:
Raptor - woman testifying about birth control is a slut (the term applies.)
Context: http://tinyurl.com/d6ozfej
Six - Wow, isn't Niki quite the CUNT? And, yes, I spell that in all caps....
http://tinyurl.com/bdjgbpe
Wulf - Niki is a stupid fucking bitch who should hurry up and die.
Context: http://tinyurl.com/afve3r9

“The stupid neither forgive nor forget; the naive forgive and forget; the wise forgive but do not forget.” -T. S. Szasz

AURAPTOR

Tuesday, December 11, 2012 11:40 PM

There's nothing to dispute ? " There will be blood " ? Maybe that?

Yeah, I remember when conservative GOP officials, TEA party activists said pretty much the same thing, if they didn't get their way...

Oh, wait. Nope. That didn't happen. My bad.

Incredible at how much berth you give to certain folks , when it comes to " context " , yet are eager as hell to jump to your own conclusions, when it comes to folks you already don't agree with or like.

Ha-ha... no, it's just you being YOU.

Fathom the hypocrisy of a government that requires every citizen to prove they are insured... but not everyone must prove they are a citizen

Resident USA Freedom Fundie

" AU, that was great, LOL!! " - Chrisisall

ANTHONYT

Tuesday, December 11, 2012 11:42 PM

Hello,

Mr. Raptor, if you look at the bottom of every post of mine, you will see that I have always been a big fan of context.

Even with people I consider to be despicable.

--Anthony

Note to Self:
Raptor - woman testifying about birth control is a slut (the term applies.)
Context: http://tinyurl.com/d6ozfej
Six - Wow, isn't Niki quite the CUNT? And, yes, I spell that in all caps....
http://tinyurl.com/bdjgbpe
Wulf - Niki is a stupid fucking bitch who should hurry up and die.
Context: http://tinyurl.com/afve3r9

“The stupid neither forgive nor forget; the naive forgive and forget; the wise forgive but do not forget.” -T. S. Szasz

AURAPTOR

Tuesday, December 11, 2012 11:47 PM

Anthony - You're a liar. You draw false conclusions and completely IGNORE context. But we all know that.

Fathom the hypocrisy of a government that requires every citizen to prove they are insured... but not everyone must prove they are a citizen

Resident USA Freedom Fundie

" AU, that was great, LOL!! " - Chrisisall

ANTHONYT

Tuesday, December 11, 2012 11:49 PM

Quote:
Originally posted by AURaptor:
Anthony - You're a liar. You draw false conclusions and completely IGNORE context. But we all know that.

Fathom the hypocrisy of a government that requires every citizen to prove they are insured... but not everyone must prove they are a citizen

Resident USA Freedom Fundie

" AU, that was great, LOL!! " - Chrisisall

Hello,

The context is provided in its entirety via link for anyone to see. The entire threads in question.

Not just a fifteen second sound-byte.

So when I condemn you as despicable, I provide context.

--Anthony

Note to Self:
Raptor - woman testifying about birth control is a slut (the term applies.)
Context: http://tinyurl.com/d6ozfej
Six - Wow, isn't Niki quite the CUNT? And, yes, I spell that in all caps....
http://tinyurl.com/bdjgbpe
Wulf - Niki is a stupid fucking bitch who should hurry up and die.
Context: http://tinyurl.com/afve3r9

“The stupid neither forgive nor forget; the naive forgive and forget; the wise forgive but do not forget.” -T. S. Szasz

AURAPTOR

Wednesday, December 12, 2012 12:03 AM

" woman testifying about birth control is a slut " '

False conclusion based on things I never said.

It was a joke.

She never "testified " in front of Congress.

Her 'sluttiness' wasn't conditional on her testifying ( or even propagandizing ) about birth control. Here, YOU missed the context, and continue to do so.

You are a liar , and spread false words.

Fathom the hypocrisy of a government that requires every citizen to prove they are insured... but not everyone must prove they are a citizen

Resident USA Freedom Fundie

" AU, that was great, LOL!! " - Chrisisall

ANTHONYT

Wednesday, December 12, 2012 12:26 AM

Quote:
Originally posted by AURaptor:
" woman testifying about birth control is a slut " '

False conclusion based on things I never said.

It was a joke.

She never "testified " in front of Congress.

Her 'sluttiness' wasn't conditional on her testifying ( or even propagandizing ) about birth control. Here, YOU missed the context, and continue to do so.

You are a liar , and spread false words.

Fathom the hypocrisy of a government that requires every citizen to prove they are insured... but not everyone must prove they are a citizen

Resident USA Freedom Fundie

" AU, that was great, LOL!! " - Chrisisall

Hello,

You can argue about my interpretation if you wish, BECAUSE I have provided full context for reference. Everyone is free to visit the context for themselves and read the source material in its entirety. Then they can agree or disagree with my assessment of events. See how important context is?

In this case we have a Woman
who Testified
about Birth Control

And You said
the term Slut
applied to Her.

The fact that you dispute these easily referenced facts is remarkable.

Now you've added some more grist for the mill:

Quote:
Her 'sluttiness' wasn't conditional on her testifying ( or even propagandizing ) about birth control.

So while you did say the term Slut applied to her, you now claim that she is slutty for reasons unrelated to her testimony.

So pray tell, why did you call this woman testifying about birth control a slut? (The term applies, per you.)

--Anthony

Note to Self:
Raptor - woman testifying about birth control is a slut (the term applies.)
Context: http://tinyurl.com/d6ozfej
Six - Wow, isn't Niki quite the CUNT? And, yes, I spell that in all caps....
http://tinyurl.com/bdjgbpe
Wulf - Niki is a stupid fucking bitch who should hurry up and die.
Context: http://tinyurl.com/afve3r9

“The stupid neither forgive nor forget; the naive forgive and forget; the wise forgive but do not forget.” -T. S. Szasz

AURAPTOR

Wednesday, December 12, 2012 12:30 AM

I'm simply stating that you're a liar, Anthony. You want to train wreck this thread, for what ever reason, fine. Just be honest about your motives, and say so. I'll not waste any more time here , going over old b.s., as I've already shown you to be what you are. Many times. It's an old, pointless battle, which we can carry on in PM, if you wish, but I do tire of your bullshit.

"False words are not only evil in themselves, but they infect the soul with evil." - Socrates

" I do not love the bright sword for its sharpness, nor the arrow for its swiftness, nor the warrior for his glory. I love only that which they defend. "

ANTHONYT

Wednesday, December 12, 2012 12:36 AM

Quote:
Originally posted by AURaptor:

I'm simply stating that you're a liar, Anthony. You want to train wreck this thread, for what ever reason, fine. Just be honest about your motives, and say so. I'll not waste any more time here , going over old b.s., as I've already shown you to be what you are. Many times. It's an old, pointless battle, which we can carry on in PM, if you wish, but I do tire of your bullshit.

"False words are not only evil in themselves, but they infect the soul with evil." - Socrates

" I do not love the bright sword for its sharpness, nor the arrow for its swiftness, nor the warrior for his glory. I love only that which they defend. "

Hello,

This is where you derailed your own thread:

Quote:
Incredible at how much berth you give to certain folks , when it comes to " context " , yet are eager as hell to jump to your own conclusions, when it comes to folks you already don't agree with or like.

Ha-ha... no, it's just you being YOU.

Forcing me to point out how I provide full context for my claims.

You still haven't provided any for yours.

If you want to return to the topic of the thread, that suits me fine. It's what I was discussing when you decided to make things about me instead of the lack of context in your video clips.

So, why aren't you bothered by the close-crop editing and lack of context in these video clips?

--Anthony

Note to Self:
Raptor - woman testifying about birth control is a slut (the term applies.)
Context: http://tinyurl.com/d6ozfej
Six - Wow, isn't Niki quite the CUNT? And, yes, I spell that in all caps....
http://tinyurl.com/bdjgbpe
Wulf - Niki is a stupid fucking bitch who should hurry up and die.
Context: http://tinyurl.com/afve3r9

“The stupid neither forgive nor forget; the naive forgive and forget; the wise forgive but do not forget.” -T. S. Szasz

AURAPTOR

Wednesday, December 12, 2012 12:47 AM

If you HONESTLY want engage in discussion of this matter, and say something to the effect that " ... yes, that does sound bad, but maybe in its full context, what he appears to be saying isn't his full meaning " , THEN you'd have a point. But with regards to the comment, " there will be blood ", your reply is " there's nothing to dispute " ... you're just being obtuse for the sake of arguing, and nothing more.

"False words are not only evil in themselves, but they infect the soul with evil." - Socrates

" I do not love the bright sword for its sharpness, nor the arrow for its swiftness, nor the warrior for his glory. I love only that which they defend. "

ANTHONYT

Wednesday, December 12, 2012 1:06 AM

Quote:
Originally posted by AURaptor:
If you HONESTLY want engage in discussion of this matter, and say something to the effect that " ... yes, that does sound bad, but maybe in its full context, what he appears to be saying isn't his full meaning " , THEN you'd have a point. But with regards to the comment, " there will be blood ", your reply is " there's nothing to dispute " ... you're just being obtuse for the sake of arguing, and nothing more.

"False words are not only evil in themselves, but they infect the soul with evil." - Socrates

" I do not love the bright sword for its sharpness, nor the arrow for its swiftness, nor the warrior for his glory. I love only that which they defend. "

Hello,

The problem is, I don't know if it sounds bad or not. I don't know what he means when he says 'There will be blood.' The fifteen second segment of his speech, mysteriously cut-off in mid-sentence doesn't give me the ability to form an opinion about what he's saying.

Similarly, I am always dismayed to see people throwing punches and shouting... but I don't know why they are doing this. Other than a general dislike for violence and bad behavior, no other judgment is possible about the video. Again, due to a lack of context.

Doesn't it bother you that the context is missing from these videos? Are you content making a judgment with the information provided in them?

--Anthony

Note to Self:
Raptor - woman testifying about birth control is a slut (the term applies.)
Context: http://tinyurl.com/d6ozfej
Six - Wow, isn't Niki quite the CUNT? And, yes, I spell that in all caps....
http://tinyurl.com/bdjgbpe
Wulf - Niki is a stupid fucking bitch who should hurry up and die.
Context: http://tinyurl.com/afve3r9

“The stupid neither forgive nor forget; the naive forgive and forget; the wise forgive but do not forget.” -T. S. Szasz

MAL4PREZ

Wednesday, December 12, 2012 1:24 AM

Not to interrupt a party, but this thread strengthens my suspicion that Rappy is the invention of a left-winger. He does nothing but make himself and his stereotype look bad, in such an extreme way that I can't be convinced that he's real. Which makes it, sadly, a little less satisfying how easily Anthony knocks him down.

However, carry on. No matter the reality, I will always admire Anthony's classiness.

AURAPTOR

Wednesday, December 12, 2012 1:31 AM

Quote:
Originally posted by MAL4PREZ:
Not to interrupt a party, but this thread strengthens my suspicion that Rappy is the invention of a left-winger. He does nothing but make himself and his stereotype look bad, in such an extreme way that I can't be convinced that he's real. Which makes it, sadly, a little less satisfying how easily Anthony knocks him down.

However, carry on. No matter the reality, I will always admire Anthony's classiness.

He doesn't knock me down, and I'm as real as it gets. ( And Anthony, Geiss speaks of there being blood, and THEN references The Battle of the Overpass - ( http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Battle_of_the_Overpass ) where UAW organizers were in front of a FORD plant, and got jumped by FORD security officers. The irony,of course, is that it was the union thugs at the protest on the video which instigated the violence, tore down a tent, and uttered all manner of threats and vulgarities.

Your judgement is what's sad here. Real fine how you admire a liar. Speaks bunches of you.

"False words are not only evil in themselves, but they infect the soul with evil." - Socrates

" I do not love the bright sword for its sharpness, nor the arrow for its swiftness, nor the warrior for his glory. I love only that which they defend. "

ANTHONYT

Wednesday, December 12, 2012 1:43 AM

Quote:
Originally posted by AURaptor:
Quote:
Originally posted by MAL4PREZ:
Not to interrupt a party, but this thread strengthens my suspicion that Rappy is the invention of a left-winger. He does nothing but make himself and his stereotype look bad, in such an extreme way that I can't be convinced that he's real. Which makes it, sadly, a little less satisfying how easily Anthony knocks him down.

However, carry on. No matter the reality, I will always admire Anthony's classiness.

He doesn't knock me down, and I'm as real as it gets. ( And Anthony, Geiss speaks of there being blood, and THEN references The Battle of the Overpass - ( http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Battle_of_the_Overpass ) where UAW organizers were in front of a FORD plant, and got jumped by FORD security officers. The irony,of course, is that it was the union thugs at the protest on the video which instigated the violence, tore down a tent, and uttered all manner of threats and vulgarities.

Your judgement is what's sad here. Real fine how you admire a liar. Speaks bunches of you.

"False words are not only evil in themselves, but they infect the soul with evil." - Socrates

" I do not love the bright sword for its sharpness, nor the arrow for its swiftness, nor the warrior for his glory. I love only that which they defend. "

Hello,

I agree that I don't knock you down, Mr. Raptor. Descent would be quite a feat.

So, the battle he was referring to when he got cut off was the battle of the overpass? Then the blood he mentions would refer to a concern that Union blood will be spilt. And you knew this already?

Why the pretext, then, of trying to claim an incitement to violence? If he was referring to the battle of the overpass then he was indicating a fear on behalf of the union members. He was expressing a concern that others might harm them.

Remarkable that you had this information and yet persisted in some kind of indignant ruse.

--Anthony

Note to Self:
Raptor - woman testifying about birth control is a slut (the term applies.)
Context: http://tinyurl.com/d6ozfej
Six - Wow, isn't Niki quite the CUNT? And, yes, I spell that in all caps....
http://tinyurl.com/bdjgbpe
Wulf - Niki is a stupid fucking bitch who should hurry up and die.
Context: http://tinyurl.com/afve3r9

“The stupid neither forgive nor forget; the naive forgive and forget; the wise forgive but do not forget.” -T. S. Szasz

AURAPTOR

Wednesday, December 12, 2012 2:32 AM

Yeah, you're feigning idiocy, merely to play the role of contrarian.

There will be blood ,is the indictment of violence. He's saying, that if the bill is passed, there WILL be violence.

How the frak are you not getting this ? Or even trying to pretend to be this stupid ? My guess is, you know damn well how this looks, and how ridiculous it makes the Democrats look, and you're just trying to confuse the issue, by asking inane questions, to avoid having to have any serious discussion on this matter.

To the point, you can't stand seeing me point out the lunacy of the Left, so instead of merely ceding the facts, you'd rather dabble in this childish obfuscation instead. How fraking petty you must be.

"False words are not only evil in themselves, but they infect the soul with evil." - Socrates

" I do not love the bright sword for its sharpness, nor the arrow for its swiftness, nor the warrior for his glory. I love only that which they defend. "

ANTHONYT

Wednesday, December 12, 2012 2:49 AM

Hello,

So strange that you would accuse me of being a contrarian, of being petty, of being inane, of confusing the issue...

So strange because that seems to be the behavior you are currently engaged in.

You yourself put proof to my concern that context matters. In the very breath following 'there will be blood' this man invokes a memory of a time when the blood of union members was spilt. This, providing the crucial missing context from the video. Whether literally or metaphorically, he's concerned that this move will bring harm to the union members.

And you choose to ignore this clear connection of context in favor of calling the Left lunatics?

It's more Doublethink from you. It is no wonder that the video was so cut. The people who prepared it did not want anyone to absorb the full context for fear that they'd come to rational conclusions. Only by excising the phrase from its neighbors can one be brought to anger over the statement.

--Anthony

Note to Self:
Raptor - woman testifying about birth control is a slut (the term applies.)
Context: http://tinyurl.com/d6ozfej
Six - Wow, isn't Niki quite the CUNT? And, yes, I spell that in all caps....
http://tinyurl.com/bdjgbpe
Wulf - Niki is a stupid fucking bitch who should hurry up and die.
Context: http://tinyurl.com/afve3r9

“The stupid neither forgive nor forget; the naive forgive and forget; the wise forgive but do not forget.” -T. S. Szasz

JONGSSTRAW

Wednesday, December 12, 2012 2:57 AM

I saw the entire sickening footage on Hannity tonight as he interviewed the reporter Steven Crowder who got repeatedly punched. Putting aside the legislation issue, I'd like to know why the Governor allowed thousands of protesters to invade the state capitol and create mayhem...why he allowed thousands of them to roam around outside with no barricades and police presence. Why no arrests in the capitol? Why no arrests after the violence? Why wasn't the National Guard called out to maintain order? I think the Governor was too busy getting his mug all over tv shows to give any of that a thought. These union members are understandably angry and upset over what they percieve as a threat to their way of life. I don't condone the violence, but I understand it. The Governor and the Chief of Police are negligent in not anticipating the emotional reactions that were promised when the union said there would be blood.

"When the people find that they can vote themselves money, that will herald the end of the Republic."

Benjamin Franklin

ANTHONYT

Wednesday, December 12, 2012 3:00 AM

Hello Jong,

Do you know if the full video is available anywhere? I'd enjoy viewing it so that I can understand the context of this violence.

On the issue of protesters, the right to assemble in protest is clearly established by the Constitution. Any crimes should be dealt with, but otherwise there is no reason to be dismayed at an assembly of citizens.

--Anthony

Note to Self:
Raptor - woman testifying about birth control is a slut (the term applies.)
Context: http://tinyurl.com/d6ozfej
Six - Wow, isn't Niki quite the CUNT? And, yes, I spell that in all caps....
http://tinyurl.com/bdjgbpe
Wulf - Niki is a stupid fucking bitch who should hurry up and die.
Context: http://tinyurl.com/afve3r9

“The stupid neither forgive nor forget; the naive forgive and forget; the wise forgive but do not forget.” -T. S. Szasz

AURAPTOR

Wednesday, December 12, 2012 12:12 PM

Jong, it may very well be a threat to how they have lived, but the perception of what this bill actual does, does not come close to the lies that the union goons have been told / are screaming about to the rest of the public.

@Anthony - you're either intentionally feigning stupidity and ignorance on this matter, or you're choosing to ignore the reality of what's before your own eyes, out of sheer deference towards the Unions, because you favor their side over the rights of the workers. The right to CHOOSE on whether they want to join a union vs being told they MUST join.

Which is it ? Don't know or care, but that's for you to know.

The 'context' of the violence? Union thugs have had their way for generations, and this is how they act when anyone stands up to them, and offers people a CHOICE. Yes, folks have the right to PEACEABLY gather and protest, but not to invade the capitol building. Contrast this mess with how the TEA party activists gathered to protest the ObamaCare bill, where they were vocal,but still allowed the Democrats free access into the building, and didn't harass or threaten the lawmakers.

"False words are not only evil in themselves, but they infect the soul with evil." - Socrates

" I do not love the bright sword for its sharpness, nor the arrow for its swiftness, nor the warrior for his glory. I love only that which they defend. "

ANTHONYT

Wednesday, December 12, 2012 1:17 PM

Quote:
you favor their side over the rights of the workers. The right to CHOOSE on whether they want to join a union vs being told they MUST join.

Hello,

Remarkable. I do not favor being forced to join a Union. Are you incapable of understanding the desire to know the whole story? Of not wanting to feel herded into a particular perception by selective editing?

Do you actually prefer carefully crafted propaganda pieces that show actions out of context? Are you so deep into a desire to be immersed in fantasy that you regard someone who wants the whole story as an enemy to your selected cause?

Unfortunate.

--Anthony

Note to Self:
Raptor - woman testifying about birth control is a slut (the term applies.)
Context: http://tinyurl.com/d6ozfej
Six - Wow, isn't Niki quite the CUNT? And, yes, I spell that in all caps....
http://tinyurl.com/bdjgbpe
Wulf - Niki is a stupid fucking bitch who should hurry up and die.
Context: http://tinyurl.com/afve3r9

“The stupid neither forgive nor forget; the naive forgive and forget; the wise forgive but do not forget.” -T. S. Szasz

JONGSSTRAW

Wednesday, December 12, 2012 2:59 PM

Quote:
Originally posted by AURaptor:

Jong, it may very well be a threat to how they have lived, but the perception of what this bill actual does, does not come close to the lies that the union goons have been told / are screaming about to the rest of the public.

I know that. I wanted to know where the police were when the unruly mob destroyed the pro-choice tent and the famous landmark hot dog stand outside the capitol bldg. And is the brute who threw the punches going to be arrested and prosecuted for assault? And what about the Lansing teachers who shut down the schools by calling in sick so they could attend the protest? Will they all be fired as I believe they should?

Also, several months ago you told me that "Pawn Stars" on History Channel was better than "Storage Wars." I have to say you're 100% right on that. I'm semi-retired now, and I watch Rick and the gang all the time. Definitely one of the best shows I've ever seen. Thanks!

"When the people find that they can vote themselves money, that will herald the end of the Republic."

Benjamin Franklin

ANTHONYT

Wednesday, December 12, 2012 3:19 PM

Quote:
And is the brute who threw the punches going to be arrested and prosecuted for assault?

Hello,

The reporter is being remarkably magnanimous, since he has the whole incident on tape. He could easily press charges and turn over the entire footage to law enforcement.

--Anthony

Note to Self:
Raptor - woman testifying about birth control is a slut (the term applies.)
Context: http://tinyurl.com/d6ozfej
Six - Wow, isn't Niki quite the CUNT? And, yes, I spell that in all caps....
http://tinyurl.com/bdjgbpe
Wulf - Niki is a stupid fucking bitch who should hurry up and die.
Context: http://tinyurl.com/afve3r9

“The stupid neither forgive nor forget; the naive forgive and forget; the wise forgive but do not forget.” -T. S. Szasz

NIKI2

Wednesday, December 12, 2012 3:25 PM

Nice, Anthony. I usually skip over these tit for tats, but you did it so well, I was intrigued enough to read the whole thing!

"Right to work" is bullshit. It's propagandaspeak for "Right to work FOR LESS" and nothing more, and the reason it's being implemented is to destroy any opposition from funding the other side of what the right-wing superpacs fund.

Tit for tat got us where we are today. If we want to be grownups, we need to resist the ugliness. If we each did, this would be a better reflection on Firefly and a more welcome place. I will try.

STORYMARK

Wednesday, December 12, 2012 4:01 PM

Well done, Anthony.

You have a singular gift for pwning our resident right wing lunatic.

Excuse me while I soak in all these sweet, sweet conservative tears.

"We will never have the elite, smart people on our side." -- Rick "Frothy" Santorum

"Goram it kid, let's frak this thing and go home! Engage!"

NIKI2

Wednesday, December 12, 2012 4:46 PM

He keeps him busy, too, and away from elsewhere. Thank you, Anthony. I hate to see you spend your time this way, but I'm grateful.

Tit for tat got us where we are today. If we want to be grownups, we need to resist the ugliness. If we each did, this would be a better reflection on Firefly and a more welcome place. I will try.

AURAPTOR

Wednesday, December 12, 2012 9:04 PM

Quote:
Originally posted by Niki2:

"Right to work" is bullshit. It's propagandaspeak for "Right to work FOR LESS" and nothing more, and the reason it's being implemented is to destroy any opposition from funding the other side of what the right-wing superpacs fund.

Wow, Niki. You parroted Obama's propaganda very well, word for word. You're hysterical, and not in the ha-ha way. The decades old tactics of intimidation and thuggery by the unions THANKFULLY is coming to an end. If EMPLOYEES ( not "workers" ) want to FREELY join a union, they can make that choice themselves. It's not " bullshit ", it's called FREEDOM.

But then, I guess you're really not down w/ that very much are you ?

"False words are not only evil in themselves, but they infect the soul with evil." - Socrates

" I do not love the bright sword for its sharpness, nor the arrow for its swiftness, nor the warrior for his glory. I love only that which they defend. "

M52NICKERSON

Wednesday, December 12, 2012 9:08 PM

Quote:
Originally posted by AURaptor:
He doesn't knock me down,

He does over and over. If this was a boxing match the ref would be explaining to you what happened as you woke up.

I do not fear God, I fear the ignorance of man.
A warning to everyone, AURaptor is a known liar.
...and now a Fundie!
http://www.fireflyfans.net/mthread.aspx?tid=53359

AURAPTOR

Wednesday, December 12, 2012 11:17 PM

Quote:
Originally posted by m52nickerson:
Quote:
Originally posted by AURaptor:
He doesn't knock me down,

He does over and over. If this was a boxing match the ref would be explaining to you what happened as you woke up.

The ref would have tossed in the towel, long ago, and Anthony would have been carried out on a stretcher.

"False words are not only evil in themselves, but they infect the soul with evil." - Socrates

" I do not love the bright sword for its sharpness, nor the arrow for its swiftness, nor the warrior for his glory. I love only that which they defend. "

M52NICKERSON

Thursday, December 13, 2012 1:04 PM

Quote:
Originally posted by AURaptor:
The ref would have tossed in the towel, long ago, and Anthony would have been carried out on a stretcher.

Yup, you're definatly punch drunk.

I do not fear God, I fear the ignorance of man.
A warning to everyone, AURaptor is a known liar.
...and now a Fundie!
http://www.fireflyfans.net/mthread.aspx?tid=53359

GEEZER

Thursday, December 13, 2012 2:11 PM

Quote:
Originally posted by ANTHONYT:
Hello,

I'm glad you agree. Were I making this video, I would be sure to show the moments preceding and following each altercation.

This video is like a theoretical version of the movie Zero Dark Thirty, but instead of showing the events leading up to the raid on the Bin Laden compound, you just show a bunch of soldiers assassinating an old man in his house, and then roll credits.

Context matters.

So Osama bin Laden was in the tent? And the Fox reporter was protecting him?

Come on, Anthony, quit being so disingenuous.

Sort'a looks like you've joined the "Don't like the message, attack the messenger" cadre. Too bad.

ANTHONYT

Thursday, December 13, 2012 2:53 PM

Quote:
Originally posted by Geezer:
Quote:
Originally posted by ANTHONYT:
Hello,

I'm glad you agree. Were I making this video, I would be sure to show the moments preceding and following each altercation.

This video is like a theoretical version of the movie Zero Dark Thirty, but instead of showing the events leading up to the raid on the Bin Laden compound, you just show a bunch of soldiers assassinating an old man in his house, and then roll credits.

Context matters.

So Osama bin Laden was in the tent? And the Fox reporter was protecting him?

Come on, Anthony, quit being so disingenuous.

Sort'a looks like you've joined the "Don't like the message, attack the messenger" cadre. Too bad.

Hello,

You took that metaphor to a bizarre place.

The point is that showing a series of altercations is not particularly informative. Just like showing an old man getting assassinated would not give you a valid picture of events.

It's what happened in the moments surrounding the altercations that lend context and texture to the event, and allow an understanding.

Rather mystifying why anyone wouldn't want to see that context.

--Anthony

Note to Self:
Raptor - woman testifying about birth control is a slut (the term applies.)
Context: http://tinyurl.com/d6ozfej
Six - Wow, isn't Niki quite the CUNT? And, yes, I spell that in all caps....
http://tinyurl.com/bdjgbpe
Wulf - Niki is a stupid fucking bitch who should hurry up and die.
Context: http://tinyurl.com/afve3r9

“The stupid neither forgive nor forget; the naive forgive and forget; the wise forgive but do not forget.” -T. S. Szasz

GEEZER

Thursday, December 13, 2012 3:58 PM

Quote:
Originally posted by AnthonyT:
The point is that showing a series of altercations is not particularly informative. Just like showing an old man getting assassinated would not give you a valid picture of events.

It's what happened in the moments surrounding the altercations that lend context and texture to the event, and allow an understanding.

Rather mystifying why anyone wouldn't want to see that context.

Well, if you saw the video without knowing where it was, what was going on, or who the participants were, you might be puzzled by the events. However, if you follow the news at all, you know that.

So, based on the who, what, when, where, context from the news, can you provide a good reason that union workers would tear down a tent that, per police, had people in it, including people in wheelchairs, and also contained propane heater and tanks. Think that might be a bit dangerous?

"We had been contacted by that group that they had three or four people that were actually trapped underneath the tent," said Lt. Mike Shaw. "Two of them were in wheelchairs and there was also a propane tank in there. So we had to send troopers out, and naturally, the crowd was not too receptive."

http://www.mlive.com/politics/index.ssf/2012/12/michigan_right_to_work
_tension.html#incart_maj-story-2

ANTHONYT

Thursday, December 13, 2012 4:12 PM

Quote:
Originally posted by Geezer:
Quote:
Originally posted by AnthonyT:
The point is that showing a series of altercations is not particularly
informative. Just like showing an old man getting assassinated would not
give you a valid picture of events.

It's what happened in the moments surrounding the altercations that lend
context and texture to the event, and allow an understanding.

Rather mystifying why anyone wouldn't want to see that context.

Well, if you saw the video without knowing where it was, what was going on,
or who the participants were, you might be puzzled by the events. However,
if you follow the news at all, you know that.

So, based on the who, what, when, where, context from the news, can you
provide a good reason that union workers would tear down a tent that, per
police, had people in it, including people in wheelchairs, and also
contained propane heater and tanks. Think that might be a bit dangerous?

"We had been contacted by that group that they had three or four people
that were actually trapped underneath the tent," said Lt. Mike Shaw. "Two
of them were in wheelchairs and there was also a propane tank in there. So
we had to send troopers out, and naturally, the crowd was not too
receptive."

http://www.mlive.com/politics/index.ssf/2012/12/michigan_right_to_work
_tension.html#incart_maj-story-2]

Hello,

According to the news source you quote, the vast preponderance of
protesters were well-behaved. "more than fine" in their behavior.

Quote:

State police did not arrest anyone during the incident, and Shaw said that
most protesters have acted respectfully and peacefully today.

"We have not made any arrests at all," he said. "The crowd has been more
than fine. They've been obeying with the fire marshall says (in terms of
building capacity). People have been coming in and out of the Capitol
exercising their constitutional rights. We've been perfectly fine with
them -- just that one small incident."

So, yes, I am interested in the context surrounding an act of sabotage and
the other altercations.

If the context you want me to use is the news report you cited, I'd have to
conclude that in a very large group of well-behaved protesters, a few were
bizarrely violent for no discernable reason other than pure meanness.

But the video, being an eyewitness to events, should provide the best
context. Unfortunately, it only conveys the briefest of glimpses.

--Anthony

Note to Self:
Raptor - woman testifying about birth control is a slut (the term applies.)
Context: http://tinyurl.com/d6ozfej
Six - Wow, isn't Niki quite the CUNT? And, yes, I spell that in all caps....
http://tinyurl.com/bdjgbpe
Wulf - Niki is a stupid fucking bitch who should hurry up and die.
Context: http://tinyurl.com/afve3r9

“The stupid neither forgive nor forget; the naive forgive and forget; the wise forgive but do not forget.” -T. S. Szasz

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STORYMARK

Thursday, December 13, 2012 6:46 PM

And now reports are coming in that Freedomworks dropped their own tent to set up this story.

Great, we've got another O'Keefe-style douchbag calling himself a journalist, now.

Excuse me while I soak in all these sweet, sweet conservative tears.

"We will never have the elite, smart people on our side." -- Rick "Frothy" Santorum

"Goram it kid, let's frak this thing and go home! Engage!"

STORYMARK

Thursday, December 13, 2012 6:48 PM

Quote:
Originally posted by Geezer:
Quote:
Originally posted by ANTHONYT:
Hello,

I'm glad you agree. Were I making this video, I would be sure to show the moments preceding and following each altercation.

This video is like a theoretical version of the movie Zero Dark Thirty, but instead of showing the events leading up to the raid on the Bin Laden compound, you just show a bunch of soldiers assassinating an old man in his house, and then roll credits.

Context matters.

So Osama bin Laden was in the tent? And the Fox reporter was protecting him?

Come on, Anthony, quit being so disingenuous.

You're calling Anthony disingenuous?!?

Holy shiznit! You've truely mastered the art of projection. Or you've actually gone senile.

Jesus.

Excuse me while I soak in all these sweet, sweet conservative tears.

"We will never have the elite, smart people on our side." -- Rick "Frothy" Santorum

"Goram it kid, let's frak this thing and go home! Engage!"

STORYMARK

Thursday, December 13, 2012 6:49 PM

Quote:
Originally posted by m52nickerson:
Quote:
Originally posted by AURaptor:
The ref would have tossed in the towel, long ago, and Anthony would have been carried out on a stretcher.

Yup, you're definatly punch drunk.

I do not fear God, I fear the ignorance of man.
A warning to everyone, AURaptor is a known liar.
...and now a Fundie!
http://www.fireflyfans.net/mthread.aspx?tid=53359

But no less hilarious for it. The boy's the poster child for right wing rage and delusion.

Excuse me while I soak in all these sweet, sweet conservative tears.

"We will never have the elite, smart people on our side." -- Rick "Frothy" Santorum

"Goram it kid, let's frak this thing and go home! Engage!"

NIKI2

Thursday, December 13, 2012 7:27 PM

That's interesting, Mark. I hunted around--Google is of course filled with stories about "union thugs" supposedly tearing down Americans for Prosperity's tent. I finally found this:

Quote:
BREAKING: Americans for Prosperity stages phony altercation at Michigan Right to Work rally

There’s a video on heavy rotation at Fox News, being massively retweeted by conservatives and Americans for Prosperity, where they talk about the “brutality” and “violence” of union members at today’s rally in Lansing, Michigan to protest Right to Work legislation. The video shows an Americans for Prosperity tent coming down on the front lawn of the Capitol Building.

As it turns out, American for Prosperity (AFP) themselves were responsible for at least one of the tents coming down. Tom Duckworth watched one of the folks that had been in the AFP tent go around and loosen the straps on the tent. According to Duckworth, “the stakes came down from the INSIDE.”

Clearly AFP came to this rally to incite an altercation that could be shown on endless loop on Fox to show that union members are, indeed, “union thugs”. Not surprisingly, Fox News cameramen where right there on the spot to capture it all on film. The main physical altercations that occurred happened after the tents came down.

Mission accomplished.More and eyewitness video at http://www.eclectablog.com/2012/12/breaking-americans-for-prosperity-s
tages-phony-altercation-at-michigan-right-to-work-rally.html

It would have to be verified, of course (which also of course is impossible after the fact), as this appears to be a progressive website. So I'd like to know more of what really happened. All I can say is I have my doubts at this point that the initial reporting is accurate.

Tit for tat got us where we are today. If we want to be grownups, we need to resist the ugliness. If we each did, this would be a better reflection on Firefly and a more welcome place. I will try.

NIKI2

Thursday, December 13, 2012 7:55 PM

Although Google is filled with the original story by Breitbart, FauxNews and other conservative sites, it's not hard to find eyewitnesses who saw it the other way if you look:

Quote:
Today at the Right to Work protest in Michigan, an Americans for Prosperity tent came down with people inside of it. Naturally, Fox was there to capture the scene and AFP were quick to blame it on violent union supporters. Also, Breitbart was there to blame the tent falling on violent union supporters, with a video that doesn’t start until well after the melee.

As you have learned by now (you’re quicker than the media), all is not always what it seems in Right Wing world.

A protester of the anti-union law passed today saw a man he’d spoken to earlier in the tent kick the AFP tent poles from the inside of the tent. A commenter (av8tor17b ) concurs, writing, “I was physically there this morning and talked to the AFP people before the tents came down. This gentleman is correct--it was a guy with a “freedomworks”? button, who was standing IN the AFP tent this morning, who caused the tent to fall.”

AFP tried everything to get pro-right to work people to come out to the rally, including using their Koch dollars to bribe the deluded Fox News masses with free food, drink, and $25 gift cards.

This has all of the usual shades of the secret Walker audio tape in which he discussed planting disruptors to blame on unions in Wisconsin.

No one is claiming the protesters are perfect, but this has all of the eerily familiar hallmarks of right wing propaganda. AFP kicked their own tent in on their own supporters.

Then they blamed the fallout on the unions. A Breitbart video was there just in time to capture the resulting melee and suggest it all started with the unions. For some reason, their videos never start off at the beginning or proceed without edits.More at http://www.politicususa.com/americans-prosperity-fake-attack-tent-mich
igan-work-rally.html]
This reporter apparently noticed the same thing you did, Anthony.

In the confusion at the time, I don't think too many know exactly what happened and who's at fault. I'm afraid, given what I've read and observed, I wouldn't put it past the Koch-brothers-funded AFP to pull something like this. Apparently they WERE seen by numerous people to be goading the protesters all day, and the video that came out certainly helped their cause, tho' as you pointed out, none of the videos I've found show any context, what happened before or after.

Also found this:
Quote:
Eddie Vale, spokesperson for the AFL-CIO on the ground in Lansing, said his group does not support the tearing down of the tent, but also blamed anti-union protesters for goading the labor folks. He said there were more than 15,000 people at the Michigan capitol, and their protest was “almost universally peaceful and calm.”

“While of course we do not condone the actions taken by a small group of people, the disciples of James O’Keefe were attempting to instigate the crowd all day,” Vale said, referring to the right-wing, video-camera-wielding provocateur. “As soon as the incident happened our marshals worked with the police to move the AFP people through the crowd to safety with no injuries.”

As it did in Wisconsin and other states on the front lines of the Republican anti-union push since 2010, AFP has had a presence in Lansing since the protests over right-to-work legislation began. Last week, the group “blared speeches by Ronald Reagan” at the state Capitol and pro-union groups gathered there.

There were reports of pepper spray being used by police at that protest. Vale noted the protesters were “chanting ‘give the police a raise,’” which he said showed “the actual spirit of the crowd.”

Conservatives are having a field day with the AFP tent video, as well as other footage purportedly showing pro-labor protesters being violent.More at http://tpmdc.talkingpointsmemo.com/2012/12/afp-tent-michigan.php[

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GEEZER

Thursday, December 13, 2012 8:03 PM

Quote:
Originally posted by ANTHONYT:
But the video, being an eyewitness to events, should provide the best context. Unfortunately, it only conveys the briefest of glimpses.

Okay. So given what you know about the general situation, is there any context in which tearing that tent down actually was appropriate? If not, your complaints about lack of context are pretty much moot.

FREMDFIRMA

Thursday, December 13, 2012 8:04 PM

Oh FFS people, didn't my absence from the thread clue you in that this was bogus from the freakin start - it was a fully staged false-flag event and even then bungled so badly only "creative editing" could even hold up the pretense.

Oh, and Anthony ?
Enabling someone elses self-abuse by holding up a spiked shield for them to run into over, and over, and over again... isn't very nice.
Am I rubbing off on you ?

-Frem

ANTHONYT

Thursday, December 13, 2012 8:23 PM

Quote:
Okay. So given what you know about the general situation, is there any context in which tearing that tent down actually was appropriate? If not, your complaints about lack of context are pretty much moot.

Hello,

Are you asking me to cast the net of my imagination to see if I can conceive of a reason someone might legitimately take down a tent? Or punch a man?

Yes. I can imagine reasons both actions might be appropriate. Just as I'm sure you can imagine reasons why such actions might be inappropriate.

I don't want to imagine. I want to know.

I have my suspicions about why these things might have happened, but I lack information to confirm them. With appropriate context, I could lend my suspicions the weight of probability. Without context, one can only guess.

But you don't seem to care about knowing what actually went on.

--Anthony

Note to Self:
Raptor - woman testifying about birth control is a slut (the term applies.)
Context: http://tinyurl.com/d6ozfej
Six - Wow, isn't Niki quite the CUNT? And, yes, I spell that in all caps....
http://tinyurl.com/bdjgbpe
Wulf - Niki is a stupid fucking bitch who should hurry up and die.
Context: http://tinyurl.com/afve3r9

“The stupid neither forgive nor forget; the naive forgive and forget; the wise forgive but do not forget.” -T. S. Szasz

AURAPTOR

Thursday, December 13, 2012 8:28 PM

Oh yeah, like anyone really needs to STAGE violent protests from the Left in order to make them look bad ?

Wow. Baghdad Bob would be envious of these ridiculous attempts at spin.

"False words are not only evil in themselves, but they infect the soul with evil." - Socrates

" I do not love the bright sword for its sharpness, nor the arrow for its swiftness, nor the warrior for his glory. I love only that which they defend. "

ANTHONYT

Thursday, December 13, 2012 8:31 PM

Quote:

Wow. Baghdad Bob would be envious of these ridiculous attempts at spin.

Hello,

I agree.

--Anthony

Note to Self:
Raptor - woman testifying about birth control is a slut (the term applies.)
Context: http://tinyurl.com/d6ozfej
Six - Wow, isn't Niki quite the CUNT? And, yes, I spell that in all caps....
http://tinyurl.com/bdjgbpe
Wulf - Niki is a stupid fucking bitch who should hurry up and die.
Context: http://tinyurl.com/afve3r9

“The stupid neither forgive nor forget; the naive forgive and forget; the wise forgive but do not forget.” -T. S. Szasz

NIKI2

Thursday, December 13, 2012 8:41 PM

Could you clarify that remark for me, Anthony? I don't know whether you're being sarcastic or serious--as you say, "without context". ;o)

Tit for tat got us where we are today. If we want to be grownups, we need to resist the ugliness. If we each did, this would be a better reflection on Firefly and a more welcome place. I will try.

ANTHONYT

Thursday, December 13, 2012 9:00 PM

Quote:
Originally posted by Niki2:
Could you clarify that remark for me, Anthony? I don't know whether you're being sarcastic or serious--as you say, "without context". ;o)

Tit for tat got us where we are today. If we want to be grownups, we need to resist the ugliness. If we each did, this would be a better reflection on Firefly and a more welcome place. I will try.

Hello,

Context is so very important.

Glimpsing highly edited footage and using it to label people as Thugs is practically the definition of propaganda. Hence, I expect a propaganda minister to be pleased with the effort.

Open minded and fair minded people, by contrast, would wonder what they were missing in these tightly edited pieces. They'd want the whole picture before jumping to conclusions.

One would imagine that Geezer and Raptor would be very anxious for the full context to be on display. For all missing segments of video to become available. For the full gamut of atrocity to be proven in every detail.

But Baghdad Bob isn't interested in the truth. Just the message. A few snippets of suggestive material is enough for Bob. And for them.

--Anthony

Note to Self:
Raptor - woman testifying about birth control is a slut (the term applies.)
Context: http://tinyurl.com/d6ozfej
Six - Wow, isn't Niki quite the CUNT? And, yes, I spell that in all caps....
http://tinyurl.com/bdjgbpe
Wulf - Niki is a stupid fucking bitch who should hurry up and die.
Context: http://tinyurl.com/afve3r9

“The stupid neither forgive nor forget; the naive forgive and forget; the wise forgive but do not forget.” -T. S. Szasz

NIKI2

Thursday, December 13, 2012 9:11 PM

Ahhh, thank you...I kind of thought that was what you were implying, but wasn't sure.

Given your response, I agree wholeheartedly.

It never occurred to me, however, that

Quote:
One would imagine that Geezer and Raptor would be very anxious for the full context to be on display.

Past experience has taught me otherwise.

Tit for tat got us where we are today. If we want to be grownups, we need to resist the ugliness. If we each did, this would be a better reflection on Firefly and a more welcome place. I will try.

NIKI2

Thursday, December 13, 2012 9:28 PM

Just found this one:

Quote:
Steven Crowder went to Michigan in search of a stereotype. “I went out here to prove the left for who they truly are, certainly these union thugs,” Crowder told Fox’s Sean Hannity Tuesday night, a few hours after he was assaulted on camera outside the Michigan statehouse in Lansing. In a sense, he succeeded. He found union protesters and one of them clocked him in the face a few times.

Crowder is a conservative standup comedian and Fox News contributor. He calls himself a social/political commentator, which is a highfalutin label for the level of commentary he offers. (“Liberalism is a disease,” his YouTube account explains.) As protests intensified in Lansing after the Michigan legislature’s passage of a pair of right-to-work bills, he waded into a crowd of angry union workers, asking them basic questions about why they opposed right-to-work legislation, according to the videos posted to the Internet.

Crowder was trying to provoke the protesters — or, failing that, to make them look stupid if they couldn’t muster an eloquent response. He was trolling a bunch of angry people who had just lost a battle that could cost them a big chunk of their salary. He irritated the wrong guy and got hit in the face.

Which isn’t to say he deserved what happened, or that there’s any excuse for violence. Crowder didn’t invite the punch or return it. But he certainly got what he wanted, which was evidence for the widespread conservative caricature that union members are thugs. (“Union thugs” yields 2.76 million hits on Google.) He got footage of a small group of union workers supporting a stereotype--threatening to shoot people, and so on.

Ideologies and the protest movements they give rise to are easy to caricature, and caricatures serve a political purpose. Promoting the stereotype that union members are thuggish is the right’s way of demonizing a group they ideologically oppose. So when Crowder tells Hannity that he “never went out here to try and be assaulted,” he’s surely telling the truth. He probably never imagined his trolling would work quite so well. http://swampland.time.com/2012/12/12/a-punch-turns-political-in-michig
an-labor-protests/

That's about it in a nutshell. To call Crowder a "social/political commentator" is to call FauxNews "fair and balanced". The two fit together perfectly.

I'm beginning to recognize the tactics used here, and what their intent was, and of course it would be effective. Provoke people long enough and hard enough, and you get what you ask for. It's not right for anyone to use violence, but there are more ways to be violent than physically.

Tit for tat got us where we are today. If we want to be grownups, we need to resist the ugliness. If we each did, this would be a better reflection on Firefly and a more welcome place. I will try.

HERO

Thursday, December 13, 2012 9:48 PM

Quote:
Originally posted by AURaptor:
Yeah. I can see how anyone might think that, because of editing, we somehow missed the part where it became fully justified to use violence and tear down a tent which had folks inside of it.

You missed that? It was kinda obvious. They were there exercising free speech to say something the Union people didn't agree with.

Come on...that's asking for it. Its like when a hot girl wears a skirt...union guys are allowed to rape her...because she's hot AND wearing a skirt. If she didn't want to be raped she'd gain 30 lbs and put on a burka. That is what liberalism is all about...raping people, hitting them, taking their things, tearing down their tents. Hello? Occupy Wall Street.

H

Hero...must be right on all of this. ALL of the rest of us are wrong. Chrisisall, 2012

STORYMARK

Thursday, December 13, 2012 9:52 PM

Quote:
Originally posted by AURaptor:

Oh yeah, like anyone really needs to STAGE violent protests from the Left in order to make them look bad ?

Ask Walker. He's the one who got caught saying it.

Oh, right, you have no interest in actual facts, just pushing the narrative. Nevermind.

Excuse me while I soak in all these sweet, sweet conservative tears.

"We will never have the elite, smart people on our side." -- Rick "Frothy" Santorum

"Goram it kid, let's frak this thing and go home! Engage!"

ANTHONYT

Thursday, December 13, 2012 9:53 PM

Quote:
That is what liberalism is all about...raping people, hitting them, taking their things, tearing down their tents.

Hello,

What a provocative statement.

--Anthony

Note to Self:
Raptor - woman testifying about birth control is a slut (the term applies.)
Context: http://tinyurl.com/d6ozfej
Six - Wow, isn't Niki quite the CUNT? And, yes, I spell that in all caps....
http://tinyurl.com/bdjgbpe
Wulf - Niki is a stupid fucking bitch who should hurry up and die.
Context: http://tinyurl.com/afve3r9

“The stupid neither forgive nor forget; the naive forgive and forget; the wise forgive but do not forget.” -T. S. Szasz

1KIKI

Friday, December 14, 2012 4:20 AM

First two or three seconds - the guy who 'threw the punch' is getting up off the ground after having been knocked down by someone -

http://www.mediaite.com/tv/steven-crowder-opens-up-to-hannity-about-br
awl-with-union-protestors-if-i-had-defended-myself-they-would-have-killed-me-where-i-stood/

Obviously he wasn't the first person to get physical.

GEEZER

Friday, December 14, 2012 1:08 PM

Quote:
Originally posted by ANTHONYT:
Are you asking me to cast the net of my imagination to see if I can conceive of a reason someone might legitimately take down a tent?

Sure. Why not? Give me a reason why pro-union protesters would have a legitimate reason to tear down a tent set up by a right-to-work group that had a permit to put it up on state property. I'd be interested to see just how far down the rabbit hole you're planning to go.

ANTHONYT

Friday, December 14, 2012 3:32 PM

Quote:
Originally posted by Geezer:
Quote:
Originally posted by ANTHONYT:
Are you asking me to cast the net of my imagination to see if I can conceive of a reason someone might legitimately take down a tent?

Sure. Why not? Give me a reason why pro-union protesters would have a legitimate reason to tear down a tent set up by a right-to-work group that had a permit to put it up on state property. I'd be interested to see just how far down the rabbit hole you're planning to go.

Hello,

If the tent was being used as a base of operations for people who were attacking them, they might legitimately wish to take it down.

--Anthony

Note to Self:
Raptor - woman testifying about birth control is a slut (the term applies.)
Context: http://tinyurl.com/d6ozfej
Six - Wow, isn't Niki quite the CUNT? And, yes, I spell that in all caps....
http://tinyurl.com/bdjgbpe
Wulf - Niki is a stupid fucking bitch who should hurry up and die.
Context: http://tinyurl.com/afve3r9

“The stupid neither forgive nor forget; the naive forgive and forget; the wise forgive but do not forget.” -T. S. Szasz

AURAPTOR

Friday, December 14, 2012 3:40 PM

Free speech is now seen as 'attacking' ?

"False words are not only evil in themselves, but they infect the soul with evil." - Socrates

" I do not love the bright sword for its sharpness, nor the arrow for its swiftness, nor the warrior for his glory. I love only that which they defend. "

ANTHONYT

Friday, December 14, 2012 3:42 PM

Quote:
Originally posted by AURaptor:

Free speech is now seen as 'attacking' ?

"False words are not only evil in themselves, but they infect the soul with evil." - Socrates

" I do not love the bright sword for its sharpness, nor the arrow for its swiftness, nor the warrior for his glory. I love only that which they defend. "

Hello,

Not to my knowledge?

--Anthony

Note to Self:
Raptor - woman testifying about birth control is a slut (the term applies.)
Context: http://tinyurl.com/d6ozfej
Six - Wow, isn't Niki quite the CUNT? And, yes, I spell that in all caps....
http://tinyurl.com/bdjgbpe
Wulf - Niki is a stupid fucking bitch who should hurry up and die.
Context: http://tinyurl.com/afve3r9

“The stupid neither forgive nor forget; the naive forgive and forget; the wise forgive but do not forget.” -T. S. Szasz

STORYMARK

Friday, December 14, 2012 4:00 PM

Quote:
Originally posted by 1kiki:
First two or three seconds - the guy who 'threw the punch' is getting up off the ground after having been knocked down by someone -

http://www.mediaite.com/tv/steven-crowder-opens-up-to-hannity-about-br
awl-with-union-protestors-if-i-had-defended-myself-they-would-have-killed-me-where-i-stood/

Obviously he wasn't the first person to get physical.

No, no, no! Now you're just denying (highly edited to misrepresnt facts so as to push a bullshit right-wing agenda) reality! Rappy said so!

Excuse me while I soak in all these sweet, sweet conservative tears.

"We will never have the elite, smart people on our side." -- Rick "Frothy" Santorum

"Goram it kid, let's frak this thing and go home! Engage!"

ANTHONYT

Friday, December 14, 2012 4:09 PM

Quote:
Originally posted by Storymark:
Quote:
Originally posted by 1kiki:
First two or three seconds - the guy who 'threw the punch' is getting up off the ground after having been knocked down by someone -

http://www.mediaite.com/tv/steven-crowder-opens-up-to-hannity-about-br
awl-with-union-protestors-if-i-had-defended-myself-they-would-have-killed-me-where-i-stood/

Obviously he wasn't the first person to get physical.

No, no, no! Now you're just denying (highly edited to misrepresnt facts so as to push a bullshit right-wing agenda) reality! Rappy said so!

Excuse me while I soak in all these sweet, sweet conservative tears.

"We will never have the elite, smart people on our side." -- Rick "Frothy" Santorum

"Goram it kid, let's frak this thing and go home! Engage!"

Hello,

I really think that understanding the nature of those highly edited altercations is central to understanding pretty much everything. Unfortunately, neither Raptor nor Geezer is interested in why those altercations are so highly edited. Nor even Why the assaulted cameraman failed to press charges.

These are not mysteries to be solved, but rather inconvenient details. The message is about violent union thugs. Any oddities that muddy that message need to be ignored, and are rightfully edited out of the picture.

It's the difference between looking for the truth and looking for validation of your beliefs.

--Anthony

Note to Self:
Raptor - woman testifying about birth control is a slut (the term applies.)
Context: http://tinyurl.com/d6ozfej
Six - Wow, isn't Niki quite the CUNT? And, yes, I spell that in all caps....
http://tinyurl.com/bdjgbpe
Wulf - Niki is a stupid fucking bitch who should hurry up and die.
Context: http://tinyurl.com/afve3r9

“The stupid neither forgive nor forget; the naive forgive and forget; the wise forgive but do not forget.” -T. S. Szasz

STORYMARK

Friday, December 14, 2012 4:31 PM

Yep. Its all about the narrative. Facts are disposable things, easy to throw away if they don't support what has already been decided.

Excuse me while I soak in all these sweet, sweet conservative tears.

"We will never have the elite, smart people on our side." -- Rick "Frothy" Santorum

"Goram it kid, let's frak this thing and go home! Engage!"

SIGNYM

Friday, December 14, 2012 5:40 PM

Quote:
Oh yeah, like anyone really needs to STAGE violent protests from the Left in order to make them look bad ? Wow. Baghdad Bob would be envious of these ridiculous attempts at spin.

Yeah. Cause no one would get up in front of the UN and stage a bunch of photoshopped "WMD" sites. No one would "stage" an attack on an American destroyer in the Gulf of Tonkin, or gin up a horrible flow of drugs passing through Panama as a reason to invade, nor snipe innocent citizens in Venezuela in order to foment a crackdown. And nobody would EVER kick down their own tent and blame it on somebody else. Stuff like that would NEVER EVER happen!

NIKI2

Friday, December 14, 2012 6:04 PM

Kiki, I watched that video several times. It appeared that the guy getting up off the ground went straight for Crowder once he was off the ground. I wonder why he went straight for Crowder, if Crowder wasn't the one who punched him? Wouldn't he normally go after whoever knocked him to the ground first?

Of course, it's a FauxNews video, so again, there's no context as to who threw the first punch...

Tit for tat got us where we are today. If we want to be grownups, we need to resist the ugliness. If we each did, this would be a better reflection on Firefly and a more welcome place. I will try.

STORYMARK

Friday, December 14, 2012 6:07 PM

Quote:
Originally posted by Niki2:
Kiki, I watched that video several times. It appeared that the guy getting up off the ground went straight for Crowder once he was off the ground. I wonder why he went straight for Crowder, if Crowder wasn't the one who punched him?

Looks like he punched Crowder after Corwder shoved him to the ground. Crowder was confronted about this on Hannity, and while Hannity (who wasn't there) denied it - Crowder would not comment on the accusation.

Excuse me while I soak in all these sweet, sweet conservative tears.

"We will never have the elite, smart people on our side." -- Rick "Frothy" Santorum

"Goram it kid, let's frak this thing and go home! Engage!"

GEEZER

Friday, December 14, 2012 6:11 PM

Quote:
Originally posted by ANTHONYT:
If the tent was being used as a base of operations for people who were attacking them, they might legitimately wish to take it down.

Any evidence of this?

The real Osama Bin Laden might have been hiding in the tent preaching jihad, and that's about as likely as the couple of dozen folks in the tent, some in wheelchairs, attacking several thousand union workers.

Come on, Anthony. If you just want to ignore the violence the pro-union forces committed in Michigan, then ignore it. Quit embarassing yourself with this "Oh, I can't decide anything without context", crap when the context is right there...if you admit it.

GEEZER

Friday, December 14, 2012 6:16 PM

Quote:
Originally posted by ANTHONYT:
Unfortunately, neither Raptor nor Geezer is interested in why those altercations are so highly edited. Nor even Why the assaulted cameraman failed to press charges.

And I've said anything about the 'assaulted cameraman' where?

Also, there are several videos if the tearing down of the tent from start to finish, including from inside the tent. You could find them pretty easily if you wanted. Apparently, you'd rather play word games that address the problem of the violence at the Michigan State House.

I used to have some respect for you, but I guess you move to the list with Mike and Story. Ignore.

STORYMARK

Friday, December 14, 2012 6:25 PM

Quote:
Originally posted by Geezer:
Quote:
Originally posted by ANTHONYT:
If the tent was being used as a base of operations for people who were attacking them, they might legitimately wish to take it down.

Any evidence of this?

You asked for a hypothetical, and when given one, demand evidence.

Amazing.

Tell us again you're not partisan. With the news today, we could all use a laugh.

Excuse me while I soak in all these sweet, sweet conservative tears.

"We will never have the elite, smart people on our side." -- Rick "Frothy" Santorum

"Goram it kid, let's frak this thing and go home! Engage!"

SIGNYM

Friday, December 14, 2012 6:29 PM

I looked for those videos, they were pretty obstructed by other people... mostly four or five people back from the tent perimeter, so it was hard to figure out what was going on. There were also none from inside the tent. (Nobody inside the tent filming this? Really???) If you have good links which have clear views of exactly what's going on, please post them. Otherwise you're just kind of waving your hands in the air.

NIKI2

Friday, December 14, 2012 6:31 PM

This guy's a riot: "I honestly, I don't want to use the world 'literally' here...but they, uh, I literally believe, Sean, that if I had defended myself at all, even flicked a small little jab, that they would have killed me where I stood.... " Further on he says "You take a scene from 'The Dark Knight Rises', it is not as bad as this, I expected Bane to walk in with his cheap little mask--I still don't know why that movie is getting great reviews--but yes, I expected these people to actually tear me limb from limb."

This guy is really...well, what can I say. WORSE than "Dark Knight Rising"?? Is he kidding??

Mark, I watched over and over the second airing of the footage, stopping the action, watching again and again. Crowder, whatever he's saying, is shown walking around with his hands in the air like he's trying to placate people...then at 5:56, Crowder ducks his head out of camera range, and the camera "shakes" and points skyward. At 5:59 you can see the back of Crowder's head, and if you stop the action carefully, you can see his left arm is doing something...then the camera swings around to show the guy on the ground, while Crowder walks in front of the camera to the other side. The guy gets right up off the ground and goes for Crowder. I ask again, why did he go straight for Crowder without any provocation...why not go for whoever knocked him down? Unless it was Crowder who knocked him down, just out of camera view, just as the camera is shaken and pointed skyward...

Gee, I dunno...Heaven knows, we've never seen any fraudulent videos from FauxNews before--certainly none they've apologized for THEMSELVES, right?

I gotta give FauxNews credit...they're good!

And yes, I would like to see those "other videos" myself...

Tit for tat got us where we are today. If we want to be grownups, we need to resist the ugliness. If we each did, this would be a better reflection on Firefly and a more welcome place. I will try.

KWICKO

Saturday, December 15, 2012 6:39 AM

Quote:
Originally posted by SIGNYM:
Quote:
Oh yeah, like anyone really needs to STAGE violent protests from the Left in order to make them look bad ? Wow. Baghdad Bob would be envious of these ridiculous attempts at spin.
Yeah. Cause no one would get up in front of the UN and stage a bunch of photoshopped "WMD" sites. No one would "stage" an attack on an American destroyer in the Gulf of Tonkin, or gin up a horrible flow of drugs passing through Panama as a reason to invade, nor snipe innocent citizens in Venezuela in order to foment a crackdown. And nobody would EVER kick down their own tent and blame it on somebody else. Stuff like that would NEVER EVER happen!

Nor would any FauxNews contributor EVER start a fight, edit the video, and then claim that he was assaulted.

http://www.addictinginfo.org/2012/12/13/fox-news-contributor-gets-punc
hed-in-face/

Nope, couldn't EVER happen here. No way.

"I supported Bush in 2000 and 2004 and intellegence [sic] had very little to do with that decision." - Hero

"I was wrong" - Hero, 2012

Mitt Romney, introducing his running mate: "Join me in welcoming the next President of the United States, Paul Ryan!"

Rappy's response? "You're lying, gullible ( believing in some BS you heard on msnbc ) or hard of hearing."

ANTHONYT

Saturday, December 15, 2012 6:49 AM

Quote:

Any evidence of this?

Hello,

I'm confused. You asked me to imagine something, and are now asking me for evidence of my imagination?

Try to concentrate. More and better evidence is what I've been asking for, and you have been lambasting me for requesting.

Quote:
And I've said anything about the 'assaulted cameraman' where?

You should be thinking and talking about that assaulted cameraman, because he is part of the highly edited footage and the person best able to provide the evidence we should both desire.

Quote:
Apparently, you'd rather play word games that address the problem of the violence at the Michigan State House.

I wonder how you construe my distrust of doctored footage as a word game. I am very interested in learning more about the violence. Are you? You seem to have decided that an incomplete picture is the only picture you need.

Quote:
I used to have some respect for you

I sympathize.

--Anthony

Note to Self:
Raptor - woman testifying about birth control is a slut (the term applies.)
Context: http://tinyurl.com/d6ozfej
Six - Wow, isn't Niki quite the CUNT? And, yes, I spell that in all caps....
http://tinyurl.com/bdjgbpe
Wulf - Niki is a stupid fucking bitch who should hurry up and die.
Context: http://tinyurl.com/afve3r9

“The stupid neither forgive nor forget; the naive forgive and forget; the wise forgive but do not forget.” -T. S. Szasz

SIGNYM

Saturday, December 15, 2012 3:38 PM

So rappy posts an opinion based on a highly edited video, Geezer castigates anyone who dares ask for non-edited video. Ah yes, the dynamic duo at work. The Kwicko finds the part where Crowder started the fight by knocking someone down. I hope the "union thug" sues and Crowder is arrested for assault.

Are we done here?

AURAPTOR

Saturday, December 15, 2012 4:09 PM

Quote:
Originally posted by SIGNYM:
So rappy posts an opinion based on a highly edited video, and Geezer castigates anyone who dares ask for non-edited video. Ah yes, the dynamic duo at work.

This thread: complete dud.

No, it's just some here are so willing to ignore what they DO see, and instead wistfully ask to see what REALLY happened, smacks of those who'd blame the victim of a rape case.

And it's not an "OPINION", but merely describing what took place on the video.

" Well, look at what she was wearing. She HAD to have said something to set them off like that "

Unfrakingbelievable.

Fathom the hypocrisy of a government that requires every citizen to prove they are insured... but not everyone must prove they are a citizen

Resident USA Freedom Fundie

" AU, that was great, LOL!! " - Chrisisall

SIGNYM

Saturday, December 15, 2012 4:14 PM

I see we xposted. Did you check out the link that Kwicko posted? The "union thug" was knocked to the ground first. It was suggested in the highly edited video and much more plain in the unedited one. This is just a courtesy wake-up call. After this, I refuse to discuss the topic with someone who is closed-minded to the point of delusion.

AURAPTOR

Saturday, December 15, 2012 4:55 PM

I checked out the link which kwickie posted, above yours, and it didn't in the least bit show anything where the reporter threw the first punch.

I see some big fat goon, yelling at the reporter, telling him to back up, and that's exactly what he does. He backs up.

Maybe there's another link ? Or if it's that one, cite where on the video this is suppose to have taken place.

And what of the guy being pulled by the collar of the shirt, as he's going into the tent. He has his back turned, and some punk cheap shots him, by throwing him down on the ground.

"False words are not only evil in themselves, but they infect the soul with evil." - Socrates

" I do not love the bright sword for its sharpness, nor the arrow for its swiftness, nor the warrior for his glory. I love only that which they defend. "

NIKI2

Saturday, December 15, 2012 5:03 PM

Checked the video, and in that one they DID edit out the section where it shows Crowder ducking under the camera, and just starts where the guy is getting up off the ground. Sorry, but there's no way anyone's going to convince me that a guy knocked to the ground would go after Crowder rather than the guy who knocked him to the ground, if that WASN'T Crowder.

Golly gee, look what I found:

vid=E8Q6Sop7EKo&v=XK04yTgClLc

Check out RIGHT at 1:35--you can clearly see Crowder (easily identified by his hair and black coat) pulling back from the man on the ground, with his fist clearly visible in front of his face, in a striking pose! I managed to get a screen shot of it:

That's what was edited out of the FauxNews video and finally puts it to rest for me.

Also, note that at the very beginning, the guy Crowder is crowding keeps saying "Get out of my face!" several times, and "Back up!"

Quote:
People familiar with conservative media videographers’ penchant for misleading edits immediately smelled a rat when the Crowder clip surfaced on Youtube, edited to show the fight already in progress. Excerpt from http://www.mediaite.com/tv/fox-news-contributor-steven -crowder-confirms-he-started-fight-with-union-protester/

By the way, here's another one, showing a union supporter saying over and over again to the people in the tent, "Get everybody out of there. Get everybody out of there NOW!...you gotta get these people out of there now!" and at 1:50 the same guy who shouts "He's got a gun!" says "You fucking pushed him!"

And there, again, you can see this, just before the camera shows the man on the ground:

The video has been called into question by numerous sources by now, and at one point, in an interview with Canada's Sun News, he said:

Quote:
Crowder says he actually did push the protesters: “We didn’t get violent with them,” Crowder said, “but we did try to push them off the tent. That is true. We tried to push them off the tent" Excerpt from http://www.mediaite.com/tv/fox-news-contributor-steven -crowder-confirms-he-started-fight-with-union-protester/

And finally:

Quote:
Although I've been reporting my suspicions (and other people's) about the truthfulness and integrity of Fox News contributor Steven Crowder's report of being assaulted by pro-union "thugs" at a Lansing, Michigan union protest of "right-to-work" legislation, Crowder's dishonesty is no longer in doubt. His video has been shown to be selectively edited and he has admitted pushing the man who later hit him (after pretending otherwise).
On the night that Crowder first appeared for his lapdog interview with Sean Hannity, I wrote that there was something a little too James O'Keefe about Crowder that made me think he was not being honest about the "vicious attack" on him, caught and presented in an edited video, and which just happened to coincide with his virulently, Breitbart-esque anti-union, anti-left agenda. I became even more suspicious when, during the interview, Crowder admitted he had gone to the pro-union protest to make trouble. Still, he told Hannity his beating was “completely physically unprovoked.”

The next night, in another Hannity segment, a guest accused Crowder of first pushing the man who later punched him - which Crowder, despite a series of dancing, diversionary responses, did not deny. However, Crowder did accuse that guest of being a liar after he made the allegation.

Crowder could hardly have been less forthcoming or more deceptive about what happened. On the night of his second seg

NOTIFY: Y | REPLY | REPLY WITH QUOTE | PERMALINK | TOP | HOME

KWICKO

Saturday, December 15, 2012 5:05 PM

Look at the second video on the link, the one which Hannity showed. At 1:20, you'll see Crowder push the guy to the ground, after which he comes up swinging, as would most people when assaulted in such a way.

Or maybe you don't think victims have the right to defend themselves...

"I supported Bush in 2000 and 2004 and intellegence [sic] had very little to do with that decision." - Hero

"I was wrong" - Hero, 2012

Mitt Romney, introducing his running mate: "Join me in welcoming the next President of the United States, Paul Ryan!"

Rappy's response? "You're lying, gullible ( believing in some BS you heard on msnbc ) or hard of hearing."

AURAPTOR

Saturday, December 15, 2012 5:09 PM

The only victims here were Crowder and free speech.

What you're supporting is mob rule, ala PURE democracy.

Have fun w/ that.

Niki - it's crowded, there are folks pushing, stuff on the ground, ever been in a hostile crowd like that? Union goons are notorious for starting crap, and then claiming they were pushed, first. Point is, those idiots had no right to tear down the tent in the first place. And it was a big tent. If there were folks on one side telling everyone to get out, doesn't mean that everyone around the tent heard it, or knew what was going on, on all around the tent. The excuse making for this sort of lunacy by the Left is unbelievable.

*edit * Are you talking about the part of the video where Crowder says " you just assaulted me " ? Please, that's far from conclusive evidence that he shoved first.

"False words are not only evil in themselves, but they infect the soul with evil." - Socrates

" I do not love the bright sword for its sharpness, nor the arrow for its swiftness, nor the warrior for his glory. I love only that which they defend. "

NIKI2

Saturday, December 15, 2012 5:32 PM

Yup, Mike, I believe that's the second I caught via screen shot.

Apparently from what I'm reading, Crowder (a COMEDIAN, remember) is well known for provoking people, which it was obvious he was doing. He pushed into a guy, then when told repeatedly to back up, he does so, hands in the air, looking innocent. Apparently that wasn't enough for him--we'll never know the details as there are no other good camera angles, but as one person said:

Quote:
At about 1:13, as the tent is coming down, Crowder comes over to the cameraman and waves him off as if to say, “that’s enough filming.” The reason for this becomes clear if you watch this longer, less edited version of the video.

What they apparently don’t want you to see is union members using knives to cut the tent open to let people inside out. Rather, the message that is being sent by the conservative media and blogosphere is that the union members deliberately cut the tent to pieces in an act of malicious vandalism. As Matt Allen points out in his comments HERE, the union members actually ask, “Is everybody out?” and then proceed to make sure that they are.

At 1:49 in the longer video, one union members notes that an AFP guy has a gun and brags that he’s “killed plenty of mother fuckers with a gun” (i.e., he’s killed people who were in possession of guns.) This is being played up as if a UNION MEMBER had a gun. Not true.

There is no question in my mind that AFP and Fox employees set out to incite a huge crowd of very angry people....Crowder uses a technique of intentionally invading your personal space to make you uncomfortable and then peppers you with questions to make you angry. It is an intentional act to incite an angry response. The Capitol grounds were a tinderbox of angry folks and both AFP and Fox News tossed a lit match into it and then blamed the wood for catching fire.Excerpts from http://www.eclectablog.com/2012/12/fox-news-steven-crowder-americans-f
or-prosperity-use-breitbart-style-film-editing-to-show-union-thug-brutality.html

Given that technique is patently obvious at the beginning of the video, I think the author has it right. FauxNews tossed a lit match into a tinderbox then blamed the wood, with the help of selectively-edited footage and their media power.

Enough; we've been here how many times? With FauxNews even in some cases ADMITTING their "error" in editing videos. And if anyone believes their material is edited "erroneously", I've got a bridge I'd like to sell you...

Tit for tat got us where we are today. If we want to be grownups, we need to resist the ugliness. If we each did, this would be a better reflection on Firefly and a more welcome place. I will try.

AURAPTOR

Saturday, December 15, 2012 5:39 PM

Again, Niki tries to blame FOX News, and gives a total pass at the unruly, thuggish mob for vandalism, violence and threats to " KILL 20 people with a gun! "

The day after the tragedy in CT, is anyone looking into that punk union guy's background ? Seriously, why isn't that guy in custody ?

And when Colbert or Stewart do 'hard hitting news reporting', it's valid as hell to the Left, because THEY'RE so smart when they do it. But if Crowder does it, oh, he's JUST a comedian,and knows how to incite a large audience.

Tit for tat, anyone ?

"False words are not only evil in themselves, but they infect the soul with evil." - Socrates

" I do not love the bright sword for its sharpness, nor the arrow for its swiftness, nor the warrior for his glory. I love only that which they defend. "

NIKI2

Saturday, December 15, 2012 5:45 PM

As to the "You assaulted me", according to Crowder

Quote:
"...the man who was coming at me I think tripped over the tent peg, fell towards me, and that’s when I said ‘You assaulted me.’" http://www.forbes.com/sites/gregorymcneal/2012/12/14/what-did-steven-c
rowder-say-about-his-video-editing/

So apparently Crowder, even recognizing that someone had tripped, claimed the man had "assaulted" him. So, let's see, even SEEING someone trip and fall toward him, Crowder claims it's an "assault". Boy, is that telling.

The whole thing is a crock of shit. Period.

Tit for tat got us where we are today. If we want to be grownups, we need to resist the ugliness. If we each did, this would be a better reflection on Firefly and a more welcome place. I will try.

AURAPTOR

Saturday, December 15, 2012 5:47 PM

Sorry, not a crock, Niki. They did pull down that tent. They did assault Crowder. Can't deny ANY of that.

"False words are not only evil in themselves, but they infect the soul with evil." - Socrates

" I do not love the bright sword for its sharpness, nor the arrow for its swiftness, nor the warrior for his glory. I love only that which they defend. "

1KIKI

Sunday, December 16, 2012 3:16 AM

And once again little Rappy shows us all how he's really just a three year old having a tantrum.

ENJOY YOUR NEXT FOUR YEARS!

HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA - HERE'S LAUGHING AT YOU KID!

KWICKO

Sunday, December 16, 2012 4:54 AM

Quote:
Originally posted by AURaptor:

The day after the tragedy in CT, is anyone looking into that punk union guy's background ? Seriously, why isn't that guy in custody ?

"The only victims here were ... free speech."

And you have no problem with that, it seems.

"I supported Bush in 2000 and 2004 and intellegence [sic] had very little to do with that decision." - Hero

"I was wrong" - Hero, 2012

Mitt Romney, introducing his running mate: "Join me in welcoming the next President of the United States, Paul Ryan!"

Rappy's response? "You're lying, gullible ( believing in some BS you heard on msnbc ) or hard of hearing."

KWICKO

Sunday, December 16, 2012 4:56 AM

Quote:
Originally posted by AURaptor:

Sorry, not a crock, Niki. They did pull down that tent. They did assault Crowder. Can't deny ANY of that.

Can deny it, easily. What you can't do is prove what you claim. As usual, you're falling for a heavily-edited video and calling it "proof". I suppose Lord of the Rings is "proof" that hobbits are real, too, right?

"I supported Bush in 2000 and 2004 and intellegence [sic] had very little to do with that decision." - Hero

"I was wrong" - Hero, 2012

Mitt Romney, introducing his running mate: "Join me in welcoming the next President of the United States, Paul Ryan!"

Rappy's response? "You're lying, gullible ( believing in some BS you heard on msnbc ) or hard of hearing."

JONGSSTRAW

Sunday, December 16, 2012 5:47 AM

Here's the man himself describing the tent/hot dog cart incident.

and here's my new hero. No one has ever said it better! He pulls no punches in calling out the real racists in America.

A formal complaint has now been filed by AFP with the Michigan State Police. They are "investigating". I'm not holding my breath.

This one was before the election. Oh well....it's still funny.

AURAPTOR

Sunday, December 16, 2012 12:22 PM

Quote:
Originally posted by 1kiki:
And once again little Rappy shows us all how he's really just a three year old having a tantrum.

The only 3 yr olds having a tantrum are the union thugs, who are willing to kill to keep people from having the freedom to choose for themselves if the want to join a union or not.

"False words are not only evil in themselves, but they infect the soul with evil." - Socrates

" I do not love the bright sword for its sharpness, nor the arrow for its swiftness, nor the warrior for his glory. I love only that which they defend. "

AURAPTOR

Sunday, December 16, 2012 12:25 PM

Quote:
Originally posted by Kwicko:
Quote:
Originally posted by AURaptor:

The day after the tragedy in CT, is anyone looking into that punk union guy's background ? Seriously, why isn't that guy in custody ?

"The only victims here were ... free speech."

And you have no problem with that, it seems.

It's not free speech to threaten to murder 20 people, with a gun. I do believe that's constituted as an assault.

"False words are not only evil in themselves, but they infect the soul with evil." - Socrates

" I do not love the bright sword for its sharpness, nor the arrow for its swiftness, nor the warrior for his glory. I love only that which they defend. "

AURAPTOR

Sunday, December 16, 2012 12:30 PM

Jongs - Great video. Some will claim this didn't happen, and that it's all Crowder's fault, he staged all this , and here's a local businessman who has no ties to the conservative group, other than just to hand out hot dogs. The union thugs called him 'n-word', as well as uncle Tom, but of course, it's ME who is having the 'temper tantrum' over what these punks did to this guy.

"False words are not only evil in themselves, but they infect the soul with evil." - Socrates

" I do not love the bright sword for its sharpness, nor the arrow for its swiftness, nor the warrior for his glory. I love only that which they defend. "

NIKI2

Sunday, December 16, 2012 3:21 PM

I abhor violence by anyone at any time. I also abhor what the protesters did in cheering the collapse of the tent, and anything else violent they did. This video proves nothing, however; I didn't see any video of any of that happening, two guys in masks could have been anyone, including AFP or others doing exactly what Crowder did, so without proof, it is one witness' statement versus another's, and the other had video to back it up,plus Crowder admitting he pushed someone and him being caught in a lie. Given his past actions, I find that more convincing, along with that of the other witness.

I only watched a few seconds of the second video--it's obviously an opinion rant of some sort or other, and didn't bother with the third.

We will never know conclusively what happened, it's as simple as that. Each of us has to believe what we think was true.

Tit for tat got us where we are today. If we want to be grownups, we need to resist the ugliness. If we each did, this would be a better reflection on Firefly and a more welcome place. I will try.

JAYNEZTOWN

Tuesday, January 31, 2023 9:02 PM

The Great British Walkout: Rishi Sunak braces for biggest UK strike in 12 years

https://www.politico.eu/article/great-britain-walkout-rishi-sunak-uk-u
nited-kingdom-workers-strike/