Legislators quick to limit Free Speech to protect Grieving Families
POSTED BY: AnthonyT
UPDATED: Monday, January 24, 2011 02:36
VIEWED: 6327
PAGE 9 of 9
Quote:
Originally posted by canttakesky:Quote:It would be telling if Magon sees any difference between the USA today and the German govt before the Third Reich.
Originally posted by AnthonyT:
We are absolutely not peaceful, and we are currently experiencing one or more of the named criteria of tyrannical inception named by Magons.
No, I don't see many similarities from where I stand.
Germany had lost millions in WW1, and then in the aftermath of the spanish flu, mostly young people as well. The pre system of governance, the Germany monarchy was overthrown, and in the ensuing chaos the Weimar Republic was established, which almost immediately came under threat from left and right forces. Fighting broke out in a number of areas in the country for contol between the extremes. The country suffered economic collapse, hyperinflation - the Mark was virtually valueless. The Treaty of Versaille had stripped Germany of all its colonies and much of it resource rich lands.
It was basically a country at civil war, its population nearly decimated and demoralised, it economy bankrupt and in ruins.
Do you see similarities?
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Geez, this system is flawed.
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Quote:Of course. It goes without saying that when comparing any two things at all, there will be both similarities and differences.
Originally posted by Magonsdaughter:
Do you see similarities?
1. The Weimar Republic was a democracy. The USA is a democracy. The WR actually had more party plurality than the USA. For example, here:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/German_federal_election,_1930
But the mechanisms for peaceful political change were there.
2. The Weimar Republic suffered from Depression and inflation. Post 9/11 USA suffered a Depression and inflation. WR's economy was worse by far, but the general economic hardships are there.
3. The Weimar Republic suffered strain from civil war (in large cities) and chronic military engagements. Post 9/11 USA suffered strain from civil war (in occupied Iraq and Afghanistan) and chronic military engagements. WR's military engagements were worse by far (because the civil wars were in country), but the general war weariness is there.
4. The Weimar Republic faced internal and external threats (internal from insurgents and external from neighbors who wanted their war reparations). Post 9/11 USA faces internal and external threats from domestic and foreign terrorists. The general hypervigilance was there.
I can go on, but you see the direction I'm heading. There is enough strain, weariness, and fear that people were willing to use the democratic process to sacrifice freedom for more security. Hitler took advantage of that and invoked enough terror to assume increasing control of the government.
Those are the similarities I see. If we had one more terrorist attack, it would open the door for an American Hitler. From there, you can follow Naomi Wolf's road map in The End of America.
I also see a civil war as a possible scenario, should an American Hitler rise to power. Unfortunately, I don't see that even a civil war would prevent tyranny. I think, because of the slippery slope, enough Americans are accustomed to a controlling govt that rebels would not be able to win that civil war. It would only cause unending death before the inevitable tyranny.
ETA: I should note that the Retenmark was instituted in 1923 and stabilized the hyperinflation. This allowed the Reichmark to stabilize the economy in 1924, well before the Nazi's came to power. So the utter economic ruin you spoke of didn't last that long.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Weimar_Republic
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Everything I say is just my opinion, not fact.
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I think that you can see similarities in anything if you really want to. Germany and the USA are both countries where people live. Doesn't mean much does it. On the spectrum of suffering, Germany and the US are a long way from one another. The US has been, and still is, one of the most prosperous, powerful nations on the planet. Probably one of the most prosperous and powerful nations we've ever encountered. So the crown is slipping somewhat, and it doesn't feel as good as it used to. But guess what, your still up there at the top of the ladder.
Have millions died in war and pestilence? No.
Have you recently had your political system overthrown? No
Do you have civil war ie actual fighting in parts of the country? No
Do you have complete economic collapse? No
The Weimar Republic was a baby democracy, a tenuous one at that. It barely had a chance to establish itself before it was replaced. It was always under serious threat from extremism, and I don't mean the kind of extremism that gets itself elected and has extreme policies, but the kind that overthrows the system of government.
I think the conditions are extremely different currently. They may get worse, or it may stay about the same.
Most historians would link the collapse of the Mark through hyperinflation as having a significant influence on the rise of the nazi party.
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