Angel Raped Buffy, Spike only tried

POSTED BY: FURYFIRE
UPDATED: Saturday, July 24, 2004 20:07
VIEWED: 35067
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NUR

Thursday, May 27, 2004 9:03 PM

Quote:
Originally posted by Elysian:
Did Angel rape Buffy in "I Will Remember You"? He slept with her and then stripped her of her memories of that. No-one can ever consent to sex without knowing that their memory of it will be gone . . . I don't think.

Insofar as Spike . . . Spike was a victim of domestic abuse. She beat him constantly. I know domestic abuse can be a qualifier for murder, say if you lost control and killed your abuser. Can anyone say that Spike was in his right mind?! I'm not sure that excuses what he did, but it does put it in a context.

Comments?

So I'm a little late but I agree completely. Spike has taken a lot of flack for that incident. I'm not saying that what he did was excuseable but rather quite understandable. I once saw it put in the framework of reversing their roles. Imagine you heard a story about a man who constantly goes to a woman he knows loves him and practically forces her into repeated rough sex then tells her at ever oportunity that she's worse that the dirt between his toes. Once, she's had enough of being degraded and violated on his terms, she turns around and gets a little rough with him wanting to turn the tables and take a little control back into her life. Would we say that she tried to rape him? Not at all, its all in the perception of the situation.

On a random note, for personal reasons I would completely disagree with anyone that tried to argue that Angel raped Buffy. Statutory rape and rape rape can be two very different things.

http://www.thecherryorchard.net

Those who restrain desire, do so because thiers is weak enough to be restrained.
-William Blake

O my Lord! bestow wisdom on me, and join me with the righteous.
-Qur'an 26:83

ACTORGURL3

Thursday, July 22, 2004 10:10 PM

Considering it is only sagitory rape if you are not "legal" the legal age is 16 so there fore she was not doing anything illegal. Had she been doing something illegal, she gave her consesus to him and would only sue if he gave her an std or pregnancy and refused to help. Otherwise, she asked for it and at first he refused.

Hazel: Paige, I just saw Spinner. He was completely out of line.
Paige: [crying] It wasn't what I thought, you know? First time, I thought it would be beautiful or something. It's so stupid.
Hazel: It's not stupid
Paige: Those shoes, I wanted it to work. I wanted him to want to be with me.
Hazel: He did want to be with you.
Paige: Yea, sure.
Hazel: He'll call you. You don't have to worry.
Paige: I didn't even want to do it Hazel. I said No, over and over and over.
Hazel: You said no? and he didn't listen?
Paige: He just pushed me down, harder, and he wouldn't stop. He just wouldn't stop.
Hazel: Paige, Honey. If you said no, that's rape.
Paige: Don't touch me. Don't ever touch me.
Spinner: Why not? Everyone else does.
Spinner: He took it too far, like Hazel said, right? Didn't he?

PVC we rock on, we rock on till the break of dawn, hip hop, don't stop, we will make your body rock. rock rock roll rol icy icy cold cold disco disco beat beat pvc sweet sweet!

FURYFIRE

Friday, July 23, 2004 5:30 PM

Excuse me? How is it understandable that he was allowed to rape her??? Doesn't matter what his feelings were or what his intentions were, he tried to bloody well rape her, and those actions can never be deemed understandable.

And in response to that other post above, Angel didn't rape Buffy in I Will Remember You, she was in a full frame of mind when she consented, he only raped her in Innocence.

If you know anyone that can help my screenwriting career, please help! And yes, I am self-advertising here. Hehehe, me such a little devil.

CHRISTHECYNIC

Friday, July 23, 2004 5:49 PM

Why couldn't this thread just die?

As I said before I don't think the laws cover the event in which a dead person has sex with one below the age of consent. As such we fall back on the fact that it was consensual and forget the established legal age of consent.

Yes, legally with the ages of them what happened would be considered rape, but it would also be considered necrophilia. I think it’s just an eventuality law doesn’t cover.

LOSTINTHEVERSE

Friday, July 23, 2004 7:32 PM

Here's how I see this playing out. (I was never a religious fan of the show, though I've seen a few eps here and there)

Angel is vulnerable to be charged with Statutory rape. Through other actions, Buffy has proven her ability to consent and understand her actions, though in trying to prove that most courts would probably rule her insane (I mean,

Quote:
"Well, I can give consent because I go around killing vampires and vaquishing demons in my free time. Those are pretty heavy decisions. Fire bad. Tree pretty."

sounds more than a little crazy). So there goes any shot of her ability to give consent at all. Of course, Buffy's mom would have to press charges, which doesn't seem likely.

Now:
Given that necrophilia is illegal... what about if 2 vampires have fully consentual sex? eh? Where does hot Undead-on-Undead action fall into all of this? Now that can lead to some interesting legal discussions.

~ Lost In The 'Verse

"About a year before we met, I spent 6 months on a moon where the primary form of recreation was juggling geese. My hand to god. Baby geese. Goslings. They were juggled!"

NUR

Saturday, July 24, 2004 8:07 PM

Quote:
Originally posted by FURYFIRE:
Excuse me? How is it understandable that he was allowed to rape her???

1)If he was allowed it wouldn't be rape then would it?

2)He wasn't allowed and though he tried, he didn't succeed.

Apart from those 2 little corrections I feel no need to respond to anything else you've said. You aren't seeing everything that led up to the incident and you didn't listen to what I said the first time.

http://www.livejournal.com/users/fleshlycherry/

Those who restrain desire, do so because thiers is weak enough to be restrained.
-William Blake

O my Lord! bestow wisdom on me, and join me with the righteous.
-Qur'an 26:83

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