The Irony of Islamophobia...The rational man's irrational fear...
POSTED BY: kaneman
UPDATED: Saturday, September 11, 2010 01:12
VIEWED: 4480
PAGE 3 of 4
Quote:
Originally posted by Storymark:Quote:
Originally posted by kaneman:
They have been doing it for hundreds of years in the name of their FUCKING god...read what I just wrote, again, once more. In the name of GOD.
So did Christians for centuries. They outgrew it. It can happen again.
"I thoroughly disapprove of duels. If a man should challenge me, I would take him kindly and forgivingly by the hand and lead him to a quiet place and kill him."
Sure, and that is horrible, but one doesn't justify the other. Christians stopped now it is time Muslims stop this threat of violence over anything....
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Quote:
Originally posted by Jongsstraw:Quote:
Originally posted by Wagneraude:
Is this Christianity as you know it?
No.
But it is happening today in Islamic theocracies like Iran. Whipping, stoning, hangings, ect., etc, and killing homosexuals.
It is also happening in Christian theocracies like Uganda. Only for some reason, nobody seems to want to talk about that. Probably because it's being done with the backing and approval of the GOP here in America.
AURaptor's Greatest Hits:
Friday, May 28, 2010 - 20:32 To AnthonyT:
Go fuck yourself.
On this matter, make no mistake. I want you to go fuck yourself long and hard, as well as anyone who agrees with you. I got no use for you.
Friday, May 28, 2010 - 18:26 To President Obama:
Mr. President, you're a god damn, mother fucking liar.
Fuck you, you cock sucking community activist piece of shit.
... go fuck yourself, Mr. President.
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Quote:
Originally posted by Jongsstraw:Quote:
Originally posted by Righteous9:
Personally I'm an atheist...well, agnostic officially, and it's all unverifiable bullshit to me,
Unverifiable bullshit? I guess you weren't paying attention when Shepherd Book explained about religion and faith to River.Quote:
but big churches are usually just trying to keep as much power as they can, appeasing the status quo as much as they can. that status quo has been slavery, converting and killing native americans, crusades, witch burnings, lutheran killings, catholic killings...etc. etc. depending on the time and the place
The past is prologue. I live in the present. I've gone to church for many decades, and no one has ever advocated any of the things you cited.
You mean no one IN YOUR CHURCH. But certainly, there are more than one brand of Christianity, you'd no doubt agree; and certainly, SOME of those churches most assuredly HAVE (and still do) advocate such things. To insist otherwise is to succumb to a delusional kind of blindness.
Quote:
You cannot draw moral equivalencies to how our ancestors behaved in the past to our modern sensibilities.
So do you promise to stop telling us what the Founding Fathers believed and meant, then?
Quote:
Lincoln suspended habeas corpus, FDR interned Japanese Americans. We've grown and learned from our mistakes of the past. Has Islam?
Have we? Bush suspended habeas as well, remember. And there have been more than a few around here who've gone with the "just nuke 'em all" blast when it comes to the mid-east. So HAVE we grown and learned?
AURaptor's Greatest Hits:
Friday, May 28, 2010 - 20:32 To AnthonyT:
Go fuck yourself.
On this matter, make no mistake. I want you to go fuck yourself long and hard, as well as anyone who agrees with you. I got no use for you.
Friday, May 28, 2010 - 18:26 To President Obama:
Mr. President, you're a god damn, mother fucking liar.
Fuck you, you cock sucking community activist piece of shit.
... go fuck yourself, Mr. President.
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Quote:
Originally posted by Kwicko:Quote:
Originally posted by Jongsstraw:Quote:
Originally posted by Wagneraude:
Is this Christianity as you know it?
No.
But it is happening today in Islamic theocracies like Iran. Whipping, stoning, hangings, ect., etc, and killing homosexuals.
It is also happening in Christian theocracies like Uganda. Only for some reason, nobody seems to want to talk about that. Probably because it's being done with the backing and approval of the GOP here in America.
AURaptor's Greatest Hits:
Friday, May 28, 2010 - 20:32 To AnthonyT:
Go fuck yourself.
On this matter, make no mistake. I want you to go fuck yourself long and hard, as well as anyone who agrees with you. I got no use for you.
Friday, May 28, 2010 - 18:26 To President Obama:
Mr. President, you're a god damn, mother fucking liar.
Fuck you, you cock sucking community activist piece of shit.
... go fuck yourself, Mr. President.
No-one cares about a barbaric black nation doing what they do...because..the powers that be know what I know and you disagree...Blacks are animals and can not create a just society...do you really think that is in the name of Jesus? Or just another reason to rape and pillage their own people?.....I know the answer, do you? Get your head out of your boyfriend's liberal ass and get a clue.....Sick and tired that all your arguments consist of "A" did it...so it is okay that "B" does it, but you never talk about the wrongness of it all...be a man...a gay man. Fag.
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Quote:
Originally posted by kaneman:Quote:
Originally posted by Kwicko:
So your response to killing in the name of god, is to...
... kill, in the name of YOUR god.
And you don't even see they idiocy in that equation.
When have I ever said kill them in the name of god? where do you get this shit? I say defend ourselves and do not minimalize the threat behind limp-wristed liberal "all is lovey dovey" ideologue.....no mention of god here. Kill them in the name of family and country.....just one girl's opinion
Oh, you know very well where and when you said it. It was in that thread where you kept insisting everyone who disagreed with you must be gay. Remember?
AURaptor's Greatest Hits:
Friday, May 28, 2010 - 20:32 To AnthonyT:
Go fuck yourself.
On this matter, make no mistake. I want you to go fuck yourself long and hard, as well as anyone who agrees with you. I got no use for you.
Friday, May 28, 2010 - 18:26 To President Obama:
Mr. President, you're a god damn, mother fucking liar.
Fuck you, you cock sucking community activist piece of shit.
... go fuck yourself, Mr. President.
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Quote:
Originally posted by kaneman:Quote:
Originally posted by Kwicko:Quote:
Originally posted by Jongsstraw:Quote:
Originally posted by Wagneraude:
Is this Christianity as you know it?
No.
But it is happening today in Islamic theocracies like Iran. Whipping, stoning, hangings, ect., etc, and killing homosexuals.
It is also happening in Christian theocracies like Uganda. Only for some reason, nobody seems to want to talk about that. Probably because it's being done with the backing and approval of the GOP here in America.
AURaptor's Greatest Hits:
Friday, May 28, 2010 - 20:32 To AnthonyT:
Go fuck yourself.
On this matter, make no mistake. I want you to go fuck yourself long and hard, as well as anyone who agrees with you. I got no use for you.
Friday, May 28, 2010 - 18:26 To President Obama:
Mr. President, you're a god damn, mother fucking liar.
Fuck you, you cock sucking community activist piece of shit.
... go fuck yourself, Mr. President.
No-one cares about a barbaric black nation doing what they do...because..the powers that be know what I know and you disagree...Blacks are animals and can not create a just society...do you really think that is in the name of Jesus? Or just another reason to rape and pillage their own people?.....I know the answer, do you? Get your head out of your boyfriend's liberal ass and get a clue.....Sick and tired that all your arguments consist of "A" did it...so it is okay that "B" does it, but you never talk about the wrongness of it all...be a man...a gay man. Fag.
And that's you in total. Anyone who disagrees with you is gay, and you see gays everywhere. So in addition to being a scared little Islamophobic bitch, you're also a homophobe, seeing "the gay" everywhere it isn't.
Uganda passed laws calling for the execution of homosexuals, and they did so at the urging and with the backing of the GOP and the conservatives in the U.S., and their claim is that it's all in the name of Jesus.
Funny that you're so willing to accept the religious aspects of it when Muslims do it, but are unwilling to accept the religious aspects of it when Christians do it, and even SAY they're doing it for religious reasons.
Says a lot about you.
Of course, given your hatred of blacks and gays, AND your own claims to be a black lesbian, that's really telling, too. You must think very little of yourself.
AURaptor's Greatest Hits:
Friday, May 28, 2010 - 20:32 To AnthonyT:
Go fuck yourself.
On this matter, make no mistake. I want you to go fuck yourself long and hard, as well as anyone who agrees with you. I got no use for you.
Friday, May 28, 2010 - 18:26 To President Obama:
Mr. President, you're a god damn, mother fucking liar.
Fuck you, you cock sucking community activist piece of shit.
... go fuck yourself, Mr. President.
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To respond to the articles you posted and crimes you listed, JS:
Saying 9/11 was an “attack by Islam” is identical to saying abortion doctors were “attacked by Christians”. Both represent extremists; that Al Qaeda made use of religion to incite people is no different than any other group utilizing any other religion to gain support for it’s goals.
I reject that “three things you didn’t know” article The articles are interesting, but biased and misleading, in one case, outright lies. The overriding goals of Islam are:
adl: balance
ahsan: compassion
ilm: knowledge
sabr: patience
All religions can be utilized for evil purposes, and virtually all have been. The fact of theocracy in Muslim countries makes it all the more easy to rule the people through religion, as was mentioned elsewhere.
Here’s the outright lie, which makes the other statements, to me, questionable: Taqiya means believers may CONCEAL THEIR MUSLIM FAITH when under threat:Quote:
Wikipedia
Taqiya is the Islamic practice of precautionary dissimulation whereby believers may conceal their Muslim faith when under threat, persecution or compulsion. The practice of concealing one’s faith in dangerous circumstances originates in the Qur’an itself, which deems blameless those who disguise their beliefs in such cases
As to Shari’a law:Quote:
Wikipedia
All Muslims believe Sharia is God's law, but they have differences among themselves as to exactly what it entails. Modernists, traditionalists and fundamentalists all hold different views of Sharia, as do adherents to different schools of Islamic thought and scholarship. Different countries and cultures have varying interpretations of Sharia as well.
Introduction (or reintroduction) of Sharia is a longstanding goal for Islamist movements in Muslim countries. Some Muslim minorities in Asia (e.g. India) have attained institutional recognition of Sharia to adjudicate their personal and community affairs. In Western countries, where Muslim immigration is more recent, Muslim minorities have introduced Sharia family law, for use in their own disputes.
The crimes and punishments you listed all have caveats, which you left out. For example:Quote:
Wikipedia
In accordance with the Qur'an and several hadith, theft is punished by imprisonment or amputation of hands. Several requirements are in place for the amputation of hands, they are:
There must have been criminal intent to take private (not common) property.
The theft must not have been the product of hunger, necessity, or duress.
The goods stolen must: be over a minimum value, not haraam, and not owned by the thief's family.
Goods must have been taken from custody (i.e. not in a public place).
There must be reliable witnesses.
All of these must be met under the scrutiny of judicial authority.
There is also the thing about adultery.Quote:
Wikipedia
There are several conditions related to the person who commits adultery that must be met. One of the difficult ones is that the punishment cannot be enforced unless the person confesses, or there are four male eyewitnesses who each saw, simultaneously, the penis of the man inside the vulva of the woman. All of these must be met under the scrutiny of judicial authority.
By making those flat statements, you are omitting all the caveats and thus misinforming. All the antiquated laws in our country, considered “Christian laws” by many (especially when they were created) are as absurd and unused as many of the laws of Shari’a, except by fundamentalists and extremists. Extremist Muslims abide strictly to Shari’a Law, but in different countries and different sects, Shari’a Law is not the same.
Check out some of the laws still on our books here in America: http://www.lawsome.net/.. We still have laws on the books like:Quote:
Florida:
Women may be fined for falling asleep under a hair dryer, as can the salon owner
A special law prohibits unmarried women from parach
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Quote:
Originally posted by Kwicko:
So your response to killing in the name of god, is to...
... kill, in the name of YOUR god.
And you don't even see they idiocy in that equation.
How about we just kill, to stop the other killers ?
“I do not love the bright sword for it's sharpness, nor the arrow for it's swiftness, nor the warrior for his glory. I love only that which they defend”
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Thank you, Wagner, HappyTrader and Righteous, for speaking up. It won’t do any good, but I appreciate it, and I appreciate someone with fuller knowledge than most of us have, Wagner, for putting things in perspective.Quote:
Right on. The Imams interpret for them, and just like extremists everywhere, mold things to fit their own agenda.
I can't speak for Muslims or terrorist of course, but I would hazard a guess that the more violent ones don't read or interpret their holy book for themselves.
Uhhh, JS, if you want current theology, again you have to deal with “Christians” who kill doctors, Christian hate crimes against homosexuals, and a whole bunch of other stuff done in the name of a religion. Because your individual experiences don’t include things in no way mitigates the fact that THEY HAPPEN.
Trader, there are parts of the Bible which do talk of violent punishments, but anyone who still abides by such things is missing the point. All religious texts can be used out of context to incite or excuse violence.
JS, I have no desire to “denigrate” Christianity; the effort is to show that virtually all religions can be used to justify bad actions, and since the argument is about Islam, a religion most of us are more familiar with can be shown to have its corollaries. We’re mostly familiar with Christianity, so it’s easiest to compare, and there are many comparisons.Quote:
It’s not legally condoned, but it’s happening here in America, and elsewhere. Can you deny that?
What modern Christian nations today are killing homosexuals?
Righteous, excellently said:Quote:
Kane, your cracks like libs say “all is lovey dovey” are so damned stupid...show me ONE such remark made by anyone, lib or otherwise, anywhere or at any time on this forum, or by anyone at any time anywhere?
you're trying to make islam its own special isolated circumstance...
I'm saying its as regressive as it is because it has thrived in a region that has for the most part remained a third world, impoverished culture. This is of course a chicken and the egg issue, in that the religion is partly responsible for that.
I would also argue, and if you haven't been listening to any rhettoric from some christians these days, maybe you've just missed it, that should we reenter third world status, we would certainly see more of the uglier side of "christian" potential.
Good point, Mike; Christianity IS being used to justify horrible things, right now, today, in some “Christian” nations. Leaving the GOP out of it, how does that negate that Islam has been used to justify horrible things? And I agree, I don’t think we’ve learned all that much from our own past; we ignore it when things come up (like 9/11) that stir emotions. Habeas is an excellent example...so is waterboarding, which is illegal in this country and by agreement of “Western nations”.
Hippie Operative Nikovich Nikita Nicovna Talibani,
Contracted Agent of Veritas Oilspillus, code name “Nike”,
signing off 
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Attempts at rational debate and perspective seem impossible to me here. I've clarified some things for those who care; obviously there are those among us who don't care and who choose to view Islam as the enemy and choose to be incapable of recognizing that terrorists EVERYWHERE use relgion as a justification; nothing will make them see otherwise.
Ergo, why bother further? I'm grateful some have spoken up with rational arguments and facts, it's nice to see.
"Libs" aren't "fuzzy" or "lovey dovey", that's never been said or intimated. But it's obvious the other side is "hatey-hatey" and "nuke 'em all" and can't/won't see past it, whatever arguments and facts are presented. It's a shame we can't all recognize that religion--any religion--can be used to stir up the masses and justify horrible things, and separate those extremists and power-mongers who do so as individuals, not representative of the religion they are abusing.
Hippie Operative Nikovich Nikita Nicovna Talibani,
Contracted Agent of Veritas Oilspillus, code name “Nike”,
signing off
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