So, how does that student debt taste ?

POSTED BY: Fremdfirma
UPDATED: Friday, October 9, 2009 17:54
VIEWED: 1353
PAGE 1 of 1

FREMDFIRMA

Thursday, October 8, 2009 8:20 PM

I am gettin more and more folk with degrees posting resumes, which considering what we pay for residential security work kinda saddens me, since that expensive as all hell "education" is supposed to be the answer, innit ?
*dripping sarcasm*

I mean, that's always the answer, more education, more debt, bigger sheepskins, right ?
I mean, it magically makes jobs appear or something.
*snark*

No, what it DOES, is make you too much of a hassle and too expensive to hire, and ensures your ass winds up slaving away down at the quickie mart just to keep up with the debt, is what it does.

All for a piece of paper of very debateable value that's little more than a join the club invite card.
http://www.strike-the-root.com/92/votlucka/votlucka1.html
http://www.indystar.com/article/20090927/BUSINESS/909270386/Jobless%2B
recent%2Bcollege%2Bgrads%2Bworry%2Babout%2Btheir%2Bloans

One of the applicants actually avoided any mention of his degree in his resume/application - a bit silly this, since a security company isn't gonna find out ?

I may just hire him, but he's gonna get a reprimand and extended probationary period for that one if I do.

Damn sad day when a computer science major is walking a watchman round, but a man has to eat, I guess.

-Frem

It cannot be said enough, those who do not learn from history, are doomed to endlessly repeat it

WULFENSTAR

Thursday, October 8, 2009 8:25 PM

HI-larious.

I put in my time all over the East Coast.

Even did time at Princeton.

I can say this... that piece of paper gets you in the door, the rest is up to you.

And truth be told...if you have a lot of experience... well, that piece of paper you paid so much for... is worth fuck-all.

PIRATENEWS

Thursday, October 8, 2009 9:50 PM

Skools dont teach how to own your own business, they train workers for factories (that don't exist anymore).

A diploma is nothing but a receipt of $100,000 invoice (debt).

STORYMARK

Thursday, October 8, 2009 10:19 PM

So what is your point here? People should be less educated?

Great plan....

"I thoroughly disapprove of duels. If a man should challenge me, I would take him kindly and forgivingly by the hand and lead him to a quiet place and kill him."

KWICKO

Thursday, October 8, 2009 10:23 PM

Quote:

Skools dont teach how to own your own business, they train workers for factories (that don't exist anymore).

Apparently, you went to the wrong classes. And you really sucked at them, because you can't seem to correctly spell "school".

FREMDFIRMA

Friday, October 9, 2009 12:59 AM

Storymark ?

Apprenticeships, Trade schools, more emphasis on WHAT you know, and how well you can apply it, than how much you paid for it.

That, and you could cheat, too - this link does ME little good since imma dyscalc, but what the hell it's free.

Same education, no sheepskin - and you'll see where I am goin with that.
http://ocw.mit.edu/OcwWeb/web/home/home/index.htm
We've come to the sillyness of valuing the paper more than the learning.

That, and outsourcing oughta come with heavy tariffs on the company what does it - you wanna be an american business, hire americans, elsewise you're just a foreign company operating here and should be subject to the same rules as any other.
Do you HEAR ME, Billy Ford ? *hissss*

-F

DREAMTROVE

Friday, October 9, 2009 1:46 AM

Huh, Frem, an almost united response

Story, I never found my lack of an "education" to be a problem. I think this is pretty on the money, but I'll add one if the intermittent net will let me:

Yes, they train slaves, and make slaves through debt, but they also indoctrinate people into a narrow mindset with a religious belief in the power of the state and the evils of chaos.

At least that frees people from the hard task of thinking...

MANGOLO

Friday, October 9, 2009 8:59 AM

My son is going to college, but I did have a sit down with him and ask him if he wanted to learn a trade - a dozer driver makes $125/hr if he owns the dozer. The dozer costs less than a college education. $100k goes a long way to starting a business.

On the other hand:

I loved my college experience and it took a long time (9 years for 2 BAs and 1 MA) because I worked and paid as I went, but it hasn't helped me get in the door. The unions here don't really like to hear about your college degree. It is actually a strike against you - "You asking for work as a Gaffer, but you really want to direct!"

So I built my own door. Late night rant....sorry. back to Big Bang Theory.

FREMDFIRMA

Friday, October 9, 2009 5:51 PM

(WHOOP WHOOP, RANT ALERT, RANT ALERT)

Oh man, I just HAVE to savage this article - given how fulla shit it is.

CIOs complain college grads aren't ready for IT work
http://www.computerworld.com/s/article/342347/Crossing_the_Skills_Gap?
taxonomyId=0&pageNumber=1

Firstoff, WTF does a CIO know about the real world - only time they even see it is through the window of their limo from their cushy gated community to the fucking boardroom table - hell, to be honest most of em are AFRAID of the real world, and even more so of us Morlocks, something the ex loved to exploit by introducing her S/O (that bein me) to these berks, reminding them there are not-very-nice people in the world who don't work on the same little social rules that keep employees from wringing your damn fool neck, but I digress...

Quote:
Not exactly, CIOs say. More often than not, there are significant gaps between what even the smartest and most tech-savvy graduates learned in school and what CIOs need from new members of their IT staffs.

Now this I can buy, college is a slightly different environment, but it really *IS* a failure of the curriculum when they do not provide the advertised service, is it not ?

Should you not be entitled to a discount or refund if the provided service doesn't match the offer, and should that be intentional, shouldn't they be liable for fraud ?

I am aware of a case where some lady is suing to get her tuition back, but it's not really clear cut enough in that one to use as an example here.

Quote:
What's more is that most companies have neither the time nor the money for on-the-job training. They'd prefer that universities incorporate more training for real-world IT roles into their curricula so that graduates are ready to start contributing their first day on the job.

Then THEY can bloody well pay for it, or apply pressure to the universities, instead of blaming the consumers of a product they have little to no control over the quality of, duh!

Quote:
"The problem is that universities don't train people to take jobs," says Michael Gabriel, CIO at Home Box Office in New York. "If they were better prepared to hit the ground running, they would be a more effective and lower-cost resource that could compete with offshore talent. They wouldn't hit potential constraints imposed by the time and effort required to get them to be productive."

I call bullshit, what the offshore-outsourcing crowd has as an advantage is a lack of fuckin overhead, like paying taxes, like having massive student debt, and all the other expenses an american employee MUST cover, and thus be paid enough to cover, in order to work for you.

Quote:
Most of the college graduates that Cindy Warkentin talks to have what she considers "unrealistic expectations." "I had one young man tell me that unless I could offer him $75,000 or above, he's not interested. That's way above what's normal for a trainee," says the CIO at Maryland Automobile Insurance Fund in Annapolis.

And now imma be MEAN - look corpies, you want that education, you DEMAND that sheepskin, then you can damned well pay enough to help finance the fuckin thing, NOBODY with an ounce of sense is gonna put themselves up to $115,000.00 USD in debt for a pissant job workin helpdesk that makes $30,000.00 a year - they got student loans, car and medical insurance, rent/mortgage, and oh yeah, as Mal says, a powerful need to EAT sometime that month.
No one is gonna slave away for you while sinking further and further into debt, they're GOING to GO SOMEWHERE ELSE - and the attitude behind this rooks me a lot, it has ever since I was a kid and jobs that *required* a car and telephone didn't pay enough to cover insurance and gas, much less the phone bill, and thus you were LOSING MONEY trying to work - folks, that's asinine.

Quote:
Warkentin says recent grads also seem to think that they'll be able to approach work the same way they approached their studies when they were in school.

A full-time job "is a 9-to-5 commitment, and that really does seem

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FREMDFIRMA

Friday, October 9, 2009 5:54 PM

Not just Dozers, Mangolo - I can drive any forklift ever made, and happen to be damned good at it, having been trained to grab, stack, pack & rack even bad airdrops scattered over four acres, up in trees, sideways in the mud, you name it - once during a hideous howling thunderstorm too.

A good forkie driver makes a decent pence too, specially if they own the thing, sure.

-Frem

It cannot be said enough, those who do not learn from history, are doomed to endlessly repeat it