450 posts IS a worse crime than wanting to kill us .
POSTED BY: AURaptor
UPDATED: Friday, May 22, 2009 14:59
VIEWED: 29463
PAGE 6 of 46
Quote:
Originally posted by Geezer:Quote:
Originally posted by AgentRouka:
Of course people are upset about the carnage and cruelty. What does that have to do with voicing their opposition to torture?
Just makes me wonder why you have to repeatedly voice your outrage over torture that has ceased, and never about the on-going carnage and cruelty. There are currently three or four threads ongoing about waterboarding, but I've never seen any (that I didn't start) about the daily car bomb attacks on civilians throughout the Middle-East and south Asia.
"Keep the Shiny side up"
I don't think people are primarily arguing about specific instances of torture but about the more abstract conflict between "Torture is effectice, reliable and justified" and "Torture is ineffective, unreliable and not justified". It's a conflict of values and ideas. That's why it never gets old.
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Quote:
Originally posted by SignyM:
GEEZER:
"It's all Islam's fault."...OR, you could substitute Palestinians and Israelis just as well.
Find any statement I've made that blames Islam, or Palestinians, or Israelis as a group for anything. I am very specific in accusing the actual perpetrators of bombings, etc. not whole groups.
Quote:
My point is: A life is a life, whether it is Jewish, Christian, Muslim, Israeli or Palestinian, or Russian or a woman or a child or a young man. Whether is was taken specifically or carelessly (collateral damage).
True. So where's the outrage when it's not the U.S. (or Israel) causing the collateral damage? Where's the outrage when civilians are specifically targeted? Why more outrage about non-lethal waterboarding that's no longer being done than about very lethal car-bombs that are used daily?
"Keep the Shiny side up"
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Quote:
Your false, baseless portrayal of me ( an many conservatives ) is a great mental block to you, and also serves as cover so as to avoid havig to deal with real, actual issues of substance.
And yet, you engage in the exact same behavior. Everyone has to agree ONE HUNDRE PERCENT with you, or they're ONE HUNDRED PERCENT AGAINST YOU. There's no middle of the road for you, no compromise. You treat all liberals as a specific "race" - and you feel that you are superior to them, and they inferior to you. You spew the words "liberal" and "Left" as if they were racial slurs.
And then you act surprised when the same is hurled back at you.
Mike
Build a man a fire and he'll be warm for a day...
Set a man on fire and he'll be warm for the rest of his life.
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Quote:
Originally posted by SignyM:Quote:or the daily death that occurs in Africa due to starvation? Or the number of fatalities due to air pollution?
but I've never seen any (that I didn't start) about the daily car bomb attacks on civilians throughout the Middle-East and south Asia.
Well, I did try and get people here interested in the mis-management of Zimbabwe by the Mugabe government, but interest - judging by responses - was pretty low. Have also noted the starvation in North Korea. Again, no interest.
It pretty much seems that if you can't blame it on the U.S., no one here is very interested in any disaster or crisis.
"Keep the Shiny side up"
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Quote:Thanks for the link, Hero, but really, it tells me squat. So they waterboarded some dudes 226 times & LA didn't go boom. I killed an ant in the kitchen & my hot water still flows.
Originally posted by Hero:
How about: http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/30335592/
We pretended to drown them...they told us good stuff.
CONNECTION please?? Oh, they can't talk specifics, eh? So it's useless hearsay as far as I'm concerned.
The laughing Chrisisall
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Quote:You dolt! We respond in greater intensity to things we CAN directly do something about (voting) than stuff we cannot touch. We ALL hate suffering, but when WE cause it, WE get more immediately irritated.
Originally posted by Geezer:
It pretty much seems that if you can't blame it on the U.S., no one here is very interested in any disaster or crisis.
Geeze, you were singing this song when I joined in 2005, time to retire it, dude.
The laughing Chrisisall
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Quote:
Originally posted by Hero:
How about: http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/30335592/
Quote:
WASHINGTON - President Obama’s national intelligence director told colleagues in a private memo last week that the harsh interrogation techniques banned by the White House did produce significant information that helped the nation in its struggle with terrorists.
“High value information came from interrogations in which those methods were used and provided a deeper understanding of the al Qa’ida organization that was attacking this country,” Adm. Dennis C. Blair, the intelligence director, wrote in a memo to his staff last Thursday.
Oops.
"Keep the Shiny side up"
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Quote:The difference is that coercive interrogation techniques are used with the intent of finding information. Witch trials and inquisitions were used with the intent of extracting confessing and then execution.
Originally posted by AgentRouka:
I don't see how that's necessarily dramatically different from waterboarding or whatever other modern torture techniques are used.
Nihil est incertius vulgo, nihil obscurius voluntate hominum, nihil fallacius ratione tota comitiorum.
Nothing is more unpredictable than the mob, nothing more obscure than public opinion, nothing more deceptive than the whole political system.
-- Cicero
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Quote:Which instances, specifically, sir?
Originally posted by Finn mac Cumhal:
In fact, intel gathered from individual sources has been some of the most crucial.
The laughing Chrisisall
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Quote:Oh, well, that certainly proves it; someone SAID it. That's good enough for me!
Originally posted by Geezer:Quote:
WASHINGTON - President Obama’s national intelligence director told colleagues in a private memo last week that the harsh interrogation techniques banned by the White House did produce significant information that helped the nation in its struggle with terrorists.
“High value information came from interrogations in which those methods were used and provided a deeper understanding of the al Qa’ida organization that was attacking this country,” Adm. Dennis C. Blair, the intelligence director, wrote in a memo to his staff last Thursday.
Oops.
The laughing Chrisisall
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