Bill Ayres was not a terrorist.

POSTED BY: chrisisall
UPDATED: Thursday, November 20, 2008 18:09
VIEWED: 2774
PAGE 1 of 1

CHRISISALL

Tuesday, November 18, 2008 9:14 PM

He killed no one. He caused no one to fear for their lives. He was radical all right, but not as much as the old men covered in blood, but never touching any of it.

Chrisisallhasspoken

AURAPTOR

Tuesday, November 18, 2008 9:38 PM

Quote:
Originally posted by chrisisall:
He killed no one. He caused no one to fear for their lives. He was radical all right, but not as much as the old men covered in blood, but never touching any of it.

Chrisisallhasspoken

Wrong.

Fire in the Night
The Weathermen tried to kill my family.
30 April 2008
During the April 16 debate between Hillary Clinton and Barack Obama, moderator George Stephanopoulos brought up “a gentleman named William Ayers,” who “was part of the Weather Underground in the 1970s. They bombed the Pentagon, the Capitol, and other buildings. He’s never apologized for that.” Stephanopoulos then asked Obama to explain his relationship with Ayers. Obama’s answer: “The notion that somehow as a consequence of me knowing somebody who engaged in detestable acts 40 years ago, when I was eight years old, somehow reflects on me and my values, doesn’t make much sense, George.” Obama was indeed only eight in early 1970. I was only nine then, the year Ayers’s Weathermen tried to murder me.

In February 1970, my father, a New York State Supreme Court justice, was presiding over the trial of the so-called “Panther 21,” members of the Black Panther Party indicted in a plot to bomb New York landmarks and department stores. Early on the morning of February 21, as my family slept, three gasoline-filled firebombs exploded at our home on the northern tip of Manhattan, two at the front door and the third tucked neatly under the gas tank of the family car. (Today, of course, we’d call that a car bomb.) A neighbor heard the first two blasts and, with the remains of a snowman I had built a few days earlier, managed to douse the flames beneath the car. That was an act whose courage I fully appreciated only as an adult, an act that doubtless saved multiple lives that night.

I still recall, as though it were a dream, thinking that someone was lifting and dropping my bed as the explosions jolted me awake, and I remember my mother’s pulling me from the tangle of sheets and running to the kitchen where my father stood. Through the large windows overlooking the yard, all we could see was the bright glow of flames below. We didn’t leave our burning house for fear of who might be waiting outside. The same night, bombs were thrown at a police car in Manhattan and two military recruiting stations in Brooklyn. Sunlight, the next morning, revealed three sentences of blood-red graffiti on our sidewalk: FREE THE PANTHER 21; THE VIET CONG HAVE WON; KILL THE PIGS.

For the next 18 months, I went to school in an unmarked police car. My mother, a schoolteacher, had plainclothes detectives waiting in the faculty lounge all day. My brother saved a few bucks because he didn’t have to rent a limo for the senior prom: the NYPD did the driving. We all made the best of the odd new life that had been thrust upon us, but for years, the sound of a fire truck’s siren made my stomach knot and my heart race. In many ways, the enormity of the attempt to kill my entire family didn’t fully hit me until years later, when, a father myself, I was tucking my own nine-year-old John Murtagh into bed.

Though no one was ever caught or tried for the attempt on my family’s life, there was never any doubt who was behind it. Only a few weeks after the attack, the New York contingent of the Weathermen blew themselves up making more bombs in a Greenwich Village townhouse. The same cell had bombed my house, writes Ron Jacobs in The Way the Wind Blew: A History of the Weather Underground. And in late November that year, a letter to the Associated Press signed by Bernardine Dohrn, Ayers’s wife, promised more bombings.

As the association between Obama and Ayers came to light, it would have helped the senator a little if his friend had at least shown some remorse. But listen to Ayers interviewed in the New York Times on September 11, 2001, of all days: “I don’t regret setting bombs. I feel we didn’t do enough.” Translation: “We meant to kill that judge and his family, n

HERO

Tuesday, November 18, 2008 9:42 PM

Quote:
Originally posted by chrisisall:
He killed no one. He caused no one to fear for their lives. He was radical all right, but not as much as the old men covered in blood, but never touching any of it.

HE WAS A PART OF THE RADICAL LEFT AND A TRAITOR...TAKE HIM AWAY!

Sure, holding him would be dangerous...it could create a sympathy for radical leftists in the Senate.

But we have traced the radical leftists to him. Now he is our only link to find their secret base!

(Dramatic music.)

H

WHOZIT

Tuesday, November 18, 2008 10:03 PM

3/6/70, 3 friends of Bill were killed by a "Nail Bomb" that exploded at there New York bomb factory, the bomb was meant for a dance at the Fort Dix Army Base.

I'm going to microwave a bagel and have sex with it - Peter Griffin

AURAPTOR

Tuesday, November 18, 2008 11:03 PM

What, no snappy, lame ass retort from the facts, huh Dorkisall ?

It is not those who use the term "Islamo-Fascism" who are sullying the name of Islam; it is the Islamo-Fascists. - Dennis Prager

" They don't like it when you shoot at 'em. I worked that out myself. "

ECGORDON

Tuesday, November 18, 2008 11:10 PM

Correction:

Bill Ayers is not a terrorist now. He was a terrorist then.

STORYMARK

Tuesday, November 18, 2008 11:12 PM

Just becuase this person claims they tried to kill his family, doesn't mean it's true. No charges were brought. SO, no proof, it's an accusation, not a fact.

Now, it may well be true - but with no proof, you can't say he did it.

This is the rationelle you always use when defending righties that are accused of things Rappy, so suck it up and deal.

And the part about him not killing anyone - sorry, but that's true.

"I thoroughly disapprove of duels. If a man should challenge me, I would take him kindly and forgivingly by the hand and lead him to a quiet place and kill him."

AURAPTOR

Tuesday, November 18, 2008 11:24 PM

Quote:
Originally posted by Storymark:
Just becuase this person claims they tried to kill his family, doesn't mean it's true. No charges were brought. SO, no proof, it's an accusation, not a fact.

Now, it may well be true - but with no proof, you can't say he did it.

This is the rationelle you always use when defending righties that are accused of things Rappy, so suck it up and deal.

And the part about him not killing anyone - sorry, but that's true.

There are truths which can be known, but not stand up in court. If you're comfortable w/ telling yourself that Bill Ayres had nothing to do w/ the TERRORIZING of this lawyer's family all those yrs ago, then have at it. Others know better. I'm sure there's lots of info about this case you'll never bother to find out, stuff which may be inadmissible in court, yet is still every bit as true.

That's who Bill Ayres was, and until he seeks redemption, will always remain. If you want to excuse make and tell yourself that there's nothing to any of it , at all....... that's on you then.

It is not those who use the term "Islamo-Fascism" who are sullying the name of Islam; it is the Islamo-Fascists. - Dennis Prager

" They don't like it when you shoot at 'em. I worked that out myself. "

STORYMARK

Tuesday, November 18, 2008 11:31 PM

But when it comes to Republicans who clearly have wronged, if there is no proof, you are more than happy to consider them innocent.

But hey, that's the law of the land -"Innocent untill PROVEN guilty".

You have no proof, ergo....

And so we're clear, I know a bit about the weathermen, and I have no love for them. My ex-step father, whom I'd gladly take a 2x4 to, was a member.

"I thoroughly disapprove of duels. If a man should challenge me, I would take him kindly and forgivingly by the hand and lead him to a quiet place and kill him."

AURAPTOR

Tuesday, November 18, 2008 11:33 PM

Quote:
Originally posted by Storymark:
But when it comes to Republicans who clearly have wronged, if there is no proof, you are more than happy to consider them innocent.

But hey, that's the law of the land -"Innocent untill PROVEN guilty".

You have no proof, ergo....

They had proof on Ayres, but then the prosecutors bungled the case. Show where there's any damn thing remotely equivalent, and then make a point. Until then, YOU HAVE NO GORRAM POINT!

It is not those who use the term "Islamo-Fascism" who are sullying the name of Islam; it is the Islamo-Fascists. - Dennis Prager

" They don't like it when you shoot at 'em. I worked that out myself. "

STORYMARK

Tuesday, November 18, 2008 11:38 PM

My point is to continually point out your bullshit, and generally piss you off.

Both are easy.

Beyond that, since you missed it last time - "Innocent untill PROVEN guilty".

Go look under a chair. Maybe you'll find the proof hiding with Osama.

"I thoroughly disapprove of duels. If a man should challenge me, I would take him kindly and forgivingly by the hand and lead him to a quiet place and kill him."

AURAPTOR

Wednesday, November 19, 2008 12:52 AM

Being a pin head and reminding me of how stupid humanity can be is your point?

Wow. Bravo. Keep reachin' for the stars, pal. You'll make it , one day.

p.s. And it's PRESUMED innocent, until proven guilty .....IN A COURT OF LAW, DICK HEAD.

It is not those who use the term "Islamo-Fascism" who are sullying the name of Islam; it is the Islamo-Fascists. - Dennis Prager

" They don't like it when you shoot at 'em. I worked that out myself. "

RUE

Wednesday, November 19, 2008 1:01 AM

Story -

I'm afraid Rap succumbed to rampant brainwashing some time over the last few years. You won't get anything sensible out of this one now.

If he thinks Ayers is guilty, then by god, he's guilty. But if he thinks someone is innocent, even a court of law won't be able to prove to him otherwise.

***************************************************************

For Rap, the truth is way, WAY, WAAAAY out there.

AURAPTOR

Wednesday, November 19, 2008 1:39 AM

Quote:
Originally posted by rue:
Story -

I'm afraid Rap succumbed to rampant brainwashing some time over the last few years. You won't get anything sensible out of this one now.

If he thinks Ayers is guilty, then by god, he's guilty. But if he thinks someone is innocent, even a court of law won't be able to prove to him otherwise.

***************************************************************

For Rap, the truth is way, WAY, WAAAAY out there.

You set yourself up so you can't win, you ridicule the opposition. Ayers says he's guilty himself, and he's proud of it. My opinion can't change the facts , no matter what you wish.

It is not those who use the term "Islamo-Fascism" who are sullying the name of Islam; it is the Islamo-Fascists. - Dennis Prager

" They don't like it when you shoot at 'em. I worked that out myself. "

RUE

Wednesday, November 19, 2008 1:42 AM

Guilty of the attempted bombing of the Murtagh family - yes or no ?

***************************************************************

Silence is consent.

AURAPTOR

Wednesday, November 19, 2008 2:11 AM

Quote:
Originally posted by rue:
Guilty of the attempted bombing of the Murtagh family - yes or no ?

***************************************************************

Silence is consent.

His organization was involved, and that destroys the false notion that he wasn't a terrorist, and never put anyone's life in danger.

It is not those who use the term "Islamo-Fascism" who are sullying the name of Islam; it is the Islamo-Fascists. - Dennis Prager

" They don't like it when you shoot at 'em. I worked that out myself. "

RUE

Wednesday, November 19, 2008 2:14 AM

You didn't answer this question either.

Ayers guilty - yes or no ?

***************************************************************

Silence is consent.

AURAPTOR

Wednesday, November 19, 2008 2:16 AM

Quote:
Originally posted by rue:
You didn't answer this question either.

Ayers guilty - yes or no ?

***************************************************************

Silence is consent.

Irrelevant. He's an admitted , unrepentant terrorist.

It is not those who use the term "Islamo-Fascism" who are sullying the name of Islam; it is the Islamo-Fascists. - Dennis Prager

" They don't like it when you shoot at 'em. I worked that out myself. "

RUE

Wednesday, November 19, 2008 2:23 AM

ChrisIsAll
He killed no one. He caused no one to fear for their lives. He was radical all right, but not as much as the old men covered in blood, but never touching any of it.

Rap
Wrong.

So, you're saying he's guilty of killing people - yes or no ?
You're saying he's guilty of bombing the Murtagh home - yes or no ?

***************************************************************

Silence is consent.

AURAPTOR

Wednesday, November 19, 2008 2:31 AM

He's a terrorist. End of discussion.

It is not those who use the term "Islamo-Fascism" who are sullying the name of Islam; it is the Islamo-Fascists. - Dennis Prager

" They don't like it when you shoot at 'em. I worked that out myself. "

RUE

Wednesday, November 19, 2008 2:34 AM

"There are truths which can be known, but not stand up in court."

So, you disagree with the principle 'innocent until proven guilty' - yes or no ?

***************************************************************

Silence is consent.

RUE

Wednesday, November 19, 2008 2:44 AM

And Rap's going to slink out of this one, too.

Bye bye Rap. Go run and hide.

FREMDFIRMA

Wednesday, November 19, 2008 3:02 AM

Quote:
Bill Ayers is not a terrorist now. He was a terrorist then.

So was George Washington, Thomas Jefferson, and many others.

And I will note that left leaning wannabe bombers have ALWAYS blown up more of their own people than anyone else, historically - cause they're just no damn good at building bombs, it's almost comedic.

Then there is the fact that The Weathermen were completely vindicated by the Church Committee hearings, as it came out that every single accusation they were making was fundamentally true, and at the time our own intel goons were committing far worse deeds against the american people than any of the folks they were pursuing.

So, if Ayers is a terrorist, then he's a goddamn piker compared to the FBI, CIA, NSA, etc - so if you wanna throw him in jail, better throw half the damn alphabet soup people in there first cause they are the greater danger and worse offenders than he ever was.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/United_States_President%27s_Commission_on
_CIA_activities_within_the_United_States
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Church_Committee
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pike_Committee
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/CIA_family_jewels
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/COINTELPRO

"Many of the techniques used would be intolerable in a democratic society even if all of the targets had been involved in violent activity, but COINTELPRO went far beyond that...the Bureau conducted a sophisticated vigilante operation aimed squarely at preventing the exercise of First Amendment rights of speech and association, on the theory that preventing the growth of dangerous groups and the propagation of dangerous ideas would protect the national security and deter violence."

The Weathermen were in fact on the COINTELPRO "hit list", proven fact, and one that everyone at the time considered mere conspiracy theory, till some folks stole the damned files and proved it.

So if you wanna arrest Ayers and charge him with terrorism, I am ok with that only if FIRST, you round up the FBI, CIA, NSA personnel and charge THEM, while seizing their buildings and files as evidence, which, frankly, if even half of the crap some of us muckrakers know about gets spilled - would unfortunately topple our entire legal, social, and governmental system.

"If the people knew what we had done, they would chase us down the street and lynch us."
George HW Bush.

In essence, you're sittin here complaining about a kid playing with matches, who burnt himself and learned his lesson from it - while a pack of drunken arsonists burns the city down around us.

How does that make sense again ?

-Frem
It cannot be said enough, those who do not learn from history, are doomed to endlessly repeat it

GEEZER

Wednesday, November 19, 2008 3:07 AM

Quote:
Originally posted by Storymark:
Just becuase this person claims they tried to kill his family, doesn't mean it's true. No charges were brought. SO, no proof, it's an accusation, not a fact.

By your logic, just because some poeple claim the Bush administration committed crimes, doesn't mean it's true. No charges were brought. SO, no proof, it's an accusation, not a fact.

Thank you for your verification that the Bush administration committed no crimes.

"Keep the Shiny side up"

FREMDFIRMA

Wednesday, November 19, 2008 3:07 AM

Gee, I've heard this song and dance before...

"Reports that say that something hasn't happened are always interesting to me, because as we know, there are known knowns; there are things we know we know. We also know there are known unknowns; that is to say we know there are some things we do not know. But there are also unknown unknowns -- the ones we don't know we don't know."
-Rumsfeld.

He was universally fulla shit, and so are you, Rap.

And Geezer, the difference between the two is that one HAS been investigated, and one has not.

And damned well should be.

-F

SIGNYM

Wednesday, November 19, 2008 3:12 AM

Quote:
He's an admitted , unrepentant terrorist.

I killed JFK and I'm damn proud of it!

You just want to convict Ayers 'cause you think he's a "bad man". But yanno, we don't have laws against how you feel or what you think or who you associate with, only on what you DO. It's possible he had nothing at all to do with that particular event.

So excluding the whole "We should convict him because I don't like him" scenario: Bill Ayers- Guilty or not?

---------------------------------
Let's party like its 1929.

AURAPTOR

Wednesday, November 19, 2008 3:13 AM

Quote:
Originally posted by rue:
And Rap's going to slink out of this one, too.

Bye bye Rap. Go run and hide.

I'm not playing your lame ass game.

Go play w/ yourself

It is not those who use the term "Islamo-Fascism" who are sullying the name of Islam; it is the Islamo-Fascists. - Dennis Prager

" They don't like it when you shoot at 'em. I worked that out myself. "

AURAPTOR

Wednesday, November 19, 2008 3:18 AM

Quote:
Originally posted by SignyM:
Quote:
He's an admitted , unrepentant terrorist.
I killed JFK and I'm damn proud of it!

You just want to convict Ayers 'cause you think he's a "bad man". But yanno, we don't have laws against how you feel or what you think or who you associate with, only on what you DO. It's possible he had nothing at all to do with that particular event.

So excluding the whole "We should convict him because I don't like him" scenario: Bill Ayers- Guilty or not?

---------------------------------
Let's party like its 1929.

I'm just at a loss as to why you're so quick to defend this dirtbag, unless it's only because you think you're some how supporting Obama, in some odd way.

Ayers is a bad man. Guilty as hell.

Charles Manson was never convicted of killing a single person, and yet he's still in jail.

It is not those who use the term "Islamo-Fascism" who are sullying the name of Islam; it is the Islamo-Fascists. - Dennis Prager

" They don't like it when you shoot at 'em. I worked that out myself. "

KWICKO

Wednesday, November 19, 2008 5:58 AM

Quote:

Ayers is a bad man. Guilty as hell.

But again, you offer nothing in the way of PROOF, only your opinion. Was he a "bad man"? Quite possibly. "Guilty as hell"? Well, not according to the U.S. Justice Department, who dropped the charges against him due to prosecutorial misconduct.

So should the prosecutors be in prison, too? After all, they're bad men, and guilty as hell. As yet, I've heard none of them repent, and so they must always remain guilty...

NEWOLDBROWNCOAT

Wednesday, November 19, 2008 7:24 AM

Quote:
Originally posted by Geezer:

By your logic, just because some poeple claim the Bush administration committed crimes, doesn't mean it's true. No charges were brought. SO, no proof, it's an accusation, not a fact.

Thank you for your verification that the Bush administration committed no crimes.

Literally , *J*U*S*T* saw this on the CNN Political Ticker: a judge in Texas just issued indictments against Dick Cheney and Alberto Gonzales for abuse of prisoners. Wasn't much in the way of details, and the judge may be a wacko, as the Republican spokesman quoted in the piece claimed, but on the other hand, it might be the first strike against them.

AURAPTOR

Wednesday, November 19, 2008 10:52 AM

Quote:
Originally posted by NewOldBrownCoat:
Quote:
Originally posted by Geezer:

By your logic, just because some poeple claim the Bush administration committed crimes, doesn't mean it's true. No charges were brought. SO, no proof, it's an accusation, not a fact.

Thank you for your verification that the Bush administration committed no crimes.

Literally , *J*U*S*T* saw this on the CNN Political Ticker: a judge in Texas just issued indictments against Dick Cheney and Alberto Gonzales for abuse of prisoners. Wasn't much in the way of details, and the judge may be a wacko, as the Republican spokesman quoted in the piece claimed, but on the other hand, it might be the first strike against them.

It's baseless. Cheney is reported to have some financial interest in a company which was accused of some such nonsense. There's nothing what so ever to suggest Cheney had any hand in the day to day dealings of how the business was run, it's just a wild, cheap political stunt, and nothing more.

As for Ayers, I never stated that he should be in jail. He had his trial, and it was tossed. Doesn't make him any less guilty for what he did, only now , there's no LEGAL room for him to be prosecuted. But makes no mistake, what this guy did ,and who he was associated with, unquestionably makes him a terrorist, which is why I replied as I did to this thread. If the world was right, Ayers WOULD be in jail, but he's not , so there's no use in beating that dead horse. All I'm saying is that , even though he didn't go to jail, that doesn't mean he wasn't a terrorist.

It is not those who use the term "Islamo-Fascism" who are sullying the name of Islam; it is the Islamo-Fascists. - Dennis Prager

" They don't like it when you shoot at 'em. I worked that out myself. "

FREMDFIRMA

Wednesday, November 19, 2008 11:05 AM

By far not the first - many, MANY states, localities and cities have already filed motions up to and including impeachment and demands for it, they've just been ignored by a rogue administration and a compliant press, is all.

Monica Conyers, wife of that nutless bastard on the Judiciary Committee, and possessing FAR more testicular fortitude than he *EVER* will, submitted it here, and passed it without a hitch or complaint.
http://pdamerica.org/articles/news/2007-05-16-16-48-17-news.php

I'd hate to be a fly on the wall in their house, given that his cowardice and that of Pelosi has prevented impeachment, and his *wife* is at the head of at least two orgs howling for his head over it.

Bet dinner conversation's pretty interesting over at the Conyers house, lol.

I'd vote for her.. I would... him, not so much, but HER ?

Yeah, cause she's willing to take the will of her constituents and kick it right up someones tail, which is all you can, and should, really ask of a politician in the first place.

-F

AURAPTOR

Wednesday, November 19, 2008 11:22 AM

Monica Conyers is a nut case. Which might explain much

All those " filed motions" amount to nothing, as not 1 damn thing they can do / say means one iota against the President. It's clear, those acts are pure political vitriol, and nothing more, certainly not based on any worth while merit , not in the least.

There are zero grounds on which to impeach the President. It's been shown, time and time again, that in no way, what so ever, did his or his administration mislead anyone into war w/ Iraq.

Deal w/ it.

It is not those who use the term "Islamo-Fascism" who are sullying the name of Islam; it is the Islamo-Fascists. - Dennis Prager

" They don't like it when you shoot at 'em. I worked that out myself. "

KWICKO

Wednesday, November 19, 2008 1:25 PM

Quote:
Originally posted by AURaptor:

Doesn't make him any less guilty for what he did...

Actually, in the eyes of the law, it DOES. Kinda how that whole thing works, ya know?

Quote:

All I'm saying is that , even though he didn't go to jail, that doesn't mean he wasn't a terrorist.

I could make the exact same claim against Cheney... You saying so doesn't make it a fact - that's something you never seem to get through your thick skull and into that walnut-sized brain of yours.

HERO

Wednesday, November 19, 2008 1:43 PM

Quote:
Originally posted by SignyM:
we don't have laws against how you feel or what you think or who you associate with, only on what you DO.

Actually we do have laws against association, but many of them have been passed since and/or partially as a result of these attacks. There are certainly laws against Conspiracy and various laws relating to funding and support for terrorist activities.

Quote:

So excluding the whole "We should convict him because I don't like him" scenario: Bill Ayers- Guilty or not?

There was never a trial. He did spend a lot of years running away like a little bitch.

H

CHRISISALL

Wednesday, November 19, 2008 4:24 PM

Quote:
Originally posted by AURaptor:

There are truths which can be known, but not stand up in court.

LOL!!!
AU, you are so gorram duplicitously, self-servingly effin' stupid...and thing of it is, you think WE are as well.

Yeah, he blew up some s**t, yeah, 3 of his peeps died makin' a bomb that WAS TO be set off & hurt folk (poetical justice, anyone?), yeah, Bush lied about WMD....OH SORRY, I just sorta worked that last truth which can be known, but not stand up in court into it, didn't I?

You are such a biped.

Have fun eating Meow Mix, pal!

isall

CHRISISALL

Wednesday, November 19, 2008 4:51 PM

Quote:
Originally posted by AURaptor:

It's baseless.

Like your political views, LOL.
See, I can only laugh at you now, AU. Poor little extremest wingnut dweeb, clinging to all which makes no sense in a raging & confusing sea of tolerant moderation...

*throws a lead life preserver*

Chrisisall

KWICKO

Wednesday, November 19, 2008 4:52 PM

Quote:
He did spend a lot of years running away like a little bitch.

Well yeah, but the same can be said of Cheney, who spent the whole of the Viet Nam War running like a little bitch, and hiding behind deferments... Or Bushie, who ran away and went AWOL rather than take a drug test.

So are they guilty as hell, too?

CHRISISALL

Wednesday, November 19, 2008 5:11 PM

Quote:
Originally posted by Hero:

There was never a trial. He did spend a lot of years running away like a little bitch.

In First Blood, I guess Rambo was running away like a little bitch while he was expressing his outrage as well.
Hmmm. Your choice of words betrays you Hero. I object.

SUSTAINEDisall

STORYMARK

Wednesday, November 19, 2008 5:53 PM

Quote:
Originally posted by rue:
Story -

I'm afraid Rap succumbed to rampant brainwashing some time over the last few years. You won't get anything sensible out of this one now.

If he thinks Ayers is guilty, then by god, he's guilty. But if he thinks someone is innocent, even a court of law won't be able to prove to him otherwise.

***************************************************************

For Rap, the truth is way, WAY, WAAAAY out there.

Oh, I gave up on getting anything sensible from Rap a long, looooong time ago. Now, it's all about pointing out his innanity, and rubbing his nose in it.

"I thoroughly disapprove of duels. If a man should challenge me, I would take him kindly and forgivingly by the hand and lead him to a quiet place and kill him."

STORYMARK

Wednesday, November 19, 2008 5:54 PM

Quote:
Originally posted by Geezer:
Quote:
Originally posted by Storymark:
Just becuase this person claims they tried to kill his family, doesn't mean it's true. No charges were brought. SO, no proof, it's an accusation, not a fact.

By your logic, just because some poeple claim the Bush administration committed crimes, doesn't mean it's true. No charges were brought. SO, no proof, it's an accusation, not a fact.

Thank you for your verification that the Bush administration committed no crimes.

"Keep the Shiny side up"

Well, yeah, pretty much. I'm useing Rappy's exact logic against him, thus pointing out the hipocracy.

And I agree, the things said about Bush are accusations. Never claimed them to be facts.

I'm just pointing out the pot 'n' kettle nature of Rappy's attcks.

"I thoroughly disapprove of duels. If a man should challenge me, I would take him kindly and forgivingly by the hand and lead him to a quiet place and kill him."

AURAPTOR

Wednesday, November 19, 2008 6:05 PM

wrong kwickie... one can be guilty of a crime and still not viewed as such by the state. Just because the law doesn't recognize one as guilty, doesn't mean that person didn't do it.

Bill Ayers is a self admitted terrorist. WHAT about that don't you get ?

It is not those who use the term "Islamo-Fascism" who are sullying the name of Islam; it is the Islamo-Fascists. - Dennis Prager

" They don't like it when you shoot at 'em. I worked that out myself. "

AURAPTOR

Wednesday, November 19, 2008 6:07 PM

Chrissy,

Bush never lied about WMD

Clinton lied about Monica.

Know the difference.

It is not those who use the term "Islamo-Fascism" who are sullying the name of Islam; it is the Islamo-Fascists. - Dennis Prager

" They don't like it when you shoot at 'em. I worked that out myself. "

CHRISISALL

Wednesday, November 19, 2008 6:28 PM

Quote:
Originally posted by AURaptor:

Bill Ayers is a self admitted terrorist.

Another of your solid facts, eh AU?
Do you wonder why we see you as so deluded?

If I said the Bush is a self admitted liar, you'd see something wrong with that. I could counter with: "Nope, sorry, you're wrong- it's a fact."

And that's how it goes with you.

Professional help might be in order.

Chrisisall

KWICKO

Wednesday, November 19, 2008 6:30 PM

Quote:
Originally posted by AURaptor:
wrong kwickie... one can be guilty of a crime and still not viewed as such by the state. Just because the law doesn't recognize one as guilty, doesn't mean that person didn't do it.

Bill Ayers is a self admitted terrorist. WHAT about that don't you get ?

I *get* that Bush can be guilty and not be viewed as such (at least not at the moment) by the state.

Can you please provide me with a direct quote from Bill Ayers where he refers to himself as a terrorist? Because what YOU view as terrorism, someone else with a different viewpoint might call a "freedom fighter" or a "Contra". Capisce?

Also, if he is indeed a self-admitted terrorist, then what on Earth is he still doing out on the streets? Shouldn't he be in jail? Why is the Bush Administration letting him walk around free, when they should have kidnapped him and taken him to Gitmo? Either Bush has no interest in stopping terrorism, or Ayers actually isn't a terrorist. Which is it?

RUE

Wednesday, November 19, 2008 7:30 PM

Most people forget that 'innocent until proven guilty' is only half the phrase. The full phrase goes:
INNOCENT UNTIL PROVEN GUILTY IN A COURT OF LAW

So Rap trying to divide innocence into the court type and some hypothetical other type is wrong - because innocence is ALWAYS presumed in every situation until PROVEN guilty IN A COURT OF LAW.

***************************************************************

Silence is consent.

AURAPTOR

Wednesday, November 19, 2008 7:31 PM

Quote:
Originally posted by chrisisall:
Quote:
Originally posted by AURaptor:

Bill Ayers is a self admitted terrorist.
Another of your solid facts, eh AU?
Do you wonder why we see you as so deluded?

If I said the Bush is a self admitted liar, you'd see something wrong with that. I could counter with: "Nope, sorry, you're wrong- it's a fact."

And that's how it goes with you.

Professional help might be in order.

Chrisisall
]

Chrissy, I don't waste my time w/ folks like you because , much like young Earth Creationist, there's nothing I could show you which would change your minds. You see, you NEED to believe Bush lied about WMD, because that's where the extreme , hyper far Left wing is these days, and nothing else will do w/ you folks.

It is not those who use the term "Islamo-Fascism" who are sullying the name of Islam; it is the Islamo-Fascists. - Dennis Prager

" They don't like it when you shoot at 'em. I worked that out myself. "

NOTIFY: N | REPLY | REPLY WITH QUOTE | PERMALINK | TOP | HOME

AURAPTOR

Wednesday, November 19, 2008 7:38 PM

Quote:
Originally posted by rue:
Most people forget that 'innocent until proven guilty' is only half the phrase. The full phrase goes:
INNOCENT UNTIL PROVEN GUILTY IN A COURT OF LAW

So Rap trying to divide innocence into the court type and some hypothetical other type is wrong - because innocence is ALWAYS presumed in every situation until PROVEN guilty IN A COURT OF LAW.

***************************************************************

Silence is consent.

You STILL didn't get that right, rue-rue. The phrase is " PRESUMED innocent until proven guilty in a court of law ". But having said that, it still doesn't matter one damn bean when it comes to Ayers. I can call him guilty all I want. That's my opinion. You clowns are simply tossing in this " court of law " b.s. simply to confuse the issue and ignore the fact, that Ayers himself admitted to these crimes and his only regret was that he didn't do more. That's the crux of the matter, which you bone heads can't come to grips on and why it was / is such a big deal that the Prez -elect was / is so buddy buddy with.

It is not those who use the term "Islamo-Fascism" who are sullying the name of Islam; it is the Islamo-Fascists. - Dennis Prager

" They don't like it when you shoot at 'em. I worked that out myself. "

STORYMARK

Wednesday, November 19, 2008 7:44 PM

Quote:
Originally posted by AURaptor:
That's the crux of the matter, which you bone heads can't come to grips on and why it was / is such a big deal that the Prez -elect was / is so buddy buddy with.

How Palin-esque of you.

Not that it matters. As you have said yourself,

"The people have spoken. Isn't that enough?"

"I thoroughly disapprove of duels. If a man should challenge me, I would take him kindly and forgivingly by the hand and lead him to a quiet place and kill him."

RUE

Wednesday, November 19, 2008 7:47 PM

"He killed no one. He caused no one to fear for their lives."

This is the statement which caused you to respond with an article which was nothing other than UNPROVEN statements, and which had no factual connection either directly with Ayers or indirectly through the Weathermen.

Bill Ayers killed no one, and he caused no one to live in fear. Those are facts. Anything else is simply your blather.

***************************************************************

Silence is consent.

AURAPTOR

Wednesday, November 19, 2008 7:47 PM

I don't care what the people have said, i am responding to Chrissy's inane subject title, that Ayers wasn't a terrorist.

He is, was and will always be a terrorist.

It is not those who use the term "Islamo-Fascism" who are sullying the name of Islam; it is the Islamo-Fascists. - Dennis Prager

" They don't like it when you shoot at 'em. I worked that out myself. "

AURAPTOR

Wednesday, November 19, 2008 7:57 PM

Quote:
Originally posted by rue:

Bill Ayers....... he caused no one to live in fear. Those are facts. Anything else is simply your blather.

***************************************************************

Silence is consent.

Wrong. Bill Ayers was a member of the Weathermen who fire bombed judge Murtagh's house. For you to claim he caused no one to live in fear is beyond all comprehension. I SHOWED YOU EXACTLY WHERE HE CAUSED PEOPLE TO LIVE IN FEAR, and your delusion for Obama and the far , extreme Left wing causes keeps you from seeing reality.

" It wasn't proven in court ! "

So fucking what ??? He did it, he admitted to it, and those bombs didn't set themselves off.

Though no one was ever caught or tried for the attempt on my family’s life, there was never any doubt who was behind it. Only a few weeks after the attack, the New York contingent of the Weathermen blew themselves up making more bombs in a Greenwich Village townhouse. The same cell had bombed my house, writes Ron Jacobs in The Way the Wind Blew: A History of the Weather Underground. And in late November that year, a letter to the Associated Press signed by Bernardine Dohrn, Ayers’s wife, promised more bombings .

This is why wasting my time with you mental midgets is so far down on my list of favorite things to do.

It is not those who use the term "Islamo-Fascism" who are sullying the name of Islam; it is the Islamo-Fascists. - Dennis Prager

" They don't like it when you shoot at 'em. I worked that out myself. "

RUE

Wednesday, November 19, 2008 7:59 PM

ChrisIsAll
"He killed no one. He caused no one to fear for their lives. He was radical all right, but not as much as the old men covered in blood, but never touching any of it."

Rap
Wrong.
Fire in the Night
The Weathermen tried to kill my family. ...

So you didn't post that reply ? Yes or no.

***************************************************************

Silence is consent.

STORYMARK

Wednesday, November 19, 2008 8:00 PM

Quote:
Originally posted by AURaptor:
I don't care what the people have said, i am responding to Chrissy's inane subject title, that Ayers wasn't a terrorist.

He is, was and will always be a terrorist.

It is not those who use the term "Islamo-Fascism" who are sullying the name of Islam; it is the Islamo-Fascists. - Dennis Prager

" They don't like it when you shoot at 'em. I worked that out myself. "

You still havn't given that example of Ayers calling himself a Terrorist.

Another one of your "facts", I must assume.

"I thoroughly disapprove of duels. If a man should challenge me, I would take him kindly and forgivingly by the hand and lead him to a quiet place and kill him."

AURAPTOR

Wednesday, November 19, 2008 8:01 PM

Ayers is a terrorist, he caused others to live their life in fear.

Chrissy's thread title is wrong.

It is not those who use the term "Islamo-Fascism" who are sullying the name of Islam; it is the Islamo-Fascists. - Dennis Prager

" They don't like it when you shoot at 'em. I worked that out myself. "

AURAPTOR

Wednesday, November 19, 2008 8:05 PM

Quote:
You still havn't given that example of Ayers calling himself a Terrorist.

Don't have to. He admitted to the bombings in the Pentagon, and others, that makes him a terrorist. He was unrepentant, and that's all that matters.

He's a terrorist, and the man you voted for as President is his friend, his associate and a political companion. You don't like folks to see Obama in that light, so you instead try to defend the indefensible.

Ayers is a terrorist punk, and ran from the law like a whiney little bitch, because he knew he was guilty. Innocent men don't run.

You probably think O.J. was innocent of murder to.

It is not those who use the term "Islamo-Fascism" who are sullying the name of Islam; it is the Islamo-Fascists. - Dennis Prager

" They don't like it when you shoot at 'em. I worked that out myself. "

RUE

Wednesday, November 19, 2008 8:06 PM

"Ayers is a terrorist, he caused others to live their life (sic) in fear."

He did ? And, do you mean others NOT the Murtagh family ? B/c certainly there is nothing to connect Ayers with that. And if not the Murtagh family, which others ? And since he never killed (or hurt) anyone, how did he instill this fear you speak of in those others you speak of ?

***************************************************************

Silence is consent.

STORYMARK

Wednesday, November 19, 2008 8:07 PM

A bomber is not by definition a terrorist. Sorry, you may like to lump all things together, but that doesn't make it so (I know, this is a lesson you refuse to consider, but we keep trying).

You said he was a self-professed terrorist. Which means he would have had to identify himself as one.

So, either there is a quote out there, or you've been caught, once AGAIN, making up your so-called "facts".

"I thoroughly disapprove of duels. If a man should challenge me, I would take him kindly and forgivingly by the hand and lead him to a quiet place and kill him."

AURAPTOR

Wednesday, November 19, 2008 8:21 PM

Quote:
Originally posted by rue:
"Ayers is a terrorist, he caused others to live their life (sic) in fear."

He did ? And, do you mean others NOT the Murtagh family ? B/c certainly there is nothing to connect Ayers with that. And if not the Murtagh family, which others ? And since he never killed (or hurt) anyone, how did he instill this fear you speak of in those others you speak of ?

***************************************************************

Silence is consent.

No, include the Murtagh family too. They lived in fear. Fear from the bombs Ayers and his buddies set off.

When a fire bomb goes off in your front yard, and then 2 more go off around your house, no one has to die in order for anyone to become afraid.

Or would you like this to happen to you? Or anyone you knew and cared for ?

Its' clear to me now that you dorks don't really believe this shit, you're merely attempting to press my buttons in order to piss me off. Sad . Truly sad, on y 'alls part.

You know Ayers is a terrorist, and that he admitted to the bombings, and caused others to live in fear. You all know this, whether you post to the contrary.

And so, I'm done w/ this thread, having proven that it was all bunk, and that Ayers is a nut case who thinks bombing and even killing for his Left wing causes is justifiable, when in fact, it's not. He's just a nut case.

It is not those who use the term "Islamo-Fascism" who are sullying the name of Islam; it is the Islamo-Fascists. - Dennis Prager

" They don't like it when you shoot at 'em. I worked that out myself. "

RUE

Wednesday, November 19, 2008 8:39 PM

"They lived in fear. Fear from the bombs I PRESUME Ayes (sic)... set off."

There, I fixed that for you.

***************************************************************

Silence is consent.

AURAPTOR

Wednesday, November 19, 2008 8:45 PM

Quote:
Originally posted by rue:
*"They lived in fear. Fear from the bombs Ayers.. set off."

.

* The same cell had bombed my house, writes Ron Jacobs in The Way the Wind Blew: A History of the Weather Underground. And in late November that year, a letter to the Associated Press signed by Bernardine Dohrn, Ayers’s wife, promised more bombings.

THERE - FIXED THAT FOR YOU !

It is not those who use the term "Islamo-Fascism" who are sullying the name of Islam; it is the Islamo-Fascists. - Dennis Prager

" They don't like it when you shoot at 'em. I worked that out myself. "

RUE

Wednesday, November 19, 2008 8:52 PM

Awwww ... that's so cute. Trying to support one unproven allegation with more unproven allegations.

***************************************************************

Silence is consent.

STORYMARK

Wednesday, November 19, 2008 9:11 PM

Quote:
Originally posted by AURaptor:
Its' clear to me now that you dorks don't really believe this shit, you're merely attempting to press my buttons in order to piss me off.

Clear NOW?

Jesus Zombie Christ, man. I flat out TOLD YOU that's what I was trying to do - yesterday.

"I thoroughly disapprove of duels. If a man should challenge me, I would take him kindly and forgivingly by the hand and lead him to a quiet place and kill him."

STORYMARK

Wednesday, November 19, 2008 9:13 PM

Quote:
Originally posted by rue:
Awwww ... that's so cute. Trying to support one unproven allegation with more unproven allegations.

***************************************************************

Silence is consent.

But in Rappy land - anything he believes IS fact, and shut your damned librul hippie commie lesbian extremist pinko mouth if you want to say anything different.

And shut it twice if you have actual facts to back your claims. No place for those in Rappy land.

"I thoroughly disapprove of duels. If a man should challenge me, I would take him kindly and forgivingly by the hand and lead him to a quiet place and kill him."

CHRISISALL

Wednesday, November 19, 2008 9:36 PM

RAppy, I don't waste my time w/ folks like you because , much like a young Earth Creationist, there's nothing I could show you which would change your mind. You see, you NEED to believe Bush didn't lie about WMD, because that's where the extreme , hyper far Right wing is these days, and nothing else will do w/ you folks.

There, I proved it. Try not to cry in you scotch, AU.

HAHAHAHAHAHisall

CHRISISALL

Wednesday, November 19, 2008 9:39 PM

Quote:
Originally posted by AURaptor:
For you to claim he caused no one to live in fear is beyond all comprehension. I SHOWED YOU EXACTLY WHERE HE CAUSED PEOPLE TO LIVE IN FEAR

No man, what is beyond all comprehension is why you are allowed to sit at a keyboard, unsupervised. The psych wards are obviously WAAAAY too Liberal these days....

Toomuchfunisall

FREMDFIRMA

Wednesday, November 19, 2008 11:18 PM

Quote:
Ayers is a terrorist, he caused others to live their life in fear.

Predators fear me, in fact one of my alias's scares them totally shitless.

Does that make ME, a terrorist, then ?

They fear the Wayne County Internet Crimes task force too, does that make them terrorists, then ?

You fear the truth, facts and anything resembling reality - by your standard wouldn't that make planet earth itself a terrorist offense ?

And no, you can't have the illudium Pu-36 explosive modulator, it belongs to the martians.

-Frem

KWICKO

Thursday, November 20, 2008 12:46 AM

Quote:

Ayers is a terrorist, he caused others to live their life in fear.

By this definition - YOUR definition, by the way - Bush is himself a self-admitted terrorist. He bombed people, many of them innocents, and caused people to live in fear.

YOUR words, YOUR definitions.

STORYMARK

Thursday, November 20, 2008 6:09 PM

And "poof" he's gone, to try and frame the discussion on his own terms - again.

"I thoroughly disapprove of duels. If a man should challenge me, I would take him kindly and forgivingly by the hand and lead him to a quiet place and kill him."