Boycott ENTERPRISE .. it's just that bad.

POSTED BY: Ghoulman
UPDATED: Monday, January 24, 2005 20:10
VIEWED: 38245
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GHOULMAN

Friday, May 21, 2004 4:25 PM

Quote:
Originally posted by jlp:
Ghoulman,

What a load. When I read posts like yours, posts that attempt to be so completely pseudo-intellectual about an entertainment show, I can have only one rational reaction--to roll my eyes. Agenda? Yes. You do have an agenda. Destroy what little science fiction on television there is in the name of advancing some liberal namby pamby schlepp ideals.

Do I love Star Trek Enterprise? Not especially. I have watched it off and on for the three seasons. I liked season one fairly, season 2 left me uninterested, and season three has been one of the more enjoyable sci-fi seasons anywhere.

Do I get my politics from Star Trek? Come on. Do I get my opinions on the Iraqi war from Star Trek? You must be kidding.

It is a show. It is entertainment. I am completely capable, as are the majority of people who think about anythign besides their navel lint of keeping story and reality seperate. So even if ST:E is trying to advance "right wing" ideals, are we not able to distance ourselves from the story line?

I had included a long political rant in this post. I have taken it out because you know what? This site is a haven for me. A place I visit daily to hang out with folks who love firefly. Politics makes people angry. I know my opinions, and no poorly worded argument by you will change them. I will avoid your posts from now on.

over and out.

Does ENTERPRISE have an agenda? Does Star Trek have a tradition of political stories? Does Ghoulman have an agenda?

Well, I'm speculating (that's the pseudo-intellectual part, can't disagree there) on the right wing shift in Enterprise. Which I think is a valid argument considering the shows past. I would hope you might recognise that before just dumping on me. It's not like I pulled this stuff from my ass. Also, I did mention the negative affect this sort of 'franchise' creature can have and the damage it can bring to genre TV and movies. But hey, if you don't care about such things ...

RKLENSETH

Friday, May 21, 2004 4:35 PM

And so something is only good if it is left wing propaganda? I find that hard to swallow because both the right wing and the left wing have committed just as much atrocities as the other.

So what if Enterprise has a right wing leaning. Should we boycott The West Wing because it has a left wing leaning?

Oh, and play Cantr II at www.cantr.net.

GHOULMAN

Friday, May 21, 2004 4:47 PM

^^^ and where is that said rklenseth? BTW, I think West Wing is didactic in a similar way Enterprise is. But please keep in mind... no one was ever killed because of some milque toast lefty gits bullsh*t opinions.

GHOULMAN

Friday, May 21, 2004 4:58 PM

Quote:
Originally posted by annik:
Quote:
Originally posted by Ghoulman:
Worse, Enterprise is also the producers sycophantic pro George "Dubya" Bush cream dream. Notice how the protagonist, Capt. Archer, is the son of a "great man" who was held back by the (liberal) Vulcans. As the show progresses, Archer becomes increasingly more angry and with a terrorist attack on Earth by an alien race he agrees to "do what it takes" to ... well, the actual goals aren't defined. Stop the bad guys? Sound familiar? Propoganda is not what I watch Star Trek for let alone a soft sell for the War in Iraq. It's become painfully obvious that Enterprise means to present the 'War against Islam" as a great adventure. Sick.
(snipped)
Boycott Enterprise.

Thanx for your time.
---
Ghoulman

I think you've done a great analysis here, Ghoulman, although as a non-American I'd go a step further and say that the show seems to be doing a soft-sell on war in general, not just the one in Iraq. (So, are you guys planning to invade anyone else this year? ).

I'll still watch the show, at this point mostly to see what else they'll screw up in their own continuity/character development.

Your point about entertainment being used as propaganda is well-known by many: remember when all the bad guys in movies always looked German? (remember The Empire in Star Wars?)

Then we hit ST:TNG and all the Romulans look suspiciously middle-eastern. It goes on from there.

I well remember a class at uni where we were looking at the movie, "Top Gun," and one guy kept insisting it was just a great movie and wasn't trying to say anything. As one of our American classmates said to him, "Do you think that the navy just loans out aircraft carriers for the heck of it?"

There was a point here somewhere, but I think it got lost somewhere behind a bad script.

Cheers,
Annik
... my sister's a ship. We had a complicated childhood.

I once loved a girl named Annik. Ahhh, Quebec City. YOU deserve a nice cyber cookie. Enjoy.

Thanx for recognising what certain other people seem to be purposely avoiding - the allegory.

SIGNYM

Friday, May 21, 2004 5:14 PM

Well, I always wondered why this bimbo was waltzing around with a can of Pledge, fer Chrissakes. Now it's babes humping beer bottles, credit cards, and cars. Talk about replacing human relationships with conusmer products!

SOUTHERNMERC

Friday, May 21, 2004 5:29 PM

Actually, Ghoulman, most of the posts of yours I have read have been very political (regardless of topic) and somewhat aggressive in tone. That you care deeply for politics comes through in your posts. The only problem being that you put a political slant on EVERY post I have read. While many of us enjoy, and look forward to, political discussions with other intelligent adults, you seem to push it upon others. That, I believe, is the issue some here have with you. Not that you are a left-wing, right-wing, dining-room, servant's-quarters or any other part of the house political person, but that you are too aggressive with it and bring politics into non-political threads. I can see you have alot of passion for this, but please remember that others may not share your enthusiasm for politics in a non-political context.

And, BTW, saying someone has a lack of sagacity means you are saying they have a lack of intelligence and judgment, since sagacity means "penetrating intelligence and sound judgment." You also don't seem to speak well of anyone til they agree with you, and trash those that don't, that doesn't help at all. Name calling doesn't help your argument, please refrain.

Now, back to topic.

Enterprise season one and two were alright in that I needed the SF fix and it was there. Some of the stories had been done before on other Trek series, though, and this was a little off-putting. When season three rolled around, I could only get through part of it before I removed it from my recorder's programming. I can see the topical nature of the current season's plot (you are right about that, GM), but the enemy in the show is alot more clear cut than the one's IRL. Archer's mission is alot clearer, as well, which made me question his judgment on a few episodes (don't ask me to name them, don't remember) when he got sidetracked doing something OTHER than moving forward toward the objective. I liked the addition of the Andorians when they first appeared, as they added an interesting political dynamic between humans and vulcans. That is what I really wish they had explored with the third season, instead of a "save the EAAAAAAAAARRTH!!" (big, booming, dramatic music and sing-song voice) storyline. There have been a few good eps. this season, but not enough to keep me interested.

DrBoris said:

Quote:
No Trek was ever at its best right out of the gate. Ent. just had a particularly bad start due to poor writeing and no attempts to find the stride.

This can be said about MANY great shows. Quite a few didn't hit their stride until later seasons, and not just Trek series (Cheers, MASH, B5). It takes a little patience to realize the great ones when they are among us. Sadly, TV execs don't have ANY nowadays: If a show doesn't rock the house right away, it gets cancelled. One reason reality shows are the rage now is that they DON'T have to build up, as they get big, drooling ratings right off the bat. They also don't hang around long, only one season typically, so don't have to be good enough to hold on to viewers. Just good (or freaky, sick, or droll) enough to get the flash-in-the-pan interest. Enterprise may get better. Will have to look at all the eps. of this season on reruns to be sure.

Jayne: "See, Vera? You get dressed up, you get taken someplace fun!"

CAPTAINCDC

Friday, May 21, 2004 6:24 PM

Quote:
And, BTW, saying someone has a lack of sagacity means you are saying they have a lack of intelligence and judgment, since sagacity means "penetrating intelligence and sound judgment." You also don't seem to speak well of anyone til they agree with you, and trash those that don't, that doesn't help at all. Name calling doesn't help your argument, please refrain.

That is how Ghoulman handles all of his threads. If a person does not agree with him, well they must be a moron.

And no Ghoulman, I do not purposefully ignore allegory. I just don't see right wing progaganda in every allegorical storyline like you apparently do.

May have been the losing side. Still not convinced it was the wrong one.

RUE

Friday, May 21, 2004 7:37 PM

The absolute most alien show I've ever seen is FF.

There was an exchange that went (more or less):
"If you can't run, then walk, if you can't walk then crawl, and if you can't crawl ..."

Now as I was following this I was trying to predict how this sequence would end.

In Western cultures we are taught that only the 'immutable' things are meaningful ... the isms and ologies. People achieve meaning with their lives only insofar as they lose themselves or sacrifice themselves to the greater. It makes our economic system possible (c'mon, do you REALLY want your certain fate to be to toil most of the years of your life and hope and pray you don't get ill and wiped out financially?) So our ending would be "if you can't crawl ... do yourself in so as not to be a burden to this big all important ism."

Instead it ended ... "find someone to carry you."
Now THAT is political. And alien.

Much more interesting that watching cowBOYS in space.

GHOULMAN

Friday, May 21, 2004 8:47 PM

Quote:
Originally posted by captaincdc:
I have been watching Enterprise since the first ep, and am thoroughly pleased that it is coming back. For one reason, because it pisses you off so much.

I formally ask you to go find a hobby other than slandering me.

FIREFLEW

Saturday, May 22, 2004 8:30 PM

Personally, it really doesn't surprise me if they're doing this. This entire war in Iraq has been a whole host of, well not propoganda, but half-truths.

Don't get me wrong, Saddam Hussein was an abhorrent person who deserves everything he gets.

However, the ORIGINAL cause of war was, essentially, a lie. There are no weapons of mass destruction found, a year after the war. In England, it was found that the idea of 45-minute deployable WMD was in fact a lie.

Sorry that this isn't related, but my point is there is spin in almost everything, even what was formerly harmless (and drivel-like) entertainment.

Jayne: "Know what the chain of command is? It's the chain I beat you with till you understand who's in command."

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