Boycott ENTERPRISE .. it's just that bad.
POSTED BY: Ghoulman
UPDATED: Monday, January 24, 2005 20:10
VIEWED: 38245
PAGE 2 of 15
Quote:
Originally posted by rklenseth:
Ghoulman, just a quick question, do you have a problem with everything in the world (well besides Firefly)? And if the answer is no then I would to hear what you don't have a problem with for once rather then what you do have a problem with.
Oh, and play Cantr II at www.cantr.net
Oh come now. It's not like I have been smackin' post after post of "things I hate". There have only been two things I've hated and posted here. Bad TV and bad politics. It's not like I have a list. Gotta ask, why do you think I'm such a muck raker?
Besides, it's not like I'm the only person around saying these things. And if you people want Sci-Fi turned into crappy 'entertainment' then you got your wish. I just thank the TV Goddesses for Joss Whedon every frellin' day.
Oh, and we are neck and neck with the SAVE Enteprise thread! *chuckle* Wow, it's a race! But hey, the show was renewed soooo... this thread has already lost. But that doesn't mean we on the Net can't express our opinions. After all, that's what this stuff is for... and Hollywoodland is reading it. Trust me, the Trek producers don't like me one bit.
Hmm, things I DO like... Sci-Fi only...
Oh... I thought Farscape turned into a great show. How's that? Oh, and the new Battlestar Galactica is terrific. Love that Moore guy. Since he left Star Trek his talents can finally be freed.
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Quote:
Originally posted by Ghoulman:
After all, that's what this stuff is for... and Hollywoodland is reading it. Trust me, the Trek producers don't like me one bit.
Even if anyone at Hollywood is reading this I don't think they give a damn what you, me, or anyone else here thinks. Just so long as they keep getting their money they're happy.
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Well, it seems like when ever I read a post by you it is something bad. Maybe I'm just not reading your good posts.
Oh, and play Cantr II at www.cantr.net.
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Well RKLENSETH, I think standing up to Right Wing liars is a positive thing myself. Have ya NOT seen CNN? Where have you been the last few years? You know there is this 'War on Terror' baloney around right? Oh, I'm just teasing ya.
And Ghola, I'm not the only one who has made the connection to Bush and Enterprise. Not to mention it's more than a little obvious. There have been articles about this, there has been talk about it. So don't come around saying I made it up or it's just my opinion - this is the reality. If you don't believe me then you haven't been paying attention to what's going on, what's being said, and most importantly, what's been written about Enterprise.
Do your own research.
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Quote:
Originally posted by Ghoulman:
I just thank the TV Goddesses for Joss Whedon every frellin' day.
Finally, something you and I agree on!
Quote:
Trust me, the Trek producers don't like me one bit.
Ah, you also found something the Trek producers and I agree on!
I have been watching Enterprise since the first ep, and am thoroughly pleased that it is coming back. For one reason, because it pisses you off so much. Another more important reason, because I enjoy the show. And what do you know, I don't exhibit any of the pathetic sexual deviant geek fan boy qualities that you implied every Enterprise fan must. Don't read so much into every show. Just because you want it to be there, 'cause you hate the show, does not mean it is or that it was the writer/producers intent. If you like the show, watch it. If you don't, then don't watch, because I for one am tired of hearing your self important blatherings. And for someone taking shots at those that you deem practice "bad politics", try not to stereotype people as much.
May have been the losing side. Still not convinced it was the wrong one.
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Quote:
Originally posted by Ghoulman:
And Ghola, I'm not the only one who has made the connection to Bush and Enterprise. Not to mention it's more than a little obvious. There have been articles about this, there has been talk about it. So don't come around saying I made it up or it's just my opinion - this is the reality. If you don't believe me then you haven't been paying attention to what's going on, what's being said, and most importantly, what's been written about Enterprise.
Do your own research.
It is just your opinion like this whole T'pol going back to Archer like a battered wife when was this? Or the vulcans being liberals and Archer's father being Bush Sr. please apart from the fact that was introduced in the pilot (the one written before 9/11) the Vulcans were merely used as a plot device to create conflict. I can see where you could see the connection between Iraq/the Xindi thing from the first few episodes of the arc but more recently Archer has been allied with some Xindi and there are aliens that have been tricking the Xindi into attacking earth. I do agree that they should give more for the two minority characters to do but yelling racism is a pretty big accusation.
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^^^ Hey CAPTAINCDC, like the show all ya want. Not like it's a crime to lack sagacity. Reading your post I suspect you think of yourself as a 'geek' and therefore don't like to be called 'smelly' or something. That's fine, and hey, you're standing up for yourself! Good on you. But I don't like "Fanboy" culture and, as someone with some experience in that melee, I can tell ya that Fanboys are nothing but psychological misfits who have obsessed over to much fantasy and Sci-Fi. Worse, tptb will take advantage of this and sell you all the fetish objects your addiction can pay for. Is that healthy for the Fanboy? No, of course not. Worse, the Fanboy culture that has been groomed by Hollywoodland to build franchises these days lately have revealed themselves as the brainwash it is. Even more ... er, worse - this model of Fanboy pandering only encourages crap shows like SG-1 or Babylon 5 (which aren't horrific like ENT but are just as boring... if written competently, and that's not saying much).
I want shows like Firefly!!! See where I'm going with this? I'm not just bitching in the air here, I see direct currents (currents you might change!) in Hollywoodland that caused the cancellation of Firefly, Angel, and Buffy.
About politics... I don't know myself but it's pretty obvious to me Firefly was 'messed with' by FOX simply because they saw it as liberal propoganda. That, btw will be my next thread. 
btw, a lie is not an opinion. So don't jump on me for shitting on peoples opinions, as I've never done that. Liars, however, will feel my full wrath.
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Quote:
Originally posted by Ghola:
It is just your opinion like this whole T'pol going back to Archer like a battered wife when was this? Or the vulcans being liberals and Archer's father being Bush Sr. please apart from the fact that was introduced in the pilot (the one written before 9/11) the Vulcans were merely used as a plot device to create conflict. I can see where you could see the connection between Iraq/the Xindi thing from the first few episodes of the arc but more recently Archer has been allied with some Xindi and there are aliens that have been tricking the Xindi into attacking earth. I do agree that they should give more for the two minority characters to do but yelling racism is a pretty big accusation.
English! Please!
But I think I get you. I see where you see some of what I mean (glad to see Joss' metaphor ladden stories have had an affect) but not all of it. Especially T'Pol. I do see one problem you have, you are following the plots. That is misleading as the plot will pull you around by the nose (narratively speaking). Watch what the charactes do. What choices they make. A story can't just ignore reality, even in these days of unreality. 
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Quote:
Originally posted by Ghoulman:
Worse, Enterprise is also the producers sycophantic pro George "Dubya" Bush cream dream. Notice how the protagonist, Capt. Archer, is the son of a "great man" who was held back by the (liberal) Vulcans. As the show progresses, Archer becomes increasingly more angry and with a terrorist attack on Earth by an alien race he agrees to "do what it takes" to ... well, the actual goals aren't defined. Stop the bad guys? Sound familiar? Propoganda is not what I watch Star Trek for let alone a soft sell for the War in Iraq. It's become painfully obvious that Enterprise means to present the 'War against Islam" as a great adventure. Sick.
(snipped)
Boycott Enterprise.
Thanx for your time.
---
Ghoulman
I think you've done a great analysis here, Ghoulman, although as a non-American I'd go a step further and say that the show seems to be doing a soft-sell on war in general, not just the one in Iraq. (So, are you guys planning to invade anyone else this year?
). I'll still watch the show, at this point mostly to see what else they'll screw up in their own continuity/character development.
Your point about entertainment being used as propaganda is well-known by many: remember when all the bad guys in movies always looked German? (remember The Empire in Star Wars?)
Then we hit ST:TNG and all the Romulans look suspiciously middle-eastern. It goes on from there.
I well remember a class at uni where we were looking at the movie, "Top Gun," and one guy kept insisting it was just a great movie and wasn't trying to say anything. As one of our American classmates said to him, "Do you think that the navy just loans out aircraft carriers for the heck of it?"
There was a point here somewhere, but I think it got lost somewhere behind a bad script.
Cheers,
Annik
... my sister's a ship. We had a complicated childhood.
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Like I said in my first reply to you Ghoulman, I am not a sad geek fanboy (not that there is anything wrong with that, and I'm sure that you will misinterpret my denial as me being in a state of denial, but whatever). I am totally on board for changing the current climate of television. I hunger for the next firefly, buffy, angel, or wonderfalls to make it on the air and be a success. I just don't think Enterprise is public enemy #1 in fighting that front. And I don't believe for one moment that the Fox network "messed with firefly simply because they saw it as liberal propaganda". They axed it because they had no vision and did not realize what a jewel joss and tim had given them. I know that there is a lot of propaganda out there primarily by the government (regardless of who is in the white house) but you come off sounding paranoid seeing propaganda where it might not exist. Your response to ghola advising to ignore plot in favor of reading between the lines is a very telling insight into your views of these shows that we are debating. I agree that we need to read between the lines to see the big picture, but how can you fully enjoy a tv show if you ignore plot?
And could you expand upon what you meant by this:
Quote:
btw, a lie is not an opinion. So don't jump on me for shitting on peoples opinions, as I've never done that. Liars, however, will feel my full wrath.
May have been the losing side. Still not convinced it was the wrong one.
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