Do you support our current president?
POSTED BY: canttakesky
UPDATED: Tuesday, December 21, 2021 17:33
VIEWED: 12746
PAGE 8 of 15
By "business" you mean bombing the police station, dontcha, ya anarchist 
(total sarcasm here, stupid text is hard to show that unless you write it out 
)
Oh, yes... suprisingly I agree with you on this topic 
Although I personally haven't had any bad experiences with cops, I've heard plenty of horror stories and wonder why in the hell they can get away with that...
Although I haven't heard a story quite like the one with the old man and his being disarmed... I'm gunna have to do some of my own digging in regards to that, and if it is true (not saying I don't think it's possible, just saying it sounds highly unlikely to me) then there is something seriously wrong there... if a man can loose a pistol that he kept for his own self defence and had registered to his name... well, that's some hardcore trampling of our constitutional right to bear arms... 
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Quote:I think most people oversimplify the situation - they don’t understand it and many don’t want to. It’s easy to despise authority, but reasonable people understand it’s necessity and should try to be fair in their thinking.
Originally posted by SignyM:
Okay, I obviously took silly-pills this AM and I derailed a perfectly valid, serious discussion about authority.
Finn, words seem to have been put into your mouth that all cops are good cops. I'm pretty sure that's not what you think. So, what DO you think?
The simplification that occurs is the myth of the “asshole cop.” Like any group of people, there will always be “assholes,” but that’s pretty subject and unspecific term. When we examine what “asshole” means I think we discover that the asshole cops aren’t really the problem. One might view an asshole cop as a corrupt cop - someone who uses his position for illicit activity. But cops aren’t stupid, and if a cop is corrupt he’s not going to bring attention to himself. Yes, it’s true he may use inappropriate force, but often he will be operating in the shadows out of view or concern of the public. So corrupt cops pose a unique problem but not typically the one that is responsible for the negative view some in the public hold of police. The second way “asshole” is interpreted is to assume that police are power-hungry, suffering from inferiority complexes - not really corrupt but just bullies - and while it makes sense that police work would disproportionately attract this kind of personality to the career, over say bank tellers or engineers, the assumption that this plays a big role in the appearance of police does not take into account the degree to which police work is heavily documented and regimented with strict rules of conduct and engagement. Quite literally police are not at liberty to employ their own personality - but rather are required to employ very strict rules of engagement - which include an excess of politeness. So I seriously doubt that the bully factor plays as much into this as some think.
This doesn’t mean that either of these situation isn’t important on its own merit and shouldn’t be source of concern and dealt with appropriately - but this is a different topic - this is not typically what creates those YouTube encounters from which some people will inevitably demand that all cops are assholes. Sometimes it is the bully-cop or the corrupt-cop that we see on YouTube, but most of the time, what we are looking at are good cops who are subject like everyone else to human nature.
Unlike bank tellers and engineers, police often routinely deal with people who have both the incentive and the will to do them harm, and while they are trained to deal with these kinds of people, situational awareness will never be 100% and mistakes get made and tress takes its tole. An officer may be having a bad day, and may over react to what would otherwise be a benign situation. We can criticize this behavior and say it shouldn’t happen, but there for the grace of god go us. Often the situation is even more ambiguous, an officer may see something or hear something that tips him off to a more dangerous situation then is present or he may correctly react to a real potential of a dangerous situation, only to have the suspect deny that there was any such danger, or the situation may go completely by the book with no one getting hurt, but a naïve uninformed populous may still find reason to resent the actions of the police. And we, the citizenry share more blame for these kinds of situations then we are generally willing to admit. Many people resent the authority of the police or may resent that authority when it is applied to them. Many people may correctly believe that they are not a threat, and may naively fail to understand why the police might view them as a potential threat. And so we tend to mouth off and become over agitated by authority more then we should - we tend to fail to understand the seriousness of the situation - but any encounter with an officer is serious,
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just got a short span here... i'm being moved to maximum security in a few... seems that they actually had to parole a couple of serial rapists/murderers to make room for me... ya see i got popped with 2 seeds in the ashtray of my vw.... johnny law in these parts has his priorities don't you know....
seriously shirley, i'm not going to waste everyone's time here with my interpretation of good cop bad cop... but i noticed a new movie out today - Street Kings that evidently paints a pretty grim picture of the LAPD.... a Keanu Reeves vehicle... so take it for what you will..
please continue....
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"Quite literally police are not at liberty to employ their own personality - but rather are required to employ very strict rules of engagement - which include an excess of politeness."
I have a cousin who is a version of federal police (don't want to say exactly what kind). Many, many things happen that aren't by the book - all the other cops know, maybe even the next level up has a suspicion (but it's a don't ask, don't tell policy) - but you're making a very unsupported statement here. Without cams and recorders, with only other police and suspects as witnesses - WHO exactly is going to ensure that this code of conduct is followed ?
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"Global warming - it's not just a fact, it's a choice."
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Quote:Except for the ones that consider themselves the Law, as opposed to being those that serve it.
Originally posted by Finn mac Cumhal:
Quite literally police are not at liberty to employ their own personality - but rather are required to employ very strict rules of engagement - which include an excess of politeness.
Quote:*muffled sardonic laughter*
So I seriously doubt that the bully factor plays as much into this as some think.
Quote:Difference is when I'm having a bad day I don't TASE anyone or start a process that requires time, lawyers and money.
most of the time, what we are looking at are good cops who are subject like everyone else to human nature.
An officer may be having a bad day, and may over react to what would otherwise be a benign situation.
Quote:I guess I'm just a superior homosapien then- NOTHING could cause me to physically harm someone who isn't directly trying to harm me or others...I guess I'm just exceptional that way- I should cut some slack for peeps with badges & guns that feel the need to let off some steam occasionally...
We can criticize this behavior and say it shouldn’t happen, but there for the grace of god go us.
Quote:Puhleeeeze. I was stopped by a cop in a police car while I was riding my bike at night when I was 25, the officer treated me like s**t for ten minutes before even noticing my hunting knife visibly strapped to my belt, at which point he asked me why I had it. I told him I checked with the local PD and they said it was all legal, and that I carried it due to the presence of wild dog packs that roamed the area I had to bike through at late hours. He asked me what planet I thought he was from and I SO wanted to tell him Uranus, but I didn't. He then took the knife from me, and when I asked him when I might be allowed to get it back, he asked me if I really wanted to spend a night in jail. Then he told me to go home. Next day I drew a picture of him & went to the station in the precinct listed on his car, and was told no such incident had been reported, and when I showed the drawing and explained that I wanted to make no trouble, but that it was a fairly expensive knife, they told me to come back the following day, which I did. They handed me my knife in a bag, and had me sign nothing. When I got home I found it had been sharpened razor-fine. That punk stole a cool, legal knife from what he thought was a scared, dumb kid (I played it well, I guess) just for fun. And that's my nicest bad-cop story.
Many people may correctly believe that they are not a threat, and may naively fail to understand why the police might view them as a potential threat. And so we tend to mouth off and become over agitated by authority more then we should - we tend to fail to understand the seriousness of the situation - but any encounter with an officer is serious, even if its just a routine traffic stop.
Quote:In MY job, I'm REQUIRED to leave my bad day at home, why can't someone with a firearm be required to do the same?
This doesn’t make cops bad, it makes them human and it makes us human.
Good Chrisisall bad Chrisisall
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Quote:
Originally posted by chrisisall:Quote:In MY job, I'm REQUIRED to leave my bad day at home, why can't someone with a firearm be required to do the same?
Originally posted by Finn mac Cumhal:
This doesn’t make cops bad, it makes them human and it makes us human.
Ah but do you? Really? I know I can't chose my bad days, sometimes things just go down hill and I can't afford to say "you know what, I'm going home now."
We all have bad days the best we can hope for is that we show some grace under pressure.
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Quote:...and not shoot someone.
Originally posted by Fletch2:
We all have bad days the best we can hope for is that we show some grace under pressure.
Agreeing Chrisisall
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Quote:
Originally posted by chrisisall:Quote:...and not shoot someone.
Originally posted by Fletch2:
We all have bad days the best we can hope for is that we show some grace under pressure.
Agreeing Chrisisall
You work for the postal service?
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Quote:No, but I do work with the public, all day
Originally posted by Fletch2:Quote:
Originally posted by chrisisall:Quote:...and not shoot someone.
Originally posted by Fletch2:
We all have bad days the best we can hope for is that we show some grace under pressure.
Agreeing Chrisisall
You work for the postal service?
, and I still wouldn't tase most folk.Non-violent Chrisisall
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You keep bring up tasing, but use of tasers is often a perfect example of a situation in which police react appropriately, only to be condemned for it because people understandably find the screaming and thrashing of tased individuals disagreeable. But what many people don’t understand (and in truth many don’t want to understand) is that tasing is far safer then physical restraint. Most unexplained deaths that occur in custody have been shown to be the result of physical restraint, yet many people would prefer police to use physical restraint simply because it avoids them the discomfort of seeing someone being tased. You want to simplify the issue down to a bunch bullying police, but its not that simple.
Nihil est incertius vulgo, nihil obscurius voluntate hominum, nihil fallacius ratione tota comitiorum.
Nothing is more unpredictable than the mob, nothing more obscure than public opinion, nothing more deceptive than the whole political system.
-- Cicero
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