Common or annoying characterization mistakes
POSTED BY: jetflair
UPDATED: Friday, October 19, 2007 12:13
VIEWED: 28421
PAGE 4 of 9
I can't stand it when the women are completely flat.
Zoe is just all stone cold, warrior but complete mush in reference to Wash (post or pre BDM)
Inara is all wise and perfect and slightly sardonic but completely smitten with Mal.
Kaylee is just so happy! All the time! She's never sad! Unless Simon's not looking at her :(
Because of their specific percieved roles on the show, they are rarely put outside their boxes. All of them are more then they are percieved as. Like the whole soup thing with Zoe. Not weak or mushy, just sweet, rarely a word applied to Zoe. Furthermore she's protective of the crew. She rarely shows it, but it's obvious that these people (with the exception of Jayne) are her friends.
Inara is always like, the Oracle for other characters. When they have a problem they go to her (or Book, depending on the timeline). What about her issues and I don't just mean her and Mal. I seriously doubt that she is just nurturing/beautific. I thought Shindig was a good example of her other qualities. Her want for freedom, but at the same time she is still a person, not just a Companion. She wants affection and respect and belonging.
And Kaylee is honestly one of the most underwritten characters. She's always the same in most fics! All sunshine, engine grease and strawberries. I get that she's loving and sensitive, but for God's sake, let her grow up! Everyone has a dark side and things they aren't proud of! No one is happy all the time, optimism or no.
_____
"You know that's gonna fall off."
-----Nathan Fillion (to me while drunk)
How are ships unlike food?
1. If you try it and don't like it, you don't have to do it again.
2. You can have as much as you want, when you want.
3. Cravings can be very specific.
I mean, hello it's not as if there's 'ship police?
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great post Danni!
and you are so right about Kaylee! but GORRAM! is she hard to write! she offers such a chance for shorthand 'tv-ish' moments but it's at the expense of her character. She is one of the characters i am in a hole right now trying to work out a new approach to that still feels like FireFly.
make someone a browncoat today - don't drive nobody away
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I think the biggest part of Mal's character we see is defined by his post traumatic stress disorder. According to Joss, that was the framework for the character modeled after Civil War survivors. I think it's very hard for anyone to truly understand how Mal would react unless they have had the same kinds of trauma he had, and thankfully not many people ever have that kind of stress in their lives. One fic author who has PTSD writes a striking Mal, different than many others, but completely true to Joss. The next most believable Mal IMO is Mal4Prez, because of how she writes the PTSD - and then enhanced it. As soon as Mal becomes someone defined outside of his PTSD, he stops being Mal and either becomes a fluffy hero, or an outlaw with a good side, and I think he's much more than that.
I think the point of using River on the heist on Lilac was to show how truly desparate he was - that he was at the end of all his resources, and because sheltering the Tam's had driven away the easy jobs. I don't think it was something he was proud of. Many people with a cynical nature are at heart a bleeding humanist, who've been hurt too often and lash out rather than risk taking another blow.
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Quote:
Originally posted by Katesfriend
I think the point of using River on the heist on Lilac was to show how truly desparate he was - that he was at the end of all his resources, and because sheltering the Tam's had driven away the easy jobs. I don't think it was something he was proud of. Many people with a cynical nature are at heart a bleeding humanist, who've been hurt too often and lash out rather than risk taking another blow.
Well said! Insightful
I don't think it was Joss's intention for any of his women characters to be portrayed weak or wooden because of their gender, especially, Inara. I cringe when I read anything remotely suggestive.
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Quote:
I don't think it was Joss's intention for any of his women characters to be portrayed weak or wooden because of their gender, especially, Inara. I cringe when I read anything remotely suggestive.
yeah - i've been arguing about this - it's complex, allowing a femminine side to charatcers without falling into a 'weak' sterotype - but not over compensating with a wooden 'warrior woman' cardboard cut out. I tried to explore different kinds of potential female strength (and power) in my 'dresses' bit of fic. it's made trickier by the fact that different writers on the show emphasise (sp?) different aspects of the characters.
one cliche that really bugs me is the oversimplification of River as 'a child trapped in a woman's body' coz it's often an excuse for slightly dubious/creepy and paternalistic minded sexist claptrap.
same with the River as a being of nature thing.
she has elements of both this things but she is much more complex than the cliches often allow.
when i was helping zoe nowhere with her River Dance piece i made damn sure she put in some refs to River's knowledge of science/maths atleast.
interstingly i used to have the same problem with Fred in Angel - always being called 'fey' 'childlike' but at the same time a geeks 'science hotty dream'. i guess it's hardest of all for the fic writer because of course the actors bring so much dimension to a role - they can suggest so much extra. the writer tends to have to be a bit more explicit which is sthe devil's road to cliche hell.
great thread this still!
make someone a browncoat today - don't drive nobody away
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I actually recently got slammed because people felt that my characterization of Kaylee was too "un-Kaylee" because of somethings I had her do in a fic. It really pissed me off because I really felt that what I had her doing was in fact realistic to her character and that it would effect her in a certain way. (Probably got all those reviews from people who like Silee and it was a Jaylee fic.)
Good characterizations of Kaylee? Go check out Jacqui's stuff. Esp "Pieces". Just enter her name and fireflyfans.net into google. If Jaylee squicks you it might bother you, but her Kaylee is amazing.
_____
"You know that's gonna fall off."
-----Nathan Fillion (to me while drunk)
How are ships unlike food?
1. If you try it and don't like it, you don't have to do it again.
2. You can have as much as you want, when you want.
3. Cravings can be very specific.
I mean, hello it's not as if there's 'ship police?
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-vump 4 plato! -
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Quote:
Originally posted by wytchcroft:
[QUOTE
one cliche that really bugs me is the oversimplification of River as 'a child trapped in a woman's body' coz it's often an excuse for slightly dubious/creepy and paternalistic minded sexist claptrap.
same with the River as a being of nature thing.
she has elements of both this things but she is much more complex than the cliches often allow.
Well, I see River as an adolescent. A gifted traumtized one at that. And if that's not complex enough as it is; I don't know what is.
My big cliche grip with her fic portrayal is that she not only has knowledge ("all the math in the verse"), but she is infinitely wise about the nature of life. And when her dialog is plucked right out of a fortune cookie.
And post BDM, when she goes from 17 to 30 in 6 months time in order to be paired up with a BDH.
I'm always left asking, where's my River? She didn't have to to grow and discover herself and face her demons. ARHHHG!!NOTIFY: Y | REPLY | REPLY WITH QUOTE | PERMALINK | TOP | HOME
LOL yeh i'm with you on that!..
a high 'Grrr! Arrgh!' factor.
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