Jayne's first betrayal
POSTED BY: Dantien
UPDATED: Sunday, June 17, 2007 03:46
VIEWED: 14959
PAGE 3 of 5
Quote:
Originally posted by j6ngo1977:
Yeh but wouldn't you whine and cower like a baby if you flew through Reaver space??? :) Jayne is a hard man but he knows Reavers have numbers and the only way to put a reaver down is to make sure they are dead. I think after Arial, Jayne was a changed man.
I agree that Ariel was a serious point in Jayne's character development.
But, no one else on the bridge was whining and cowering in the corner... He's always been wussy about Reavers. Even in Bushwhacked, he didn't want to unload the cargo from the derelict because the Reavers had been there. ZOE: "Jayne, you'll scare the women."
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Quote:
Originally posted by milford:
Dead on, Causal. You know Jayne won't change his stripes. He's loveable, he's funny, and he seems dumb. And that's why Joss would have him drop the others like a bad habit. Remember the scene in Serenity with Jayne after his blow-up with Mal. He clearly comes to a choice and goes after River. Now, does the Miranda situation change things? I think so. But in the Firefly world that wasn't, the seasons that we missed (you FOX!), you know he would have turned on each one of them. Joss loves to do that. Remember Wesley on Angel and Willow on Buffy?
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Customizeable handmade baby gifts personalized by my wife! Check them out at www.baby-bobo.com. All proceeds go towards international adoption.I think River made Jayne come after her. She had just suffered another Miranda vision. She makes Jayne attack her. Easily dispatches him. Then, convinces the crew to investigate Miranda.
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Quote:
Originally posted by Dantien:
did Jayne give the knife to the Alliance mole in the pilot episode?
I don't think that he did, just because he asks "Would helping you out mean turning on the captain?" and I think that he does have some respect for Mal, even if it doesn't seem like it. Even in Ariel he didn't think he was betraying Mal, only the Tams, whom he doesn't really like. And then there's also the fact that Jayne doesn't shoot Mal when he could've in the pilot.
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I'd always assumed that Jayne decided to play it safe in the pilot eposode. Tells the fed he won't help...much, drops a knife about two feet away. That way he'd helped, so he'd get his coin if the fed one, but it'd been untracable, so he wouldn't get shot if Mal won. I think Jayne had a best-case scenerio set up in his head, and was hoping on that. Namely, Fed gets out, takes the doc and moonbrain, and gets away before Mal, Jayne, and Zoe got back. Then, the fed wires him a lot of money for his help. Leave him a knife, leave the ship, and play his part. He's clean no matter who wins.
Yes, I do think Jayne's that smart.
As far as him turning on his previous crew...did those look like three men who got along? Seriously, he shared a bunk with one of them! They probablly had some dinky little rig that was giving them all cabin fever. More money, better working conditions, and getting away from people he'd been cramped up with goodness-knows-how-long? Yeah, that's worth taking.
If the series had continued, I think Jayne would have had many, many oppurtunities to turn on Mal...and wouldn't take them. Then, sometime, I'd say near the end of season 3, he freaks out 'cause he can't figure out why, gets in over his head on an outside deal and...well, who knows?
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I, for one, do not think Jayne left the knife for Dobson.
Just to point this out, however, Jayne was very prepared to leave Mal and Zoe on Paradiso in The Train Job. Whether or not he intended to come back for them, or his idea was to run and regroup, we never got to find out.
Of course, the rest of the crew wouldn't have stood for just leaving them, but, you never can tell what Jayne was thinking of.
At least, I can't!
In an edit: Hey? Is Serenity really going to be playing in Raleigh in June?
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I think Jayne is a merc-with-a-HoG.
I mean, Jayne was travelling with Marco before, but Marco was just a crook. Serenity is much more of a family, and we can tell that Jayne has always been part of a family, and can be part of one. (Mattie is still sick with the damplung 
)
In The Train Job, he wants to leave Mal because A) He wants to get the money and B) He knows everyone else on the ship is dead meat if they don't get the cargo to Niska.
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Quote:
Originally posted by Kaio:
I think Jayne is a merc-with-a-HoG.
I mean, Jayne was travelling with Marco before, but Marco was just a crook. Serenity is much more of a family, and we can tell that Jayne has always been part of a family, and can be part of one. (Mattie is still sick with the damplung
I do not see how that is relevant. Yes, he has family, but that does not mean anything. it does not make him softer or harder.
Quote:
In The Train Job, he wants to leave Mal because A) He wants to get the money and B) He knows everyone else on the ship is dead meat if they don't get the cargo to Niska.
B is conjecture.
having disagreed with you, I have to slightly agree and say he does have his own principles and priorirites.
1. Him.
2. The crew.
3. The Tams. (he does not consider them crew. Just a liability that has got attached to them and will likely get them all killed.)
As an example, the money in the pilot definitely was good enough, but he did not take it.
In Ariel the money was also good and he went for it. 2 major differences. One was that he had been stabbed. Second, the rest of the crew would not go down with the Tams and would be rid of a liability.
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Quote:
Originally posted by nbz:Quote:
Originally posted by Kaio:
I think Jayne is a merc-with-a-HoG.
I mean, Jayne was travelling with Marco before, but Marco was just a crook. Serenity is much more of a family, and we can tell that Jayne has always been part of a family, and can be part of one. (Mattie is still sick with the damplung
I do not see how that is relevant. Yes, he has family, but that does not mean anything. it does not make him softer or harder.
It makes a difference. Think about how different adults who grew up with close-knit stable families differ from adults who come from broken homes? It's not an exact 100%, but it is a goodly percentage.
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great discussion, as always. i'm with ladyknight. good logic. as is in the verse, nothing ever matches up exactly with the series and bdm. but i definitely see jayne dropping the razor on the floor. i see the interesting day coming up in season 3 (if wishes were horses...), where jayne does make his move overtly against mal.
i'll be in my bunk
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I think in the BDM, Jayne has warmed up slightly to the Tams, because when River goes all crazy and violent, he doesn't just punch her in the face to deal with her. He comes behind her and tries to reason with her while keeping her from doing any more damage to the rest of the people. Since at that point the Tams are not part of the crew, he wouldn't be doing it to protect the crew's reputatoin, and I seriously doubt he was doing it to turn her in for the money. Granted, afterwards he seems to do an about face and goes back to asking "Didn't we have this whole plan about how they were gonna not be here anymore?" So why then did he try to calm her down instead of just coldcocking her? Is he chivalrous? He certainly wasn't trying to hurt her, and even when she grabbed him ((Though this may be due to shock and confusion [To me his face just screams "I should not have told her about those".])) he didn't try to throw her around.
In Ariel, it certainly seems plausible that he was just trying to remove a foreign source of trouble for his family//crew on the ship. In Bushwhacked when they're playing the game in the hold he seems to be having genuine fun with the others, co-operating with them to the point where Kaylee was on his shoulders to give them the advantage, which I think would show at least his familiarity and comfort with them. He shows remorse about what he did to the captain, and concern for what the crew will think of him after he is gone.
I like the idea of Jayne assisting the fed obliquely enough to avoid incrimination if Mal won, because that seems to be a very Jayne thing to do.
In the Firefly-that-would-have-been-except-for-Fux I think Jayne would have become a much more Machiavellian, Manipulative character. He could possibly turn on Mal & Co, but I don't think he would as it gives him a certain level of anonymity and makes him less likely to be the focus of an investigation.
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