Common or annoying characterization mistakes
POSTED BY: jetflair
UPDATED: Friday, October 19, 2007 12:13
VIEWED: 28421
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Hmm… fanfic pet peeves:
1 –River: “You like Simon/Mal/Inara/Kaylee/Sasquatch. He/She likes you, too. Don’t deny it, I’m psychic. Just get together, because I have just pointed out how foolish/in love/covered in mayonnaise you two are.” Next Scene: “Simon/Mal/Inara/Kaylee/Sasquatch , I am in love/covered in mayonnaise with you. Lets be together forever!” First, why would River do this? Would she really know to do this? She’s a developmentally stunted teen. She doesn’t know about adult relationships, not first hand. She would be a fish out of water as a love doctor. Secondly, since when would Mal/Inara/Kaylee/Simon/Whoever listen? Change is internal. It doesn’t happen because River gives a speech.
2 – Inara suddenly realizing that her entire life is a sham/she is wrong about everything/she is a fool and must beg Mal for forgiveness. One, even if she did realize this, she has a lot of pride. Second, she would never realize this, because… she wouldn’t. It’s completely out of character. It’s just an easy way to resolve complex feelings, and it comes across as cheap.
3 – Zoe the suicidal robot post-Serenity. Yes, Zoe will grieve. It’s a loss she will carry with her the rest of her live. But Zoe is a warrior woman. She isn’t going to curl up an die. She’s a survivor. She’s going to live, and though she may lose her way a while, she’ll some day find something to live for.
4 – Rape fics. Not because they include rape, but because I feel that nine times out of ten instead of trying to really show what it would be like for one of the characters to deal with being a rape survivor, it does like this: She was raped. Oh god! Now, she has shut down completely. She doesn’t socialize. She talks in a monotone. She cries all day. For Months! But its okay, because her love interest pulls her out of her grief/funk, heals her emotional wounds, and then they get together, the horror now behind them.
Arcadia (aka Greyfable and/or Katie)
www.stillflying.net -- picking up Firefly were Joss left off. We will hold 'til he gets back.
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I just have to debate a little on the Zoe thing. You watch her in the movie, in the confrontation with the reavers, and she's like a Samurai going into battle. Woman is already dead. Okay, so maybe that wouldn't ever come up again? No, I can see her being a little more reckless than she otherwise would be, and all because she's a warrior woman. When you're a warrior who is pretty much already dead, you're able to do things you otherwise couldn't, but it's still more dangerous.
Okay, she still has things to live for. He wasn't her entire life. But he was a lot of it, and the fact is that something inside her has died. This can be an intriguing concept to explore. I'd love to see a really well-done fic that follows a whole arc with Zoe; her deadness and grief, her stubborness, and finally coming back from the edge. Or dying in some horribly noble way, because that could be realistic.
Just my two credits.
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Most definitely having River refer to herself in the third person or as "the girl", which is even worse. And believe me, there are a LOT of fics that fall into that trap for some reason I can't fathom since, as been pointed out, she only does it twice in the entire series/movie/comics/R. Tam sessions, and once it's as a joke, the other (in Objects in Space) as a means to make a point (remember Mal is talking over her to Simon when she's right there next to him). It just annoys me to no end. I tend to back out of stories that overuse this, even if they are otherwise well-written, just because it's a really big pet-peeve of mine.
Completely unrelated (or maybe not so), I have a problem with having River refer to Mal as Captain Daddy. Where did *that* come from? I just cringe when she calls him that in fanfics.
"People tell you things all the time, without talking. The way they move, the way they aren't talking." - River Tam
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You watch her in the movie, in the confrontation with the reavers, and she's like a Samurai going into battle. Woman is already dead. Okay, so maybe that wouldn't ever come up again? No, I can see her being a little more reckless than she otherwise would be, and all because she's a warrior woman. When you're a warrior who is pretty much already dead, you're able to do things you otherwise couldn't, but it's still more dangerous
I’m not saying the recklessness would go away, because, as you said, it’s a sign of her grief. However, as reckless-samurai as she was in the Reaver battle scene, she did tell Mal at the end of Serenity, “She’s torn a plenty, but she’ll fly true.” She’s going to heal. Sure, it will take a long time, but it will happen. And during that time, she's going to be more interesting than a suicidal robot, because she has a lot more to offer than stoic grief.
As for captain daddy, I think its from Safe when River says, "Daddy's coming to take us home" (or something to that effect). Simon things she's talking about Gabriel Tam, but she's talking about Mal.
Arcadia (aka Greyfable and/or Katie)
www.stillflying.net -- picking up Firefly were Joss left off. We will hold 'til he gets back.
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Xeyra - I'm so with you! The Safe "Daddy" thing was, IMHO, a metaphor to show that River (and Simon) can now think of Serenity as their home. The whole episode is about them - and Simon in particular - becoming crew.
In fact, I think River had been sensing Simon's memories of how he was abandoned by their father, and she's telling him that that won't happen on Serenity. I totally don't take it as her expressly calling Mal daddy. She may have father like feelings for Mal, but she wouldn't call him daddy.
Can you imagine her, in the final scene of the movie, saying "I can fly it captain-daddy"? *shudder*
It makes her sound like a 5 year old! I can be reading a fic where River is decently written, but as soon as "captain-daddy" comes out of her mouth, I totally lose it. It no longer seems like River to me, but some other character.
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I hate the out of characterness as well. For me it is anything that is inconsitent with what we see in the show and the movie. Pairings for instance that have no correlation. They bug me to no end. Now, I've seen a Jaylee or two that I actually like... but gee. And certainly under this category is slash. Some people like that, but (for this show at least) that's not Joss idea. I refreain from reading such things.
I agree with most of what's been stated previously. Kid Kaylee, cuddly Jayne, girly Zoe, completely wack River, all that has to go. Makes my stomach turn.
When I write, I try to write moments in time durring the episodes or in the movie. That way, I can easily stay true to the characters. Course it also happens that I'm not all that creative when it comes to writing completely original material. So.
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Quote:
Originally posted by AgentRouka:
For me it's when the balance in a relationship is lost.
River may have teased Simon about being a boob and said that he "takes so much looking after", but there are just as many moments where she honestly adores him.
I absolutely agree, on that and on simplified Simon too. In fact, the moment when she calls him a "boob" is the only one when she's really, deliberately mean and bratty to him. I'm viewing "He takes so much looking after" more like a lighter version of "My turn": she's proud that after all looking after he's done for her she can finally return the favour. And the moments when she's proud of him are so many more, in addition to Safe and OoG there're also scenes in Ariel when she's proud of him as a doctor, and in OiS when she's giggling over his mocking of Early, etc.
It's a very complex relationship, most interesting on the show, it pains me when it's not given a justice it deserves. There's another pet peave to it: when Simon is written as not understanding River, when everybody on the crew gets her better than him. Or when he's belittled for giving her medicines, because why would she need them - she's OK already. Yeah, sure.
And I also don't like when River is written as an action hero, enjoying heists and fights and such. She hates violence, she's kind by nature and when she has to act like a weapon it takes huge toll on her: she's horrified by what she has to do.
And it's an opposite pet peave with Inara: she's sometimes written as a delicate flower, all proper and refined, when she's in fact also a warrior woman in her own way and pretty bloody minded. There're many examples in FF/S when she wishes someone would be killed or die a horrible death, and she really means it. She can be dangerous and ruthless, like Mal.
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Can't agree about the slash thing. Joss has no fear of gay characters, and I believe he's been quoted as saying suggestive things about the male characters on Firefly.
Seriously, if you watch the show looking for sexual tension between Simon and Mal, you'll find it! I prefer M/I myself, but I can't argue that that's the only way...
Edit: good point about River/Simon. I'm thinking I have her be a little rough on him sometimes, and that may need rethinking.
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Quote:
Originally posted by MRSU:
There's another pet peave to it: when Simon is written as not understanding River, when everybody on the crew gets her better than him. Or when he's belittled for giving her medicines, because why would she need them - she's OK already. Yeah, sure.
Oh god, yes!
River's brain has been irrevocably altered and it's most likely Simon's medication since "Ariel" that even allowed River the level of lucidity to defeat Jubal Early in the way she did. She walked into dangerous situations carelessly ("Bushwhacked", "Safe") and ran away from hair ("Jaynestown" - church metaphor or not) and had violent fits before that. Giant leap in self-control since then, because of Simon's care.
It's a falsely inserted sense of teen rebellion that just has no place in their relationship, not if the validity of Simon's concerns isn't aknowledged by the author.
Quote:
She hates violence, she's kind by nature and when she has to act like a weapon it takes huge toll on her: she's horrified by what she has to do.
Very good point. It was dancing that she loved. Her fighting abilities are something that was forced upon her. "Can't look, can't look."/"Put a bullet in me."/"You've always taken care of me, my turn." She'll do it if she has to, but I sincerely doubt it's something she embraces as an empowering skill.
Her most geniune moments of joy were always born out of harmony. Simon saving lives, happy memories, playing with Kaylee. She sees a tree branch in a gun. That's a creature of love, not of war.
And a healthy dose of agreement on the "Captain Daddy" dislike. It sounds weird and far too cutesy, even if it reflects the nature of her feelings for him.
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Quote:
Originally posted by AgentRouka:
Her most geniune moments of joy were always born out of harmony. Simon saving lives, happy memories, playing with Kaylee. She sees a tree branch in a gun.
That's a creature of love, not of war.
Yeah, that's why she's wearing all those hippie clothes. :)
Poor girl almost doesn't get any moments of joy in the movie, except the very end when she's flying the ship. It might be one of the reasons the movie felt so dark. That, and her not wearing hippie clothes anymore. :(
Going back to Simon and River relationship: yep, he surely deserves credit for changes in River in the show. She's very different after Ariel, not throwing things around, calmly conversing with Simon, like in Trash, calling him "a boob" (yes :)), admiring the baby in HoG, saving Kaylee in War Stories, saving everybody in OiS. He worked so hard for that, and it wasn't in vain.
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