Bush to send troops to border
POSTED BY: rklenseth
UPDATED: Friday, May 19, 2006 00:56
VIEWED: 8734
PAGE 7 of 8
Bush to send troops to border
Syria or Mexico?
Edited to add: remember good old days when everyone chuckled that Bush couldn't find Afghanistan on the map? Now the twit is in .... charge ... of ... international ... borders.
Nearly everything I know I learned by the grace of others.
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It isn't looking good for the latest idea from the White House "brain trust". These guys remind me more and more of the Keystone Cops. Here's today's summary of related items from DailyKos:
Bush Immigration Plan: Sucky? Or Suckiest Plan Ever?
by SusanG
Wed May 17, 2006 at 04:12:15 PM PDT
Let's take stock of the reactions to Bush's immigration plan, shall we?
First off, there's the National Guard itself, resisting federal control:
Nat Guard leaders oppose Bush takeover
U.S. state-level National Guard leaders will fight any effort to place their forces under direct presidential control.
The National Guard commanders are poised to carry out the Bush administration's border-security plan to deploy thousands of troops to patrol the Mexican border, but they likely will fight any attempts to place the state-run units under the president's control, CongressDaily reported Tuesday.
Then there's the governor of California, who would seem to have a stake in the issue:
"Securing our borders is a law enforcement function and what we need are more Border Patrol agents, not National Guard troops who are neither trained nor suited for this purpose," Schwarzenegger said in a letter to Homeland Security Secretary Michael Chertoff.
And then there's the entire country of Mexico:
Mexico warned Tuesday it would file lawsuits in U.S. courts if National Guard troops detain migrants on the border, and some officials said they fear the crackdown will force illegal crossers into more perilous areas to avoid detection.
There's the Minutemen:
Minutemen dismiss Bush's border plan
TUCSON, Ariz. --A civilian border-patrol group said it still plans to erect a short security fence along the Mexican border, despite President Bush's pledge to deploy thousands of National Guard troops there.
A spokeswoman for the Minuteman Civil Defense Corps said Tuesday what Bush promised was not enough.
Add to that the writers at business website Forbes.com, an outlet that felt compelled today to publish not one, but two editorials questioning the wisdom of the idea, one claiming Bush's plan could "lead to a nightmare of contract abuse and waste," and another entitled "Mission Impossible?" that comes dangerously close to arguing Bush cannot possibly satisfy all the people he's claiming he will satisfy (known in reality world as "pandering").
There are various residents of El Paso, interviewed by AP:
"It didn't seem like a meaningful suggestion at all," said O'Rourke, a 33-year-old freshman city councilman in this border city. "But maybe that's because we already have it and it doesn't seem to be working."
And then there are the hodge podge of Senators and Congress people too numerous to cite and mention, fighting it out on the Hill. There's even some group I've never heard of, the National Immigration Institute, saying it will ask the Mexican government to "send a migrant protection force to remote sections of the border."
So who does Bush trot out to defend his nonsense? None other than Donald Rumsfeld. Remember him? The one who showed such prescient judgment on how many troops were needed in Iraq? Yes, that Donald Rumsfeld, if you can believe it.
And he sends Karl Rove, so close to indictment he's shifted his diet to prison fare in anticipation, to twist arms on Capitol Hill. You've got to wonder on that one, with all the back-stabbing he's done over the years. I can hear some House rep now: "Sure, Karl. I'll get back to you on supporting this loser issue. Right after Fitzgerald's next press conference."
So what is Bush's response to all this caterwauling from the ungrateful? Why, a photo op, of course!
Bush to Visit Border Smuggling Hotspot
YUMA, Ariz., May. 17, 2006
President Bush will be get an up-close look on Thursday when he visits Yuma as part of his push to overhaul the nation's immigration laws and tighten the 2,000-mile U.S.-Mexican border by sending up to 6,000 National Guardsmen in a backup role.
I have but one request of my country: If we're going to have a preside
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Quote:
Originally posted by rklenseth:
Nothing officially confirmed yet but it appears Bush is sending troops to guard the borders and that as well as the immigration problem in general is what Bush big speech is about tomorrow
HAHAHAHA. HE'S SENDING A TINY HANDFUL, SOMEDAY, TO SIT IN OFFICES, TAKE MEMOS AND TAKE OUT THE TRASH. CAN'T HAVE THEM INTERFERING WITH THE NARCOTRAFFIC AND SLAVE PLANTATION.
"You can't stop the signal!"
-Mr Universe, Pirate TV
FIREFLY SERENITY PILOT MUSIC VIDEO V2
Tangerine Dream - Thief Soundtrack: Confrontation
http://radio.indymedia.org/news/2006/03/8912.php
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Do you have your very own lovebot?
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A lovebot would be sweet!
I wanna be Mr. Baccarin!
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Which is entirely sensible Citizen. Someone who opposes gun control PLEASE tell me what reason an individual would need a 357?
Cause I just can't see it.
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When the right wing tries to attack the 1st Amendment they do so piece by piece, gradually. First they'll say, why do we have to have porn DVDs? That's not free speech, that's obscenity. Newspapers and TV shows are free speech, not porn. If they get rid of hardcore porn, then they'll ask, why do we have to have Playboy and soft core mags like it? If they get rid of soft core porn, they'll turn to racy, but not nude, mags like Maxim and FHM. Why do we need that garbage, they'll ask. Once they get rid of that they'll go after internet political sites they don't like, small magazines (like The Nation), TV shows with adult content, movies with nude scenes, and so on. The reason I point this out is people who want to eliminate gun ownership use the same tactics. they go after the most objectionable types of firearms first, establish a precedent that it's ok to ban certain types of firearms, and then they go after the more common firearms (like shotguns or 9mm pistols). A direct answer to your question is that a 357 is a very effective means of self defense. If you're going to have a pistol for self defense, the 357 is a good choice since it will take out an intruder regardless of whether you make a perfect shot or not. I don't own any firearms, but gun ownership is as protected by the Bill of Rights as porn, left wing political magazines, or your right to not incriminate yourself. If the 2nd Amendment were to fall, all other Amendments would follow since the only reason they survive is that they are viewed as sort of sacred and unassailable by the public. If one Amendment were to be destroyed the likelihood is that the other vulnerable Amendments would be stripped away soon after.
I wanna be Mr. Baccarin!
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Quote:
Which is entirely sensible Citizen. Someone who opposes gun control PLEASE tell me what reason an individual would need a 357?
Cause I just can't see it.
The .357 magnum revolver is possibly the handiest home defense tool ever invented.
First, it's a revolver. Revolvers are very simple to operate. You point them at what you want to destroy, and you pull the trigger. There's not a lot of switches or settings to bother with.
Second, the .357 magnum revolver is a dual-cartridge weapon. That means that you can fire either the .38 special bullet from it (an old police officer/security guard cartridge that dominated the 20th century; Only the .45 ACP has seen as much use) or you can load it with the more powerful .357 magnum cartridge.
Now, according to the FBI (and I take them seriously, because they learned their lessons the hard way) it is difficult to stop a determined attacker. A certain number of people, when struck by a bullet, will stop and drop. It's psychological. You could shoot them with a flimsy .25 caliber bullet, and that bullet might stop just under the skin. Pychologically, the person thinks, "I'm hit!" and they are out of the fight. In fact, most people are like this.
BUT, there is the other kind of person. Either their mental wiring is different, or they are too upset or too high to think about the fact that they've been shot. This kind of adversary can only be stopped if the bullet destroys them to such a degree that they can't continue. This means the destruction of immediately vital organs (like the heart) or the destruction of the central nervous system (by way of the spinal coord or brain.)
The FBI (and again, I take them seriously after that Florida disaster) has determined that the most essential component to stopping a determined attacker is penetration. You need your bullet to penetrate deeply enough into an adversary so that the bullet can reach and destroy vital organs. (I know this sounds morbid, but it's the way things are.)
There was a horrible shootout in Florida where several FBI agents were killed and maimed by a dead man. The purpetrator was shot lethally more than once, but his heart and central nervous system were not immediately destroyed. An autopsy later revealed that one of the first shots of the engagement had placed a bullet in line to destroy the heart of the criminal, but the bullet did not reach the heart because it did not penetrate deeply enough.
This caused the entire FBI to rework its weapons strategy, and a decade long debate on stopping power and ammunition ensued. In the end, I forget whether the FBI ended up adopting the 10mm or .40 caliber bullet. Their goal was essentially, "Have a bullet powerful enough to penetrate deeply, and then have it be a wide bullet, so that the wound channel is more likely to intersect with a vital organ."
Now, a .38 special bullet will not always penetrate deeply enough to reach a vital organ. It's hit and miss. .38 special rounds aren't known for their superb penetrative properties. However, the .38 special round is a low-recoil bullet that is relatively inexpensive to purchase.
A .357 magnum round is almost certain to penetrate deeply enough to reach internal organs. It can also reliably penetrate very light obstacles such as interior doors and windshields. A .357 magnum round is simply more likely to stop an attacker than a .38 special round.
I own a single-action .357 magnum revolver made by Taurus. It's just like the Wild-West single-action Colt Peacemaker revolver, except that it is chambered in .357 magnum. It allows me to use the inexpensive and fun .38 special rounds when I am shooting for sport or practice. It also allows me to load the more powerful .357 magnum bullets for home defense.
Anyone knowledgeable will tell you that ANY bullet might kill someone. Even the weakest and most anemic bullet is dangerous. However, when your life is on the line, you will tend to want the most effective weapon you can get. Other than a
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For those who are interested, here is the actual FBI report on handgun wounding effectiveness:
U.S. Department of Justice
Handgun Wounding Factors and Effectiveness
Special Agent UREY W. PATRICK
FIREARMS TRAINING UNIT
FBI ACADEMY
QUANTICO, VIRGINIA
July 14, 1989
Introduction
The handgun is the primary weapon in law enforcement. It is the one weapon any officer or agent can be expected to have available whenever needed. Its purpose is to apply deadly force to not only protect the life of the officer and the lives of others, but to prevent serious physical harm to them as well.1 When an officer shoots a subject, it is done with the explicit intention of immediately incapacitating that subject in order to stop whatever threat to life or physical safety is posed by the subject. Immediate incapacitation is defined as the sudden2 physical or mental inability to pose any further risk or injury to others.
The concept of immediate incapacitation is the only goal of any law enforcement shooting and is the underlying rationale for decisions regarding weapons, ammunition, calibers and training. While this concept is subject to conflicting theories, widely held misconceptions, and varied opinions generally distorted by personal experiences, it is critical to the analysis and selection of weapons, ammunition and calibers for use by law enforcement officers.3,4
Tactical Realities
Shot placement is an important, and often cited, consideration regarding the suitability of weapons and ammunition. However, considerations of caliber are equally important and cannot be ignored. For example, a bullet through the central nervous system with any caliber of ammunition is likely to be immediately incapacitating.5 Even a .22 rimfire penetrating the brain will cause immediate incapacitation in most cases. Obviously, this does not mean the law enforcement agency should issue .22 rimfires and train for head shots as the primary target. The realities of shooting incidents prohibit such a solution.
Few, if any, shooting incidents will present the officer with an opportunity to take a careful, precisely aimed shot at the subject's head. Rather, shootings are characterized by their sudden, unexpected occurrence; by rapid and unpredictable movement of both officer and adversary; by limited and partial target opportunities; by poor light and unforeseen obstacles; and by the life or death stress of sudden, close, personal violence. Training is quite properly oriented towards "center of mass" shooting. That is to say, the officer is trained to shoot at the center of whatever is presented for a target. Proper shot placement is a hit in the center of that part of the adversary which is presented, regardless of anatomy or angle.
A review of law enforcement shootings clearly suggests that regardless of the number of rounds fired in a shooting, most of the time only one or two solid torso hits on the adversary can be expected. This expectation is realistic because of the nature of shooting incidents and the extreme difficulty of shooting a handgun with precision under such dire conditions. The probability of multiple hits with a handgun is not high. Experienced officers implicitly recognize that fact, and when potential violence is reasonably anticipated, their preparations are characterized by obtaining as many shoulder weapons as possible. Since most shootings are not anticipated, the officer involved cannot be prepared in advance with heavier armament. As a corollary tactical principle, no law enforcement officer should ever plan to meet an expected attack armed only with a handgun.
The handgun is the primary weapon for defense against unexpected attack. Nevertheless, a majority of shootings occur in manners and circumstances in which the officer either does not have any other weapon available, or cannot get to it. The handgun must be relied upon, and must prevail. Given the idea that one or two torso hits can be reasonably expected in a handgun shooting incident, the ammunition used must maximize the likelihood of immediate
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Finally, according to the information I was able to find online, the 125 grain .357 Magnum JHP bullet averages penetration of 13.25" in ordinance gelatin. This falls securely in the FBI recommended zone, which states that, "a handgun bullet MUST reliably penetrate 12 inches of soft body tissue at a minimum"
So... Now that you've absorbed all this ballistic knowledge...
THAT is why a .357 magnum bullet (and the revolvers that fire them) are a prime choice for home defense.
--Anthony
"Liberty must not be purchased at the cost of Humanity." --Captain Robert Henner
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