Male and Female Imponderables Part Deux
POSTED BY: Tristan
UPDATED: Monday, May 15, 2006 20:33
VIEWED: 25808
PAGE 10 of 23
Just a random thought, on the subject of being "dumped," and maybe I'm reading too much into things here, and often it's hard to separate what may be a difference between people, and a gender divide as a whole:
Not to say that I haven't learned (or at least attempted to :) from my past failed relatioships. But, save for the occasions where I know it was mostly my fault, I've attributed them ending to just irreconcilable differences between us. Most times, it wasn't anyone's doing, it just didn't work out or we didn't have much chemistry to begin with, etc...
I've noticed here and in past experience, a tendency for women to wonder about what they did "wrong." Or at least that's how my addlepated male brain percieves it :P
Is this possibly another difference between men and women, or am I just confused again? 
In other words, when I'm coming out of a relationship, not that it's in any way easy, I usually figure it was bound to happen at some point. But I notice in the women more often than not thinking that there must have been something they could have to done to save the relationship. Or am I just being a chauvanist? :P
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You can take my hope when you pry it from my cold, dead fingers. (Or if Kaylee asks me nicely...)
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Erm, well, you might have something there.
See, though, it's never a chemistry thing with me. Believe me, I have yet to be in a relationship that didn't have good chemistry. And, while it possibly has been irreconcilable differences, that's never been my impression. That's part of my problem with the out of the blue dump, as I have been complaining, because we didn't seem to be having any problems. One week we're fine and the next not so much does not say "irreconcilable differences" to me.
So, since it's never struck me as being either of those things... Well, yes, I suppose I usually do think there had to have been a way to save it. Not to be a reverse chauvanist here, but maybe it's because women get more attached? I haven't ever wanted relationships to end when I didn't end them, so I have wanted to save them, and nothing had made me believe they couldn't be saved.
But, when saving them depends on a man who thinks it's unavoidable that it ends... No, I'm sorry, that's not very nice of me. But it might be true. If women want to save something and men figure it's just over, then it's ultimately over because the man didn't want to save it. Is that logical to anyone else?
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One summer.
One mission.
One legion of Browncoats.
Starting June 23rd, we aim to misbehave.
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'Course my own viewpoints might just be 'cause most of my relatioships have tended to end due to personality conflicts of some form or another. Alot of times we'd get along just fine as friends, but found we really didn't have enough in common to really be spending all that much time together. (Plus I understand I can be downright hard to live with at times :)
Far as this guy who up and dumped you with no stated reason (and just reiterating that there's really no good justification for that short of being a secret agent or something...) Seems like if there was any chance of saving the relationship, it would have had to come from his end. Doesn't sound to me like there was really very much you could have done, or even that you were doing anything wrong.
Back to the "cave" metaphor: Sure, it's a source of conflict at times. But I can hardly fault a girl for caring about what's going on in my head.
Side effect, of course, of bottling up all those tricky emotions: Maybe on the surface everything seemed fine. But I'd bet he was having doubts about the relationship for some time and just not coming clean about it. In my case, that was what happened. We'd actually broken up a couple times before it all totally fell apart. A part of me wanted to make it work, still, and thought that if I acted like everything was hunky-dory for long enough that it would become so. Obviously, that's a pretty wrong way to look at things though :P
If that was the case, though, I'd call that "irreconcilable differences" certainly.
________________________________________________
You can take my hope when you pry it from my cold, dead fingers. (Or if Kaylee asks me nicely...)
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Quote:
Originally posted by nuclearday:
Far as this guy who up and dumped you with no stated reason (and just reiterating that there's really no good justification for that short of being a secret agent or something...) Seems like if there was any chance of saving the relationship, it would have had to come from his end. Doesn't sound to me like there was really very much you could have done, or even that you were doing anything wrong.
Back to the "cave" metaphor: Sure, it's a source of conflict at times. But I can hardly fault a girl for caring about what's going on in my head.
Side effect, of course, of bottling up all those tricky emotions: Maybe on the surface everything seemed fine. But I'd bet he was having doubts about the relationship for some time and just not coming clean about it. In my case, that was what happened. We'd actually broken up a couple times before it all totally fell apart. A part of me wanted to make it work, still, and thought that if I acted like everything was hunky-dory for long enough that it would become so. Obviously, that's a pretty wrong way to look at things though :P
If that was the case, though, I'd call that "irreconcilable differences" certainly.
...You know, it's real nice to get a male perspective on this.
Obviously we did have irreconcilable differences; I just wasn't made aware of them. Guess that's what I was so stuck on. It makes a little more sense to me now. Not, you know, a lot... But seems that most emotional logic isn't really logical, so trying to make logical sense of it really wasn't working.
This really helps me out. Thank you.
And it's nice to hear you don't fault us for wanting to know what's in your head.
Would women be believed if we said "I don't think you're a moron who needs me to solve your problems for you, I just wanna know what's going on."? Cuz that's the truth. Maybe I should just try saying that next time around.
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One summer.
One mission.
One legion of Browncoats.
Starting June 23rd, we aim to misbehave.
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Good morning! I am glad to see this is turning into a constructive thread!
PhoenixRose, I would like to find however it was that hurt you and toss them into an engine. Slowly (although I am not sure that is possible...I think you get my intent).
Now, to address some of your posts:
Chemistry...how do you define this? As a male, when I see chemistry, it usually relates to pheromones, hormones, and those happy little fireworks that go off in your brain. And, yes, sexual compatibility. It is also a highly visibile indicator that two people are together for a reason. The whole "love bird" thing, I guess you could say. Chemistry is wonderful, but sadly, it can fade away.
I am not really sure if there are many people out there that wanted a relationship to end if they did not end it themselves. But, if you know for certain that a relationship will no longer work, no matter how hard you try to "fix" it, would you still want to try? Generally, the person being broken up with thinks they are doing something wrong, and that they can repair any damage done. This is, unfortunately, not always the case. The one doing the breaking has reached a point where they can no longer tolerate the relationship, and the only alternative is to escape. Fight or flight reaction, ingrained in the caveman. 
But yes, males who are on the receiving end feel the same way; "what could I have done to keep her", or "what did I do to lose her"? Well, I am that way; again I can't speak for all males.
Alright, enough for first thing Monday morning...I hope I am helping further the understanding, and not just muddying the water further.
Holding until you get back, Captain.
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Quote:
Originally posted by Tristan:
PhoenixRose, I would like to find whoever it was that hurt you and toss them into an engine. Slowly (although I am not sure that is possible...I think you get my intent).
Awwww, thanks.
You want his address?
Quote:
Now, to address some of your posts:
Chemistry...how do you define this? As a male, when I see chemistry, it usually relates to pheromones, hormones, and those happy little fireworks that go off in your brain. And, yes, sexual compatibility. It is also a highly visibile indicator that two people are together for a reason. The whole "love bird" thing, I guess you could say. Chemistry is wonderful, but sadly, it can fade away.
Ummmmm, yes, that is how I define chemistry as well. I don't mean to sound shallow here, but a relationship without that is just a friendship. Not to say I don't like friendships, I like them quite a lot. But a romantic relationship pretty much requires attraction and pheromones and sexual compatability. I have often said that if you aren't having sex, you really are just friends. Attraction and desire always come into play. I have not had a romantic relationship without that. And believe me when I say the chemistry has never been the first thing to go. I will try not be be crude here, but my ex and I were having mind-blowing sex up until the day he stopped talking to me. This was not our problem. I have only theories as to what our problem in fact was, but I can say that lack of chemistry was not it.
Quote:
I am not really sure if there are many people out there that wanted a relationship to end if they did not end it themselves.
There are complete chickens in the world who wait for a relationship to die but can't end it themselves. There are also times when it's something close to a mutual decision. I just don't tend to function that way.
Quote:
But, if you know for certain that a relationship will no longer work, no matter how hard you try to "fix" it, would you still want to try?
No, not really. the "certain" thing is easy to get hung up on though. Obviously at this point I can be certain that I would never trust him again and therefore a relationship would not work (this, of course, if he ever decides to try reconciling with me) but at the time of ending I was massively confused as to what wasn't working here. I most certainly was not certain that it wouldn't work, which is why I wanted to know what was wrong before it was too late. He didn't tell me. It is now much too late. Yeah.
Quote:
Generally, the person being broken up with thinks they are doing something wrong, and that they can repair any damage done. This is, unfortunately, not always the case. The one doing the breaking has reached a point where they can no longer tolerate the relationship, and the only alternative is to escape. Fight or flight reaction, ingrained in the caveman.
Well, that exactly hits on why you might feel you drive someone away, doesn't it? Wonder why it is they can no longer "tolerate" being with you? Even if it's something that can't be fixed, it can be applied as a learning experience in future relationships.
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But yes, males who are on the receiving end feel the same way; "what could I have done to keep her", or "what did I do to lose her"? Well, I am that way; again I can't speak for all males.
Well, good to know. At least I'm not the only one.
And thank you for restoring a little of my faith in the male half of the species.
I'm sure you noticed how badly it was shaken. Still, probably won't date again for awhile.*************************************************
One summer.
One mission.
One legion of Browncoats.
Starting June 23rd, we aim to misbehave.
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PhoenixRose, no problem at all! Thank you for your responses as well. I am sorry that you were hurt and that your trust in males has suffered. There are those of us out here who do not think like "typical" males, and we cringe every time one of us does something stupid and enrages a female against out entire sex. So, we go out into the world, and try to spread tolerance and understanding in the wake of the idiots. We also have a secret society that tracks down the worse transgressors and eliminate them from the gene pool. 
Alright, let's see if we can lighten things up a little, bring some smiles instead of anger...
On the subject of perfume and colonge...when is it too much? Also, is there a favorite scent anyone finds completely irresistible on the opposite sex?
Holding until you get back, Captain.
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Quote:
Originally posted by Tristan:
PhoenixRose, no problem at all! Thank you for your responses as well. I am sorry that you were hurt and that your trust in males has suffered. There are those of us out here who do not think like "typical" males, and we cringe every time one of us does something stupid and enrages a female against out entire sex. So, we go out into the world, and try to spread tolerance and understanding in the wake of the idiots. We also have a secret society that tracks down the worse transgressors and eliminate them from the gene pool.
Again, good to know.
So where do I find those of you who don't think like typical males? Or is it the "have to kiss a lot of frogs" problem that can just never be solved?
Quote:
Alright, let's see if we can lighten things up a little, bring some smiles instead of anger...
On the subject of perfume and colonge...when is it too much? Also, is there a favorite scent anyone finds completely irresistible on the opposite sex?
For me personally if it is chemical based, it is always too much. I have a delicate nose and it tends not to be able to get past the nasty base smell to the possibly nice smell it's pretending to be. Essential oils, however, smell wonderful, and it only takes a little bit to last a long time and have a decently strong smell in most cases. I love them.
I can't say I favor just one smell. Everyone has different body chemistry, etc. so different scents are good on different people. Some people smell good wearing a sweet scent, some a spicy one, some one that combines the two. I wear flower or fruit scents, and ironically my namesake (rose) seems to smell the most irresistable on me. Tearose, to be exact, is my favorite scent on my personally. My ex who I have been complaining of always smelled heavenly to me; he wore vanilla oil, sometimes sandalwood vanilla. He smelled like candy and I just wanted to eat him up! But anyway, different scents smell good on different people. I can't wear my mom's perfume, which is poppy (commonly called opium) because it's too spicy for me, but it smells great on her. My stepdad weats patchuli, I think, and no one else I've ever met smells as good as he does wearing it. A friend of mine used to wear a scent called Night Queen which was just enchanting on her and really not the same on anyone else. Can you tell I'm obsessed with scents? Anyway, I just like people who smell good, and that is a matter of finding the right scent for you.
*************************************************
One summer.
One mission.
One legion of Browncoats.
Starting June 23rd, we aim to misbehave.
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*ribbit, ribbit* 
Yep, have to kiss a lot of frogs...but we are out there. Kinda hard to be sometimes, with the machismo B.S. everywhere, but we are around.
No, can't tell you're obsessed with scents at all! I also prefer the "lighter the better approach"...I cannot stand people who bathe in the stuff. If I can smell you from across the room, it's too much! My wife wears something called Black Dress...and on her it's heavenly. Just a slight hint of scent, not quite spicy, no quite flowery, but just right. As far as I am concerned, I do not usually wear cologne. When I do, it's Apen, as that is what my wife likes...and that's all that matters.
Holding until you get back, Captain.
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Good morning/afternoon depending on where you are. I would also have to say that kissing frogs is the only way Phoenixrose. I don't want this to sound like I'm bragging, but some of us don't have to disguise ourselves as frogs. What do you think Tristan? But, please don't give up on all males. Some of us are really good guys.
I'm not really big on perfume or cologne. There is nothing wrong with natural as long as you bathe on a regular basis.
Simon: What if he(Mal) tells you to kill me.
Zoe: (without hesitation) I kill you.
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