Abandoned by Heaven

POSTED BY: zzetta13
UPDATED: Friday, April 14, 2006 10:27
VIEWED: 8751
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PURPLEBELLY

Tuesday, April 11, 2006 6:04 PM

Quote:
I'm unaware of Joss making any comments on the subject

http://www.brainyquote.com/quotes/quotes/j/josswhedon181877.html

DESKTOPHIPPIE

Tuesday, April 11, 2006 6:07 PM

Yep, I think Mal pretty much lost his faith in Serenity valley, and the series was mostly about reclaiming his faith - not so much in God as in humanity.

I've never seen him wear his cross since the battle. Is it stowed away somewhere? It could be. That would be interesting to find out actually!

Joss mentioned on the DVD commentary for the Pilot that someone (not him) saw the other characters as representing something Mal had lost. Kaylee would be his innocence and sense of fun, Wash his sense of adventure, Book his faith and so on. It explains why Mal clashes with the characters at different times.

Short answer - yes, Mal lost his faith. But that's not to say he can't get it back. After all, he accepted Book as one of his crew.

Desktop Hippie: at one with the 'verse

MILFORD

Tuesday, April 11, 2006 6:08 PM

I was thinking along the lines of Tommy Boy Callahan and his brake pads.

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Leaning into the wind that used to carry me-Stavesacre
That's why I don't kiss'em on the mouth- Jayne Cobb

ZZETTA13

Tuesday, April 11, 2006 6:40 PM

Interesting DesktopHippie and certainly something that looks like possible connection points.Mals other selves.

Book.....Mals faith
Kaylee...Mals innocent side
Wash.... Mals adventuresome/exploration side
Zoey.....Mals connection to his past
Jayne....Mals Blutal and harsh side
Inara....Mals self battle (torn between Serenity & Inara)
Simon & River..Mals Alliance connection that he keeps.

MILFORD

Tuesday, April 11, 2006 6:45 PM

I like that line of thought, but I'd suggest a slight change. I think Simon and River are less about the Alliance and more about family. Mal is a VERY loyal person, and I find it strange that the little we know about his family came from the short conversation with YoSaffBridge in Our Mrs. Reynolds. I think there's more there, perhaps they represent the guilt he feels at leaving his family on Shadow to join the Browncoats. Or maybe the Alliance did something to them. Who knows. We'll just have to wait for Joss to finish writing the second through fifteenth seasons and the five pictures for us to know the whole story.

- - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - -
Customizeable handmade baby gifts personalized by my wife! Check them out at www.baby-bobo.com. All proceeds go towards international adoption.

Leaning into the wind that used to carry me-Stavesacre
That's why I don't kiss'em on the mouth- Jayne Cobb

WHOME

Tuesday, April 11, 2006 6:47 PM

Lots of people become more overtly religious when things are going bad, or when they're under stress. You know that old saying that there are no atheists in foxholes? There are, of course, but there are also people who only had some vague religious thoughts before but start praying nonstop when things get rough. Mal doesn't need to have been very religious before the war to have become very religious during it. Then in his disappointment, disillusionment, depression, and anger, he convinced himself that he had stopped believing in anything good at all. (It's not true of course- he believes in Serenity, and he believes in the strength of his crew.)

DAYVE

Tuesday, April 11, 2006 6:59 PM

ok, for what it's worth...
i think that Mal, when faced with the ultimate crisis of faith, realised that reality and religion are not necessarily one and the same.

This is an old argument. And while i never intend to offend people of religious belief, I must stand up for my own personal belief in secular humanism.

If Joss intended to resolve this issue in some future story, we'll just have to wait (and hope) for a continuation of the series. I certainly don't know his thoughts on this, except that I have read about his curiousity about extistentialism, which is not usually associated with worship of a deity.

Like i said, an old argument, with sincere views on both sides of the question, and from past experience one that will never be resolved to everyone's satisfaction. So, at least for me, i accept the story as told, and whether or not Mal finds a faith in something besides his ship and crew will be left for another story.

PHOENIXROSE

Wednesday, April 12, 2006 3:39 AM

Alright, so if I'm allowed to get off the topic of just Mal's faith here, I'm wondering about Eastern religion on Firefly. There was some evidence of it, but it did seem mostly Christian. Not many contemplative people coming up on the show. Book was actually the most calm and centered character, and it was mentioned (in Ariel) that at the Abby you could contemplate the wonders of your rock garden. Anyway, I'm just wondering if there are any theories on why there's not a lot of Zen or Buddhism in the series. On a similar note, might Mal become more contemplative and Zen? That would be an interesting direction to go. Not really a worship of a deity, but a path nonetheless. I think that would be shiny.

*************************************************
Bible's broken. Doesn't make sense.

Zhu fu ni, mei-mei

STDOUBT

Wednesday, April 12, 2006 4:52 AM

God doesn't abandon his children. <---note the period.
Wasn't there some bible story about a shepard who
tended a flock of 100 sheep, and one went wayward?
The shepard searched high and low, and finding the
lost sheep, said, little sheep, you are more dear
to me than the 99?
Anyway, sermons make me sleepy.

LITTLEALBATROSS

Wednesday, April 12, 2006 5:20 AM

Quote:
Originally posted by PhoenixRose:
Alright, so if I'm allowed to get off the topic of just Mal's faith here, I'm wondering about Eastern religion on Firefly. There was some evidence of it, but it did seem mostly Christian. Not many contemplative people coming up on the show. Book was actually the most calm and centered character, and it was mentioned (in Ariel) that at the Abby you could contemplate the wonders of your rock garden. Anyway, I'm just wondering if there are any theories on why there's not a lot of Zen or Buddhism in the series. On a similar note, might Mal become more contemplative and Zen? That would be an interesting direction to go. Not really a worship of a deity, but a path nonetheless. I think that would be shiny.

In the Visual Companion Joss says that the main religion on the 2 main planets was Buddhism. But that didn't come out in the series or film (although I think there was a Buddha statue at the companion house in Serenity).

I really like that idea of Mal becoming more contemplative. Maybe he doesn't find religion again, but maybe he finds some peace.

If only there'd been more time...

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