Illegal immigration

POSTED BY: SignyM
UPDATED: Wednesday, April 22, 2026 17:49
VIEWED: 84088
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SIGNYM

Sunday, March 26, 2006 4:13 AM

My first reaction to the demonstrations has been less than generous. People demand to be legalized just because they want it? Most other nations have strict immigation laws, so why should the US be singled out to throw open its borders? The large grafitti-covered neighborhoods where homies speak Spanglish with north Mexican drawl makes me think we haven't absorbed the last couple of generations yet.

Don't get me wrong- my dad was an immigrant. My SO immigrated to the USA. My grandparents on my mom's side were immigrants. My SO walked out of Hungary in 1956 and was plunked into second grade not speaking a lick of English. Now he works as a computer/ engineering guru for a major university. But they were LEGAL immigrants. They worked hard and they assimilated.

And then aside from feelings of cultural lifeboatism, there's the whole issue of having a whole population of desperate workers. Why export your business when you've got a foreign, intimidated population right at home? Illegal immigration is good for agribusiness, homeowners who want to pay rock-bottom dollar for a 24-7 nanny, and construction companies but does it do any good for the average US worker to be competing on those grounds?

But I don't think the law that was passed will work.

Your thoughts?

---------------------------------
Free as in freedom, not beer.

DONTCALLMELAWRENCE

Sunday, March 26, 2006 7:36 AM

First off I just want to say that I got caught in the huge march in downtown LA this weekend. Not because I wanted to be, but because I had to go down to the garment district. Something that should have taken 1 hour took 4.

now tell me if I’m wrong, because I am not noted for my grasp of current events, but this is my understanding of this whole thing:

they are protesting because they are being called/made criminals for immigrating ILLEGAL.

And this is just something that bothers me...

people say all the illegal immigrant in California are good "because they do jobs americans won't do." This is not true. I have cousins who can't move out here because they cannot find work largely due to the fact that those jobs are held by illegal immigrants.

I'm not against immigration or anything, but it does seem stupid to be upset about something illegal being made... illegal.

Lawrence

****************************
Tom: The men from 2nd Maine are being fed, sir.

Lawrence: Don’t call me sir.

Tom: Well, Lawrence, Great God A-Mighty–

Lawrence: You just be careful of that name business in front of the men. Listen, we don’t want anybody to think there’s favoritism.

Tom: General Meade has his son as his ajutant.

Lawrence: That’s different. Generals can do anything. Nothing quite so much like God on earth as a general on a battlefield.

FLETCH2

Sunday, March 26, 2006 8:23 AM

Quote:
Originally posted by DontCallMeLawrence:
And this is just something that bothers me...

people say all the illegal immigrant in California are good "because they do jobs americans won't do." This is not true. I have cousins who can't move out here because they cannot find work largely due to the fact that those jobs are held by illegal immigrants.

Well a more accurate quote is that they can't hire an American for the amount they are willing to pay. This isn't just a matter of the immigrant working for lower pay, by using undocumented workers employers can cut taxes, social security, insurance and other overheads from the equation that they couldn't legally do with an American.

DREAMTROVE

Sunday, March 26, 2006 12:37 PM

Sygnym,

I really agree.

Open immigration has been an invitation to disaster in other countries, and litterally the end for South Africa. Anyone who's studied the whole S.A. imigration nightmare, or even paid attention, should see the potential for badness. It's not like Mexico is zimbabwe, but it does border countries like Guatamala which more or less are.

My grandmother came here to escape the Nazis. As a Czech princess, she was also on the list of enemies of the great social revolution. Living on a town on the German border during the 30s, they began to be worried and sent her and a now dead aunt to America. They were right, everyone who stayed behind got killed.

This is one of two situations that I can see immigration as being a oksy. The other is when people come here to go to school, for a particular decent job, or are in some way clearly going to be a benefit to the society. Otherwise you get what Europe is getting now, which is a flood of people whose intent is to be a drain on the system.

RUSSELL

Sunday, March 26, 2006 11:50 PM

Ill put my 2 cents in on this because I have been directly effected by illegal workers in this country.

Ive been doing construction work for nearly 15 years. I started off in Michigan and moved to Las Vegas about 7 years ago. I do concrete construction work. Ive done everything from laborer, finisher, form carpenter and foreman. I was working for a company that I absolutely hated. I finally put in my notice and decided to take a month off from work. The field supervisor at the company and I are good friends. He would NEVER give me a bad referal and we still hang out at least a couple times a month.

After my short vacation I went out looking for another job. I should have had one lined up ahead of time but I have a nice nest egg in the bank and finding another job wasnt a big worry. I started out looking for a concrete finisher job or a foreman job. After about a week of no luck I switched over to "anything". After around 3 weeks of with no luck I lowered my requested $ amount considerably and started submitting applications right from the beginning of the list all over again.

After another 2 or 3 weeks I realized that I wasnt going to get a job in this town. I know for a fact that my friend, the field supervisor, would be giving me a good referance. He told me that he only recieved 2 phone calls about me in the entire 2 months (+/-) that I was putting in applications (150+ applications). Im a clean cut white guy, 35 years old, good physical condition, a nice truck, my own tools, i can read blueprints (and have been for 10 years), i dont drink or smoke or do drugs, Im a nice guy, and there is almost nothing in concrete construction that I cant do and havent done.

I came to the conclusion that the problem was, Im a white guy that doesnt speak spanish. These construction companies are all made up of 50%+ mexican guys that dont speak a word of english. Then theres 25% that speak broken english and another 20% that speak spanish and english, then theres the 5% black and white guys that either speak english only or both english and spanish. The guys get hired, work their way up to foreman or some other management position and they dont want to hire a non-spanish speaking white guy.

All of these guys make good money in this town. From the low/mid-teens (laborer wages) to the $30+ range. These guys arent paid pennies on the dollar, they are paid regular (MAYBE a bit less) construction wages. And 90% of them have social security cards, driver licenses, etc... Ive been told many times that getting a social security number/card isnt hard, and most of the illegal construction workers have one.

So, my feeling about this is that these politicians that say "illegal immagrants that do jobs americans dont want" is rediculous. They may be jobs that their rich, cadilac driving, $1k suit wearing friends and kids dont want but they are jobs that alot of us would LOVE to have. All of these manufacturing jobs that have been lost, automobile and whatnot, where are those people going to find jobs? What about all of us that DONT have a college education? What about the kids fresh out of high-school that arent going to college? What about all the unemployed homeless people on the streets of Las Vegas? What about all the kids starting kindergarden that dont speak a word of english?

In my opinion these politicians live so far above lower/middle class that they dont even know about the real problems from illegal immagrants. "The jobs that americans dont want" are few and far between. In fact I dont even know what one of those jobs would be?

This isnt just a Las Vegas problem either. This is every southern state and quickly making its way north its way north. California, Texas, Arizona, Florida, etc... Go to any construction site and see how many mexican guys there are. Then count how many of them speak english, then (I dont know if this is possible) do a background check and see how many of them are here legally. Its a terrible thing thats happening and from what Ive heard on the news from both Republicans and Democrats its no

DREAMTROVE

Monday, March 27, 2006 12:11 AM

You make some excellent points here Russell.

BROWNCOAT1

Monday, March 27, 2006 4:25 PM

SignyM,

I want to start out by saying I generally avoid doing more than reading any of the posts in this area. I try not to post my thoughts in political discussions to avoid the running flame wars that normally accompany such topics. I say this so you and everyone else will realize just how serious a problem I think illegal immigration is becoming in the U.S.

I truly that believe that illegal immigration is a serious threat to our economy & our way of life. I agree w/ what Fletch2 said:

Quote:
Originally posted by Fletch2:
Well a more accurate quote is that they can't hire an American for the amount they are willing to pay. This isn't just a matter of the immigrant working for lower pay, by using undocumented workers employers can cut taxes, social security, insurance and other overheads from the equation that they couldn't legally do with an American.

Businesses are always looking for ways to cut what they spend & boost their profits and one of those ways is to hire illegals. As Fletch said it allows these employers to pay a much lower wage, avoid paying taxes, paying social security, and eliminates benifits & insurance cost as these workers are undocumented illegals. This causes problems in that these are jobs that legal citizens of the U.S. can not get and many of these illegals send a good portion of the money they make back to their families in their country of origin. This of course is bad for our economy as money earned here is not being spent here.

Another issue I draw w/ illegal immigration, specifically from Mexico, is that the Mexican government, especially President Fox, seems to fully support it. They even encouraged the printing & distribution of a comic book that details how to illegally enter the U.S. For Fox & his government it is a win-win situation as they get unemployed workers out of their country so they are no longer the responsibility of the Mexican government, and the Mexican economy benefits from the influx of U.S. dollars sent home to families left behind by these illegal immigrants.

The U.S. government seems content to do nothing to stem the tide of illegals entering from Mexico either. The Minuteman project clearly illustrated for all of us how grossly unprotected our border w/ Mexico truly is today. Border agents patrol a border over 1,600 miles long with a relative handful of agents. In many places there is no wall or fence so it is merely a matter of walking across the border.

Dubya is now working to push his amnesty bill through which will allow all the illegals here to stay. His private meetings w/ Fox at Bush's ranch in Texas just work to assure me that business, the federal government, and the Mexican government are all in this together. All of them will do whatever is necessary to put money in their pockets.

I am not against immigrants coming here. Hell, all of us were immigrants at some point no matter how long our families have been here (unless you are native american of course), but I think they should become legal citizens, pay taxes, contribute to the community and all just as the rest of us do. There should also be a push to learn the english language to communicate w/ others effectively & for their children to interact in school. I don't think it is right that the rest of society should have to conform to their lack of desire to learn the common language. If I move to France to live you can bet I will learn french rather than expect everyone else to conform to me & learn english.

I fully agree w/ what the Minuteman Project did & can only say I am saddened by how Dubya and his cronies responded to the public demand that something be done about our borders. He claims he wants to protect us from terrorists & is sending American soldiers off to die in foreign lands, yet he leaves our entire southern border completely exposed. That seem right to you?

I look forward to everyone's comments.

__________________________________________

"May have been the losing side. Still not convinced it was the wrong

CHRISISALL

Monday, March 27, 2006 4:45 PM

Quote:
Originally posted by BrownCoat1:
I am saddened by how Dubya and his cronies responded to the public demand that something be done about our borders. He claims he wants to protect us from terrorists & is sending American soldiers off to die in foreign lands, yet he leaves our entire southern border completely exposed.

Ah-ha! Another left-wing commie out to bash Bush and condem his perfect plans for this great country. If you can't see how Dubya's helping this land, why not move to another? *smirk*

Okay. Ya got me...
Ithought it would be more interesting than...Ummm, I agree.

But someone will say it for real, I'm sure Chrisisall

KUANGZHEDE

Monday, March 27, 2006 5:19 PM

I live in Charlotte N.C., and here are a few issues I have with illegal immigration here.

1- Free healthcare
2- Free school
3- License without proof of citizenship
4- Can not be prosecuted for any crime unless it is "violent"
5- 2 INS agents for both NC and SC.
6- If arrested, they are let go and asked to please go to Atlanta for their INS hearing (no one goes)
7- 5 out of the 10 drunk driving murders this year, so far, have been by illegal immigrants.

PIRATEJENNY

Monday, March 27, 2006 7:50 PM

Quote:
(unless you are native american of course), but I think they should become legal citizens, pay taxes, contribute to the community and all just as the rest of us do. There should also be a push to learn the english language to communicate w/ others effectively & for their children to interact in school.

I agree with everything all of you have said, I have an international studies class and the main focus this semester has been about the border, I'm going to take all of you guys post and make copies for the class to read.

I sympathize with the immigrants I understand that they want a better life, but on the other hand why should it be at our expense. The facts are the corporations don't want them here llegally, because then they would have to pay a higher wage, taxes, healthcare etc. illegal workers benifit the Corporations and businesses, while driving wages down for U.S workers and its putting a squeeze on the middle class, I'm also tired of the argument that, Americans don't want to do the jobs that illegal immigrants to, if they paid a fair wage Americans would do just about any job for the right price.

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