Can you believe this.

POSTED BY: Firestalker
UPDATED: Monday, March 6, 2006 06:43
VIEWED: 14415
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ARCADIA

Thursday, February 9, 2006 5:26 AM

Hmm... well, the only thing that shǎ zi got right was that Firefly/Serenity isn't too popular. I would hardly consider it a parody.

Will it stand the test of time? Well... it might not. But, I ask you to consider Dante. He wrote his master work in the 1300s but it was neither critically acclaim nor remotely popular until the romantic era in the 1800s, about five hundred years later. Now it is a classic. See, cynical reviewer? Things change. :-)

Also, it is worth noting the western lit (and now, media arts -- they are literature in their own way, says I) is nothing but one generation responding to the generation before it. You can trace it all the way back to the Greeks. From Socretes to Plato to Aristotle to Dante to Shakespeare to Jane Austen... this is how literature of the west works. It's pretty cool that way. Almost anything anyone ever says is a response to something that happened before it.

So, yeah. I don't necessarily disagree with the poster when he says that Firefly/Serenity will not stand the test of time. I have my fears (and hopes). I just think his/her reasons for saying it won't are bullshit. Firefly has as good a chance of withstanding the test of time as anything. So, stay shiny, firefly/serenity. Keep flyin.

"Objects in Space"
River: It's just an object. It doesn't mean what you think...

MALBABE

Thursday, February 9, 2006 5:50 AM

on that reviewer.

I am a HUGE sci-fi nerd. I love Star Trek, Star Wars, Battlestar Galactica (new & old), Firefly/Serenity. You name it, I bet I love it. That said:

I think Firefly is as unique and original as is possible to be millions of years after the big-bang! Star Trek tried to be "space-going wagon train western", hello! Trench coat and six-gun, how much more western can you get?

Firefly has it all over, story, dialog, originality. I don't watch it for the FX, that's just a bonus when it's there!

HALFBREEDINKC

Thursday, February 9, 2006 1:32 PM

THe thing about Firefly/Serenity is the ORIGINALITY! Oops! Can I say that since this amazon geek said it was ripping off Star Wars/Star Trek? Oh well I guess I did...

Here's my take on it (uh-oh - look out). Star Trek = Utopian vision of a future that AIN'T gonna happen (not unless the human race evolves into something else...and then guess what? It ain't the human race no more). Star Wars = Great retelling of the whole Aurthurian/Sword in the Stone legends, and don't get me wrong I loved it growing up, BUT I thought the acting was more than a little, shall we say, cardboard? And yes I do mean ALL of the movies (ducking for cover at that one), and all six of the movies were overshadowed by the effects. Battlestar = the old series was a lot of fun, the new one is darker and somewhat more "realistic", and yet they seem to carry the dark side of the human pysche to an extreme some times.

Now we come to Firefly/Serenity - a show that was, dare I say it?, STORY/CHARACTER driven - was that because they didn't have the budget for more special effects? Don't know and don't care 'bout the reason. All I know is that it WORKED. The characters in the show were some of the most real I've seen in a long time (for a science fiction show). Just a bunch of people, trying to make their way ON THEIR OWN, without interference from some government entity.

Can you imagine a character like Kirk or Yoda, going "okay, that's the way you want it" and then booting the bad guy through the engine? Ain't gonna happen! I've been around a few years, seen a lot of things in life, and I've yet to meet any of these "saintly" types that we see in all the aforementioned shows - mostly I've seen folk like those in our beloved Firefly. Frail, flawed, and in general - human!

I know this is gonna sound a little weird but, the crew of Serenity remind me, more than anything, of a group of bikers. I've met a few hardcore bikers in my life, and when it comes down to it they're decent folk, even if they look a little different. They're just folk who want to be left alone, go their own way, won't bother nobody until somebody bothers them first. They're a very protective bunch, of their own, that is, and wary of outsiders.........hmmmmm, this sounds awful familiar-like here don't it?

I think the haters have a fundamental problem which is this; They want to see something bigger than themselves, something that says the human race has grown, matured (and that's fine - personally I just don't think that's gonna happen), they don't want to see something that depicts us 500 years in the future just like we are now - squabbling, struggling, mundane, winning and losing, in essence just like we are today - again, in a word, just folk.

Now how much more original can you get than that?

I know this is long but I wanted to get it out before I forgot most of it (that happens when you get older...LMAO). So I'll get off my soapbox and come back to reality and..........oh yeah, go to work.

HalfBreedinKC

"We meddle. People don't like to be meddled with. We tell them what to do, what to think, don't run don't walk we're in their homes and in their heads and we haven't the right. We're meddlesome" - River

EST120

Thursday, February 9, 2006 2:22 PM

oops.

EST120

Thursday, February 9, 2006 2:35 PM

Quote:
Originally posted by CBY:
I don't really care what other people think of the show. You can't force them to like it anyway.

I agree with CBY. There are always going to be people who do not like the same things you do. There are lots of shows and movies that I do not like that other people love to death. People have their opinions and they are free to say what they want. Heck, people here argue all the time about which episodes are good and which are bad. Personal taste.

11THHOUR

Thursday, February 9, 2006 7:14 PM

Quote:
Originally posted by christhecynic:
I don't remember that. I've been here since then, but to be honest I didn't read as many posts until I registered in Jan '03.

The biggest fallout of angry Dark Angel fans occurred when Firefly premiered, and kept going fairly strong for a while afterward. Near the end of Firefly's run the furor had died down a lot, but there were still plenty of angry fanboys who gleefully jumped in and cheered the demise of our shiny show.

They wanted to find a target to vent their rage against the cancellation of Dark Angel. Since Firefly inherited the timeslot, that was reason enough for them.

You may not have seen these posts because the majority of the D.A. trolls showed up on the original official FOX message board, since that's where they hung out anyway because of Dark Angel. Made it convenient for them to jump to the Firefly section and have tantrums.

I can understand being disappointed when a favorite show is cancelled. But the way they behaved to the FF fans, plus the petulant and immature bashing they gave Firefly, was extremely annoying and disruptive.

Quote:
For the record, what little Dark Angel I saw I liked. Doesn't mean it was good, didn't see enough to tell whether it was good or not, but no matter what more people liked it than the herds of wailing, whining fanboys.

I'm not saying you were claiming anything negative about fans in general or the show though, just saying.

I wasn't dissing that show or the fans in general. Just the rather vocal minority of wailing, whining fanboys who vomited their childish rage on Firefly and the fans on the forum.

________________________________________________

"Because teenage pranks are fun when you're about to die!" - Hoban Washburne

GRIZWALD

Thursday, February 9, 2006 8:45 PM

In English Comp 101 I learned that there are really only about 6 plots in literature throughout the ages. All stories are mere variations on those 6 plots.

Small wonder there are bound to be similarities between tales.

CHRISTHECYNIC

Friday, February 10, 2006 6:55 PM

Quote:
Originally posted by 11thHour:
I wasn't dissing that show or the fans in general. Just the rather vocal minority of wailing, whining fanboys who vomited their childish rage on Firefly and the fans on the forum.

Just wanted to make sure you made the distinction.

CHRISTHECYNIC

Friday, February 10, 2006 7:09 PM

Quote:
Originally posted by grizwald:
In English Comp 101 I learned that there are really only about 6 plots in literature throughout the ages. All stories are mere variations on those 6 plots.

Small wonder there are bound to be similarities between tales.

Care to share what the six are?

I've heard three:
1Boy meets girl.
(Common variations: Girl meets boy, Girl meets Girl, Boy meets boy, boy/girl/thing fails to meet boy/girl/thing, boy meets two girls, girl meets boy who already met a boy ...)

2 The humble tailor. (Little guy does great things.)
(Common variations: Little guy fails to do great things, inverse [great guy isn't so great], people strive for greatness and drop like a rock ...)

3 The man who learned better.
(Common variations: the guy learns worse, in spite of character shaping events the character remains the same [twit], character's mind is changed and then changed back, ideals/knowledge/preconceptions are tested and affirmed.

Mal-Inara, Mal-Nandi, and Simon-Kaylee are all boy meets girl plots, though it could be argued quite well that the second two should be considered girl meets boy by the nitpicky.

More or less all of Firefly and Serenity is humble tailor, and all of the characters have a bit of learning better arcs as well.

-

What some people fail to understand is that life is in the details. The story of a boy being thrust into greatness and being pressured by parent and teacher alike yet still managing to rise higher is a well known and cliché tale. However few people mistake, "Searching for Bobby Fisher," with the story of Alexander the Great.

Similarly I'd hardly call Ocean's 11 and CSI carbon copies just because they have the same setting.

TAYEATRA

Friday, February 10, 2006 7:42 PM

I haven't got anything meaningful to add to this discussion but I couldn't not comment because reading the original post was somewhat akin to a punch in the gut.

It has to be said however that where firefly differs from the Star Trek/Wars and other Sci-Fi shows is that it always seemed to care more about characters and writing than special effects and future of humanity.

Everything profound that was said in Firefly through the plots and writing applied much more to the Present than any idealistic views. People keep flying/fighting/living because in the end it's all they can do. It may sound kind of morbid but it's true.

The closest plot link that I could find to justify the original posted comment was that the Firefly was set in a 'verse where the political rulers were on the opposing side (bigger, stronger, meaner), in the same way as the Empire vs Jedi in Star Wars. Though I can't find a Reaver equivalent in either Trek or Wars and i'm definitely not seeing a Blue Sun similarity.

In the end it's the way Serenity and Firefly were brought together. They're our Big Damn Heroes and it's our Big Damn Movie, we're not making people watch and we can't stop them ranting but we can Keep Flying and hopefully it's enough.

Taya

Dark Angel, Firefly, Buffy, Angel, Enterprise, Farscape... anything else you'd like to cancel?

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