It CAN'T be true!!! *major movie spoilers*
POSTED BY: engineangel
UPDATED: Sunday, March 26, 2006 06:58
VIEWED: 45977
PAGE 5 of 13
I'm getting through...it'll take me a while to deal like with Tara's death in Buffy. Of course what would make it better is if Zoe's pregnant.
I think that Wash's death wasn't necessary. Usually there's a reason. Like the Haven townspeople death. It will stay like this until it's properly resolved.
It would be interesting to see how Zoe is in the next movie. It seems like her emotion is unresolved.
I can't but help think of her crying in her room at night behind everybody's back. River having Wash talk to her is a pretty good idea. Mal would come in while River's in midsentence, just to make her even more off.
When I saw Wash's tombstone I cried like a baby. I too thought his body could be missing or something. It's possible, but I dunno. They kind of cut out that important part out. Or hell, a mention of it.
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Quote:
Originally posted by reallykaylee:
i was in the middle of "that's my bab-" when it happened. i cried and hated the movie for the next 12 hrs. but then i talked to jacqui. she explained it ALL! and for that she gets to go to the 'special' heaven.
find her!
I had the exact same reaction. I'm still kinda peeved about it, but slowly coming around.
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I really want to hear what Joss and Alan say about this. Theres a quote on someones blog, about how Alan was all for Wash dying the way he did (don't remember the link for the blog). There's so many reasons why he died, or why he shouldn't have, but I know that Joss did it for a reason, and I also know the reason was not to hurt us as fans.
I always complain that in every movie, everyone gets away scott free without dying... well, I regret it now.
But I'll stick to what I've said since it happened... the great thing about creative license, is that you have it. Joss could make an entire season of Firefly that happens before Wash ever dies. It's all up to him, and he has my upmost trust and respect.
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Quote:
Originally posted by Jonquill:
Wash didn't die because we needed to be afraid. He didn't die because people do die in real life. He died because the crew of Serenity went to war, and that means sacrifice. At the risk of employing a tired cliche that the Bush Administration enjoys butchering: "Freedom isn't free." And the crew of Serenity chose to pay the price. Wash died a death of belief, as a hero.
Wash, you made me laugh, right from "This land." Thanks.
I hope you enjoyed my overstating of the obvious.
Wow, thanks so much for that. You made me cry. In a good way. :)
But it wasn't overstating the obvious...lots of people still don't get it, conditioned as they are by lowest-common-denominator pre-packaged, 100% polymerized junk TV and movies.
I love Joss because he makes me think...and then he slaps me (figuratively) upside my noggin and makes me feel.
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Right, there's no structure to this, I'm just thinking out loud (well, you know what I mean)...
Generally, when you up the ante, someone dies, especially when it's a TV series to a movie. So one of the nine was going to go; I was prepared for that. But, for some reason, I never thought in a million years that it would be Wash. But I should have known.
This is gonna work as an indirect proof (any geometry students out there?). I'm just assessing who was likeliest to die. First, there's Mal. He was pretty much safe from the beginning (doesn't stop him from getting pretty beat up, though). You don't kill your main character, not if you want a sequel, not after the fans have worked so hard to bring him to the big screen. Then there's Zoe. Zoe is Mal's right hand woman and she adds girl-power. But also, she provides an important link to the past; if Mal were the only veteran of the war, then flashbacks would seem too introspective and distant. No, Zoe had to live. Jayne's main purpose is, obviously, comic relief, but also a much more important one: he is Mal's foil. Their constant struggle of power is essential drama, plus Jayne's thick-headed love of violence juxtaposes Mal's inner moral conflict. So Jayne wasn't going out. Inara's easy: don't kill your hero's love interest, not in the first movie, especially after they've just reunited. And if you do, make her sacrifice herself for him (but that's impossible to make non-cheestastic). Shepard died, and others have said why better than I can, so I'll leave it there. Kaylee, like Jayne, is comic relief, plus she's Zoe's foil. Zoe is always emotionally collected, while Kaylee's not so subtle. Actually, next to Wash (ohgodImisshimsomuch), I thought Kaylee the most expendable, as River is also a contrast to Zoe. If Simon had died when he was shot (and I thought at the time he was going to), it would have been redundant. His dramatic death would've echoed Book's far too much. Plus, I think it's important that River's slaughter of the Reevers was defensive, rather than an act of revenge. Speaking of whom, I also thought River was doomed, that she'd go out saving the 'verse. When she throws Simon's bag and gets dragged back by the Reevers, I thought that was the last we'd see of her. Guess not.
And so that leaves Wash. What I loved most about him was his relationship with Zoe: it's so rare you see a happy, working marriage on TV or in Hollywood, as this usually eliminates most drama (we saw Wash and Zoe's drama in "War Stories"). And here's the kicker, that negates everything I've just said. This death had to be totally random. It's like you guys have said, that's real. In real wars, you can't choose who's most expendable, you can't choose your last words, you can't choose how you go. It's random, and useless, and pointless, and unfair, and real. I'm also incredibly torn about whether I want Joss to bring him back. On the one hand, I find myself actually grieving for this fictional man. I feel like someone I know has died (and I have known that feeling; my stepfather died in Iraq a year ago. He hadn't been my stepfather long, but still...); if that's happened to anyone, then you understand how lost and numb it feels. And now I can't watch his scenes in Firefly without tearing up. I'd give anything to have him back (well, not anything, not in reality, but the sentiment's there). Vice versa, bringing Wash back defeats the purpose of his death: that there was no purpose. In real life, you can't snap your fingers and awake the dead. You can't have your psychic friend talk to them for you (or maybe you can, depending on what you believe). It's the same with the death in book five of Harry Potter (is this the wrong crowd to mention that in?). So there's the conudrum.
I have but one regret, one thing I wish Joss had done differently. Wash's death is just so...cruel. Not to him; thank god, he didn't see it coming and probably didn't feel much pain. No, I mean to us. I, at least, was pretty emotionally vulnerable at the time. I'd just seen Serenity take a major whupping,
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I too was devastated by Wash's death. And I think the HP reference is very fitting you have grown so attached to a fictional person that it hurts still to think they are gone probably forever.
I can't help but wonder though...Death as depressing as it is open's doors for life (especially in TV shows and movies). So when I think back to the Heart of Gold episode Zoe and Wash banter about having baby she says:
“And I'm not so afraid of losing something that I won't try havin' it.”
Hearing this today I tried my hardest to tear up quietly for my Husband who hasn’t yet seen the movie.
At the movie I thought about this when I realized that yes Wash was dead and Zoe (Oh my GOD in a DRESS!!!) would have to live with out him than I thought about what she said after that:
“You and I would make one beautiful baby.”
So (through my logic) Wash’s Death opens up room for a new life aboard Serenity.
This actually has played out in my head. Imagine everyone waiting on Zoe and not letting her get into trouble. Anyway I think I would be more okay with Wash’s death were there a chance for a Hoban Jr.
This is all just me hopin’ though.
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hey travelers, this is a long post because i haven't been able to get on for a while, so bear with me.
Quote:
Cybersnark wrote:
Based on the final scene, I'd say River's gonna be the new pilot (assuming she stays as lucid as she appears). Of course, she is psychic, and Wash spent a lot of time in that cockpit. If there's likely to be a ghost, that's where she'd find it.
I can already see the scene in the sequel:
Wash is giving River flying lessons --warning her about the wobbly starbord engine (don't trust it in heavy manoeuvres, just shift thrust to port-side). River is talking back (a two-way conversation).
Camera swings away, as Mal enters, leading a client and avowing the professional skills of his expert crew. River laughs at one of Wash's jokes, the camera swings back to see River chattering and carrying on with empty air.
The client looks confused, Mal goes "huh" and quickly turns the very wealthy and respectable client around and leads him away from the crazy girl.
I love it!!!!! That would be soooooooo cool! Thanks for giving me hope!!!
Quote:
written by TRANSYU
There was another post that I had read on another site that tried to come up with some logical reason for Wash NOT to be dead. Now it may be a bit of a stretch for some, but it gave me enough hope that I plan to see the movie another 10 times. Was too heartbroken to go back after seeing the 'SCENE' initially.
Basically, after he was impaled, everyone left the ship in a hurry (fleeing Reavers and the like). Now, Reavers would not mess with Wash as he's already 'dead'. So he stays pinned there for a bit. Who happens upon the scene? Why the Alliance, hot on the Reavers (and the crew's) tail! We allready know from the 'Message' episode that there is some pretty radical medical technology available (organ replacement/reconstruction and the like), plus the human brain retains a charge for a good long while after the body is declared to be dead. They could have rescued his body during this time and evaced him out for interogation or something (not sure why myself, but I'm sure Joss could come up with a compelling reason). They may have informed the Operative, or they may not. After he was discovered to not be the Alliance's man anymore, that tidbit of information could/would have been kept from him. I HOPE that we'll see Wash back in some form or another. I also trust Mr. Whedon to not change the significance of his death or make it seem cheesy. He may or may not be the same man we remember, but I hope he turns up in Episode 2: The Search for Wash.
ok. I also have to admit. that is a cool concept too. I don't get it all (just a bit confused) but the mechanical organs from "the message" being put into Wash as a prototype or something is a great idea!!
Quote:
written by STAKETHELURK
Picture something like this: it’s movie two and Mal has gotten involved in something very dangerous. Then he discovers Shepherd Book was a party to it (maybe it was the thing that drove Book to take the cloth) and that Book has left a series of holographic recordings for Mal to help him out. We see another side of Book, we get to see Book giving (admittedly one-way) counsel to Mal, etc. My example is kinda trite, but Whedon could use something like that to keep Book and Wash a part of the story. Whether Joss will do that in a sequel is another matter--but first we have to get a sequel, so spread the word and turn up at the second weekend.
now that's a good idea!!!!
River: There's too much snow on top. It's going to cave in. His brain's in grave danger.
Zoe: River, honey, he's putting the hair away now.
River: It doesn't matter. It'll still be there. Waiting...
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Wash's death was a kick in the pants and unnecessary, as engineangel said. I'm a guy - an OLDER guy -- and when he was killed I was shocked at first then just in disbelief. I refuse to believe it was Joss Whedon's choice to do this ... to me, it smacks of interference from other money types involved.
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way to go jsturgis!!!!!!!!!!
I really like the idea of Zoe having a baby. If we’re not going to bring Wash back that’s the next best thing.
hey, i've been hearing that the whole cast is going to come back for the sequel and trequel. Can anyone confirm that?
River: There's too much snow on top. It's going to cave in. His brain's in grave danger.
Zoe: River, honey, he's putting the hair away now.
River: It doesn't matter. It'll still be there. Waiting...
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