First Amendment no big deal, students say.
POSTED BY: sgtgump
UPDATED: Monday, February 14, 2005 22:27
VIEWED: 8613
PAGE 3 of 5
Yes the Pledge is still recited every day, in elementary, middle, and high school. Considering that school admin requires students to stand and recite the pledge starting in kindergarten, I doubt that you will find any child in K-9 actually contending the recitation. In my case, I'm an atheist with a learning-disabled daughter; I can hardly expect her
to go against the grain at ANY grade level, but I consider my parental rights to have been violated.
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Quote:
Originally posted by SignyM:
Yes the Pledge is still recited every day, in elementary, middle, and high school. Considering that school admin requires students to stand and recite the pledge starting in kindergarten, I doubt that you will find any child in K-9 actually contending the recitation. In my case, I'm an atheist with a learning-disabled daughter; I can hardly expect her
to go against the grain at ANY grade level, but I consider my parental rights to have been violated.
Well..I disagree. My father-in law is on teh board of education for his school district. We've discussed the "Under God" issue and as it stands his school district and those around them DONOT recite the pledge of allegiance nor do they broadcast it over the big speakers. I know that they do the pledge in some elementary schools..but for the most part..I think its and outdated practice that holds very little meaning to kids anyways. Which is why I find it hysterical that people are up in arms when their kids do do it before chool plays and whatnot.
I also have never seen or heard the Pledge of Allegiance in a highschool. I've been out of school for 17 years and have to tell you..I don't buy this, they weren't doing it when I was in highschool (Pretty much stopped when we hit Middle school) and I doubt they've started again. But hey..could be wrong. I suppose in the South they may push this.
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Actually my daughter attends school in CA. And yes, they did the pledge in LA Unified (where she attended for K-1) and in her current school district. Back in the olden times when I was in HS they also mandated the pledge. This was during the Vietnam War, and so it was controversial whether to mandate or not. I compromised by standing but not reciting and was allowed to get away with that, but kids who sat got detention.
However, we could go round and round on whether schools require the pledge or not. Let's just settle on that it prolly varies from school district to school district.
Let's move on to more interesting topics of what you think schools should teach.
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Quote:
Originally posted by SignyM:
Actually my daughter attends school in CA. And yes, they did the pledge in LA Unified (where she attended for K-1) and in her current school district. Back in the olden times when I was in HS they also mandated the pledge. This was during the Vietnam War, and so it was controversial whether to mandate or not. I compromised by standing but not reciting and was allowed to get away with that, but kids who sat got detention.
However, we could go round and round on whether schools require the pledge or not. Let's just settle on that it prolly varies from school district to school district.
Let's move on to more interesting topics of what you think schools should teach.
UH BOY LOL..You opened a can of worms with that one hehehehe.
What schools should teach?
It'd be nice if Teachers stopped dictating thought and ideologies and went back to teaching Math, English, Science, READING/Literature (Good God..I ran into a kid in a youth group meeting that My brother-in law goes to, where they play violent Videogames of all things LOL..who can barely read, let alone write),American History , European History, World History etc..etc..
All I've seen is a continuing move to push for mediocrity ad nauseum, less independence or diversity between students (Not talking about special favors..but those students who excel should be allowed to pursue more difficult subject matter).
I think both science and religion can be taught. When I was in school I took a course on World Religion, one of the most fascinating courses ever. I'm not a partciularly spiritual person and didn't view the course as spiritually enlightening..what I loved about it was that it revealed different cultures through their religions. I don't think they should be teaching Science that removes the theory of evolution..what the hell happened to Chemistry, Physics, Earth Science, Biology?
How about a course called "Free Thought and Debate"..where the teacher is not allowed to push their own ideologies..but must allow the students to pursue their own opinions with research as a basis for their opinions. Holy christ ..what a thought LOL.
I'll stop rambling for now hehe.. been a long day.
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One of the things I'd like to see taught in elementary school is basic material science and technology. I used to take care of a group of kids in my home on some afterschool days, some of the kids from underpriviledged backgrounds, and it was amazing to see how little they really knew about their world. So we would tackle a different topic each week: metal, plastic, glass, wood, electricity, plumbing, weather etc. For instance, I'd ask them to try and figure out HOW water got to the faucet, and we'd go under the sink and trace out the pipes and look at the hot water heater, and I'd explain about the big pipe under the ground that brought water in. If I had the resources I would have arranged for a tour of the local water treatment facility. Then the learning disabled and little kids would draw pix and the bigger kids would write a few sentences. I kind of made it a game, and after a while they got into the habit of just LOOKING AROUND and THINKING ABOUT what they saw. I still keep in touch with a couple of the kids and they're doing quite well, considering their rotten families. I like to think I had a hand in that!
BTW- Free thought & debate is taught in some schools under the title "Rhetoric". I think it should be MANDATORY for all non learning-disabled high-schoolers most of whom couldn't think their way out of a paper bag with instructions. (In fact I wouldn't mind taking a course like that myself... I prolly need one!)
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Wildbill- I'm not ignoring your post, but I need to dig up a copy of the ten planks.
However, I want to add the caveat that Marx spent much ink discussing the nature and flow of capital (Das Kapital I,II,III) and that his theories can't be summarized in a series of "planks" any more than a current party's platform reflects its true aspirations.
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I emailed that article to my dad and this was his response:
"If kids go to catholic schools, they learn Catholicism
If kids go to protestant schools, they learn Protestantism
If kids go to government schools..."
I think that kinda hits it on the head.
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Quote:
Originally posted by Connorflynn:
...I suppose in the South they may push this.
I live in the North...
Hero, I stand now. They don't make you say it. You just have to stand.
"...Somebody should organize a picnic where they barbecue and play that game with a parachute and a giant World Ball and then we should go to that picnic and take all their stuff and make fun of them..." --Drew Goddard
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Quote:
Originally posted by SignyM:
BTW- Free thought & debate is taught in some schools under the title "Rhetoric". I think it should be MANDATORY for all non learning-disabled high-schoolers most of whom couldn't think their way out of a paper bag with instructions. (In fact I wouldn't mind taking a course like that myself... I prolly need one!)
Interesting....
I don't think you need one hehehe. Though a course like that for adults would be a blast.
My 3 favorite classes from Highschool were:
European History
US History
World History
I had 3 of the greatest teachers in the world. Many people often talk about great fictional tales..but the best stories are always the ones that are real. These teachers presented history in a non-boring fashion. History is just one gigantic tale waiting to be told and waiting to be written.
I even wrote my senior thesis on the Yalta Conferences. Neat stuff.
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Quote:
SignyM wrote:
Wednesday, February 02, 2005 10:36
Wildbill- I'm not ignoring your post, but I need to dig up a copy of the ten planks.
And I am ignoring WB's comments. Painfully simplistic to compare property taxes (evil though they are) to the dissolution of private property. Let's not be stupid?
-Eli
If voting mattered, they'd make it illegal.
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