How Trump split the left
POSTED BY: SIGNYM
UPDATED: Monday, June 28, 2021 00:04
VIEWED: 1589
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What Happened to Glenn Greenwald?
Trump happened – and put the left’s priorities to the test
Jonathan Cook • June 22, 2021 • 4,100 Words • 117 Comments • Reply
There’s been a new public fracturing of the intellectual left, typified by an essay last week from Nathan J Robinson, editor of the small, independent, socialist magazine Current Affairs, accusing Glenn Greenwald and Matt Taibbi of bolstering the right’s arguments. He is the more reasonable face of what seems to be a new industry arguing that Greenwald is a wolf in sheep’s clothing, setting the right’s agenda for it.
Under the title “How to end up serving the right”, Robinson claims that Greenwald and Taibbi, once his intellectual heroes, are – inadvertently or otherwise – shoring up the right’s positions and weakening the left. He accuses them of reckless indifference to the consequences of criticising a “liberal” establishment and making common cause with the right’s similar agenda. Both writers, argues Robinson, have ignored the fact that the right wields the greatest power in our societies.
This appears to be a continuation of a fight Robinson picked last year with Krystal Ball, the leftwing, former co-host of a popular online politics show called The Rising. Robinson attacked her for sharing her platform with the conservative pundit Saagar Enjeti. Ball and Enjeti have since struck out on their own, recently launching a show called Breaking Points.
Notably, Greenwald invited Robinson on to his own YouTube channel to discuss these criticisms of Ball when Robinson first made them. In my opinion, Robinson emerged from that exchange looking more than a little bruised.
As with his clash with Ball, there are problems with Robinson’s fuzzy political definitions.
Somewhat ludicrously in his earlier tussle, he lumped together Enjeti, a thoughtful rightwing populist, with figures like Donald Trump and Brazil’s Jair Bolsonaro, both of them narcissists and authoritarians (of varying degrees of competence) that have donned the garb of populism, as authoritarians tend to do.
Similarly, Robinson’s current disagreements with Greenwald and Taibbi stem in part from a vague formulation – one he seems partially to concede – of what constitutes the “left”. Greenwald has always struck me more as a progressive libertarian than a clearcut socialist like Robinson. Differences of political emphasis and priorities are inevitable. They are also healthy.
And much of Robinson’s essay is dedicated to cherrypicking a handful tweets from Greenwald and Taibbi to make his case. Greenwald, in particular, is a prolific tweeter. And given the combative and polarising arena of Twitter, it would be quite astonishing had he not occasionally advanced his arguments without the nuance demanded by Robinson.
Overall, Robinson’s case against both Greenwald and Taibbi is far less persuasive than he appears to imagine.
Stifling coverage
But the reason I think it worth examining his essay is because it demonstrates a more fundamental split on what – for the sake of convenience – I shall treat as a broader intellectual left that includes Robinson, Greenwald and Taibbi.
Robinson tries to prop up his argument that Greenwald, in particular, is betraying the left and legitimising the right with an argument from authority, citing some of the left’s biggest icons.
Two, Naomi Klein and Jeremy Scahill, are former journalist colleagues of Greenwald’s at the Intercept, the billionaire-financed online news publication that he co-founded and eventually split from after it broke an editorial promise not to censor his articles.
Greenwald fell out with the editors in spectacularly public fashion late last year after they stifled his attempts to write about the way Silicon Valley and liberal corporate media outlets – not unlike the Intercept – were colluding to stifle negative coverage of Joe Biden in the run-up to the presidential election, in a desperate bid to ensure he beat Trump.
Greenwald’s public statements about his reasons for leaving the Intercept exposed whaNOTIFY: Y | REPLY | REPLY WITH QUOTE | PERMALINK | TOP | HOME
Cleanup and comments later
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Pity would be no more,
If we did not MAKE men poor - William Blake
THUGR posts about Putin so much, he must be in love.
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Trump didn't split the Left.
He just exposed how they've been duct taped together.
A house of cards, the Democratic Party. They all hate each other and will eat each other.
They are the party of Hate.
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And he who is not sufficiently courageous to defend his soul — don’t let him be proud of his ‘progressive’ views, and don’t let him boast that he is an academician or a people’s artist, a distinguished figure or a general. Let him say to himself: I am a part of the herd and a coward. It’s all the same to me as long as I’m fed and kept warm.
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Basically, the author says the split in 'the left' was between people who primarily identified as partisan democrats and party shills all along (ie tribal), v people who were rooted in principles that don't seem to have any party representation.
I'll have to go back and re-read it to try to tease out the historical thinking of 'democrats' v the unrepresented, to see if it says anything significant.
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Well, first of all I think the article mis-identifies "the left" as Democrat-leaning.
I used to hang around "the left" in the 60s and 70s, and even I wasn't sure what "the left" was.
There was the antiwar "left", the pro-environment "left", the women's-lib "left". And moving to the more hardcore leftists, there were the Communists, the socialists, and the transnational crazy-eyed Trotskyists. But Democrats were thought of as too pro-establishment, and liberals were referred to as "liberaloids" (liberal-like, for their lack of conviction.)
"Leftist" meetings usually seemed to devolve to squabbling over whose ideology was purer, or who had a better understanding of Marx/Lenin/Trotsky, or who was the most aggrieved/shat-on. I recall taking an anti-nuclear war petition to a woman's group, but they refused to sign/endorse it because nuclear armageddon wasn't a woman's issue!
But now that the deep state and deep state-controlled media, big tech, transnational-loving corporatists and authoritarian politicians of BOTH parties have reared their ugly heads, perhaps "the left" acutely defines itself by what it fights against.
I personally reject any representation of "the left" as being part of the centralized, politically-correct, virtue-signalling authoritarians that SOME people seem to have devolved to, even as they insist on thinking of themselves as "leftists".
TRUMP didn't split the left. The polarization around Trump simply revealed who was on whose side.
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Pity would be no more,
If we did not MAKE men poor - William Blake
THUGR posts about Putin so much, he must be in love.
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Quote:“I Am Not a Member of Any Organized Party — I Am a Democrat”
Originally posted by SIGNYM:
TRUMP didn't split the left. The polarization around Trump simply revealed who was on whose side.
By Sheldon Drobny
01/26/2006 03:49 pm ET <-- Take note of the dates
Updated May 25, 2011 <-- Note this date
June 26, 2021 <-- Today's date. The essay remains true despite another decade passing.
www.huffpost.com/entry/i-am-not-a-member-of-any-_b_14512
The title of this piece comes from a Will Rogers quote made in the 1930s. Here are some of his funnier quotes about the Democrats and politics in general:
“Politics has got so expensive that it takes lots of money to even get beat with.”
“You’ve got to be optimist to be a Democrat, and you’ve got to be a humorist to stay one.”
“The income tax has made more liars out of the American people than golf has.”
“Lord, the money we do spend on Government and it’s not one bit better than the one we got for one- third the money twenty years ago.”
It is amazing that after over 60 years these quotes are applicable to politics in the 21st century. Before 1933 and FDR, the Republicans controlled all branches of government and it took the Great Depression to convince the electorate that Republicans, as the party of big business, were not looking out for the best interests of most Americans. And the Democratic Party was just as disorganized before 1933 as it is today.
The problem that the Democrats always have when they are the minority party is that they have no powerful constituency. The Democrats have always been the party that represents working America which now includes the middle class. That constituency is virtually powerless especially since the decline of organized labor. The Republican Party is the party of “big business” and their constituency are the rich and powerful in this country. That is why the Democrats can only regain their control when the country is in major crisis. The corporate media of the 1920s was as biased as it is today because they represented the rich and powerful.
There is nothing new about this dilemma and we should not be too critical about the Democratic leadership. I do agree that many Democrats are trying to hedge on their positions regarding various issues. However, most Democrats stand for positions that are best for 80-90% of Americans. The problem is that corporate propaganda is disseminated through filters and spin that demonize Democrats, liberals and progressives. Clearly the business class does not want to have Democrats in control unless the economic situation is so negative that they have no choice.
And the idea that the Republicans are the party of national defense is a myth that is a fairly recent event. From the time of Woodrow Wilson, FDR, Harry Truman and Lyndon Johnson (all wartime Presidents) Democrats were criticized by isolationist Republicans as being the party of war. Since Herbert Hoover, the Republicans were viewed as the party of economic depression. Those perceptions have definitely changed, but perception is now realty and all of these things are a by-product of the corporate media which is controlled by the Republican Party.
America is definitely heading toward economic and political collapse as a result of the decisions made by Republican Administrations over the last 25 years. The collapse of the American Empire will be the necessary step that will once again bring people back to the sanity necessary to change the political and economic crisis we are facing today. It will take no less than a “Depression” type calamity like it did in the 1930s to bring America and its leaders back to their senses. And this time I believe it will be the “last hurrah” for Republicans and the wealthy elite they represent.
Every sentence in the above essay is true, but I believe that when typical Trumptards read it, perhaps by Signym, 1kiki and 6ix, every sentence will be misunderstood and the plain meaning of this essay will be tu
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Quote:
Originally posted by second:
Every sentence in the above essay is true, but I believe that when typical Trumptards read it, perhaps by Signym, 1kiki and 6ix, every sentence will be misunderstood and the plain meaning of this essay will be turned upside down and backwards.
The Democrats are running on racist policies with full backing by the racist Legacy Media.
My post history here shows that I used to lean Democrat. But I have no interest in being cucked and supporting a party that actively hates me because of my skin color coupled with my genital organs.
Democrats today are also pro-war and pro-censorship.
Fix your fucking party.
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And he who is not sufficiently courageous to defend his soul — don’t let him be proud of his ‘progressive’ views, and don’t let him boast that he is an academician or a people’s artist, a distinguished figure or a general. Let him say to himself: I am a part of the herd and a coward. It’s all the same to me as long as I’m fed and kept warm.
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Quote:All the people I know who voted for Trump, with the exception of wealthy Trump voters, are crazy, stupid to boot, and have personal problems to prove they're insane. They struggle to stay in the middle class and are oblivious to why their lives are hard because they don't recognize craziness when they look in the mirror. See the Confederates for how crazy political beliefs cause economic hardship.
Originally posted by 6IXSTRINGJACK:Quote:
Originally posted by second:
Every sentence in the above essay is true, but I believe that when typical Trumptards read it, perhaps by Signym, 1kiki and 6ix, every sentence will be misunderstood and the plain meaning of this essay will be turned upside down and backwards.
The Democrats are running on racist policies with full backing by the racist Legacy Media.
My post history here shows that I used to lean Democrat. But I have no interest in being cucked and supporting a party that actively hates me because of my skin color coupled with my genital organs.
Democrats today are also pro-war and pro-censorship.
Fix your fucking party.
The Joss Whedon script for Serenity, where Wash lives, is Serenity-190pages.pdf at www.mediafire.com/folder/1uwh75oa407q8/Firefly
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The Democrat Party leadership is a wholly-owned subsidiary of Transnational, Inc. Don't let the chaff that they throw into the air confuse you.
Even the party "insurgents" will never speak against a centralized authoritarian government which follows the precepts of transnationalism while destroying the USA.
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Pity would be no more,
If we did not MAKE men poor - William Blake
THUGR posts about Putin so much, he must be in love.
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Quote:I, quite literally, laughed out loud when I read that.
Every sentence in the above essay is true ....
When I look at REAL DATA - numbers of nukes, number of wars, first-strike nuclear policy, CO2 and other global-warming gas emissions, spook agency spying on citizens, wage - mode (less than 1,000 per year!), US manufacturing loss ... even union membership - I see NO DIFFERENCE between republicans and democrats, except the democrats seem to start more US wars than republicans (with a shout-out to the Clintons!).
Well, facts never seem to get in the way of agendas; especially of the personal-grudge type.
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Quote:Project your own inner demons much?
All the people I know who voted for Trump, with the exception of wealthy Trump voters, are crazy, stupid to boot, and have personal problems to prove they're insane. They struggle to stay in the middle class and are oblivious to why their lives are hard because they don't recognize craziness when they look in the mirror.
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Nothing Second has to say on any given topic should ever be given more than a cursory skim before throwing it in the circular file.
Second loves coming here because he mistakes our constant destruction of his deranged beliefs as attention.
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And he who is not sufficiently courageous to defend his soul — don’t let him be proud of his ‘progressive’ views, and don’t let him boast that he is an academician or a people’s artist, a distinguished figure or a general. Let him say to himself: I am a part of the herd and a coward. It’s all the same to me as long as I’m fed and kept warm.
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Quote:I don't see how Trump did anything here. Only Li8berals who excessively navel gaze are deluded enough to imagine Trump did something to them.
Originally posted by SIGNYM:
Cleanup and comments later
The title should be how The Left split The Left.
Otherwise, point out any specific action which Trump specifically did which specifically split The Left.
The left has been divisive for centuries, Trump mostly ignored them.
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Sen. Bernard Sanders said in a new interview he’s uncomfortable with social media companies banning former President Donald Trump
https://www.washingtontimes.com/news/2021/mar/24/bernie-sanders-i-dont
-feel-comfortable-with-donald/
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But when push comes to shove, Bernie caves to the party* every time. And gets reamed every time.
Maybe they're* holding something over him. Maybe they've* been telling him he can't 'caucus' with the democrats* unless he plays ball. Maybe he needs to change his party affiliation to 'democrat'*. Anybody can call themselves anything. After all Trump called himself a republican. And there's nothing a political party can do to keep the person out.
BTW - where are Bernie's and Elizabeth's influential positions in the Biden* administration?
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Quote:Data show that the economy has performed much better during Democratic administrations. Economic growth, job creation and industrial production have all been stronger. -- The Economy Under Democratic vs. Republican Presidents
Originally posted by 1KIKI:Quote:I, quite literally, laughed out loud when I read that.
Every sentence in the above essay is true ....
When I look at REAL DATA - numbers of nukes, number of wars, first-strike nuclear policy, CO2 and other global-warming gas emissions, spook agency spying on citizens, wage - mode (less than 1,000 per year!), US manufacturing loss ... even union membership - I see NO DIFFERENCE between republicans and democrats, except the democrats seem to start more US wars than republicans (with a shout-out to the Clintons!).
Well, facts never seem to get in the way of agendas; especially of the personal-grudge type.
www.jec.senate.gov/public/index.cfm/democrats/2016/6/the-economy-under
-democratic-vs-republican-presidents
1kiki, read what you wrote, again. Just maybe you will see what I see -- how crazy and stupid was what you wrote. I don't think you will have a sudden enlightenment because, while Democratic voters' thinking ranges over all possibilities, the people I know who voted for Republicans and are not rich have little variability, which doesn't work out so well for keeping them in the middle class. It's just a struggle for Trumptards to stay in the middle class as it is for any crazy and/or stupid American, whether Democrat, Republican or Independent.
I could do an essay about why Malcolm Reynolds has financial and legal struggles, but one example is enough. In the first episode, The Train Job, Mal murders a henchman. To kill the henchman, Mal risked damaging the fan jet on his spaceship, and permanently ruining Serenity, his only source of income. Mal left DNA evidence all over his spaceship for the law to find. There is much more that is wrong with Mal's decision but I will stop. Murdering that henchman was stupid and crazy, and Mal will make many similarly bad decisions in future episodes that make his life a struggle. I have seen Trumptards make bad decisions and, this is the whole point, NOT recognize what they did was self-destructive because the wrong decision felt right. Trumptards' feelings are poorly calibrated for their prosperity. Again, they can NOT recognize that because they are crazy.
The Joss Whedon script for Serenity, where Wash lives, is Serenity-190pages.pdf at www.mediafire.com/folder/1uwh75oa407q8/Firefly
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Quote:
Originally posted by 1KIKI:
BTW - where are Bernie's and Elizabeth's influential positions in the Biden* administration?
Who?
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And he who is not sufficiently courageous to defend his soul — don’t let him be proud of his ‘progressive’ views, and don’t let him boast that he is an academician or a people’s artist, a distinguished figure or a general. Let him say to himself: I am a part of the herd and a coward. It’s all the same to me as long as I’m fed and kept warm.
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Quote:Bernie and Elizabeth, alone or together, can prevent any Biden priority or project or spending from becoming law by joining with the Republicans. That is their influential positions.
Originally posted by 6IXSTRINGJACK:Quote:
Originally posted by 1KIKI:
BTW - where are Bernie's and Elizabeth's influential positions in the Biden* administration?
Who?
The Joss Whedon script for Serenity, where Wash lives, is Serenity-190pages.pdf at www.mediafire.com/folder/1uwh75oa407q8/Firefly
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Quote:
Originally posted by second:Quote:Bernie and Elizabeth, alone or together, can prevent any Biden priority or project or spending from becoming law by joining with the Republicans. That is their influential positions.
Originally posted by 6IXSTRINGJACK:Quote:
Originally posted by 1KIKI:
BTW - where are Bernie's and Elizabeth's influential positions in the Biden* administration?
Who?
The Joss Whedon script for Serenity, where Wash lives, is Serenity-190pages.pdf at www.mediafire.com/folder/1uwh75oa407q8/Firefly
I thought that was Manchin's job.
Man. Your party really sucks.
You should probably try to fix it.
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And he who is not sufficiently courageous to defend his soul — don’t let him be proud of his ‘progressive’ views, and don’t let him boast that he is an academician or a people’s artist, a distinguished figure or a general. Let him say to himself: I am a part of the herd and a coward. It’s all the same to me as long as I’m fed and kept warm.
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Sure SLOPPY - whatever.
You *** DO *** know that "Gross Domestic Product is defined as C + I + G + (X - M), where:
C = Consumption, the amount spend by consumers on products
I = Investment, the amount spent by businesses on new equipment and other capital expenditures, plus the amount spent by consumers on new homes. *** I does not equal what you might typically think of as a consumer investment, such as buying stocks
G = Government spending ***
X - M = Exports minus imports"
Right? And that production isn't part of the measure of GDP?
And that *** jobs *** includes gig work, temp work, part-time, and minimum wage - right?
NOW FOR SOME RELEVANT DATA
Unemployment and labor force participation do NOT improve under democrats. 
https://tradingeconomics.com/united-states/labor-force-participation-r
ate
Real wage growth is NOT better under democrats.
CO2 emissions are NOT lower under democrats.
Nuclear warhead stockpiles decreased under republicans - but never under democrats.
Global mean temperature doesn't decrease due to democratic administrations.
Pappy Bush started 3 wars,and dubya started 3 wars, but Obama started 6 - and Trump started 0.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_wars_involving_the_United_States
So why don't you take your phony data and put it where it belongs?
SLOPPY - why do you never start any threads of your own but instead spend 100% of your time crapping up everyone else's? Is it because you really have NOTHING you want to discuss and are only here to troll?
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Quote:
SIGNYM:
Cleanup and comments later
JSF: I don't see how Trump did anything here. Only Li8berals who excessively navel gaze are deluded enough to imagine Trump did something to them.
The title should be how The Left split The Left.
Otherwise, point out any specific action which Trump specifically did which specifically split The Left.
The left has been divisive for centuries, Trump mostly ignored them.
JSF, you are - once again- responding to what you THINK someone posted, not to what they actually wrote. In my next post, the last line reads
Quote:You see? WE AGREE! If you could focus your attention on what people ACTUALLY post, it would be a good idea.
SIGNY: TRUMP didn't split the left. The polarization around Trump simply revealed who was on whose side.
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Pity would be no more,
If we did not MAKE men poor - William Blake
THUGR posts about Putin so much, he must be in love.
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JSF could agree fully with the last 10 posts you made, but if you arrange half of the words in any given sentence in such a way that he might not like the outcome of he were to finish reading it then he will write a page long explanation why you're a Libtard.
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And he who is not sufficiently courageous to defend his soul — don’t let him be proud of his ‘progressive’ views, and don’t let him boast that he is an academician or a people’s artist, a distinguished figure or a general. Let him say to himself: I am a part of the herd and a coward. It’s all the same to me as long as I’m fed and kept warm.
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