Herc's Speculation about Giles in 4.10 -- Can it be true?

POSTED BY: Poster Nutbag
UPDATED: Wednesday, March 26, 2003 03:57
VIEWED: 17466
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NOVAGRASS

Tuesday, December 24, 2002 1:55 AM

Quote:
Originally posted by bobknaptor:

#3, Angel Investigations:
Not sure why they haven't mentioned it. Or why Angel investigations haven't mentioned getting a Slayer involved in their big apocolypse. however (more inviso-text)
Select to view spoiler:
Wanda on Eonline has hinted that the 2 big uglies are connected in some way and this will become clear soon.
, although I'm not sure how much to trust her, as she's the only one saying it so far.

As for Joyce, I still say it's not her, whether she be good or evil, I don't think she's Joyce. And I'm pretty sure that Giles is really Giles, and ME is just messing with us by not letting him touch anyone or anything.

I guess spoiler tags are needed

Select to view spoiler:

I'm telling you, the image of the being Willow summoned is the spitting image of Angel's Beast.

My theory about Joyce is this:

Joyce is really Joyce. Though, her message against destroying The First may be more telling than we realize. During "Conversations With Dead People," in The First's little manifesto, he/she/it declares that it has thrown off the mortal coil of balance between good and evil. Perhaps Buffy isn't meant to kill The First Evil... but to somehow subdue it... or even take its place (I won't go into this theory... it's too far-fetched anyway... it gets to be a bit "Spawn"-y). The balance between good and evil story has been done before, and every time it has been done, it's always been implied that a balance is needed to keep the world running. Since the First has thrown away this ideal (I'd like to think it's due in large part to Buffy's proclaimation in Amends for the first to get over itself... that'd be fun

), maybe it's Buffy's job to preserve the balance.

--Dylan Palmer, Pretentious Bastard at Large--

"Oh my god, I'm a hack!" - Joss Whedon

XANTACLAUS

Tuesday, December 24, 2002 8:20 AM

Don't remember which episode, but I'm pretty sure Xander said something along the lines of, "Should we go down to the bar and shake down Willy for information?" But I don't tape eps so I can't verify it. Maybe the giant underground worm ep?

"I wouldn't belong to a club that would have me as a member." - Groucho Marx

TERAPH

Thursday, December 26, 2002 1:08 AM

Quote:
Originally posted by bobknaptor:
God, huh? That's a pretty interesting theory. Although I don't see him as being some sort of "pure good" creature, since he buried Jonathan, which seems to help keep the evil secret.

I look at the Johnathan thing in a different light after this episode. Woods talks about experiencing evil and being changed by it.

Maybe he had some experience with evil and is

a) Trying to block it out by getting rid of those things that remind him of it.

b) Getting rid of the evidence of evil so his students don't encounter it and be changed by it. Maybe this is why he hired Buffy: so she could get a line on bad things and stop them before students (i.e., children) get hurt/traumatized.

TERAPH

Thursday, December 26, 2002 1:11 AM

Quote:
Originally posted by Nonoluna:
Tara couldn't be brought back because it was a natural death...the Harbingers don't bring a natural death so maybe they'll bring him back from the dead.

In what way is death by the Harbingers not natural? Tara's death by bullet was natural, why wouldn't death by sharp knife also be natural?

TERAPH

Thursday, December 26, 2002 1:20 AM

Quote:
Originally posted by Novagrass:
I guess spoiler tags are needed
Select to view spoiler:
I'm telling you, the image of the being Willow summoned is the spitting image of Angel's Beast.

I don't know that the spoiler tags are needed. What I do know is that the demonic manifestation of the First in "Amends" and its manifestion out of Willow in this episode look identical. But neither reminded me of the LA problem any more than Moloch ("I Robot, You Jane") does.

ZEKE023

Thursday, December 26, 2002 2:43 PM

Okay... my theories.

1.) GILES IS DEAD.
I watched the last episode again and he touched nothing - not only this but he cringes from the door when coming back from fighting the uber-vamp. Buffy notices and closes it without thinking. Whether good or evil, I'm almost positive that giles is dead.

2.) The principle is good.
He may be a watcher (we need one of those on the hell mouth), or he may be just a third party helper. I think he knows that Buffy is the slayer too... he hired her too readily. Principles don't have the authority to do that. He had other intentions.

3.) I don't know what the hell is up with Joyce, but it should be mentioned that she was the only ghost in the talking with the dead episode that had a big black thing trying to keep her at bay... definately not like the manifestations of the First.

4.) There better damn well be some sort of Buffy /Angel crossover!

-Zeke

NONOLUNA

Saturday, December 28, 2002 5:13 AM

I figured that because the Harbingers aren't human, that qualifies it as an unnatural death. Then again, I've been wrong before...

Nice idea about Joyce, true she was held back so something is different about her...

Lastly, because Buffy and Angel are on different networks the likelihood of crossover is very difficult. Willow went to tell them about Buffy but when Buffy returned she talked about seeing Angel...:-( I think it would be a good thing too though.

BOBKNAPTOR

Tuesday, December 31, 2002 12:21 AM

The harbingers aren't human? I thought they were.... just self-mutilated alphabit eyed humans.

______________
That way lies spooky carnival death.

NONOLUNA

Tuesday, December 31, 2002 4:28 AM

Now that you mention it I'm not sure...they didn't look human and they don't act human...I don't know...

STOPCALLINGMESHIRLEY

Tuesday, January 7, 2003 1:22 AM

Okay. Deep breath. My theories:

Joyce: I think the Joyce thing is evil. Big black thing just to play with Dawn's mind. Definnitely don't see Buffy turning against Dawn, and even if she did by some weird chain of events, that's not the way to help the situation, Joyce.

Giles: That's not him. Probably the First. Someone on another site said that he thought he remembered he and Ethan Rayne playing with death in their younger days. Maybe, like Buffy, he's been dead, too? But he's still alive, tied up somewhere? For what purpose, I have no idea. *And, as a side note, I have believed forever that the first season thing should not have counted. Thousands of people have "died" if you count resuscitation as resurrection. But that's beyond my powers. Just saying it's easier to die than most people give you credit for.

Wood: Here I'm lost. I have no frickin' clue. Evil, or thinks Buffy's evil? I don't think he's out to help her, though it's possible they're on the same side.

Crossovers: Don't think it's gonna happen, though I'd dearly love it. Afraid the most we'll get is an offscreen phonecall regarding Faith, since she's scheduled back. Angel & Co. are a bit busy with their own Apocalypse.

You are strange and offputting.

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