What are our national goals? What about the international rules of the road? And who are "we", anyway?
POSTED BY: SIGNYM
UPDATED: Monday, August 31, 2026 20:17
VIEWED: 6222
PAGE 2 of 9
Quote:
Originally posted by SIGNYM:
I was asking very general questions about our nation's responsibilities to the world in general when we see injustice ... something that does NOT involve bombing and killing. How do we not promote injustice in our trade deals? How do we react to the desires of regions to break away from their home states? How many refugees are we morally obligated to take in? All of them? None? Some? How do we decide?
There are very open-ended questions designed to stimulate thought and discussion. I would be very interested in hearing what other people have to say, as I'm sure there are as many ideas as posters ... probably more!
I'd love to be able to really pursue some of these questions very deeply:
Why do you think ...?
What do you mean by ...?
How do you decide ...?
Perhaps somebody wants to ask me the same questions!
Everybody's got their views, it would be nice to discuss them in depth without all of the rancor and infighting.
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You can't build a nation with bombs. You can't create a society with guns.
No SIG what you are doing is what you always do. Try to bring down the reputation of America while lifting Russia's, and Irans'.
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Quote:
Originally posted by THGRRI:
You are an atheist, so am I.
I am probably more Agnostic I can not prove or disprove a higher power, it is up to you to make that free choice of what to believe
However I know islam is violent perverted nonsense founded by the camel jacker pedophile terrorist Mahomet
they try to murder Rushdie, kill people over songs or cartoons
on this so-called religion I am Anti-Religion or Atheist
Quote:
Originally posted by THGRRI:
We need to send more into space and let that message permeate the Muslim world. Let them ask themselves, live in a hut sitting on a dirt floor, or fly to the stars?
I don't think you are a true man of science or don't think you truly ever followed the US space flight program, except maybe in some kind of superficial way
Let me give you a quick run down on Muslims in Space, first lets begin with Sputnik and the USA....not muslims yet but since a lot of asscrackistani and Communist Christian nations made up the USSR lets begin with the USSR in space.
Russia, first rocket launch into orbit
first satellite around the Earth
first man in space is done by the Russian USSR
first woman in space
first space station by the Russian USSR
first artificial space probe to fly near the Moon
at the start Russia was beating the pants off America
JFK comes along, decides to beat them Ruskies...he dies in office but his dream comes true....America lands on the Moon and beats the Russians...Nixon witnessed the landings and later ends the JFK Apollo Program
Carter comes along, does nothing of note
Reagan not to be out done by JFK dedicates one of the STS Challenger or was it Columbia? anyway he dedicates the Shuttle flights to the Taliban freedom fighters of Afghanistan...two launches later it explodes in space! Thanks for cursing it with your hexed islamic prayer Reagan!
Reagan also has the 'first' of putting the first muslim in space Salman-Al bin-lad-Saud or someshitname can't remember it correctly, anyyways this rich religous Saud with a dishcloth on his head he launches up on maybe STS-51....the stories of heard from people in the industry US flight crew are nervous Salam-al-bin-Saud keeps going over by the air-lock....the US can't wait to get back home and land with this wacko onboard
The USA and Russia start helping other nations with their programs, German, French, Japanese, British and others get space experience....Japan later builds great robotics, Canada builds a Canada-Arm to attach to sats and space stations, the Europeans later form the ESA build their own space telescopes in different spectrum and wavelength to look out into space and rival the discoveries of the Hubble
A bunch of muslim Soviets also launch, I think they had MIR, Salyuts and Skylab back then...most of the USSR-stan nations some of the cosmonaut muslims quit religion or become apostates or atheists or change their religion having a religious experience and seen or tiny planet from above
A Malaysian recently launches on a Soyuz on a space-tourist trip, the muslim malaysian government wastes the journey to the ISS by repeatedly asking the Malaysian to pray while in space, asks him Ramadano questions or to bow in the direction of Mecca as the station orbits at 22,000 mph, a space station spinning around the world 18 times a day, wonderful science experiments onboard and the idiotic islamo nmalaysian government wastes its time trying to get him to find Mecca....needless to say nothing has been heard of their space program since
Ansari a tech and phone company woman from Iran Persia, she doesn't seem too muslim, Western attitude Western dress, she goes into space....some of her trip gets good coverage in Iran, it features as news on live show, some in Iran radio are very positive while come religious hardline of Iran respond comdemning the launch and screaming DEATH TO AMERICA while trying to start a program building more scud missiles, Anasari becomes fluent in English and French and Russian....so while
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No JAYNZTOWN, I don't think you have the skill set to teach anyone anything. Especially on American History. It's apparent you are very confused and so is your understanding of who, what, when, how and especially WHY things happened and what that really represents is subject.
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Point out where I'm wrong you regressive liberalist moron
Quote:
Originally posted by THGRRI:
You are an atheist, so am I. Well I don't believe in god. Here is why I see you as radicalized.
Let's go back to this
I believe I could be Agnostic, I dont deny the existence of a higher power a greater intelligence out there somewhere in the Universe that would seem godlike
but I do not force anyone to believe in a God.... I dont get offended if they dont believe in some sky fairy in the clouds or white bearded man throwing thunder bolts or some Blue thing with an Elephants head
Agnostic perhaps is the term
but with islam I am Anti-Religion
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Quote:
Originally posted by JAYNEZTOWN:
Point out where I'm wrong you regressive liberalist moron
It's over your head or capability to understand. People like you exist throughout our history and are always at the forefront of trouble.
Like I have said before. The last time the world listened to assholes like you seventy two million people died. It was world war two.
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Signy
The US used to be a mansion with infinite rooms. For the most part people assumed the mansion would take care of itself, they only needed to care about their own room. It's how I imagine we got such regionalism, factionalism, and isolationism, as well as apathy to what's going on nationally and internationally. If a topic doesn't have a connection to your own room - the 'war on Christmas' as an example - it doesn't exist. It's just part of the big mansion that someone (else) is taking care of.
So my vision of the US is one of many disparate groups, each focused on their farm, or their community, or their religion, or their borough, or their guns ... I suspect the people who have the strongest sense of the US as a nation and who have a sense of national identity are newly-minted citizens.
That leaves the oligarchy in charge of the mansion.
BTW, I was listening to a radio show a while ago and they had a whole series of speeches, movie clips, ads and popular songs, all focused on changing the American mind so people would support the US entering WWI. (If people think government doesn't have a propaganda arm aimed at the citizens they should look at history from 100 years ago.) I think that, looking over the herd of cats that is the US, the ruling class has figured out a way to bring people along with their specific goals (which most people would otherwise not care about). It starts with repeating a meme in the media over and over (Assad BAD!) and finding a way to link it to a sense of either outrage, vengeance, or superiority. And most people, being divorced as they are from better information, go along with it.
SAGAN: We are releasing vast quantities of carbon dioxide, increasing the greenhouse effect. It may not take much to destabilize the Earth's climate, to convert this heaven, our only home in the cosmos, into a kind of hell.
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if I have wrote anything wrong, I will give you a clue
cursed the future Shuttle launches with an islamic prayer ;)
Quote:
Originally posted by THGRRI:
Like I have said before. The last time the world listened to assholes like you seventy two million people died. It was world war two.
I am against war you braindead f*cking moron, you try to paint me as some deep south mississippi redneck cartoon character who wants to invade Iraq....what if I told you I was always against the Iraq war, what if I told you I wasn't even white...maybe that's wrong but maybe you know little about me, am I Canadian? Philippine? I have wrote very little about myself.
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1kiki, America was never a mansion everyone lived in that is now decaying. America is the dream we can create a mansion everyone can live in and is a work in progress.
Look at the back of the dollar bill. The last block of the pyramid has not been placed yet signifying this. And many of the arguments now being put forth in these threads threaten that very concept.
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I hope I didn't imply a sense of decay. What I hoped to express was a nation where groups of people have very limited identities, very limited concerns, and very limited goals. Which leaves national and international decisions in the hands of the oligarchy.
So my vision of the US is one of many disparate groups, each focused on their farm, or their community, or their religion, or their borough, or their guns ... I suspect the people who have the strongest sense of the US as a nation and who have a sense of national identity are newly-minted citizens.
That leaves the oligarchy in charge of the mansion.
SAGAN: We are releasing vast quantities of carbon dioxide, increasing the greenhouse effect. It may not take much to destabilize the Earth's climate, to convert this heaven, our only home in the cosmos, into a kind of hell.
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Quote:
Originally posted by 1kiki:
Signy
The US used to be a mansion with infinite rooms. For the most part people assumed the mansion would take care of itself, they only needed to care about their own room. It's how I imagine we got such regionalism, factionalism, and isolationism, as well as apathy to what's going on nationally and internationally. If a topic doesn't have a connection to your own room - the 'war on Christmas' as an example - it doesn't exist. It's just part of the big mansion that someone (else) is taking care of.
So my vision of the US is one of many disparate groups, each focused on their farm, or their community, or their religion, or their borough, or their guns ... I suspect the people who have the strongest sense of the US as a nation and who have a sense of national identity are newly-minted citizens.
That leaves the oligarchy in charge of the mansion.
BTW, I was listening to a radio show a while ago and they had a whole series of speeches, movie clips, ads and popular songs, all focused on changing the American mind so people would support the US entering WWI. (If people think government doesn't have a propaganda arm aimed at the citizens they should look at history from 100 years ago.) I think that, looking over the herd of cats that is the US, the ruling class has figured out a way to bring people along with their specific goals (which most people would otherwise not care about). It starts with repeating a meme in the media over and over (Assad BAD!) and finding a way to link it to a sense of either outrage, vengeance, or superiority. And most people, being divorced as they are from better information, go along with it.
So, maybe the first questions:
1) DO we need to have more-or-less global memes and ethics? How individualized can we be, anyway?
2) Are our rights and responsibilities "god given" or "natural" (as the FF believed) or are they subject to change? IF they're subject to change, should we be involved in their development?
3) And, if we're shaping our rights and responsibilities (or at least accepting them), what do we want our society to look like, anyway?
I guess the last question is the first question to answer, since it's hard to know where you're going without a goal.
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You can't build a nation with bombs. You can't create a society with guns.
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