Companion Powers
POSTED BY: TheRealMe
UPDATED: Sunday, August 8, 2004 07:39
VIEWED: 5623
PAGE 3 of 3
To know that the little girl in Safe was traumatized, yes. To know the details of what her mother did?
No.
To come up with the hints that the previous village leader was done in by the current village leader?
No.
Mal and Book seem convinced that River is psychic. Neither of them are given to flights of fancy, and based on Book's demeanor, language, and knowledge (even of sadistic dictators) I believe that the Shepherd is an educated man.
But I have no doubt that you will remain unimpressed. Any evidence I could offer, you seem able to ignore or dismiss. So, I will stop, and allow you to believe in whatever you like.
Maybe the BDM will answer this question to both our satisfactions.
The Real Me
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Quote:
Originally posted by TheRealMe:
To know that the little girl in Safe was traumatized, yes. To know the details of what her mother did?
No.
Why not? Many psychiatrists claim to be able to help people relive old traumas; to bring back the details. People have been convicted of crimes based on this 'evidence'. You seem to be implying this is impossible without psychic help.
If it is not that it is impossible, but is just that River did it in one afternoon, then we are back to the 250 IQ intuitive genius, just seeming like magic.
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To come up with the hints that the previous village leader was done in by the current village leader?
No.
I frankly find this troubling. I don't know how she got that out of him. but having had friends who could do the same thing, I try to be humble enough to think that I could just be a little slow. I have seen guys on TV doing the same thing (with the same sort of interaction as river and the leader) claiming to speak to the dead. So... willing to admit this is one piece of evidence, it is not enough to convince.
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Mal and Book seem convinced that River is psychic. Neither of them are given to flights of fancy, and based on Book's demeanor, language, and knowledge (even of sadistic dictators) I believe that the Shepherd is an educated man.
Well, Mal is superstitious, and a bit of a yokel, I don't know enough about Book to judge (he does claim to believe in things that don't make sense). Simon is the one clear scientist amongst the crew. But even so, I haven't seen ANYTHING which makes those beliefs reasonable. What even remotely psychic seeming thing has River done in Mal &| Books presence? Why do they believe it?
Quote:
But I have no doubt that you will remain unimpressed. Any evidence I could offer, you seem able to ignore or dismiss.
I find this is a bit insulting. I am open to being convinced, you just haven't given me anything to be convinced about. I don't even have anything invested in it, as it is only fiction. Buffy had super powers; Willow was a witch.
Quote:
So, I will stop, and allow you to believe in whatever you like.
Maybe the BDM will answer this question to both our satisfactions.
Actually I hope not. I rather like that River is a bit ambiguous. But I will leave that to Joss, as he is a far better story-teller than I will ever be.
Thank You Kindly.
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Ok, I'm basically just going to respond to the entire board right now, so bear with me.
Originally posted by Jayneztown:
Quote:
Kaylee - A companion often will try to manipulate someone by playing their bad traits, like greed lust and other weakness, kaylee is just to nice so I would say she's almost immune
I dunno, she's pretty trusting and uncynical. Inara could easily trick her because she has her trust, and other companions could make her believe things that are already plausible. "No, I would never tell the police! I'll just walk away and forget everything I saw here."
Posted by YT:
Quote:
I think Early is stone cold, but I doubt he would have hit Inara if she couldn't influence him.
Well, he did lick Serenity, so he's not entirely rational. Even if she couldn't reach him, he probably wouldn't appreciate her trying to.
Posted by Knibblet:
Quote:
It is also important to note that companions are members of the higher ranks of society. This societal ranking in a 'verse which is NOT egalitarian packs a lot of punch when she's dealing with just plain folks.
I agree. But I think it's something you earn through intense training, and thus high society people don't aspire to be companions. I would think that they have aptitude tests for young women.
Posted by LupinAddams:
Quote:
Chinese sexual alchemy is a tradition going back to at least 4000BC and still practiced today.
Dammit, I spent 2 weeks there and nobody told me! Oh well, it's a big country.
I personally think that the Guild has a spiritual element, as either Inara or Nandi wanted to be house priestess, but their bottom line is prostitution. It's really all about the sex and company, at least for most customers, but the companions themselves might see it as something more.Posted by Corwyn:
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I don't know enough about Book to judge (he does claim to believe in things that don't make sense
Are you refering to Christianity here? The way I see it, their aren't any aspects of Christian that don't make at least some sense. Not that I'm offended or anything.
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Quote:
Originally posted by LtNOWIS:
Well, he did lick Serenity, so he's not entirely rational.
Actually that is a standard tracking technique. He discovered by it that River was up there recently.
Quote:
Posted by Corwyn:Quote:
I don't know enough about Book to judge (he does claim to believe in things that don't make sense
Are you refering to Christianity here? The way I see it, their aren't any aspects of Christian that don't make at least some sense. Not that I'm offended or anything.
No, Book (not I) says "it's not about making sense, it's about believing in something..." He admits it doesn't make sense, but that he believes in it anyway (at least that is my read).
I personally think the Bible makes sense in a lot of places (and not so much in others) for instance, the bit in Leviticus about fixing sick building syndrome.
Thank You Kindly.
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Quote:I thought he licked a vertical bar, and she stood on a horizontal railing. That and she was wearing shoes. Either way, he's definitely got issues.
Actually that is a standard tracking technique. He discovered by it that River was up there recently.
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are you refering to Christianity here? The way I see it, their aren't any aspects of Christian that don't make at least some sense. Not that I'm offended or anything.
No, Book (not I) says "it's not about making sense, it's about believing in something..." He admits it doesn't make sense, but that he believes in it anyway (at least that is my read).
I personally think the Bible makes sense in a lot of places (and not so much in others) for instance, the bit in Leviticus about fixing sick building syndrome.
Ah, I see. I agree with Book about his quote. Obviously the methods and intentions of a diety wouldn't be apparant to those who are infinitely less intelligent. I also think that only some parts of the Bible make sense, but that's also to be expected. It's important to remember that many parts of the Bible aren't telling us how to live our lives, but are merely other stuff that got thrown in. The book of Numbers includes some censuses of the Jewish people. Song of Songs is a bunch of poems written by Solomon about his wife. According to my study Bible, Jewish rabbis said someone should be 30 before they read it.
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Sorry, Corwyn. I did not mean to insult you, but I have to admit that I am quite frustrated.
I have offered you what I believe to be very compelling evidence to River's psychic ability, and you dismiss each because a particular character did not personally see it.
You tell me that it doesn't matter if River heard Early in her head before she met him because Simon did not hear it. Or whatever.
Frankly, I don't see why it matters if Simon believes in River's abilities or not. I can easily see Simon denying such a thing just becasue he is too close to it. What, does Simon have to present River with some kind of mind-reading certificate?
In my mind, if Joss lets us hear Early in River's head, then later laughs at us and tells us that he was messing with us, that is poor public relations at the very least. I have to believe that Joss is better than that. If River heard Early, then Joss put it there for a reason. What do YOU think that reason was?
And as far as psychologists bringing out details from patients, can they do that from mute patients? How did River get the details right?
How did River know anything about the old town leader being supplanted by the new? It was only after she brought that up, and after a strong reaction on the new leader's face, that the new leader went along with the witch-burning idea. Before that, he seemed to be attempting to be reasonable.
If you dismiss everything that I offer, then there can be no useful discussion between us unless I completely accept your point of view. You don't even explain why you reject it, other than you seem to be able to intuitively tell what "counts" and what "doesn't count".
And nothing I say counts.
The Real Me
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