Impeach?

POSTED BY: captaincrunch
UPDATED: Saturday, March 8, 2025 02:55
VIEWED: 9877
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WISHIMAY

Monday, April 22, 2019 11:13 AM

Quote:
Originally posted by captaincrunch:

I'd also like to see him dragged over the coals on live tv.

What I would love to see is after he's out of office have a group of psych docs explain what is wrong with his behaviors and explain them simply so that dim people learn that charisma is NOT THE SAME THING AS COMPETENCE.
This country needs a straight up crash course in understanding human behavior so that this doesn't ever happen again.

Anyway, I have a good article on the subject of ramifications of impeaching Trump.
While it would feel righteous, it would ultimately prove fruitless and pointless...

https://www.historyextra.com/period/modern/history-impeachment-preside
nt-trump-nixon-clinton-explained/

Yet even if Trump were impeached by a Democratic-controlled House next year, his chances of being convicted and removed from office by the Senate would seem to be so low as to be virtually non-existent. Whatever happens in the mid-term elections, it is mathematically impossible for Democrats to gain a two-thirds majority in the Senate. Between 15 and 20 Republican senators would be needed to support the president’s removal from office, more than would have been necessary to convict Nixon had he not resigned first. Whatever they may think of Trump privately, Republican lawmakers have proved time and again that they will not take him on publicly.

Only if Trump’s popularity with Republican voters plummeted might that change, but why would that happen? All the evidence suggests that Trump’s supporters have no illusions about his character but want him to be their president anyway. Nixon, by contrast, had very low approval ratings by the time of his resignation, but that was in a less partisan age in which there was no equivalent of Fox News to provide the president’s supporters with an alternative narrative. Barring death, Trump seems likely to remain in office until at least the next election so long as he maintains the support of core Republican voters.

RUE

Monday, April 22, 2019 11:50 AM

You think he's charismatic? You've got strange tastes.

In any case, while impeachment might be a moment of gratification and bonding for a certain percentage of voters, I don't think it's going to win any converts. Democrats need to hone their sales pitch to answer the voter question - what are you going to do to make my life better?

WISHIMAY

Monday, April 22, 2019 7:02 PM

Quote:
Originally posted by rue:
You think he's charismatic? You've got strange tastes.

Oh hell no, but his base does...

CAPTAINCRUNCH

Monday, April 22, 2019 7:20 PM

Quote:
Originally posted by WISHIMAY:
Quote:
Originally posted by captaincrunch:

I'd also like to see him dragged over the coals on live tv.

What I would love to see is after he's out of office have a group of psych docs explain what is wrong with his behaviors and explain them simply so that dim people learn that charisma is NOT THE SAME THING AS COMPETENCE.
This country needs a straight up crash course in understanding human behavior so that this doesn't ever happen again.

Anyway, I have a good article on the subject of ramifications of impeaching Trump.
While it would feel righteous, it would ultimately prove fruitless and pointless...

https://www.historyextra.com/period/modern/history-impeachment-preside
nt-trump-nixon-clinton-explained/

Yet even if Trump were impeached by a Democratic-controlled House next year, his chances of being convicted and removed from office by the Senate would seem to be so low as to be virtually non-existent. Whatever happens in the mid-term elections, it is mathematically impossible for Democrats to gain a two-thirds majority in the Senate. Between 15 and 20 Republican senators would be needed to support the president’s removal from office, more than would have been necessary to convict Nixon had he not resigned first. Whatever they may think of Trump privately, Republican lawmakers have proved time and again that they will not take him on publicly.

Only if Trump’s popularity with Republican voters plummeted might that change, but why would that happen? All the evidence suggests that Trump’s supporters have no illusions about his character but want him to be their president anyway. Nixon, by contrast, had very low approval ratings by the time of his resignation, but that was in a less partisan age in which there was no equivalent of Fox News to provide the president’s supporters with an alternative narrative. Barring death, Trump seems likely to remain in office until at least the next election so long as he maintains the support of core Republican voters.

Thanks for the article. I'm well aware of the math. I know going in %-wise, it's probably a lost cause. But... I still feel that even if the only benefit is in retrospect, "at least we took a stand and had the b@lls to take him to task - because it's what we're suppose to do and not necessarily the politically expedient thing to do - we can always be inspired by that." Small victory, but otherwise? I don't have any faith in the voting public or the sanctity of the voting booth. I imagine RUSSIA! will only be emboldened by the removal of sanctions (the quo) and how Dump has removed much of the oversight on election intrusion. Another term only goes to solidify Dump/Putin alliance. And don't take any solace over "he can only get one more term." It won't be him, but he'll find some kind of desciple and we'll have Dump II. They - the GOP and the Dump whores - are solidifying their grasp on the small stuff, changing out judges, changing laws, changing regulations (how are those robocalls working for you? Did you notice that home equity lines of credit have just doubled? You can dig yourself into twice as much debt as ever. Talk about having control over people's lives). Of course, it will take a lot of time. Just slow enough that most people won't notice or care because they never cared.

REAVERFAN

Monday, April 22, 2019 7:26 PM

Quote:
Originally posted by WISHIMAY:
Quote:
Originally posted by rue:
You think he's charismatic? You've got strange tastes.

Oh hell no, but his base does...

"I love the poorly educated."

WISHIMAY

Tuesday, April 23, 2019 3:58 AM

Quote:
Originally posted by captaincrunch:

Thanks for the article. I'm well aware of the math. I know going in %-wise, it's probably a lost cause. But... I still feel that even if the only benefit is in retrospect, "at least we took a stand and had the b@lls to take him to task - because it's what we're suppose to do and not necessarily the politically expedient thing to do - we can always be inspired by that." Small victory, but otherwise? I don't have any faith in the voting public or the sanctity of the voting booth.

I just realized how little energy I have left to go tilting at windmills.

I am too old for this shit...

I dunno. I look around and see bombings and shootings and people bankrupted by basic medical care and all the crap.... and I don't think picking battles purely for the edification of history and benefit of a dubious future is worth that much. If we evolve then people of the future are going to look on us poorly anyways. If we don't then nothing we do matters much in the long run either. When you have limited energy like I do, you learn to just put it into things that matter.

There is just so much to fix here. Trump is something that can't be. You can't ever convince someone with a personality disorder that there is something amiss because they always will believe they are awesome and will rationalize away anything else you say.

I'm not sure anything can be done about Russia until there's a Dem or other Prez who is willing to recognize the threat.

SECOND

Tuesday, April 23, 2019 4:31 PM

Quote:
Originally posted by WISHIMAY:

There is just so much to fix here. Trump is something that can't be.

It happens that Mueller clearly thinks Trump can be charged once he’s out of office

The special counsel makes his view plain in a single footnote.

https://slate.com/news-and-politics/2019/04/mueller-report-footnote-10
91-prosecute-trump-obstruction-post-presidency.html

In the report, it’s Footnote 1,091, which appears on Page 178.

The implication of both the passage and the subsequent footnote is clear: If Trump committed obstruction of justice, even through official actions, a prosecutor could charge him after his term has ended.

Further, impeachment would be no “substitute” for eventual criminal charges, and “Congress is not restricted to relying only on impeachment,” which is “a drastic and rarely invoked remedy.” This is pretty strong stuff, and it hasn’t received the attention it deserves.

6IXSTRINGJACK

Tuesday, April 23, 2019 5:04 PM

lol

That line item didn't get "the attention it deserves" because there are about 450 pages saying that he wasn't guilty of anything.

Oops.

Do Right, Be Right. :)

SECOND

Tuesday, April 23, 2019 5:38 PM

Quote:
Originally posted by 6IXSTRINGJACK:
lol

That line item didn't get "the attention it deserves" because there are about 450 pages saying that he wasn't guilty of anything.

Oops.

6ix, you understood nothing. Actually what the Report said was that Mueller is operating under rules that forbid him from indicting the President with a crime. That was widely known in May of 2018:

Mueller's team told Trump's lawyers the special counsel cannot indict a sitting president
www.houstonchronicle.com/news/article/Mueller-s-team-told-Trump-s-lawy
ers-the-special-12920958.php

Robert Costa, Josh Dawsey and Carol D. Leonnig, The Washington Post May 16, 2018

WASHINGTON - Special counsel Robert Mueller III's team told President Donald Trump's lawyers recently that prosecutors do not believe they can charge a sitting president with a crime under Justice Department guidelines, Trump lawyer Rudy Giuliani said Wednesday.

The special counsel's conclusion signals that it would be left to Congress to address any finding of wrongdoing by Trump in the investigation. Mueller's team is scrutinizing Russian interference in the 2016 election, whether the Russians coordinated with any Trump associates and whether the president has sought to thwart the probe.

Mueller indicated in a meeting a few weeks ago that he concurred with the view that a sitting president cannot be indicted under past legal opinions issued by the Justice Department, Giuliani told The Washington Post.

Giuliani said that Mueller at first tried to be "coy" when Giuliani asked the special counsel for his stance on the issue. One of Mueller's aides responded that the special counsel would follow Justice Department guidelines, he said.

A spokesman for the special counsel declined to comment.

Then what happened? Mueller wrote: "Fourth, if we had confidence after a thorough investigation of the facts that the President clearly did not commit obstruction of justice, we would so state. Based on the facts and the applicable legal standards, however, we are unable to reach that judgment." - Page 214 of 448

Translation: Trump is guilty as hell, but I cannot say that because of the rules and Attorney General Barr.

The Joss Whedon script for Serenity, where Wash lives, is Serenity-190pages.pdf at www.mediafire.com/folder/1uwh75oa407q8/Firefly

JEWELSTAITEFAN

Wednesday, April 24, 2019 12:55 AM

Quote:
Originally posted by 6IXSTRINGJACK:
lol

That line item didn't get "the attention it deserves" because there are about 450 pages saying that he wasn't guilty of anything.

Oops.

Do Right, Be Right. :)

All of those tiny infractions from decades ago that they threw at others, but they couldn't find a single credible thing that Trump did wrong?

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