What happened to "freedom of religion"?
POSTED BY: Niki2
UPDATED: Sunday, April 21, 2024 23:47
VIEWED: 7822
PAGE 5 of 8
To return to the original issue:
Both the fear of Sharia law and the resistance to allowing Muslims to build mosques are the same issue; fear instigated by hateful people to create controversy and persecute one group and the religion they practice.Quote:
That is pure bullshit and you know it. We already KNOW some of the “reasons” for denying the permits are mere excuses, so that doesn’t hold water. Refusing a permit to build a house of worship BY THE GOVERNMENT, be it local, state or federal, IS infringing on freedom of religion, period.
Just because a local municipality here or there doesn't want to pass an ordinance for the building of a mosque at a certain site, that doesn't constitute some vast display of 'intolerance' or attack on anyone's freedom of religion.
How about property rights??? Some here are so quick to scream “property rights!” when something happens which THEY dislike, yet the property rights of a these people mean nothing when it fits their mentality. In some instances the people who want to build a mosque OWN the land, so let's see some hypocrisy to deny them the right to build on THEIR PRIVATE PROPERTY...I'm sure it's coming.
West Rogers Park, Chicago:Quote:
Tax revenue. Right. I wonder how long that site has sat idle, not producing any tax revenue, or if a Christian church would have been denied for the same excuse. The fact is The First Amendment is applicable to the states and local governments. No governmental entity may prohibit the free exercise of religion--they may not deny building permits or make zoning decisions based solely upon the identity of the religious group seeking to build. The due process and equal protection clauses of the 14th Amendment ensure the protection of fundamental rights in every state as well. AND, those seeking to pressure their government into denying the permits aren’t hiding behind things anymore:
We’re hearing from the local chamber of commerce and alderman’s office that the city has denied a special use permit that would allow a mosque to replace a shut down hot dog grill.
It’s based on the need to generate tax revenue on the former site of the original Fluky’s and later U Lucky Dawg, at 6821 N. Western Ave.Quote:
At one time, neighbors who did not want mosques in their backyards said their concerns were over traffic, parking and noise — the same reasons they might object to a church or a synagogue. But now the gloves are off.
In all of the recent conflicts, opponents have said their problem is Islam itself. They quote passages from the Koran and argue that even the most Americanized Muslim secretly wants to replace the Constitution with Islamic Shariah law.
These local skirmishes make clear that there is now widespread debate about whether the best way to uphold America’s democratic values is to allow Muslims the same religious freedom enjoyed by other Americans, or to pull away the welcome mat from a faith seen as a singular threat.
“What’s different is the heat, the volume, the level of hostility,” said Ihsan Bagby, associate professor of Islamic studies at the University of Kentucky. “It’s one thing to oppose a mosque because traffic might increase, but it’s different when you say these mosques are going to be nurturing terrorist bombers, that Islam is invading, that civilization is being undermined by Muslims.”
Mr. Harmoush said the Muslim families had contributed to the local food bank, sent truckloads of supplies to New Orleans after Hurricane Katrina, and participated in music nights and Thanksgiving events with the local interfaith council. “We do all these activities and nobody notices,” he said. “Now that we have to build our center, everybody jumps to make it an issue.” The City of Temecula recently postponed a hearing on whether to grant the mosque a permit.
“As a mother and a grandmother, I worry,” Ms. Serafin said. “I do believe everybody has a right to freedom of religion. But Islam is no
NOTIFY: Y | REPLY | REPLY WITH QUOTE | PERMALINK | TOP | HOME
Am I opposed to/afraid of mosks being built in my area? No, if they want to they can as long as they obtain the property etc. Am I afraid of Sherria law? Sort of. Am I afraid of Sherria law gaining a foot hold in the US? Not in the near future since we have laws against hurting girls and women etc. But Sherria law, well those aspects of it, do scare me some.
"A completely coherant River means writers don't deliver" KatTaya
NOTIFY: N | REPLY | REPLY WITH QUOTE | PERMALINK | TOP | HOME
As far as I know sharia is only practiced in Saudi Arabia. Someone can correct me if I'm wrong.
That's what a ship is, you know - it's not just a keel and a hull and a deck and sails, that's what a ship needs.
NOTIFY: Y | REPLY | REPLY WITH QUOTE | PERMALINK | TOP | HOME
Quote:
Originally posted by dreamtrove:
As far as I know sharia is only practiced in Saudi Arabia. Someone can correct me if I'm wrong.
Wrong. Its practiced in many Muslim countries. Its a matter of degree as to how much its implemented. In some ways the Saudis are strict and some ways they are not. The most extreme was in Taliban-controlled Afganistan...try being a woman there.
H
"Hero. I have come to respect you." "I am forced to agree with Hero here."- Chrisisall, 2009.
"I would rather not ignore your contributions." Niki2, 2010.
NOTIFY: Y | REPLY | REPLY WITH QUOTE | PERMALINK | TOP | HOME
Quote:
Originally posted by RionaEire:
Am I afraid of Sherria law gaining a foot hold in the US? Not in the near future since we have laws against hurting girls and women etc. But Sherria law, well those aspects of it, do scare me some.
Open your eyes a bit, please.
Pedophilia is supposed to be illegal, too.
Rape is supposed to be illegal, too.
Yet in Wisconsin, Hmong groups still practice the traditional method of marriage - a grown man kidnaps a girl of about 12-14, rapes her, and thus she becomes his wife. Have not heard of a single one of these men being prosecuted, have you?
I do not expect different from Sharia Law once entrenched.
NOTIFY: Y | REPLY | REPLY WITH QUOTE | PERMALINK | TOP | HOME
Iran still has public executions, correct ? Women 'guilty' of adultery are stoned and gays sent to the gallows ?
Dunno how much Sharia law is involved, but it sure as heck is barbaric.
NOTIFY: N | REPLY | REPLY WITH QUOTE | PERMALINK | TOP | HOME
I'm never sure if you're really this ignorant.
Sharia law is fundamentalist Sunni, not Shi'a.
Even George W. Bush understood that.
Specific cases, in the NW and NE corners of Iran there are some tribal areas. Sometimes local chiefs do kill people. This is illegal, but it's hard for the national govt. to control.
The hanging of homosexuals was homocide, they were hung from a swingset, not a gallows.
Iran has capital punishment, so does the US. I've known people who go to observe executions, I guess that's sort of public. Certainly the stories are broadcast on the television, which has the same purpose: To make sure that everyone sees the death that is done to the people who break this law.
I don't know what the story is on Iranian executions. I know that overall, the western myth of the Mideast as a stone age society is pretty much imperial bigotry. The first two major complaints Iraqis made about our effort to topple Saddam Hussein was that we disrupted their interstate system and took down their cell phone network. This contrasted sharply with the president's comment "We're talking about people who live in caves." And yes, he was talking about Iraq, not Afghanistan, when he said it.
So, bearing in mind that Iran is a massive military industrial power with its own nuclear program and its own space program, yes, they're less advanced than us, but not less advanced than us from 1/2 a century ago. In fact, we recently sacrificed 3 predator drones to the discover that in fact, they were useless against Iran.
As I keep telling people: You have one life, and one planet. You can like what's on it, or not. Every time you dislike something, your world gets smaller. Pretty soon your world becomes insular. Not only is it not any fun for you or those around you, you become ignorant because you're not getting any ideas from the outside. Personally, I know where I would be without the input of Iranians, the same place I would be without the input of Jews. People who've had profound positive impact on my life come from all places, and I'm very grateful to all of them, and I'm grateful to the man who told me many years ago to not hate things.
I'm using a mac. I'm not a mac user. I'm upstairs at the mac. In a little bit, I'll be downstairs using linux. then, I'll pick up my ipad, and do my inventory, I'll load up windows to check the stocks, and then I'll start programming on the Android. That's five different OS's. If I didn't have a mac, I could code for iPad, if I didn't have an iPad, I couldn't write apps, if I didn't have a PC I wouldn't have this stock program, and without linux, programming for the web would be a pain. The android is to expand my apps, and make some more powerful open source stuff.
The rest of the world works the same way.
There is suddenly a stunning quantity of rain
That's what a ship is, you know - it's not just a keel and a hull and a deck and sails, that's what a ship needs.
NOTIFY: Y | REPLY | REPLY WITH QUOTE | PERMALINK | TOP | HOME
Didn't read my post, did ya ?
Quote:
Dunno how much Sharia law is involved, but it sure as heck is barbaric.
I admitted as much, or did you miss that in my 2 whole lines of my reply ?
This is the sort of story I meant -
Quote:
A gay Iranian teen could be facing the gallows in Iran after his attempts to seek asylum in Britain and Holland failed.
Yesterday the Netherlands' highest court rejected Mehdi Kazemi's last-ditch bid to avoid deportation to Britain, where he fears authorities will send him back to Tehran and possible execution.
The teenager came to London to study English in 2005 but later discovered that his boyfriend had been arrested by the Iranian police, charged with sodomy and hanged.
Mr Kazemi applied for asylum in the UK, saying he feared for his life if he returned to Iran.
Read more: http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-531729/Gay-teen-facing-gallows
-Iran-asylum-bids-Britain-Holland-fail.html#ixzz1IZNkbFMd
As I understand, Mehdi Kazemi was eventually given asylum in Britain, and did not have to return to Iran.
'Public' viewing means exactly that. Open to all those who want to see it. A 'viewing' of an execution ,as we have here in the US, isn't 'public', by any stretch of the imagination.
" I do not love the bright sword for its sharpness, nor the arrow for its swiftness, nor the warrior for his glory. I love only that which they defend. "
NOTIFY: N | REPLY | REPLY WITH QUOTE | PERMALINK | TOP | HOME
I read your post, you didn't read mine. As I said, a homocide is not public policy. We have homocides here too. Actually, Obama has made it legal for the US govt. to assassinate US citizens. One was for running a website. I don't know offhand how many rights that violates. Depends if it involved bivouacking.
That's what a ship is, you know - it's not just a keel and a hull and a deck and sails, that's what a ship needs.
NOTIFY: Y | REPLY | REPLY WITH QUOTE | PERMALINK | TOP | HOME
You and I are talking about totally different things. Which I find curious, as I only had 2 lines in my reply, and there wasn't all that much room for confusion.
" I do not love the bright sword for its sharpness, nor the arrow for its swiftness, nor the warrior for his glory. I love only that which they defend. "
NOTIFY: N | REPLY | REPLY WITH QUOTE | PERMALINK | TOP | HOME