Real World Event Discussions

Pirates Attack Wrong Ship!

POSTED BY: Kwicko
UPDATED: Sunday, October 11, 2009 08:22
VIEWED: 4562
PAGE 2 of 5

GINOBIFFARONI

Thursday, October 8, 2009 3:23 PM

Quote:
Originally posted by Hero:
Quote:
Originally posted by Jongsstraw:
What work? This is the horn of Africa.

Are you saying there is nothing that needs done in Africa or that they are simply incapable of doing anything besides piracy or simply rolling over and dying.

Seems if they have a boat, they can figure out how to fish. Lots of jobs. Somebody to make nets, somebody to fish, somebody to maintain the boat, somebody to unload the fish, somebody to sell the fish...seems to me that with a little imagination and some microeconomics, they have the makings of an industry.

Or they can use guns to steal.

H

"Hero. I have come to respect you"- Chrisisall, 2009.

Until the only fish you bring in have three eyes

I also read a story about foreign fishing trawlers running down the local fishing boats...

" I don't believe in hypothetical situations - it's kinda like lying to your brain "

" They don't hate America, they hate Americans " Homer Simpson

Lets party like its 1939

KWICKO

Thursday, October 8, 2009 3:57 PM

Quote:
Originally posted by Hero:
Quote:
Originally posted by Jongsstraw:
What work? This is the horn of Africa.

Are you saying there is nothing that needs done in Africa or that they are simply incapable of doing anything besides piracy or simply rolling over and dying.

Seems if they have a boat, they can figure out how to fish. Lots of jobs. Somebody to make nets, somebody to fish, somebody to maintain the boat, somebody to unload the fish, somebody to sell the fish...seems to me that with a little imagination and some microeconomics, they have the makings of an industry.

Or they can use guns to steal.

H

"Hero. I have come to respect you"- Chrisisall, 2009.

But the stealing is so much more lucrative - sounds like you have a burgeoning "free-market capitalist" economy in development there. Geezer should be so proud... They're living the American Dream!

Mike

The percentage you're paying is too high-priced
While you're living beyond all your means;
And the man in the suit has just bought a new car
From the profit he's made on your dreams

GINOBIFFARONI

Thursday, October 8, 2009 4:18 PM

Somalia: Piracy vs. Blind Western Justice

http://www.somalilandtimes.net/sl/2009/379/41.shtml

By Dalmar Kahin
Somali teenagers, of course, remain potential pirates—a menace to society. So to thwart chaos in high seas, the “civilized” and “enlightened” Western world needs to not only freeze the pirates’ assets—the fish—but also obliterate their dens. For they [pirates] pose a threat to shipping lanes; or more precisely, they create a formidable obstacle to illegal fishing incursion into Somalia’s coast—a condoned theft.
The same European countries that stormed the coast of Somalia under false pretext of fighting off piracy not only pillaged Somalia’s rich marine resources but also poisoned Somali generations. For instance, both French and Spanish fishing vessels looted Somali fish at will.
During dinner, for many Europeans in London, Paris, Rome, Madrid, Anthem and other cities, while they devour a lavish buffet of looted Somali fish, remain horrified to watch video clips of starving Somalis—perhaps form coastal communities—on TV.
As captive audiences, the European viewers blame the pirates just as the Media feeds viewers with the usual undiluted dozes of disinformation.
The ignorance towards the root cause of Somali piracy is amplified by the insipid response from Secretary of State Hillary Clinton to piracy. She states, "These pirates are criminals…they are armed gangs on the sea, and those plotting attacks must be stopped and those carrying them out must be brought to justice." http://www.abc.net.au/news/stories/2009/04/16/2544018.htm
But what the Media and Hillary Clinton conveniently avoid informing their ever gullible audiences as well as TV worshipers of North Americans is: Somali piracy stems from the unabated European and Asian illegal fishing expeditions and toxic dumping into Somalia’s waters. Portraying pirates as savage criminals while putting a lipstick smudge on the vicious vultures pillaging Somalia’s fish and dumping nuclear waste into its waters is a testimony of how the scheme is rarely mentioned much less condemned.
Italian and Swedish companies, among others, dumped tones of toxic waste into Somalia crystal clear waters. After the tsunami much of their deadly poisons were exposed. See the CBC report: http://www.cbc.ca/national/blog/video/internationalus/pirates_of_somal
ia.html
Yet, the Europeans audaciously expect pirates to abase their heads once they encounter European flagged ships. Don’t forget the illegal fishing vessels, the ships that dump toxic waste into Somalia’s waters, the Western civilian ships, and NATO navy ships carry the same flags. Yet the West expresses shock and dismay when pirates attack randomly.
Separating truths from lies
• Somalia loses $300 to $500 dollars worth of fish per year to foreign intruders
• Somali pirates get $30 to $50 million dollars per year for ransom—10% of what Somalia loses to foreign trawlers
• Toxic waste dumped into Somalia’s waters killed over 300 people. Somali coastal communities suffer from cancer, skin diseases, gum bleeding, and miscarriages
• Europeans waste management companies calculated: poisoning Somalis is far more inexpensive than storing their [European] toxic waste in Europe. To dump a container of toxic waste into Somalia’ waters costs less than $2.50. Not even hazardous warning signs are required. On the other hand, the same container costs over $1000 to store it in Europe. Again, Europeans are saving millions of dollars while poisoning millions of Somali children. Brazenly, the Italian and Swedish companies argue that Somali leaders—factional warlords that never controlled more than few blocks in Mogadishu—signed the agreement to dump the toxic into Somalia
• Pirates have never killed, tortured or poisoned any of their captives
• U.S., EU, NATO and Asian forces plan to attack pirate bases. From air, however, pirates, fishers, and civilians look the same. But the West doesn't understand why pirates cannot distinguish civilian ships from fishing vessels. Forced to abandon fishing, a Somali pirate who perhaps has hi

RUE

Thursday, October 8, 2009 4:40 PM

"History never proves anything except to document the past."

Even worse, it's written by the winners. So it certainly can't be considered an unbiased record. I suspect any other solution Hero is thinking of has been tried, and simply was not documented for the reason that it wasn't a winning strategy.

***************************************************************

Silence is consent.

AG05

Friday, October 9, 2009 2:14 AM

See, I'd buy the poor fisherman angle a whole lot more if it were fishing boats (or ships dumping waste) that were being attacked. but it's not. It's commercial transport vessels and passenger ships. Which seems to me that the Somalis in question are not attacking the ships and people which most directly threaten their ancient and noble profession, but the ships that can provide the most profit. The fishing thing may have had some peripheral impact on the upswing of piracy at first, but I can't imagine it took to long before even the successful fisherman decided there was more money to be made knocking off transports.

Mercy is the mark of a great man.
Guess I'm just a good man.
Well, I'm alright.

CHRISISALL

Friday, October 9, 2009 2:18 AM

Quote:
Originally posted by Hero:
Are you saying there is nothing that needs done in Africa or that they are simply incapable of doing anything besides piracy or simply rolling over and dying.

I am forced to agree with Hero here.

The laughing Chrisisall

FREMDFIRMA

Friday, October 9, 2009 2:55 AM

Quote:
The fishing thing may have had some peripheral impact on the upswing of piracy at first, but I can't imagine it took to long before even the successful fisherman decided there was more money to be made knocking off transports.

Again, repeat after me...

You know what the difference between a pirate and a customs inspector is ?

Perceived legitimacy.

You don't like the toll, don't sail in their waters.
I know that's drastically oversimplifying it, but what gives US the right to decide which other nations policies within their OWN waters are valid or not ?
Outside of em, meh - fire at will.

-F

AG05

Friday, October 9, 2009 3:33 AM

Customs inspections usually involve less supressing fire?

Who are we (or who are they, for that matter) to dictate who's waters are whose in an endless ocean? Should the waters of our world ocean not be free for all to ply without fear of... whatever, I'm getting tired of this fuzzy bunny line of thinking. Q-ships for everybody!!!

Mercy is the mark of a great man.
Guess I'm just a good man.
Well, I'm alright.

GINOBIFFARONI

Friday, October 9, 2009 3:44 AM

So, when I show up on your coastline and start pitching barrels overboard.....

don't you be dictating to me lmao

" I don't believe in hypothetical situations - it's kinda like lying to your brain "

" They don't hate America, they hate Americans " Homer Simpson

Lets party like its 1939

AG05

Friday, October 9, 2009 3:52 AM

like I said, I could understand them shooting up barrel-dumping ships. But there's no money in it, so they hit cargo ships instead.

Why don't shipping companies hire those Blackwater dudes for protection? Mercenaries vs. Pirates, that'd make some good reality TV right there. We could take bets.

Mercy is the mark of a great man.
Guess I'm just a good man.
Well, I'm alright.