Can there be 'good' laws?
POSTED BY: SignyM
UPDATED: Sunday, March 8, 2026 22:49
VIEWED: 1971
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Topic came up in a (completely unrelated! 
) thread. Lots of folks... in fact MOST folks around here... see laws an an imposition on their freedoms. Doesn't seem to matter which laws or which freedoms: LAWS? They bad. They step on our Constitutional RIGHTS, by gum!
But then, it occurred to me: Our rights? They're granted to us by a series of LAWS. Because, after all, that's what the Constitution is: a series of laws which govern our government's behavior!
So, are there laws which INCREASE freedom? What about laws which govern organizations, not individuals? For example, what if there was a law which said that all working members of a business.... and ONLY working members of that business... have a right to determine how that business was run? What about laws which said that no organization could collect or disseminate information about an identifiable individual without that individual's consent? Laws which said that any organization could not discriminate on the basis of (the usual list)?
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The laws that stop you from murdering, bashing raping and stealing are all pretty good.
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Then only the criminals will be able to murder bash rape and steal...
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Quote:I wouldn't say pt stops people from doing it. Moreso that it punishes people for doing it.
Originally posted by Magonsdaughter:
The laws that stop you from murdering, bashing raping and stealing are all pretty good.
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Quote:
So, are there laws which INCREASE freedom?
Broadly speaking, yes and no. Laws against discrimination based on age, gender, race, or sexual orientation increase "freedom" for the people protected under them - but it could be argued that they DECREASE freedom for the people hindered by them.
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Quote:
Originally posted by Cuda77:Quote:I wouldn't say pt stops people from doing it. Moreso that it punishes people for doing it.
Originally posted by Magonsdaughter:
The laws that stop you from murdering, bashing raping and stealing are all pretty good.
Hee hee. yes, I guess that it true, semantically speaking. You'd hope that the thought of punishment would deter some....
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This isn't the issue. "Laws" are taken here as "powers given to the govt" as opposed to what we call "rules."
An orthodox jewish community has what it calls "laws" but they are only those set by the leaders of their community. If you fail to follow them, you're out.
The Govt. is a controlling elite. Giving it the power to *punish* people is a really bad idea, it creates power with either corrupts or is a magnet for the corrupt as Nietzsche suggests.
Our govt. was supposed to be a shell to prevent this kind of dictatorship, a shield against this kind of law, and punishment, but it created too much central power and not enough checks and balances, those that were created relied on the good will of humans, who were to be less and less trusted, since power is a magnet for the corrupt.
So I can't really answer the question without first addressing the issue of who has the power to make laws and enforce them. I suspect under the current system, no, nothing useful will come out of the govt.
Edit: I don't think that punishment has proven an effective means of detering crime. We have more serious crimes in our lawful communities than on our isolationist unruled communities (reservations, the amish, etc.) Though hunter gatherers in brazil have a fairly high murder rate.
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DT_ SO, it's not the laws per se but the method of writing and enforcing them?
Waiting for others to weigh in.
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Laws, as you've defined them, are mandated, enforced, and changed by people-in-power in order to control the behavior of those "underneath".
So, no. There can never be any good law.
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Wulf- the laws I brought up are laws which specifically govern the actions of THOSE IN POWER. The most famous example, and one which you keep bringing up, is the Constitution. Are you saying the Constitution is bad?
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