Real World Event Discussions

Hey, we want to be part of the hate!

POSTED BY: dreamtrove
UPDATED: Tuesday, January 20, 2009 02:14
VIEWED: 18566
PAGE 21 of 23

DREAMTROVE

Sunday, January 18, 2009 7:35 PM

Quote:

So anyway, Finn, any comment my post, in which I question the ultimate purpose of capital punishment?

Oh, I can throw a few in here:

Capital Punishment is a mechanism of fear. Essentially, state terrorism. Far too few people are executed to have a real agenda to it.

RUE

Sunday, January 18, 2009 7:47 PM

"Let's face it. Many people don't come here to share and learn from one another."

I don't think most can. What I find really disenheartening is that many, many people here seem to be relating to their childhood issues ad infinitum, often without realizing it, and never quite get beyond them.

It's sad. To grow older and older and never quite become an adult.

***************************************************************

Silence is consent.

DREAMTROVE

Sunday, January 18, 2009 9:26 PM

Kathy

I suspect that most people have forgotten their childhood. Most people I find want to vent their opinion on issues. Some just want to talk about their private life with bagels.

DREAMTROVE

Sunday, January 18, 2009 9:26 PM

Erg. Double post.

CHRISISALL

Sunday, January 18, 2009 9:31 PM

Quote:
Originally posted by Finn mac Cumhal:
Evil, in my example, in the context I thought I presented clearly enough, is just anti-survival urges in the human psyche brought on by post-environmental population toxicity: an emergent attempt by nature to curb the epidemic spread of the human species. But, oh yeah, original sin and dichotomy fit in there, too. Somewhere. I'm sure.

They sure do. You’re just using modern rationale for the good-evil dichotomy.

Explanation is not the same as rationale, if I understand the meanings correctly.

The comprehending Chrisisall

FREMDFIRMA

Sunday, January 18, 2009 9:39 PM

Quote:
Not sure if this was a reference to HK's post?

I meant in regard to how you were referencing the nothingness of Zen, HK was referencing the prominences of Euro beliefs, and I found a way to come in sideways and make fun of the concept - three totally different takes on a single point in time, just fascinating, in a sorta way.

Re: Neurochemical Processes.

I hope you have some time on your hands then, cause Doc Perry's work is real heavy on this sorta thing, especially as it relates to the HPA axis and Fight-Freeze-Flight reaction, but it's seriously "heavy lifting" to read without the associated medical/scientific backgrounding.

Two especially good ones to start from are here.
http://www.childtrauma.org/ctamaterials/neuros~1.asp
http://www.childtrauma.org/ctamaterials/states_traits.asp

The main site link for fav placing - http://www.childtrauma.org/

Quote:
I still don't get which institutions you are referring to

From the CAICA mission statement.
http://www.caica.org/

CAICA seeks to expose the abuse and distress of children placed in private and state-funded programs including but not limited to residential facilities, behavior modification programs, boot camps, wilderness programs, and boarding schools.
CAICA believes that no child should be abducted, incarcerated, abused, neglected, or stripped of their basic human rights for the sake of profit.

Basically, any full-time residential/incarcerative facility that uses behavior modification processes on children and/or teens that are known to be in fact harmful in physical or psychological fashion.

Reform Schools, Boot Camps, Training Schools, whatever euphamism they hide behind - especially those run by WWASP, cause that was an offshoot of the Synanon Cult originally financed and co-opted by a certain blackops program involving behavior modification research.
http://www.thestraights.com/flowchart.htm
That ain't conspiracy theory, it's conspiracy fact, proven and admitted, and the one reason I despise Mitt Romney is that Sembler, Lichfield and Kay were/are his primary financiers.

Those who survive and thrive after "treatment" at these hellholes do so by a form of learned/trained sociopathy that makes them absolutely perfect recruits to carry out "plans", in short high end triggermen, meant as mission capable rather than actual trigger-pullers, which are a dime a dozen.

Jeff Guckert/Gannon and Talon News Service is a prime example, and one the media backed off and buried awfully damned fast because it lead to *questions*, some of which provoked the dissappearance of Rusty E Nelson and the suicide of Hunter S Thompson, who were both to some degree involved in the procurement chain used to secure Jeffie boy in the first place.

These facilities are the "factory" which produces folk capable of carrying out objectives with absolute loyalty and unswerving devotion, lacking a single blink of conscience or regret cause they're already disconnected from and scornful of the society that cast them into the pit, and thus have no loyalty to it - and often fanatic loyalty to their "rescuers".

I play on that myself, cause if you get to them early enough, you can re-integrate them into a semi-normal life, but the fanatic loyalty is still there, often to a degree that requires a very tight ROE if you wanna keep them out of trouble.

Does that clarify the issue ?

-Frem

It cannot be said enough, those who do not learn from history, are doomed to endlessly repeat it

CHRISISALL

Sunday, January 18, 2009 9:40 PM

Quote:
Originally posted by rue:
What I find really disenheartening is that many, many people here seem to be relating to their childhood issues ad infinitum, often without realizing it, and never quite get beyond them.

It's sad. To grow older and older and never quite become an adult.

If I went back in time & had a talk with my younger self, I think I'd be confronting a very different person.
If you went back to agree with everything you held true in your youth, I think that would mean that no growth had taken place. Can you say 'arrested adolescence'?

The observing Chrisisall

DREAMTROVE

Sunday, January 18, 2009 10:46 PM

Chris,

I think I would go tell that arrogant shmuck to stop talking and start listening, and reading. I would also tell him to not put trust in figures of authority. I could probably tell him a thing or two about his left wing ideas of govt. regulation, but I would be wasting my breath. Nah, I'd shut up. I'd rather have arrived at my current position earlier in life, but I would probably screw it up, and my former self would end up married to some slut and live in a trailer in Tennessee with kids in college, and a job at IBM.

DREAMTROVE

Sunday, January 18, 2009 11:14 PM

Zen snark mighta missfired.

Quote:
Re: Neurochemical Processes.

Neurochemistry is one of my more active hobbies. I like to mix things up. I consider myself really quite informed on the topic, enough to tell big pharm when their wrong about their own drugs. I guess that amounts to "bring it on."

Quote:
I hope you have some time on your hands then, cause Doc Perry's work is real heavy on this sorta thing, especially as it relates to the HPA axis and Fight-Freeze-Flight reaction, but it's seriously "heavy lifting" to read without the associated medical/scientific backgrounding.

Two especially good ones to start from are here.
http://www.childtrauma.org/ctamaterials/neuros~1.asp
http://www.childtrauma.org/ctamaterials/states_traits.asp

The main site link for fav placing - http://www.childtrauma.org/

Okay, I'll take a look. But mind you, if I'm liable to disagree with something, which I am never predisposed to do, (I was even willing to give Bush's second term a chance:) lol, but true,) then I'm liable to say so. Recently in a post about the meaning of the word "Apocrypha" I said, if Merriam-Webster disagrees with me, then I'm still right, and they're still wrong.

While this might come off as arrogant, it's not really, it's a lot of logic and the balance of evidence. I study a lot of disciplines, and I can tell you right now that the field of psychiatry is way off, and psychopharmacology usually doesn't know its own science. So, I may be wrong, and often am, but I can accept that. But I'm still liable to shoot down a skeet or two if I see 'em.

Jes warning you is all.

Quote:

Basically, any full-time residential/incarcerative facility that uses behavior modification processes on children and/or teens that are known to be in fact harmful in physical or psychological fashion.

Reform Schools, Boot Camps, Training Schools, whatever euphamism they hide behind - especially those run by WWASP, cause that was an offshoot of the Synanon Cult originally financed and co-opted by a certain blackops program involving behavior modification research.

Not doubting, but just ignorant: These places still exist?

The open and free society is, imho, a very dangerous place, and it's like a giant death camp, and a typical kid is likely to end up dead, or as good as dead, in the drug war, drug culture, if they're lucky, they'll end up a slave in a credit-based lifestyle working endless overtime wages.

Still, I can see where institutions can be dangerous. I even think that the university is a psychological training center, and marketplace for substance abuse-slavery route.

I would favor institutions that created a safe haven, I've seen some iron curtain ones that were definitely preferable to what I've seen on the streets, but I've also seen some that weren't, where torture, corporal punishment, programming went on. I didn't know we had any.

IMHO, the worst institution I've seen in the US is the public school. I don't miss not having been a part of it.

The only reason I'm saying this is that it's a tricky thing to do, to classify a wide group of institutions as "evil." I hope it's a specific list with a very definite set of criteria.

Here's another dangerous programming, torturing and killing field for kids today: The US military.
Oh, and Juvie, Prison.

Also, recognize that John's MKULTRA is also very real, and out there on the loose. I have certainly lost more people to it than anything else, in fact, everything else combined, by a wide margin. Not through death, just zombies. I've seen the best minds of my generation, and the one after it, and the one after that, destroyed by substance abuse.

Doesn't mean that this substance abuse treatment network isn't just a cover for child slave labor or whatever. Most of the drug treatment programs I've seen are not nefarious, but just stupid and misguided.

Quote:
Those who survive and thrive after "treatment" at these hellholes do so by a form of learned/trained sociopathy that makes them absolutely perfect recruit

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DREAMTROVE

Monday, January 19, 2009 1:30 AM

Whatever I say, I may disagree on a fair number of points, I have a lot of respect for you, you're fighting a tough fight, and you have great taste in sci-fi, and make a lot of insights, here on the forum. I'm a very skeptical man. If we disagree, that's not to say that the subject is closed, that I think I'm right and you're wrong, and there's no more to be said about it. But you might remember Chrisisall dubbed me "skeetshooter" for my tendency to shoot down anything that looked like it couldn't fly on its own, and might be made of clay. I'm actually quite good at shooting skeets, which is just an ironic coincidence, esp. for an avowed non-violent non-gun owner.

Okay, preliminary results. First off, let me say a couple of things:

1. I know the network pretty well now, and I can identify it pretty much within I'd say 60 seconds or so. I have a friend who is pretty heavy into this. This is a very real threat, and it's out there in the open, and not in an institution. It's tentacles creep down through society, mostly through the public school, but through many avenues, and reach up to the govt, cia, dea, and "nightshift" operations.

2. This means that there is a need for treatment, and as someone who has worked with drug addicts I know that this only works in isolation. the network is so pervasive that the addict will get back in touch with the source anywhere they are, and they will do so because it is the path of least resistance. The network serves the NWO to subdue the populous, make a profit, and control the population. It also is breeding a fine generation of mindless killing machines.

3. As a person who has worked at both state and private facilities, and been an inmate, I tend to agree with you that they are a racket for stamping human beings into dollar bills, almost without exception so far.

4. I'm familiar with the cult of synanon, aka hotel california, and that it's a nefarious organization.

5. The anti and pro forces involved in the drug, and drug rehabilitation and their backers in terms of the powers that be, and their interest in them needs to be examined logically, and fully. I am very well aware of tptb's interest in the drug market, their many interests, and the end goal.

Breaking for a second, I just want to point out a logical problem: Scientology is often pegged as a nefarious organization. I'm not a scientologist, obviously, but I can see that this is nonsense. I investigated it to the end point where I now know a lot of people in the rankings of CoS, and I fully understand where their coming from, how they operate, and how and why they exist, their goals, etc. The war against CoS was started by the network, with strong backing from pharma, and msm, which pharma has tremendous influence over. Scientologists can be wrong, misguided, and at times do some dumb things, but they are trying to correct what they see as a real problem, and it is, a very real problem.

Casting too wide a net for anti-drug groups as nefarious organizations is going to certainly nab CoS as one, and if you end up at war with CoS, you are fight for tptb.

Now, considering that logic, you can see that this is a very tricky game. I might throw in a possible monkey wrench here, but it's possible that the game is a step trickier than it appears.

Okay, back to the analysis.

6. http://www.caica.org/ was unconvincing. Since I have seen a lot of pro and anti on a lot of different things in society, virtually everything can be cast as the devil or the saviour. My gut reaction to this is that most of these groups are probably neither. They're in it to make a buck, maybe, or they're religious, or have faith in some sense, and really believe in their cause. As for this website, the accusations fall short of what I see in the open in the light of every day institutions, like the public school.

7. The network is my term for something which doesn't have a name, but I know it to exist as a coherent entity. In the US it has had a lot of programs like mkultra, a cia program you know. The network now has grown int